Linky

Thoughts......?  Is there pre-emption in MO?

ETA:    RedStar article

21.750 does allow for regulation, but they are doing a complete ban...this is in and of itself unconstitutional.  There was one person to challenge, Joyce vs. Cape Girardeau.  The eastern appeals court stated that he didn't properly bring his challenge and it was upheld...quoting the SCMO case of Wilson vs. state....expect for the very next line in that opinion that stated that the legislature doesn't have the authority to only allow the carrying of unloaded weapons.

If the legislature overrides the GOV, the OC with permit in these cities will pass and in a couple weeks, we can vote on a new and stronger RKBA amendment to the state constitution.

We will take care of this issue shortly.

How does this affect anyone but the yahoo attention seeker?

Solution looking for a problem.  OC has been legal in KC for a longtime. In all the years I've lived in KC I've only seen a handful of individuals doing it so where's the problem.

Sorry this is a fail on the City.

ANYTIME the government tells law abiding people they CAN'T do something when that action has ZERO negative impact on anyone, it is a very bad thing and affects everyone.

I think that is debatable.

Do tell...

Nothing wrong with open carry.

Plenty wrong with the skittish soccer mom that scarfs alcohol and antidepressants to try to make up for her shitheadedness and crap family, and the fact that she's more than likely in a loveless marriage and it's all her fault, yet she goes into panic mode at the sight of even a pink plastic water gun.

I say we ban soccer moms instead.

I'm all for bangin' soccer moms.

... wait? Ban? not bang?

OC does nothing but harm to our cause. While people shouldn't fear guns, it's a known fact that a sizable percentage of the American people do.  Not only does it make all the Nancys get their panties in a bunch, but it makes the OC'er a target. It doesn't really have any advantages.

There are good ways to introduce people to firearms, but strolling around wearing a sidearm or slinging a rifle isn't one. Be polite, be professional, be informative, and if you ever get the opportunity to introduce someone to shooting, make sure it's a safe, fun, and educational experience.

I can only think of TWO times where this statement has held true, neither were recent.

Like people with aggressive names on a gun forum sorta ?  

It just makes me want to puke that if it's a right YOU don't use, we can do without it. If it's something someone ELSE wants, it's bad.

If you have to hide your fucking gun, you are more of a threat to me than an open carrier. OC'ers SHOW YOU what they are doing, whereas a CCW holder hides his , in the name of not being an "attention seeker"  I'm guessing ?

Shit like this is why I'm getting away from guns and gun forums more and more. Too many fuckin' hypocrites who want what THEY want, but ONLY if THEY want it.

My opinion of CCW is more and more on the negative side because of people like this. YOU may want to pay for your RIGHTS, but some of us still stand for something and don't believe in that . Fuck CCW carriers and the horse they rode in on, most are a bunch of hypocritical pricks......

From this day forward, I refuse to hide the fact that I am carrying . I'm not a criminal.I refuse to act like one,  I don't need to hide my gun .

Are you a CCW trainer ?  Or am I confusing you with someone else ?

I am .

Thx for the clarification.

In principal, I agree with much of your post.

Thanks. Sorry for the rant, but it was the God's honest truth, and it sucks.

The gun boards are so fucking full of people who are full of shit and who are hypocrites.

I think stupid people open carry, but I have my 1911 under my shirt right now and feel all cuddly about it.
I can't believe we are allowing people to smoke pot legally. Pass my pack of smokes please.
Drug addicts should all be killed on the spot. Where did I put my glass of whiskey ......

It just gets old, and I don't get it. I guess I'm an independent in my thinking of, as long as it doesn't bother me or interfere with others I'm cool with it. Why should someone tell someone else what they should or shouldn't do, if it is not even affecting them  ?

Open Carry does NOT harm our Cause...

Open Carry Internet Attention Whores DO.

Open Carry does NOT harm our Cause...

Open Carry Internet Attention Whores DO.

I think OCers sometimes do stupid things, like what has been happening at some OC events in Texas. I sympathize with the gun laws those people are dealing with, but what good can come of carrying long guns into a restaurant, especially after a pattern appears of restaurants setting an anti-gun policy in your wake? And don't get me started on the stupidity of actively carrying an unslung rifle in Chipotle.

That said, I am in favor of constitutional (concealed AND open) carry for hand and long guns, regardless of what a few nitwits do. In principle I agree with OCing for all the reasons you state, but I personally would prefer to CCW because I give credence to the idea of not making myself a target. I shouldn't need a permit from our Great State to exercise my right, though!

IMO, and this is only my opinion, the ones who are the internet douchbags trying to get caught and harassed so they can film it, as well as people carrying long guns into business', is just plain ignorant and it does hurt our cause. It makes me cringe when I see those videos.

What I and most folks I know do, is simply put on our gun as we would, with a good retention holster, tuck our shirts in, dress nice and go about our business. That way people see a normal acting person interacting with others in a social environment and see that nothing bad happened. The more people see that, the more they will go, "Well I saw 2 people today with guns on and they were just shopping." It won't even be an issue with most folks anyway, as they are looking for their brand of shampoo or zit cream . They could care less about me, you or anyone that is in between the door and the zit cream .

The myth about OC'ers being "targets" is ridiculous at the least. Most criminals don't want any resistance, so they pick soft targets  . First of all, I doubt they are going to be "looking" for a normal guy to be carrying. They are going to be nervous and not concentrating on any one person, but the group of people they are bothering . If it's one on one, I don't think they are going to pick on the guy with the gun . They want the little gal with the purse instead. If that person is cold enough to shoot you for having a gun, he was probably going to shoot you anyway .

Just my .02 on the subject.

Agree! I support the right of these guys to be d-bags, even though I don't like it. Just because you can doesn't mean you should

I think shaming and disapproval is appropriate, but trying to change law because of a few morons is bad.



I hear you. And even if an OCer is "seen" by a bad guy, in some cases I am sure it would be a deterrence. There are many variables to it, and I don't think it's a "one size fits all" thing. For whatever reason, at this stage in my life I am only comfortable OCing in a relatively controlled environment, where I can be paying more attention to my surroundings. When shopping or in close quarters with a lot of strangers, it's not for me... at this time. More power to you though, I'm glad some are willing to do it

'Target' in this case, is also being the recipient of LEO encounters.

Doesn't matter if they stop me for questioning because someone called them about my open carried gun, or of their own 'curiosity'.

I don't want the waste of time .

And just because you open carry all the time and never get hassled about it, I'm not taking the risk in my part of town.

I would bet that most of the local cops would be cool about it and not make a scene, but I'm not going to risk meeting up with that ONE cop who will disarm me and make me deal with his opinion.

Don't want the waste of time.


And then there is another fact to think about.

How about the business owner or salesman trying to bring in profits for his family and employees ( with families ) .

Would you rather them go unarmed, conceal carry, or unnecessarily loose business by open carrying ?

Again.  In principal I agree with the open carry thing, but I don't see our society ever evolving to the point where it would be practical.

Periods of chaos? Sure.

Your experiences are 100% different than mine . I've been in line at Wal Mart OC'ing with a Jeff City cop behind me . He wanted to know what kind of 1911 it was and did I like it . Why I wasn't tased and cuffed....I dunno . Maybe because I acted normal and anyone with half a brain could tell that from my demeanor I was for all intents and purposes... a normal guy with a gun. Just like him .

I open carry in restaurants all the time as well as any stores I go to. Never has one lost money because I was there. That makes no sense . I wasn't there to rob them or I would have concealed . You know...like a criminal does.

Pease tell me you understand there are  different dynamics in business relating to relationships and networks within industries.

Retail and restaurants, at the end user level, are not what I was talking about.

Open carry result in St Charles, MO

I don't look like the open carry guy in this video, and MAYBE folks wouldn't freak as much if they saw ME carrying openly, but I'm not willing to risk having a LEO waste my time.

You are free to do as you wish .

I don't get my time wasted because I'm not doing anything wrong .

It's not rocket science to me, but I don't complicate things more than they need to be  either .

Did you watch the video ?  If you did, you would see the proof that folks doing nothing wrong get their time wasted by cops when they open carry.

I do not complicate things by carrying concealed....  Unlike the guy in the video who's gun was taken by the LEO.

Please tell me you understand the point as a valid one in the following post :

I watched the video 4 years ago. So yes to both of your questions.

Thanks for answering.