I'm all for enforcing the laws of having a valid drivers license and insurance but setting up roadblocks to check everyone is not the way to do it.  The paper lists a dozen locations that could have the check points.  The article literally starts out with "Be sure to have license, registration, and proof of insurance handy".  I moved to Kentucky to get away from this type of thing.

Advertising this is what is wrong here.  Kinda like saying "There is going to be a drug round up tonight."

Being in Scott County for 25 years I can tell you that there are uncountable incidents of no insurance accidents.  Not to mention those with out insurance, licenses, illegals, etc.  I am sure it is everywhere.  So they want to put up a check point and have me prove it?  Nope, I don't like the idea stated as you have but IF it will do something about the problem around here, I am all for it.

[...reminds self to find current insurance card and put in wallet/glovebox!]

I've been pulled over by the Georgetown PD because I didn't use my turn signal.  They can pull over anyone at any time.  So the premise that this is needed in order to initiate a stop is a bunch of BS.  I'm told Bevin is making a big push for this type of thing, in addition to increased fines, penalties, and impounding the vehicles.  I am ok with the penalties, as there are way too many people on the road without a license, registration, and insurance.  They don't need to put up a "papers please" checkpoint to harass law abiding citizens as they go about their day to stop those that are driving illegally.

I might have a negative opinion on this due to previous interactions with law enforcement.  I grew up in a small town.  Between age 16 and 18 I was pulled over 12 times for every little reason imaginable.  Zero tickets were issued from that.  It was just the police keeping a heavy hand on people.  It went far beyond "protect and serve" and crossed into the "you are a criminal you just haven't been caught" approach that some law enforcement agencies take.  

I believe the advertising piece is what makes this type of stop legal/constitutional otherwise the courts have ruled this type of abuse isn't allowed.

I believe you are correct. They are allowed to stop cars and check for DUI and other things, but not just to check papers. They must have a system and not check all cars, but it can't be random either. Every other car is OK, three out of five is OK, but they have to have a system. I haven't seen the newspaper and you have. I don't know what the stated purpose of the stops is. Does it say that they are stopping cars just to check for the papers you mentioned? The US Supreme Court ruled this unconstitutional in a case named Prouse vs. Delaware. I am sure you can find it with a google search. It is famous. In that case, marijuana was found in a car that was stopped. The evidence was excluded from the trail and the stop ruled illegal. They can't just stop people to check if you have a CCDW, either. If they have a reason to stop you for some suspicion of a crime and then become aware of your concealed weapon, they can then request you to "display" your CCDW.

I too have been harassed by LEO in the past, but things have gotten better in recent years. Police are trained better and police departments are run better. Policies are in effect to stop this kind of abuse. Will it ever happen again? Of course it will, there will always be abuse and abusers, there will always be people that try to short cut the rules. That is just human nature. People are lazy and will try to take the easy way. They  expect the public to be ignorant of the law and are often justified in that expectation. I expect that if all of the facts are known, we would find out that this is a DUI check point or, at least, claims to be a DUI check point and the mention of license, registration and insurance card was just a "heads up". There was just recently a case in Western Ky. where a man was stopped at a DUI checkpoint and the police officer saw a gun in the car. The man was ordered to pull over and ordered out of the car. The police detained him, searched him and cited him for disorderly conduct when he complained about this treatment. The Ky. Court of Appeals found the whole thing to be illegal. That case is Pulley vs. Commonwealth. The presence of a gun, on your person or in a vehicle, is not evidence of any crime unless it is accompanied by some other activity that is criminal in nature.

The stated purpose in the paper is "conducting traffic safety checkpoints" and "are intended to reduce the number of accidents and enforce other traffic-related laws". 

I'm sure they have some type of system to get away with it.  I've been through one "safety checkpoint" in Michigan.  The officer was stopping cars, looking in through the window, and then said something about driving safely as there were a lot of accidents on that road.  Since the article specially mentions "accidents" I bet that is their cover for the fishing expeditions and only people that appear nervous will be asked for their license.  I don't expect any problems and all my papers are in order.  It just brings up bad memories.

The question is, what happens if you say no you can't see my papers.  Will the officer allow that?  Will anyone be willing to say that knowing the officer could easily make up a reason to make things much worse?  I went ahead and printed out a summary of the Delaware v Prouse to have in my vehicle just in case.

Thanks for the Delaware v. Prouse case.  I see it happened in 1979.  It was either 1993 or 1994 when I was stopped in my small town and the specific reason was "to check my registration".  Granted I had recently purchased the and had a paper tag, Also the car was covered in mud/gravel dust due to the country roads out there and it was 10pm or so.  Once verified he let me go, no warning or hostility.  One of the friendly stops actually.  If I had a regular plate I doubt I would have been stopped.  

I am torn on such matters.   I wish cops did not do such intrusive things.  Yet, I hate such things as:

Drunks driving
Druggies running about
People not paying taxes for registration
People not carrying proper insurance.

I can't even begin to comprehend not having a current license.

Illegals are big time violators of these things.

I do wish everyone who is a supporter of illegals would suffer a death in their family at the hands of a drunk, unlisenced, uninsured driver operating an impropriety registered or "stolen" vehicle.   Such supporters of illegals should not mind.   I wish anti-illegals never had to face that shit.

Agreed.

Admittedly, I used to know a lot of the LEO here but now only a few.  They were and are good folks.  Yes, there are those who watch too much tv and think incorrectly about that badge and gun.  I have met that elsewhere (Covington).

I am concerned about such thing, too. The solution is better police training, better tactics, better enforcement and maybe a little bit more hard work. The solution is not the surrender of our rights. I am not just talking about the few rights enumerated in the constitution, but all of our rights as free people to be allowed to go about our daily activities without constant intrusion into those activities by the government. If that means a few misdemeanors go unpunished, so be it. Government and it's agents are always pushing the envelop of constitutional restraint. Those restraints make their jobs harder, they are supposed to make them harder. That's why they are "restraints". Mr. Prouse and Mr. Pulley, spent months of their time, tens of thousands of dollars and many sleepless night to fight these injustices. We have to confront them every time they appear.

Apparently they have done checkpoints before.  If they were effective then everything you just complained about would no longer be a major issue.  Sure they might cite a few people in the brief period that they are doing checkpoints but it has no lasting effect. As I said, they already can pull over any car they want to.  They do not have to be intrusive about it to accomplish the same goal.  I have no problem with the actions, just the method.

The time that I was pulled over by Georgetown PD for not using my turn signal it was around 7pm and I had just left Applebees.   I made a right and immediately had to cross two lanes of traffic to get in the left lane to turn left.  That is 4 turns/lane changes in matter of 100 yards.  The officer was very disappointed that I didn't have a single drink with my dinner so he checked out every light on my vehicle hoping to write a ticket.  That was a complete setup by the GPD for fishing expeditions hoping to catch someone who had a drink.  I didn't like it but I didn't use my turn signal on each turn, so I brought that on myself.  If that is the type of police state you want to live in, then so be it.  I moved to Kentucky to escape such things.

I wasn't saying anything about the individual LEOs in Kentucky.  Compared to other states they are great.  I've heard this "safety" push is coming from Bevin as a way to crack down on illegals and uninsured drivers.  Law enforcement has to take orders just like everyone else.  

At the same time the paper said the county detention center is still ignoring Trump's order to deport criminal illegals.  So now we have law abiding citizens being intruded upon in the name of "safety" while the criminal illegals already in custody are just going to be let go once their time is up.  That isn't the LEO's fault and quite frankly that is why they don't bother to arrest them during routine traffic stops to begin with.  Arresting more of them that are just going to be let go is pointless. 

While I have only been through one checkpoint in my life, I am firmly against these events.

I strongly value our rights and freedoms in this country and I emphatically feel that being stopped, delayed, or detained with no immediate and clear evidence of illegal activity is a direct violation of our rights.
I sympathize with people who have lost time, money, or loved ones due to the illegal actions of others. However I do not think that justifies these check points.

As others have said, the police can almost always find a way to pull over any vehicle on the road if the want to. They can have a targeted enforcement area and go about it this way if they desire.

Surprised Tony is doing this, he's a rather laid back sheriff.

GPD has a hottie LEO.....

This is the same thing that the KSP has been doing for years. They run the notices in local papers to cover their collective asses, should someone sue them to expose exactly what this is: a violation of your rights as guaranteed by the Fourth Amendment. The argument is, "Hey, we warned you that we were checking papers, you should have stayed home."

GO TONY!!!!

They do that here in Madison County. I don't read the papers so I can't say whether they were announced or not. They ask for DL and that's it. It's intrusive but they don't really care. They can get away with a lot of shit in the name of 'public safety'

That's it, exactly. I really pissed off the local PD when I was editor of a newspaper in Eastern Kentucky. They sent over the usual notice about setting up these checkpoints, and I told them they would have to pay for it. The chief came over and asked why. I said, "Are you required by law to publish this?" He said, "Yeah, if we do these spot checks." I told him, "That makes it a legal notice, here are the rates for that." 

Heh. We didn't get any news tips or anything from them for the duration of my tenure at that publication, needless to say.

Well crap. Hopefully this crap blows over. I remember when they got their new window tint meter toys....seen cars pulled over everyday for a week or so it seemed, checking tint.

Think it was Tony who got rid of the helicopter.

Explain your comment.


And please explain the relavance to the discussion.