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jon7400
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Posted: 2/1/2013 10:39:00 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/1/2013 10:49:37 AM EST by jon7400]
Originally Posted By Gingerbreadman:
Originally Posted By duhflushtech:

I might be reading it wrong, but it looks like HB244 only makes it a crime to falsely report a theft or loss, but does not make it a crime to not report it?


That is the way I've been reading it.


Yep, I typed that wrong.

EDIT: Although with lawyers the way they are, I can see room for lies of omission.
vingrjoe
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Posted: 2/1/2013 11:20:02 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/1/2013 11:20:55 AM EST by vingrjoe]
I used Rat_Patrol's letter and then sent a second one like below. The statistical data tables actually looked proper in the email versus my post here.


Dear Rep. XXXX,

In this email are statistics directly from the FBI's website covering weapons used in homocides. I am hoping that by using the following facts, not emotion, you will decide correctly and not pass any more useless, unconstitutional laws banning semi-automatic rifles or any other firearms or magazines, or any laws requiring registration.


First off is the FBI statistics for the nation:

Weapons 2007 2008 2009 2010 2011
Total 14,916 14,224 13,752 13,164 12,664
Total firearms: 10,129 9,528 9,199 8,874 8,583
Handguns 7,398 6,800 6,501 6,115 6,220
Rifles 453 380 351 367 323
Shotguns 457 442 423 366 356
Other guns 116 81 96 93 97
Firearms, type not stated 1,705 1,825 1,828 1,933 1,587
Knives or cutting instruments 1,817 1,888 1,836 1,732 1,694
Blunt objects (clubs, hammers, etc.) 647 603 623 549 496
Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.)1 869 875 817 769 728
Poison 10 9 7 11 5
Explosives 1 11 2 4 12
Fire 131 85 98 78 75
Narcotics 52 34 52 45 29
Drowning 12 16 8 10 15
Strangulation 134





Now the statistics for the state of Minnesota:


State Total Murders Total Firearms Handguns Rifles Shotguns Unknown Knives or other Other Weapons Hands, Feet,
Firearms cutting instruments Fists, etc.


Minnesota 70 43 36 3 3 1 12 12 3




As you can see according to the national statistics; knives, baseball bats, 2x4 boards, hammers, fists and other weapons were used to kill more people in each of their respective categories than all rifles ! According to the Minnesota statistics, fists and shotguns were used to kill just as many people as rifles per their respected categories. Knives, cutting instruments and other weapons each were used to kill more people than rifles in their respected categories.

Now mind you, the rifle category in both the National and State tables refer to ALL rifles. This includes bolt action, lever action and semi-automatic rifles such as the AR-15 and AK-47.

Now you tell me, where do you see a problem with semi automatic rifles such as the AR-15s or AK 47s or SKS's when more murders are comitted using various other weapons ?

How about going after knives, baseball bats and fists ! That won't really work because the common denominator in all these murders is that there are people who are bent on doing evil and will do it with whatever they can find, be it guns, knives, fertilizer bombs, vehicles, etc.
And there will always be evil people and crazy people who will want to harm others. The most effective way to combat this is for the law abiding citizens to be armed.

Passing new uneffective, restricting, illegal and most importantly unconstitutional laws banning firearms and magazines will not stop crime. It will not stop criminals. It will only hurt and punish the law abiding citizens.

Sincerely,

vingrjoe
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Posted: 2/1/2013 11:47:14 AM EST
Response from Brian Johnson, seems very positive;


Thank you for contacting me regarding the issue of gun control in our state, I appreciate hearing your thoughts on this matter.

We must take a thoughtful approach to this subject and work on solutions that get to the root cause - mental illness - with a goal of preventing future tragedies. We also must ensure that whatever measures we enact do not infringe upon our Second Amendment Constitutional Rights.

In 2008, the Supreme Court affirmed the right of the individual to bear arms as a fundamental concept of liberty. Not only does this liberty protect our nation, community, and families today, but it will serve to preserve the rights and safety of future generations.

If you have any future comments or questions regarding a state legislative issue, the actions of a state agency, or if you have issues that require legislative action, please do not hesitate to contact me.

Again, thank you for contacting me regarding this issue.

Regards,

Brian

Brian Johnson
State Representative
233 State Office Building
100 MLK Blvd.
St. Paul, MN 55155
651-296-4346
"A firearm is like a fine woman. You take care of it and it will take care of you. You don't take care of it and it can be a real Bitch."
lewisabc123
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Posted: 2/1/2013 2:50:29 PM EST
Contacted each Representative on the committee, hopefully my small part will be part of a larger sounding of voices imploring our elected representatives to respect our Constitutional rights as citizens of this great nation.
glockkaboom
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Posted: 2/1/2013 3:13:49 PM EST
So if you have a mag floor plate and a spring for more than 7/10 round mag you will be a criminal if this nonsense passes. Fire should come down from the heavens and consume them or the earth open up and swallow them alive.
SFSMN
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Posted: 2/1/2013 4:23:25 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/1/2013 4:32:36 PM EST by SFSMN]
This from the National Gun Rights Org site.

Authored by anti-gun St. Paul State Representative Alice Hausman, H.F. 241 would:

*** Ban the sale, transfer, possession and manufacturing of ALL semiautomatic firearms with a detachable magazine and at least one “characteristic” -- which means just about anything that makes a gun “look scary.”

(This includes rifles AND pistols!)

*** Impose sweeping bans on pistols, rifles and shotguns that have “the capacity to accept” more than 7 rounds of ammunition;

*** Force current owners of ALL “grandfathered” weapons to undergo intrusive, redundant, ANNUAL background checks at their own expense;


*** Force owners of ALL “grandfathered” weapons to obtain permission to keep their guns by registering them annually with law enforcement;

*** Force the confiscation of thousands of firearms to law enforcement. Failure to comply could result in a $25,000 fine, five years in jail or both;

*** Give local law enforcement a blank check to make up their own gun storage rules as they please, and;

*** Give local law enforcement agencies vast new powers to bust down your door to make sure you are in compliance with all of their new, made up, “rules.”

This bill forces you to open up your door and let the police “inspect” your legally possessed firearm as they please.

Obama is coming in Monday to promote this with his Obamacrats.
csacksteder
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Posted: 2/1/2013 5:25:32 PM EST
Wish I would have checked here first - some great letters guys.

Here is what I'm sending - a slightly different approach...

As an American Citizen, Voter, Taxpayer and resident of Minnesota I wanted to thank you for protecting the Constitution of the United States of America. As you are aware, there is a very emotional effort underway to abridge the rights granted to every law abiding American under the Second Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America.

There are those that feel abridging the Right to Keep and Bear Arms would somehow magically prevent violence. What they fail to recognize is that the criminals that would perpetrate violence against our society have no intention to obey any law. In fact – events like the often cited Columbine shooting occurred four years into the 10-year “Assault Weapon Ban” of 1994. infringing on the rights of the just citizens of this country will in no way limit the actions of the unjust.

I thank you for your support in voting no against any bill that would limit magazine capacity, ban a particular type of gun based on how it looks, limit the ability of law abiding citizens to pass their guns on to family members or sell them to their law abiding friends, or otherwise abridge the rights that millions of responsible, law abiding gun owners exercise today

Together, as a united country we can make our schools, places of business, and neighborhoods safer through more efficient enforcement of existing laws and earlier intervention for those that need the support and help of their community.

Sincerely,
sjuhockey10
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Posted: 2/1/2013 5:31:24 PM EST
Not to get too tinfoily here, but since the law only allows for grandfathering in firearms purchased before today, how does one prove that short of having a dated receipt with a serial number? Or is this just a backdoor way to start confiscating shit when they allow the "registration" of grandfathered firearms?
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MNGLI
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Posted: 2/1/2013 5:55:26 PM EST
Originally Posted By sjuhockey10:
Not to get too tinfoily here, but since the law only allows for grandfathering in firearms purchased before today, how does one prove that short of having a dated receipt with a serial number? Or is this just a backdoor way to start confiscating shit when they allow the "registration" of grandfathered firearms?


I'm wondering this same exact thing since I have some stripped lower receivers that I purchased that won't be ready for a while. So, does that mean since I don't have them transferred in my name/possession that I will be unable to get these if this law (praying it won't pass) passes? Also wondering what will happen with my form 1s out to the ATF for my SBR rifles will be affected!
MNGLI
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Posted: 2/1/2013 5:58:26 PM EST
To those of you sending letters to your representatives, found this great letter on another site. Little long but very informative, just not sure they will keep attention long enough to finish the letter and give a damn. Sample Letter


Please send this out to your Representatives and try and get your friends to do the same.

Senator or Congressman,

Why have you bought into the lie that more 'draconian restrictions', and more 'gun control', will lessen gun violence and make the populace safer? That mindset flies in the face of rational reasoning, and also in the face of your own Governmental compiled data since 1970 when Gun restrictions have shown a significant drop in those crimes where the laws have been eased. Statistics from the FBI and Justice Department have shown the correlation between a freely armed civilian populace and a significantly lower gun crime, and violent crime rate. If you want to do something to protect the public as you profess you do, end the gun free zones, since those zones are where the majority of gun crimes takes place.

Use your intelligence and common sense to see the Sandy Hook incident, the Colorado Theater incident, the Virginia Tech incident, the Columbine incident, all have one thing in common; The Gun Free Status, which is directly attributable to the Progressive Democratic Agenda to severely restrict private carry of guns, by law abiding citizens. Why is that? Why don't you trust the Law Abiding Public? Attack the Criminals that are the cause of crime, by enforcing the many many laws already on the books. Stop attacking the law abiding citizens for wanting to exercise their God Given Right to Self Protection. To do other than that, suggests a nefarious hidden agenda on the part of the Progressive Democrats, to eliminate the Second Amendment Protections, and that in turn, would give rise to a major increase in the violence and gun crimes, by the very criminals who ignore the law anyways.

If you wish to persist in your ideas about the merits of gun control and banning, please, try to convince me that I am the one who is wrong in my thought processes instead of you. Tell me (sir or madame), if you can; If severe restrictions and draconian control facilitate lower gun crimes, and Illinois ( Chicago being the strictest) has the most draconian ones on record, and their laws in Chicago are comparable with with ones in New York ( NYC) and Connecticut ( Sandy Hook), WHY IS; Chicago, NYC, and recently Sandy Hook so dangerous for unarmed innocent citizens?

If Gun Free zones create lower shooting incidents and lower violent crime rates, why do the majority if those incidents, and incidentally, the incidents with the highest body counts, happen primarily in legislated Gun Free Zones? Only the Law Abiding Citizen will comply with the Gun free Zones, and thus expose themselves to a much higher threat level from the criminal element and mentally deranged, who have historically proven consistently through their actions, they ignore all the laws anyway.

You say you are for the Assault Weapon (( misnamed since true assault weapons are select fire automatics)), and Clip Capacity Bans, but can you tell me why the previous 10 year long Assault Weapon and Clip Capacity Ban had absolutely no impact on gun crime over the entire ten (10) year period they were on the books? That statement is a fact, and proven beyond a shadow of a doubt by what the Government's own Statistics irrefutably show? (Sir or Madame), you know why, but you refuse to admit the Second Amendment was put into the Bill of rights because the Founding Fathers deemed it necessary for the public to be able and capable of protecting themselves, resisting any possible invasion, and also for resisting an oppressive government, should that ever become necessary. You also know beyond peradventure, that the current Political rhetoric about Hunting and Sport shooting are not the reasons for the Second Amendment either. Obey the Second Amendment as Constitutional Law requires you to do, and remember you took an Oath of Office to uphold it. Stop infringing on Americans Constitutional Rights at the Federal Level.

The proposed set of restrictions and bans places an unfair burden on all minorities and women. Maybe an Amicus Curiae brief outlining how it unfairly impacts them on the subject would influence you if it were filed in federal court to allege that the proposed bill is deliberately Racist in Nature, and places an unreasonable burden on all minorities in it's effect, and/or that it does not follow the "Rule of Law" because of the unfair burden placed on minorities, women in general, especially minority women, by preventing them from being able to protect themselves, combined with the fact that it deliberately is not equally applied to American Citizens, because government officials and a few select others are exempt from it's jurisdiction.

I intend to bring these things up in Court should the bill pass. If you choose to hide behind the wording of the Second Amendment citing Militia, you should know that Congress defined the term over 100 years ago as the Organized and Unorganized Militia with the Organized Militia being the Army and National Guard, and the unorganized Militia as the rest of American Citizens.
dpmmn
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Posted: 2/1/2013 6:02:04 PM EST

Originally Posted By MNGLI:
Originally Posted By sjuhockey10:
Not to get too tinfoily here, but since the law only allows for grandfathering in firearms purchased before today, how does one prove that short of having a dated receipt with a serial number? Or is this just a backdoor way to start confiscating shit when they allow the "registration" of grandfathered firearms?


I'm wondering this same exact thing since I have some stripped lower receivers that I purchased that won't be ready for a while. So, does that mean since I don't have them transferred in my name/possession that I will be unable to get these if this law (praying it won't pass) passes? Also wondering what will happen with my form 1s out to the ATF for my SBR rifles will be affected!


Do not comply
IYAOYAS
J75player
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Posted: 2/1/2013 8:04:07 PM EST
Originally Posted By MNGLI:
Originally Posted By sjuhockey10:
Not to get too tinfoily here, but since the law only allows for grandfathering in firearms purchased before today, how does one prove that short of having a dated receipt with a serial number? Or is this just a backdoor way to start confiscating shit when they allow the "registration" of grandfathered firearms?


I'm wondering this same exact thing since I have some stripped lower receivers that I purchased that won't be ready for a while. So, does that mean since I don't have them transferred in my name/possession that I will be unable to get these if this law (praying it won't pass) passes? Also wondering what will happen with my form 1s out to the ATF for my SBR rifles will be affected!


its a big ol pile of cluster fuck.
retroactive laws (I thought) are not concidered enforcible.
then this bill goes of to violate the 2nd AND 4th Amendments (allowing LE to search your home to "inpect" your arms.
Pharcta2
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Posted: 2/2/2013 3:58:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/2/2013 4:04:39 AM EST by Pharcta2]
I received the identical boiler plate response from Rep. Cornish

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Posted: 2/2/2013 4:13:50 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/2/2013 4:15:49 AM EST by RaptorRage]
So are black rifles let alone the newly defined AW's under definition of this bill still being sold or transferred at retail locations in Minnesota as of yesterday? It would seem like a potential problem for new owners if this ends up passing later with the retroactive date.
sjuhockey10
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Posted: 2/2/2013 10:50:26 AM EST
Originally Posted By RaptorRage:
So are black rifles let alone the newly defined AW's under definition of this bill still being sold or transferred at retail locations in Minnesota as of yesterday? It would seem like a potential problem for new owners if this ends up passing later with the retroactive date.


Yes, because nothing is law yet. There's nothing preventing you from buying one after yesterday and storing it out of state or handing it over to the gov if this passes.
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Posted: 2/2/2013 11:03:37 AM EST
Originally Posted By mnvwguy02:
Here is what I just sent (feel free to use it, feel free to modify it for your purposes).

“…shall not be infringed.” These four words are the last four words of the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution of the United States.” The four words refer to “the right of the people to keep and bear arms”.

Recent Supreme Court of the United States decisions, D.C. v. Heller and McDonald v. Chicago, affirm the individual right to keep and bear arms and incorporate the 2nd Amendment to apply to the states, respectively.

The protected right of arms ownership, specifically semi-automatic firearms ownership, under the 2nd Amendment is not about the canards of hunting or sporting purpose. The human right to keep and bear arms is an individual right of all persons to keep them free. Free from illegitimate coercive force from any source.

We write to you as your constituents to respectfully tell you that we do not support any new gun control laws. In particular, we do not support restrictions on semi-automatic magazine capacity, nor do we support the banning the manufacture, sale or transfer of so-called “assault weapons”.

We beseech and implore you to vote “no” on any proposal, bill or amendment that will restrain or remove the right to own semi-automatic rifles, or pistols and their accessories. Vote “no” on any restriction to magazine capacity. Vote “no” on any new Assault Weapons ban. Vote “no” on any new gun control measures.

Be advised the current proposals, HF243, HF242, HF241, HF240, HF239, HF238, HF237, HF184 and SF205, SF83, SF69, SF64, will affect us directly, and restrict, ban or subject to registration every firearm and every magazine we possess. None of these proposals addresses the root cause of violence, in fact they create an environment that invites violence.

Remember the last four words of the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution of the United States are “shall not be infringed”. We urge you to vote NO! to any new gun control laws.

Warmest Minnesota regards,


Thank you, just sent this out.

Proud Member of Team Ranstad
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Posted: 2/3/2013 5:09:53 AM EST
Sent out some yesterday and again today.
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Posted: 2/3/2013 6:10:16 AM EST
Reply from my state rep:

Dear Damon777,

Thank you for writing me on the issue of guns and the developing effort of Democrat legislators to attempt to take away the 2nd Amendment rights of law abiding Minnesotans.

I want you to know that I will continue to stand up tall in support of our precious 2nd Amendment rights. You can be assured that I will vote against each and every one of these efforts to usurp our freedoms. The freedom to protect ourselves against the tyranny that our founders fought so hard to defeat is a fundamental freedom that they knew to be so important that it needed to be written into our Bill of Rights.

The goal this session and next, with an anti-gun Minneapolis majority controlling the legislature, is to maintain the status quo.....keep the laws of Minnesota exactly where they are today. It will take your help and the help of hundreds of thousands of freedom-loving Minnesotans to stand up together, with one voice, in opposition to these insane proposals.

We don't need more laws restricting our freedoms. We need simply to enforce the laws we have and encourage "good guys" with guns, to deter the "bad guys" with guns from carrying out their criminal acts.

Please stay in touch in the days and weeks ahead, and encourage other lawmakers to hold the line and say "NO" to these freedom-robbing proposals.

Thanks for writing and have a great weekend!

Steve.



Steve Drazkowski
State Representative
District 28B
Room 401 State Office Building
100 Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Blvd.
St. Paul, MN 55155-1298
Office: 651-296-2273
Fax: 651-297-7523
Aldo_The_Apache
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Posted: 2/3/2013 7:29:07 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/3/2013 7:29:30 AM EST by Aldo_The_Apache]
Originally Posted By Damon777:
Reply from my state rep:

Dear Damon777,

Thank you for writing me on the issue of guns and the developing effort of Democrat legislators to attempt to take away the 2nd Amendment rights of law abiding Minnesotans.

I want you to know that I will continue to stand up tall in support of our precious 2nd Amendment rights. You can be assured that I will vote against each and every one of these efforts to usurp our freedoms. The freedom to protect ourselves against the tyranny that our founders fought so hard to defeat is a fundamental freedom that they knew to be so important that it needed to be written into our Bill of Rights.

The goal this session and next, with an anti-gun Minneapolis majority controlling the legislature, is to maintain the status quo.....keep the laws of Minnesota exactly where they are today. It will take your help and the help of hundreds of thousands of freedom-loving Minnesotans to stand up together, with one voice, in opposition to these insane proposals.

We don't need more laws restricting our freedoms. We need simply to enforce the laws we have and encourage "good guys" with guns, to deter the "bad guys" with guns from carrying out their criminal acts.

Please stay in touch in the days and weeks ahead, and encourage other lawmakers to hold the line and say "NO" to these freedom-robbing proposals.

Thanks for writing and have a great weekend!

Steve.



Steve Drazkowski
State Representative
District 28B
Room 401 State Office Building
100 Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Blvd.
St. Paul, MN 55155-1298
Office: 651-296-2273
Fax: 651-297-7523


Hope to see more like this. Well said Steve.

ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
bigbad401
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Posted: 2/3/2013 7:39:30 AM EST
I am noticing that any response we get is from a Republican rep. Interesting. Anyone hear from a Dem yet??
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Posted: 2/3/2013 8:11:34 AM EST
Originally Posted By bigbad401:
I am noticing that any response we get is from a Republican rep. Interesting. Anyone hear from a Dem yet??


I have received noting positive from a single democrat. Reublicans, YES.

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Posted: 2/3/2013 9:43:55 AM EST
Ya'll keep up the fight and do us proud! Don't be the next to fall. Now is not the time to hunker down and worry about low profile or not showing up on lists or whatever excuse you make for not doing your part. Stand and fight. This means you risk a little. Make your presence known loud and clear.

Write, and write, and write some more...email and paper
call, call, call
when possible, show up!

If you folks want to stop it you'll have to get skin in the game.

Good luck!
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Posted: 2/3/2013 11:42:48 AM EST
Wrote my Representative, Denny McNamara. I have little doubt he's with us. This whole deal makes my blood boil.
tesla120
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Posted: 2/3/2013 2:22:30 PM EST
Originally Posted By pointnshoot:
Wrote my Representative, Denny McNamara. I have little doubt he's with us. This whole deal makes my blood boil.


iirc he voted for stand your ground
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Posted: 2/3/2013 4:51:30 PM EST
Here is the reply I received from my state rep just a minute ago:

"Helium":


Thank you for your e-mail and for calling in to the office this week. I agree with you on the governor's budget and on the bills that have been introduced that would limit our 2nd amendment rights. As an endorsed member of the NRA (and the son of a lifetime member) I am a strong advocate for protecting our 2nd Amendment rights. I have and will continue to support legislation that will ensure the Federal and state government cannot infringe upon those rights and will keep your thoughts in mind as we work to protect your right to keep and bear arms.


I appreciate you sharing your thoughts with me.

Best Regards,
Rep. Kelby Woodard
District 20A
Southern Scott and Western LeSueur Counties
651.296.7065
221 State Office Building
100 Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Blvd.
Saint Paul, Minnesota 55155
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