I've tried to get my head around what prohibitions are allowed and which aren't, but always get caught up in "this is prohibited by USC, this is prohibited by KRS, local gov. bodies can prohibit in X places, they cannot prohibit in Y places, etc."  So I don't have a good feel for what signs are enforceable and which are the ones that SoftPoint does such a good job of getting taken down.

I recently had to go to Metro Revenue Commission at 617 W Jefferson.  I asked someone who was going by earlier to check if it was posted and they said it wasn't.  On my way in I noticed the sign (which was difficult - their doors are very dark tinted) - it had verbiage to the effect that carrying concealed weapons there was prohibited by metro ordinance, with some numbers (89 1996 or similar) at the bottom.  Not knowing which signs need to be followed, I left and went back later without ccw.

The building is between LMPD and Metro Council, but AFAIK it isn't attached or accessible (https://goo.gl/maps/GavxF).  

I didn't get a chance to get a good look at the sign or take a picture because I had to piss like a race horse, they didn't have a head there and the one they sent me to was on the other side of a WTMD in the Metro Council building next door, where Barney told me I wouldn't get my pocket knife back if I left it, so I was in a bit of a rush.

What are the "Cliff's Notes" of what to look for in a posted location in KY?

Metro ordinance?


I thought cities couldn't make up their own gun laws?  You may want to try to IM Softpoint though. His understanding of the KY laws is better than mine.

See, that's what always gets me confused.  They took down tons of signs because they weren't allowed to prohibit carry there, but then...


237.115  Construction of KRS 237.110 -- Prohibition by local government units of carrying concealed deadly weapons in governmental buildings -- Restriction on criminal penalties.
...
((2) Except as provided in KRS 527.020, the legislative body of a state, city, county, or urban-county government may, by statute, administrative regulation, or ordinance, prohibit or limit the carrying of concealed deadly weapons by licensees in that portion of a building owned, leased, or controlled by that unit of government. That portion of a building in which the carrying of concealed deadly weapons is prohibited or limited shall be clearly identified by signs posted at the entrance to the restricted area. The statute or ordinance shall exempt any building used for public housing by private persons, highway rest areas, firing ranges, and private dwellings owned, leased, or controlled by that unit of government from any restriction on the carrying or possession of deadly weapons. The statute, administrative regulation, or ordinance shall not specify any criminal penalty for its violation but may specify that persons violating the statute or ordinance may be denied entrance to the building, ordered to leave the building, and if employees of the unit of government, be subject to employee disciplinary measures for violation of the provisions of the statute or ordinance. The provisions of this section shall not be deemed to be a violation of KRS 65.870 if the requirements of this section are followed. The provisions of this section shall not apply to any other unit of government.


I presume that the relevant portion of 527.020 that the reference is the part about the specific people allowed to carry there (commonwealth atty, judges, justices, etc.)

That is correct, but notice that KRS 237.115 only applies to CONCEALED weapons. If you encounter one of these signs, all you have to do is remove your coat or whatever is covering your gun and go on in. They can not prohibit openly carried guns. In fact, their signs are advising that the only legal way for you to carry in the building is openly. Apparently, that's what they want. I have open carried into the Jefferson County Sheriff's office on several occasions, not one word was said about it. You may run into some Metro employees that don't understand what "concealed" means, but if you get a supervisor involved it should work itself out. I was asked to leave a Metro Senior Citizen's Center in Okalona about 5 months ago. I've got a nice letter of apology from the Metro Parks director with a promise to retrain all their employees. Here is a link to some advice to all the cities that was sent out by the Ky. League of Cities on this subject (KLC has sent out a total of 4 memos about guns. I can post them all, if anybody is interested):
http://www.klc.org/news_detail.asp?article=1655

edit: Be aware that our preemption statute only applies to guns. Ky.'s local governments can regulate other weapons, including knives. Be careful.

Unless there is a guy with a  wand going over my body..........well..................Shhhhhhhhh!

I got wander about a month ago on entrance to a local concert that was prohibiting ccw while carrying my glock g41. The Guy never found it and I got in no problem. Hows that happen? Too much plastic?

Its the threat or fear of them catching you , sure they could have found it if the guard had done a good job of wanding you, but he wanted to keep the line moving , had about 2 minutes training , and was just there for a check. Thats my guess anyhow.

I was in Louisville yesterday and had occasion to go into the Jeff. Co. PVA office which is located in the Fiscal Court Building, along with the Sheriff's office and several other agencies. I was carrying concealed and to comply with the signs on the door to that building, I removed my jacket and went on in open carry. I was carrying an FN P45, which is a big gun and impossible to miss, since I had it cross draw at about 11 o'clock. My business at the PVA office was more complex than I had expected and the lady that was assisting me asked me to step over to a computer and she sat down beside me to help me find the information that we were looking for. I spent about an hour there and nothing was ever said about my gun. I finally got what I needed there and it was necessary to go the County Clerks office, just across the street, and look at some things in the deed room. There is a metal detector at the entrance to that building and signs saying that you must produce ID to enter. I didn't like that and protested, but finally showed my DL to the rent-a-cop. He said he was just doing his job and if I didn't like like it to complain to the mayor. I went through the metal detector, with my gun, was wanded (I don't know why, I still had the gun) and went to the deed room. I found what I need there, but was still steaming about the ID issue. I remembered what the rent-a-cop had said and decided that it was good advice, so I got on the elevator to the 4th floor and went to the Mayor's office. I asked to see Mayor Fischer and was told he is "out of town". The receptionist asked what I wanted to talk to him about and I told her. She gave a couple of lame excuses and said she'd pass on my complaint. I then left. During all of this, not one word was said about the gun. Every week I have somebody tell me, don't go here or don't carry in this place, they will arrest you or the will handcuff you or they will be mean to you or whatever. I look for these places and can't find any. I want people to tell where these places are. I want to go there. Please, please, somebody tell me where to find this kind of stuff. My life is getting boring.

Turway (horse) race track.    Make sure to say howdy to the Deputies working there.

Its PRIVATE PROPERTY. They can ban left handed people if they want to.

But, I'd never expected the Deputies to arrest people for carrying but they do.

Oh, I suppose they don't want to ban gay wedding parties.   LOL! Anything but that.

I'd like you to cite just one case where a person was arrested for carrying a gun and nothing else. They might have been arrested for sitting in the bar while carrying, for refusing to leave when told to while carrying or being loud and obnoxious while carrying (DC), but just carrying by itself, no way. What would they write on the arrest ticket where it asks for the KRS that was violated? Just show me one.

No.      I'm not going  to spend my day researching that.     I know what I experienced.       We don't have to believe or trust each other.

Well then, there it is. If it was you that was arrested, just look it up in the Circuit or District Court data base. Anybody, arrested and charged will be in  there. Come back here with a link to the info or print it out and post it. 15 mins. tops

Not all arrests are in the database because an arrest doesn't require a charge. The police don't charge people, the commonwealth does and they'll decide in the morning if they want to charge you or not AFTER you've been arrested.

What?
No jail in KY accepts a body without a Uniform Citation from a peace officer. A UC will have a charge on it, period. That info is put into whatever database said jail uses. If that county uses CourtNet it will be entered into that database as well. Now those charges might be dismissed later, but no one goes to jail in KY without a charge being listed on a UC.
The only exceptions would be interstate transfers, courtesy holds for prisoners in transit, etc.

Is this something that anyone can look up in Kentucky or is it only available to the accused and lawyers and cops?

Everyone else can have fun and play these games.     This has no bearing on what I have seen and experienced.   NONE WHAT SO EVER.  

Turfway race track is a bar.    The Boone County Sheriff's department has treated it as such.    If one of them recognizes you and decides to go after you, hopefully you can out smart them.   Even then, depending on how determined the cop is, you may or may not get a ride to the detention facility.   I do not know if  things are still done this way.    Expect for restaurants which are specifically detailed in the KRS, I do not go any place that serves alcohol, as they are not exempt as restaurants are.    

(Turfway has restaurants in it, but is not a restaurant, and the restaurants are inside areas that are not restaurants.)        

The bottom line is, until we get rid of all these weaponized restrictions/limitations on carrying within the state,  good people will be subject to unreasonable search and potential arrest for simply being responsible.

(The restrictions/limitations are used as weapons on people.   Thus, they have been weaponized.)     While the idea of constitutional carry is cute, I would MUCH prefer going with a CDWL IF it had no limits and had criminal and civil penalties for violation of the rights.     To me, carrying a firearm should be like carrying a tampon.   It is no one's dang business.

Turfway is not a bar, it is a race track. This is from Turfway's wikipedia page:Turfway Park is an American horse racing track..... I support eveybody's right to carry a firearm and I also support people's right to do what they want with their own private property.].

LOL  !!!!   Right.   I suppose it is not good enough that I already posted that.



It is also a bar or was last time I checked, around 2000 or so.  (I stopped going about that time.)    Otherwise, they could not search and arrest people for carrying  concealed so easily.   Now, having said that, I don't know how the state can consider them a bar and allow children there, but they do.    It absolutely makes no sense to me.    But, I have avoided any place that could be twisted into being a bar.  

I should not care.   I know I won't have any problems as I don't go to such places.     It might be best if I just  stop caring.   Over the years, I have given thousands of dollars to  defend the 2nd amendment .     I should probably stop, not worry about it, and just focus on my approaching retirement.    I am getting to old to give a rats tail about other people's lives.    Everyday, I try to make my world a little smaller and my exposure to others a little less.

I suppose it is fine for businesses to violate people's most basic human rights, like why shouldn't  they force women to perform sex acts to keep their jobs, or maybe gay bosses or gay business owners should be able to force sex from their male employees?   I mean, maybe we should abolish all the laws regarding doing business in the public sector while we are at it.  
 
Their place, their rules and all like that.     While that is not consistent with the law, in general,  that is the general view and practice of the web site.  



Everyone has their own views.    I know the most basic of all human rights is the right to self preservation and self defense,  accept on websites,  of  course.     If property and business owners do not have to respect that,  maybe they shouldn't have any restrictions on them.      (I own property in Northern KY, Louisville, and Eastern KY.   I know I have plenty restrictions on what I can do on my own dang private property. )

Long story made short.    My wife would go to the track at least once a week, sometimes 3 times a week.   Around 2000, I noticed more cops around Turfway one weekend.   I recognized some of them from the parking lot.    Some of them I knew going back to when they were in high school.   Supposedly people don't really change who they are.   While I don't know if that is true, I knew that I saw someone I did not trust at all.   Sure enough,  while walking through the venue, I got stopped, harassed, and searched for suspicion of carrying a concealed deadly weapon.   He said he  was going  to arrest me when he found my gun.   Luckily,  I trusted my instincts, and did not trust them from the beginning.     It was also very crowded  at the time.    He might have been willing to frame me, but it would probably have required more effort than he was willing to expend.    He expected to find a gun on me.   He was genuinely surprised when he did not.   I saved my own tail.    I do pray for him daily.    

At the time, I checked with the department that runs the CDWL program  in Frankfort and spoke with a very well respected lady that ran the office who has since retired.    She  politely explained that it was all perfectly legal as it was considered a bar.    The same is true for Fourth street live in downtown Louisville.  It is a private street,  to a degree.    They can block it off, as they lease it from the city.     When it is completely open, it is not a bar.     When they close it off AND restrict foot traffic, they sell alcohol.    Some of the restaurants become off limits then.     One could literally go into Fridays while the venue is unrestricted, have a long dinner with family and friends  carrying a concealed deadly weapon while the area is unrestricted yet later  walk out into a restricted area... a bar.   Lovely.    

But hey, that is just my first hand experience about which I've written.    It isn't like we should believe/respect what others report as first had experience on here.    

You have a very poor understanding of the law. There is no law that allows you to be arrested for carrying a gun in a open air area where alcohol is served. The law say that you can not carry a LOADED gun in a ROOM where alcohol is served. Then, it goes on to say that, even that doesn't apply in a bona fide restaurant. So, if you walk outside, you are no longer in a ROOM. So, no you can't be convicted of carrying a gun in a bar on 4th street. 4th St. is not in a ROOM. They may charge you with something else, but carrying a gun in a bar won't stick, in that situation. Does Turfway have a restaurant license? Do they serve food? I don't know, but I'd bet that they do and I'd bet that they don't get more than 50% of their revenue from the sale of alcohol, which is what a bar is. I have never been there. If you don't know the law and let them let them bluff and intimidate you, that's on you. Just because you are asked to leave a place while you are carrying a gun doesn't mean that you were asked BECAUSE you were carrying a gun. You may have been asked to leave because they though you smelled bad, because they didn't like your shirt or maybe they thought your were crazy as a march hare. In a previous post, you said that deputies arrested people, but can not name anyone that has been arrested or tell us what the charge might be. Now, I don't know what you are saying. Something about "weaponized restrictions". I don't have a clue what that might be.You seem to be very confused. Turfway is not a bar, but they can ask people to leave any time they want, for any reason they want. Right or wrong that is the current state of the law. Get over it, live with it, like the rest of us do. I think that I am done with this discussion, I think you could use some rest.

You have a very poor understanding.

The gun laws are used to control people.   The gun laws are weaponized.     Take that away, and the control goes with it.   The REAL way the law works is people get arrested, spend tens of thousand of dollars on bond/bail along with as much or more on felony criminal defense attorneys, and even loose jobs, (Such does not apply if a person is retired.) even when charges are dropped.   It happens routinely.    THAT is how the law REALLY works.   People do not have to be convicted of anything to have their life almost destroyed.    If you don't realize that, maybe it will be on you some day.    I know I want NOTHING to do with those types of situations, though I do keep money available to address such situations.          

I never mentioned being asked to leave, nor do I know from where those comments came.   CLEARLY, you are either extremely confused or just making things up.   I do not know which.    In my specific situation, after I was searched in public, I was free to go about as I pleased.   I could have stated.  I left and never went back.  I do pray for him every day.  

Obviously, you prefer to ignore what people write, such as a deputy trying to arrest me for carrying a gun (he expected me to have a gun on me) inside of a bar, Turfway.  

Maybe I should get over the 2nd amendment, like most people.  I certainly seem to be throwing my money away donating to such causes, at least in Kentucky.  We are probably going to be surpassed by Ohio in guns rights.   That is a shame.   Maybe I should stop trying to change the situation.   It won't be much longer until I retire and won't have to be out in town much again.  

I am done with the thread.