Want to start out by caveating that I’ve done business with Rainier Arms for years, I recently added up all of my receipts and have totaled more than 7k since 2007/8.  I’ve always, always advocated for small and local businesses even if their prices were higher.  

Last May, I finally got a return stamp on a Class 3 item.  Well, it only prompted me to buy MORE!  (Guns, ammo, accessories, F* cking Gun God’s how dare you tease me!)

Well a retailer online was the only and first Class 3 dealer in the nation to carry a certain suppressor (I’m sure it was based upon volume that they got exclusivity).  So I placed my order and waited on a Form 3 for dealer-to-dealer transfer.

About 6 weeks later, I get tracking from that online retailer and my item was on it’s way to Rainier Arms.  Checked a few days later and it had arrived, I waited a few days for RA’s call to come fill out paperwork and begin the NFA process.  After a few days, I couldn’t wait any longer and called for confirmation before I made the trek down.  Person on the phone “Oh yes, it came in today, come on down.”  At this point, I’m thinking “wtf, I guess you’ve just done receiving but whatever”  

I head down to Rainier Arms to fill out form 4, with all of my firearms and accessories, I ALWAYS jot down the serial number for insurance purposes.  After the paperwork is complete, I fully expected to wait 8mos for the stamp.  I pay their transfer fee ($75), sales tax, and write a check for the stamp tax.  Prior to this, I had tracked NFA return times were down to about 6-8mos.  

Well here comes the beginning August, a local Class 3 is running a special on another caliber suppressor, “F*cking buy it!”  So I run on down and purchase said suppressor and begin the wait again.  

Come December and I’m picking out Christmas trees and get a phone call.  “Hello, blah blah blah your stamp has returned sir.”  But…it’s not from Rainier Arms.  It’s from the other dealer that I purchased from in August. Hop on down to the dealer and I look at the form 4.  It was 2 days over 5mos from submission, pending to approval.  F*cking FASTER than the 9mos I waited last time!  The f*cking Gun God’s have blessed me I thought!    I check online and see that people have been getting returns from 5-6mos.  I work with data to make a living and data does not lie!  (Business Intelligence and Data Analytics background)  It tells the MF (Motherf*cking) story, sure there are outliers and errors, but the meat of data DOES NOT LIE!

That following Monday, I’m thinking to myself “Where the f* is my other can?”  I remember that I jotted down the serial number and call the NFA.   The NFA says, “Sir, it would have been approved last month, had the dealer not forgotten lines 9,10,11”  so I ask about what I need to do or what the next steps were. Okay, no problem, this should be simple.

I call RA two weeks from that date and ask if they’ve seen it kicked back.  No one picks up, so I try again the next day, and the next day – no response.  So I figure I’ll just email them.  I get a response that it was corrected in Mid-Dec.  I go home that night and look at my previous form 4’s.  Lines 9,10, 11 are items the dealer is responsible for.  WTF Yo!

My first thought after reviewing this was, “For a business that does this as their living, how the hell do you miss that?  F*, F*, F*.  Okay, whatever it’s fixed.”

At this point, I also remember my brother had recently completed a transfer through them about 7 mos ago, but they had never called him, it had sat at Rainier for 6 weeks before I told him to call and that current times showed 4-6mos at most.  BOOM!  “Sir, we forgot to call you or we lost your number.”  What!  What?!  Really, no way!

The New Year rolls around and its mid January, I figure it’s been enough time for the NFA to get back from vacation and catch up on work.  I call the NFA and find out it was approved 12/31/14 and that the dealer should’ve gotten the form 4 by now.

So I dial up Rainier, again no one answering the phone, I leave a message and wait a few days.  No response.    I’m like no big deal; I’ll wait another few weeks.

It’s now early February and I decide to email and see if that works.  I get a message from them stating the following “… at the very least NOT tell our customers what they told you because it's simply not true… In the past 5 years I've been doing this I typically experience, 2 weeks until I get the actual stamp which includes the transit time….As soon as it gets here we will call you, thanks for your patience.”  -Basically telling me to f* off.

My first thought – “Well, if you’ve been doing this for so long, why in the world did ya’ll miss lines 9,10,11? Especially if this is basically your livelihood.”  Whatever, I’ve waited long enough but I felt like your response was BULLSHIT!  I do some research and realize that this could potentially be a problem on the NFA’s side, with lost mail, lost paperwork, etc….So I give them (NFA) a call and their response is – “We can send the dealer a certified copy in place of the stamp, as that is protocol and the dealer will get it anywhere from 2-4 weeks but again sir it was approved on 12/31.”  

I call Rainier and they confirm that all they have to do is submit a request on Monday for a certified copy, which they assured me that a request would be submitted.  “Sir, we know what we’re doing, we’ll call you when it comes.”  I even suggest they call the NFA to confirm what I’ve been saying!  But no, I’m just a customer, I don’t know anything.

Well…I call the NFA the following Monday and ask for my own certified copy, which they instructed me to do in writing.  Cool, no problem, I wrote up a quick letter and mailed it off.  I wait, wait, wait….come mid-March – BOOM!  That b*tch certified copy I’ve been waiting for comes to my house (4 week turnaround). I’m thinking “What…the f* that bitch came!  Hallelujah”

I roll on down to RA with Certified copy in hand and I’m calm, composed throughout the whole experience, I don’t raise my voice, I try to be as courteous as I can.  So I walk in and present it to the counter person “Hello, I’m here to pick up my NFA item.”  Dude looks at the certified copy, walks over to some folders, doesn’t see anything.  

Him:  How did you get this?  I can’t accept this until your stamp comes in.

Me:  If ya’ll had called, they would just send you a certified copy, the exact same form, with the exact same date of approval 12/31/14.

Him:  “Sigh, I don’t know.  Hold on”  - Walks in the back, I see that a few people get together, blah, blah, blah.

Me:  Thinking – WTF?!?!?!?  I mean seriously, why would I ever fake the form?

Him:  Comes back with suppressor in tow, I think the NFA must’ve lost your paperwork.

Me:  Silence…..Thinking  - “Well, all you had to do was call to confirm what I’ve been saying, and request a copy for yourself months ago”

Him:  Well, you’re all set.

Me:  Thanks, have a nice day.

So I ended up waiting a total of 9 mos on this can but what really pisses me off is that I paid a transfer fee for them to handle all of this, which it was not.  No – “I’m sorry for the wait and you had to do all the work yourself, when you paid us for it.” Or the fact that there was any initiative or follow-up on their part.  I truly understand that it does get annoying when you have customer’s calling every few months asking about a status, but I my only follow occurred when I had suspicions that something was not right.  Why would the NFA give me wrong dates?  

1)Bias for action – Zilch!
2)Empathy – NONE, they never listened to what I had to say, I was just “wasting their time.”
3)Deliver Results – Pattern of behavior anyone?
4)Ownership – Blew it off, blamed it on the NFA.
5)Lost values – I remember the days when owner’s John & Paul would come down and shoot the sh1t with customers, I understand that they’ve diversified to grow the business with publication, marketing, etc…and look at things from a high level and let their employees handle the day to day but I question if RA has lost its roots in the process.  


This is f*cking bush league garbage!

At the end of the day, I’m probably just small beans, but Rainier has lost me as a customer and everyone I’ve ever sent their way.

Assuming the above is accurate, you should request your transfer fee back from them.  ASAP.  They didn't earn it.  Hell, just the failed lines on the original form would prompt ME to strongly request that refund.

Rob

Who was the "local Class 3 is running a special on another caliber suppressor" and what was the suppressor?

Anyone know if Silencer Shop Direct uses RA for their transfers?

I'm not sure if they do but in that area Pantel Tactical does, north of that I do SS direct and I'm in Snohomish. But really if you are thinking of ordering call your local dealer and ask them what they can get it for, normal stuff we can usually all beat SS direct pricing because they add $70 to the cost of the can.

Ahh...OK...I thought the Silencer Shop Direct prices includes the transfer fee.

I'm fairly certain that Pantel is not the SS Direct dealer in the Renton area......

They may do transfers from Silencer Shop, but I don't think Silencer Shop designates Direct dealers that close together to the existing Direct dealer in Renton....  

What ScorpioMk is saying is that the Direct program adds $70 to the cost of the suppressor ($65 Direct fee plus $5 extra on the NFA tax).  That adds up to $70.  So if SSD has a suppressor for $1,000, plus 9.5% Use Tax, plus $205 NFA Tax plus $65 Direct Fee, you are looking at $1,365 out of pocket total.  The Direct dealer is paid a cut of that fee, so all you have to pay at pickup is the Use Tax.

A local dealer might be able to offer that same suppressor to you for $1,050.  At that price, your total out of pocket becomes $1,350.  You save $15, and the dealer likely makes double or triple the profit on the deal.....

Pantel is a direct dealer, when they started it they had wanted a 50 mile radius but they dont seem to do that anymore cause I'm not 50 miles from him, and probably not 50 miles from you.

Exhibit A as to why Form 1 is the way to go. Not only is there eforms, but it's ALL up to you. Unless its a MG, just make it yourself.

Unless your CLEO (e.g. Pierce co. Sheriff Pastor) refuses to sign them.

No Cleo sig needed for a form 1 and a trust

 
Or go to a competent dealer. I've never had a problem with Cascade Arsenal and I've bought several suppressors from Chip. Its also not easy to build a suppressor as tough or lightweight as a commercial can especially with a QD system.

Hehehe... I've had some NFA take 2 years to complete.  It's all about the patience...

I did 2 cans through RA back when suppressors were first allowed. Everything went smooth. I think now that they (both suppressors AND RA) are more popular, it makes things more difficult.

Easy to say.. Harder to accept that you are forced to go through the trust BS just because your CLEO politicizes shit like signing NFA applications.

Forced to go through the trust BS? The bullshit is going through the CLEO and getting prints. The trust is the no bullshit method.

 

Yup. Just walk into the store with a copy of the trust and a fresh schedule A for the new item, buy, pay, wait your time.  Done.

9 months LOL.
I've had 2 of 6 cans take well over a year due to random issues.
I won't name names - but my .308 can was ordered Nov 2012, and I just received it a month ago (2 years 5 months). My .223 can was 2 years 3 months.
It's the name of the game sometimes, and I don't and won't ever buy a can expecting it in less than a year.
If it comes in 6 months like my 45 Tyrant did - early Christmas.
I'm all for 100% customer service, but people do make mistakes.
Looks like R.A. is willing to make things right, that's a +.

A trust is the way, until they bend us over with 41P and force us to go the CLEO route

I'm in King county and do believe I am screwed.

Exactly, if 41p goes through many of us are screwed.  This is why I'm at 7 stamps and counting, in a mad rush to get all of them done in the next month.  10 or so in total.

I contacted the CLEO of Federal Way PD and they said hell no.  I've heard Kent PD will sign them.  Best to contact your local PD and ask, but if in King County there is a high likelihood the answer will be no... :(

Possible to register a trust in a different county? Say, at a relatives house? Even if NFA goodies are kept elsewhere?

Add relative to trust.  Might be a few other moving parts to caress but could certainly be done.







So OP, what was Rainer's effort made on the resolution?  It certainly looked like they stepped up to try and make things better for you.

Thanks  

Negative.  No effort

Did you contact Mike as he suggested?

To add more clarity.  I called the store 2x within the past week.  No one picked up, I'm done with trying.

It's difficult for me to understand why I also have to reach out and RA does not.

Do they know specifically know your name and the situation?  Not doubting your story, but is the name on your form 4 the same and your name here?   Other than by IM, how would they know to get in touch with you?

Sounds like a severe case of SVS.

Oh I'm sorry you're dealing with that, must be tough

I have yet to even begin working on the process to buy a can, but considering the number of places I've noticed recently that don't even know which box to check when selling a simple pistol-grip Mossberg 500...