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Posted: 1/30/2015 1:28:49 PM EDT
Parts list:
Spikes Tactical stripped Punisher Lower Spikes Tactical Carbine Receiver Extension Spikes Tactical T-2 Buffer & Spring Magpul CTR Stock (disabled / pinned) Magpul Extended Rubber Butt Pad Magpul BAD Lever Magpul 30-round Mags Magpul MBUS Pro BUIS CMMG Lower Parts Kit MolonLabe.com Trigger Guard Geissele SSA Trigger RifleGrip.com Grip** Gunfighter Mod 4 Charging Handle Noveske 60-Degree Short Throw Ambi-Safety Selector Noveske QD Endplate Noveske Keymod QD Sling Attachment Point Noveske Keymod Picatinny Rail Section Noveske 15" NSR Free Floated Handguard Noveske 16" 1-in-7" Stainless Barrel w/Mid-Length Gas System AAC Single Chamber Muzzle Brake LaRue Tactical Index Clips Trijicon VCOG 1-6x Variable Combat Optical Gunsight in Trijicon mount 
** For those curious about the RifleGrip.com grip, it's actually pretty comfortable (especially compared to the alternative MonsterMan grip or Hammerhead Grip) and still allows for the use of a standard stock, rather than going with the popular Thorsdon FRS-15 stock. The RifleGrip is made by a guy in NY state, for those AR owners afflicted by New York's "Safe Act". In practical use, the RifleGrip places your trigger hand thumb so that it rides right on the ambi-safety selector. (cross posted here for relevance from "Build it yourself") |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 4:09:05 PM EDT
[#1]
So, is it that OLL, that grip and no "flash hider" which allows you to use 30 round mags with a regular mag release?
Is that a genuine "pre-ban" Pmag? 
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Posted: 1/30/2015 4:24:38 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So, is it that OLL, that grip and no "flash hider" which allows you to use 30 round mags with a regular mag release? Is that a genuine "pre-ban" Pmag? To your first question, yes. An off-list lower, no pistol grip conspicuously below the trigger, a brake instead of a flash hider, PLUS a fixed stock (mine is disabled and does not adjust), all allow you to use a regular mag release and standard mags. To your second question, the magpul mag parts were from rebuild kits used to repair old mags. I'm older than I look. If you're interested in what is / is not California compliant, here is the CALGUNS.NET flow chart that helps to determine what is compliant: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 4:35:00 PM EDT
[#3]
For your convenience, I'll post them here -- not sure if they're legible at this size, but we'll try:
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Posted: 1/30/2015 7:21:15 PM EDT
[#4]
How do you like the Magpul BAD Lever?
I haven't tested one but I just feel wrong about them. 
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Posted: 1/30/2015 7:28:01 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How do you like the Magpul BAD Lever? I haven't tested one but I just feel wrong about them. I see what you did there... 
As I have not been properly trained by the military, I have many bad habits. Accordingly I have Bad levers on all my AR's...with the exception of my LaRue OBR 7.62 which has a Phase 5 Tactical bolt lever. Personally, I enjoy both the speed & the convenience. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 8:03:48 PM EDT
[#6]
OP,
You did good. It all looks nice and legal to me. Now, lets see the range report. A photo of the test target, a measurement of the group and a description of any malfunctions. -W 
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Posted: 1/30/2015 8:16:14 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OP, You did good. It all looks nice and legal to me. Now, lets see the range report. A photo of the test target, a measurement of the group and a description of any malfunctions. -W Will do! Hope to get some trigger time Sunday possibly. Last week, I did a 1-MOA-ALL-DAY target with my OBR 7.62, only to find out the contest isn't running currently. 
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Posted: 1/30/2015 8:55:22 PM EDT
[#8]
Looks good
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Posted: 1/30/2015 9:40:01 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looks good Thanks! |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 10:48:56 PM EDT
[#10]
I asked in your Build forum thread about the telescoping stock being on a featureless rifle. I don't believe that you stated that it was disabled which, I assume, makes it okay to use on a featureless. I like the idea & may look into it...
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Posted: 1/30/2015 10:58:53 PM EDT
[#11]
How can you "repair" a P-mag when they did not exist prior to the mag ban ?
 
 
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Posted: 1/30/2015 11:06:05 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I asked in your Build forum thread about the telescoping stock being on a featureless rifle. I don't believe that you stated that it was disabled which, I assume, makes it okay to use on a featureless. I like the idea & may look into it... Sorry - was afk, and just noticed your post(s). The Featureless Build requires a non-telescoping stock. In this case the CTR's adjustment mechanism has been disabled, rather than pinning it which would require drilling through the stock and receiver extension. I detail the steps to disable in this thread |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 11:06:41 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How can you "repair" a P-mag when they did not exist prior to the mag ban ?
I didn't repair a P-mag. I repaired a steel mag that was damaged. |
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Posted: 1/30/2015 11:17:47 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sorry - was afk, and just noticed your post(s). The Featureless Build requires a non-telescoping stock. In this case the CTR's adjustment mechanism has been disabled, rather than pinning it which would require drilling through the stock and receiver extension. I detail the steps to disable in this thread Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I asked in your Build forum thread about the telescoping stock being on a featureless rifle. I don't believe that you stated that it was disabled which, I assume, makes it okay to use on a featureless. I like the idea & may look into it... Sorry - was afk, and just noticed your post(s). The Featureless Build requires a non-telescoping stock. In this case the CTR's adjustment mechanism has been disabled, rather than pinning it which would require drilling through the stock and receiver extension. I detail the steps to disable in this thread Right on. Thanks for the info. I like the rifle by the way. The rifle grip ain't the 'prettiest' but it isn't about looks as much as it is about functionality.
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Posted: 1/30/2015 11:25:01 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Right on. Thanks for the info. I like the rifle by the way. The rifle grip ain't the 'prettiest' but it isn't about looks as much as it is about functionality. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I asked in your Build forum thread about the telescoping stock being on a featureless rifle. I don't believe that you stated that it was disabled which, I assume, makes it okay to use on a featureless. I like the idea & may look into it... Sorry - was afk, and just noticed your post(s). The Featureless Build requires a non-telescoping stock. In this case the CTR's adjustment mechanism has been disabled, rather than pinning it which would require drilling through the stock and receiver extension. I detail the steps to disable in this thread Right on. Thanks for the info. I like the rifle by the way. The rifle grip ain't the 'prettiest' but it isn't about looks as much as it is about functionality. QFT! Given the alternatives - Monsterman: Hammerhead: 
FHS-15: 
I'm very happy with my choice |
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Posted: 1/31/2015 2:49:06 PM EDT
[#16]
Is the grip ambi?
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Posted: 1/31/2015 3:02:01 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is the grip ambi? Yes, it is. |
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Posted: 1/31/2015 3:19:49 PM EDT
[#18]
Wow
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Posted: 1/31/2015 7:29:35 PM EDT
[#19]
Nice build, I've been thinking of doing a featureless build. How do you think that grip would work for someone with small hands and bad thumbs?
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Posted: 1/31/2015 8:20:26 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
To your first question, yes. An off-list lower, no pistol grip conspicuously below the trigger, a brake instead of a flash hider, PLUS a fixed stock (mine is disabled and does not adjust), all allow you to use a regular mag release and standard mags. To your second question, the magpul mag parts were from rebuild kits used to repair old mags. I'm older than I look. If you're interested in what is / is not California compliant, here is the CALGUNS.NET flow chart that helps to determine what is compliant: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
So, is it that OLL, that grip and no "flash hider" which allows you to use 30 round mags with a regular mag release? Is that a genuine "pre-ban" Pmag? To your first question, yes. An off-list lower, no pistol grip conspicuously below the trigger, a brake instead of a flash hider, PLUS a fixed stock (mine is disabled and does not adjust), all allow you to use a regular mag release and standard mags. To your second question, the magpul mag parts were from rebuild kits used to repair old mags. I'm older than I look. If you're interested in what is / is not California compliant, here is the CALGUNS.NET flow chart that helps to determine what is compliant: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf Dude, your sense of humor must have fallen out of your pocket during the build, maybe your glasses, too. Did you notice the smiley?
It is a nice build. I like it. I was just cataloging why your rifle is lawful. The thing is, I have huge hands and I do not care for the little gap between the stock extension and the top of the grip, into which your hand must slip. Does that bother you when shooting or maneuvering the rifle? |
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Posted: 1/31/2015 11:23:01 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Nice build, I've been thinking of doing a featureless build. How do you think that grip would work for someone with small hands and bad thumbs? Using the grip as it was intended, I would think you'd be fine. I had heard some reviews where people with small hands had problems reaching the safety selector and / or the mag release using the Thorsdon and the Monsterman. The ergos on the RifleGrip are much more natural. See my further explanation in my next post below vvvvvvvvvv |
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Posted: 1/31/2015 11:30:11 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dude, your sense of humor must have fallen out of your pocket during the build, maybe your glasses, too. Did you notice the smiley?
It is a nice build. I like it. I was just cataloging why your rifle is lawful. The thing is, I have huge hands and I do not care for the little gap between the stock extension and the top of the grip, into which your hand must slip. Does that bother you when shooting or maneuvering the rifle? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
So, is it that OLL, that grip and no "flash hider" which allows you to use 30 round mags with a regular mag release? Is that a genuine "pre-ban" Pmag? To your first question, yes. An off-list lower, no pistol grip conspicuously below the trigger, a brake instead of a flash hider, PLUS a fixed stock (mine is disabled and does not adjust), all allow you to use a regular mag release and standard mags. To your second question, the magpul mag parts were from rebuild kits used to repair old mags. I'm older than I look. If you're interested in what is / is not California compliant, here is the CALGUNS.NET flow chart that helps to determine what is compliant: http://www.calguns.net/caawid/flowchart.pdf Dude, your sense of humor must have fallen out of your pocket during the build, maybe your glasses, too. Did you notice the smiley?
It is a nice build. I like it. I was just cataloging why your rifle is lawful. The thing is, I have huge hands and I do not care for the little gap between the stock extension and the top of the grip, into which your hand must slip. Does that bother you when shooting or maneuvering the rifle? Yes, I noticed the smiley, but I wanted to clarify things for those reading this that are not familiar with CA (stupidity) law. The RifleGrip was not intended to be used with an 'overhand / web-of-the-hand" traditional grip hand position. It was actually designed to be used with an A2 stock, and there is a groove along the top spine of the grip for the A2 to mate up with....creating a solid grip. This is due to the N.Y. Safe Act's requirement that you not use a "web" grip. CA isn't quite so sensitive in that area. The RifleGrip was intended to be used with the trigger hand thumb running parallel to the trigger finger - on the same side of the grip. It sounds weird, but it's actually very comfortable in practice. My original intention was to sand / file down the 'wings' above the groove along the top spine, so as to be able to use a "webbed" grip....knowing that I was going to go with a pinned CTR stock and not an A2. However, after mounting the grip and giving it a few minutes, it's quite comfy as is. They're only $15....I strongly urge you to try one for yourself. |
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Posted: 1/31/2015 11:53:37 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The RifleGrip was intended to be used with the trigger hand thumb running parallel to the trigger finger - on the same side of the grip. It sounds weird, but it's actually very comfortable in practice. They're only $15....I strongly urge you to try one for yourself. Cool! I may try one someday. I shoot my bolt rifle in rapid fire with a grip similar to the one you describe. It's too time consuming to operate the bolt, then re-grasp the "wrist" of the stock. The rifle is held in place by the sling, not by your trigger hand. |
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Posted: 2/1/2015 7:17:23 PM EDT
[#24]
Hit the range today with the new build. Nothing 'xploded, no failures of any kind - so I'm very pleased with my build. I had to readjust my zero 3/4", but no big deal.
The WEIRD thing is, I'm SOOO used to using the tip of my chamber flag as a mag release tool, that after every mag I shot I was still looking for my chamber flag, instead of just dropping the mag with the standard mag release. It's a problem, I'm happy to resolve with some more practice. Meanwhile, I was shooting some positional stuff (mostly tank barricades) with my OBR 7.62 (which has a bullet button) for practice for an upcoming match. We were doing a stage requiring 2 mags, and while shooting off of one barricade during the 2nd magazine, a barricade bag strap that was velcro'd around the barrel, got in the way of an ejecting round and bounced an ejected piece of brass back into the chamber causing a double feed. The 2nd round was wedged into the chamber behind the 1st. Typically -- I'd drop the mag to resolve this problem --- EXCEPT I had already dumped my tool (my chamber flag) many yards away when I changed mags earlier in the stage. Well that was stupid... Had to resort to some fancy knife work to eject the errant round without being able to drop the mag....while under the clock. What this tells me is , that if I were ever in a firefight, a California Bullet Button will get you KILLED! God and Mr. Stoner never intended for there to be a tool required. This has me thinking that perhaps I'll convert ALL my AR's to featureless. Gonna have to ponder this a bit. |
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Posted: 2/1/2015 8:48:52 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What this tells me is , that if I were ever in a firefight, a California Bullet Button will get you KILLED! God and Mr. Stoner never intended for there to be a tool required. This has me thinking that perhaps I'll convert ALL my AR's to featureless. Gonna have to ponder this a bit. Have you seen the mags with the built-in 'tool'? I think they are very cool and will likely buy some to avoid the outcome you mentioned. They make an innovative, very nice, ambidextrous Bullet Button, too. Link to video of BB use 
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Posted: 2/1/2015 11:12:24 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you seen the mags with the built-in 'tool'? I think they are very cool and will likely buy some to avoid the outcome you mentioned. They make an innovative, very nice, ambidextrous Bullet Button, too. Link to video of BB use http://siterepository.s3.amazonaws.com/2675/92530120481928x800_ubbtjpg.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What this tells me is , that if I were ever in a firefight, a California Bullet Button will get you KILLED! God and Mr. Stoner never intended for there to be a tool required. This has me thinking that perhaps I'll convert ALL my AR's to featureless. Gonna have to ponder this a bit. Have you seen the mags with the built-in 'tool'? I think they are very cool and will likely buy some to avoid the outcome you mentioned. They make an innovative, very nice, ambidextrous Bullet Button, too. Link to video of BB use http://siterepository.s3.amazonaws.com/2675/92530120481928x800_ubbtjpg.jpg I had NOT seen the 'bilateral bullet button mag release"....That's interesting, BUT I wonder if you can still use a BAD Lever with it (or in the case of my OBR 7.62, a Phase 5 Tactical ambi bolt lever)....looks like they might be really close to each other. Will look into that. I have seen the Thorsdon BB "tool" before , and think I was initially put off the idea by drilling into my mags. I see they have the option to use a Magpul also, which I like better since you don't have to drill the mag -- but I'm running 10 round Gen3 for the .308, and I don't think the Magpuls work on those stubby mags....will have to look into this also. Or I suppose I could get 20/10's if not. Good suggestion, thanks! ETA: After reading up on the Bilateral Bullet Button Mag Release, apparently it does work with Ambi bolt release levers |
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Posted: 2/1/2015 11:21:52 PM EDT
[#27]
Better solution (for me). They make the Ultimate BB Tool in a Ranger Plate that will fit the Gen3 10 round 308 mags
HOWEVER, I just read the install instructions and watched the video below for the Ultimate Bilateral BB Magazine Release...which require drilling 2 new holes in the lower receiver. While I was never planning on selling my LaRue Tactical OBR, I'm not quite sure I want to drill holes into it. Gonna have to wrap my head around THAT. Meanwhile - the Ranger Plates with BB Tool, get me halfway there. 
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Posted: 2/2/2015 12:52:04 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hit the range today with the new build. Nothing 'xploded, no failures of any kind - so I'm very pleased with my build. I had to readjust my zero 3/4", but no big deal. The WEIRD thing is, I'm SOOO used to using the tip of my chamber flag as a mag release tool, that after every mag I shot I was still looking for my chamber flag, instead of just dropping the mag with the standard mag release. It's a problem, I'm happy to resolve with some more practice. Meanwhile, I was shooting some positional stuff (mostly tank barricades) with my OBR 7.62 (which has a bullet button) for practice for an upcoming match. We were doing a stage requiring 2 mags, and while shooting off of one barricade during the 2nd magazine, a barricade bag strap that was velcro'd around the barrel, got in the way of an ejecting round and bounced an ejected piece of brass back into the chamber causing a double feed. The 2nd round was wedged into the chamber behind the 1st. Typically -- I'd drop the mag to resolve this problem --- EXCEPT I had already dumped my tool (my chamber flag) many yards away when I changed mags earlier in the stage. Well that was stupid... Had to resort to some fancy knife work to eject the errant round without being able to drop the mag....while under the clock. What this tells me is , that if I were ever in a firefight, a California Bullet Button will get you KILLED! God and Mr. Stoner never intended for there to be a tool required. This has me thinking that perhaps I'll convert ALL my AR's to featureless. Gonna have to ponder this a bit. Great thread. A featurless build like this is now on my to do list. Heres what I did for using my bullet buttons after trying various methods and objects. I bought a key ring with a 5.56 inert round on it. I attached a retractable Badge holder I bought at lowes. It has a clip on it to attach to your belt, plate carrier, vest etc. Last round fired to bolt lock, grab the key ring round and release mag, drop key ring round (it auto retracts out of the way but still retained on your person), grab new mag and insert, release bolt, rock n roll. It works surprising well and with practice is pretty quick. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 2:09:01 AM EDT
[#29]
I wouldn't consider drilling the holes without using their jig. Even though I could do a good job, I just wouldn't do it any other way.
I saw the Ranger-type bases but thought I'd let you explore their offerings. I am very, very proud of the designers and fabricators in the gun industry. They have developed and marketed several products that have SIGNIFICANTLY improved our self defense situation in the wake of the crappy, unconstitutional laws enacted in this State. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 2:15:15 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't consider drilling the holes without using their jig. Even though I could do a good job, I just wouldn't do it any other way. I saw the Ranger-type bases but thought I'd let you explore their offerings. I am very, very proud of the designers and fabricators in the gun industry. They have developed and marketed several products that have SIGNIFICANTLY improved our self defense situation in the wake of the crappy, unconstitutional laws enacted in this State. Yeah, the jig is a no-brainer, although I find it slightly annoying that they're not included with the ambi release, and cost an extra $40....although I suppose that keeping them separate helps keep the price down on the mag release itself. |
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Posted: 2/16/2015 7:17:46 PM EDT
[#31]
Just make sure you possessed the high cap mags you decide to use before 1 Jan 2000. Magpuls were not available at that time. The repair kit approach is really thin ice. Personally, I use GI 20/30 mags with absolutely no date stamps on the bodies. This is the truly safe way to get around the mag law.
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Posted: 2/16/2015 7:21:12 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just make sure you possessed the high cap mags you decide to use before 1 Jan 2000. Magpuls were not available at that time. The repair kit approach is really thin ice. Personally, I use GI 20/30 mags with absolutely no date stamps on the bodies. This is the truly safe way to get around the mag law. Already asked and answered, but your concern is appreciated. |
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Posted: 2/17/2015 3:59:47 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Already asked and answered, but your concern is appreciated. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Just make sure you possessed the high cap mags you decide to use before 1 Jan 2000. Magpuls were not available at that time. The repair kit approach is really thin ice. Personally, I use GI 20/30 mags with absolutely no date stamps on the bodies. This is the truly safe way to get around the mag law. Already asked and answered, but your concern is appreciated. My buddy who is a Sacramento cop is under the impression that mere possession of any 30 rounder is a misdemeanor, regardless of when you acquired it. I keep telling him that the law hasn't changed at all, and possession is still legal. He is a gun guy too, so this is pretty worrisome. You may beat the rap but you can't beat the ride. |
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Posted: 2/17/2015 4:11:55 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My buddy who is a Sacramento cop is under the impression that mere possession of any 30 rounder is a misdemeanor, regardless of when you acquired it. I keep telling him that the law hasn't changed at all, and possession is still legal. He is a gun guy too, so this is pretty worrisome. You may beat the rap but you can't beat the ride. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just make sure you possessed the high cap mags you decide to use before 1 Jan 2000. Magpuls were not available at that time. The repair kit approach is really thin ice. Personally, I use GI 20/30 mags with absolutely no date stamps on the bodies. This is the truly safe way to get around the mag law. Already asked and answered, but your concern is appreciated. My buddy who is a Sacramento cop is under the impression that mere possession of any 30 rounder is a misdemeanor, regardless of when you acquired it. I keep telling him that the law hasn't changed at all, and possession is still legal. He is a gun guy too, so this is pretty worrisome. You may beat the rap but you can't beat the ride. QFT, however the law is still the law, and your buddy is badly misinformed. I would suggest you offer him this link to CALGUNS.NET 's flow chart download There's already plenty of derp to go 'round the PRK, and your avatar sums it up nicely. |
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Posted: 2/17/2015 4:54:37 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My buddy who is a Sacramento cop is under the impression that mere possession of any 30 rounder is a misdemeanor, regardless of when you acquired it. I keep telling him that the law hasn't changed at all, and possession is still legal. He is a gun guy too, so this is pretty worrisome. You may beat the rap but you can't beat the ride. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Just make sure you possessed the high cap mags you decide to use before 1 Jan 2000. Magpuls were not available at that time. The repair kit approach is really thin ice. Personally, I use GI 20/30 mags with absolutely no date stamps on the bodies. This is the truly safe way to get around the mag law. Already asked and answered, but your concern is appreciated. My buddy who is a Sacramento cop is under the impression that mere possession of any 30 rounder is a misdemeanor, regardless of when you acquired it. I keep telling him that the law hasn't changed at all, and possession is still legal. He is a gun guy too, so this is pretty worrisome. You may beat the rap but you can't beat the ride. Ask your cop buddy what section of the penal code he would charge him with violating. -W |
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Posted: 2/20/2015 12:51:45 PM EDT
[#36]
Great thread, great build. I'm in the middle of a couple builds myself... and I'm originally not from California. Getting abreast of all the prohibitive BS this state throws at you is making my head hurt. Glad to see someone making it work nonetheless.
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