Among all the manufacturers making MP5 clones, which one most closely resembles the real deal?


By "resembles," I mean, which one is the most authentic (down to very last detail) clone? Zenith, POF, Atlantic, Getz?

EDIT: I realize none of these are going to be 100% like an original HK - just wanted your opinion on which model you think "get's it right" - the best of the bunch.

Not sure about any of the new mfg guns, but the later made Special Weapons guns were well made and reliable. When they went out of business they sold the forming dies to Vector I believe.

Grab a DJ Getz before you can't anymore. Atlantic has a few in stock. DJ announced on HKpro a short time ago that he is no longer going to make them anymore. He is regarded as one of the best MP5 clone builders around. His welds are beautiful.

Doesnt DJ Getz just have Todd Bailey make his recievers, and Getz does final QA and assembly, minus the firing pin?

He and TB seemed to be pretty cozy and I've always suspected that was the case.

Regarding US made guns rolled from a flat I've never seen anything better than builds from Dakota Tactical.

Looks like Getz doesn't have any full size Mp5 clones at Atlantic - just the K version.

I suppose it's either Zenith or Atlantic at this point.

No different than all the AR lowers that come from the same few machine shops.. Just engrave a different name and logo on them. I think that's all DJG guns are, but with better customer service and quality assurance.

Personally I like PCS clones. If you are in the mood to buy a parts kit and ship it off, I think for the money spent, Jeff Walters puts out the best guns, best turn around and best price.

+1 for PCS. Jeff is a great guy who really knows his stuff. His prices are reasonable too.

The Zenith/MKE guns are outstanding.

from one POV, the Zenith guns (and to a lesser extent the POF's) are closest to a German HK MP5. I would say closer than an HK94 in the sense that they are built as MP5's from the start, albeit modified to pistol status to satisfy importation rules. The difference between the two (POF and MKE) mainly being weld quality and finish. I would think that a POF could be refinished to the quality of the MKE, and welds can be cleaned up.

Both guns are produced by licensed military production facilities.

On the other hand, the US clones may be fully equal to or even exceed a German MP5, but are more boutique built. They may exceed the HK in build quality due to the hands on work going on, and are many times using German parts or parts kits. The down side is that in some, some parts are used, so that's a consideration as well.

I don't know of any US clones which exceed German MP5 quality, but I haven't examined and fired them all. I just don't see how that's possible. HK manufacturing quality is, and always has been, outstanding, even though the company changed hands several times. I can understand having beneficial extra features like an optics rail welded on top, but one could be welded onto a German MP5 as well. I don't see how the lack of one could make it inferior from a build quality standpoint. I don't know of anything else US clones have as an offering that isn't available elsewhere. Am I missing something?

 

I agree the front pushpin on the POF and MKE/Zenith offerings is very cool, and closer to an original MP5. I agree MKE has better fit and finish than POF. I think, for the price, it's the best MP5 clone available today. Even if a HK94 was the same price, the front pushpin is very appealing.

I've owned a few of the clones (a Vector 10mm, two Coharie 9mm Ks, a MKE Z5K) and one of the real deal guns (an SP89).

I still own the Vector (which is now an SBR) and the MKE (which is pending a form 1).

The closest clone in assembly quality, fit and finish to the real SP89 that I had in the 90s is the MKE. The worst I owned were the Coharies, of which I owned TWO and both took considerable effort in parts swapping to get running right. I have always heard good things about the DJ Getz clones but I've never owned one. DJ Getz had a thread over on HKPro detailing all the work they have to do to the Bailey supplied parts to get them into the quality guns they produce. I have also heard good things about the Atlantic Firearms "AA" series of guns.

The most "authentic" clone on the market you can get right now IMO is the MKE. It is built on HK machines and finished to HK specs, it uses a push pin lower and has the correct layout. It is a nitpick of mine but I'm a bit of a K fiend, and the lion's share of the K clones on the market are "incorrect" guns... they have the wrong rear sights, the wrong cocking handles, the wrong sling adapters, the wrong backplates, etc. etc. etc. The MKE guns are pattern correct to the current HK MP5KA4 and PDW pattern, they accept push pin lowers, have the correct castle rear sights, etc. If your goal is to make a "correct" clone, the MKE's are the way to go. The only downside to the MKE is the bolt block, and that is only a problem if you plan on using the gun as a host for a registered sear.

And from my own personal experience I would AVOID any and all Special Weapons, Coharie, Bobcat, Omega, or whatever other names the Bailey produced guns are going by these days unless you get it for an absolute steal price wise. Yes there are good ones out there, but in my personal experience their guns are predominantly project guns in need of TLC to get and keep running right. Unless the guy before you put in all the leg work, always price extra money into those guns to get them running. As I already said I had TWO Coharie K pistols and NEITHER ran out of the box without a good deal of parts swapping.

I think in order to choose which clone you want to buy you need to ask yourself two questions: First, is this going to be a wall hanger collector's item or a shooter? Second, do I plan to someday buy a registered full auto sear?

If the answers are Collector's Item and Yes, then go DJ Getz.

If the answers are Shooter and Yes, then go with the Atlantic AA series.

If the answers are Collector's item and No, then go MKE.

If the answers are Shooter and No, then POF or still go MKE.

My point is only that a builder can take extra care to make clean welds, and/or clean them up prior to finish application. They can take particular care that the finish is 100%, whereas an MKE may not be 100%

A griped I heard the other day is that the MKE three lug is finished and isn't supposed to be. I mean, big deal. In the same case, the barrel is supposed to be CmV CHF, not stainless.

 
Sounds like the MKE is the winner - for me anyway.


Appreciate all the info. Very much obliged.

I've heard the Atlantic guns are great, but if authenticity is a #1 concern, note that the rear sight is a bit incorrect.  The largest aperture setting on the rear sight should still be a closed aperture, but on the AA, it's an open V shape, like on the G3.  I think it's cooler to have the V shape, since it's better than just 4 closed apertures of varying size, but I don't think it's 100% authentic to have it.

I had pretty awful cs from Getz when I had problems with one I got straight from him (full price, standard warranty).  Pretty good cs from Atlantic by comparison.  But as long as you get whichever one from Atlantic they'll take care of you.

It's a G3 drum on the AA clones.  An mp5 drum can be swapped on there if you want.  I have one on my aa89.

Turner Fab build. All German, minus receiver. Runs beautifully in full auto (with an RSP). Well worth the $3K pricetag.

I have a Getz that is finicky. OP if you decide you want one and find someone with a Getz in stock I would double check what the warranty would be since he has closed shop right now from what I have seen him post.

I personally would go with AA, MKE or buy a parts kit and send to a reputable builder to finish out.

I surprised you guys have been having as many problems as you have with Getz guns.  Mine runs like a Swiss watch, in semi, burst, and auto.  And Dave has been very responsive to every email I've ever sent him about stuff...

Replying to email, and fixing a defective gun,  are 2 very different things.

 
Getz is closing his shop in the very near future, so if you do get one of his last remaining guns, repairs will have to be provided by another builder.


Not that his guns are known for problems, most seem to love them, but it's worth mentioning.

So far I've been very impressed with my new MKE.

My advice on the subject of buying a clone, would be pay for the quality (buy once cry once);  as someone who had a MP5/40 built I've found that is something to live by

Sure they are.  But you're talking about one of the most well-respected HK clone builders in the country with hundreds of very happy customers.  I'd be pretty shocked to hear he wouldn't make something right on a problematic gun.  He has quite a few QC standards and practices in-place and every gun is hand-inspected more than a few times and test fired before leaving his shop.  I find it hard to believe that soemthing truly major could go wrong with one of his guns, as far as welding, tolerances, etc. are concerned.  Certainly something could break or be defective as far as a part is concerned, but the actual receiver, etc. I'd be surprised if something was wrong.

Again, I'd be really shocked if Dave didn't try to resolve the issue quickly.




I'm actually curious about that.  From what he told me, he's basically closing up shop for good.  Without going into specifics, he said that he likely won't be able to handle it physically in the future.  

Is Atlantic going to back the guns in the event that Dave in-fact can't handle warranty and service needs in the future?

I understand he is well-respected. For the volume of guns he has put into the market, the low number of complaints speaks to that. My comment regarding emails was in response to this:







And as you asked above, there are guns for sale that potential customers have to wonder what the warrany status will be. No different from buying any other product and having the manufacturer go out of business. Ive never shot/handled/seen DJGetz's guns but I wish Dave the best and it is unfortunate that he has to step out of the US clone market.

Well it sounds like AA is doing or will do the right thing if and when a DJ Getz gun goes down. I have a Getz gun and I am a bit concerned about the long term warranty help on it as well. I would think an acceptable solution would be a replacement of a similar custom clone they offer or a refund if the gun catastrophically fails. If they can fix it then that's great as well. I recently bought one in the last month and decided to pick up one from AA for this very reason as I am sure the one's bought directly from Dave will be difficult to warranty in the near future if he shuts down 100%

Great

Cant go wrong with Zenith/MKE. They are licensed by HK and made on HK equipment.. Just ordered on myself!!

Now I feel like I should have gone that route given AA's statement. They didn't mention a word to me about it during the ordering process.

 
You're gonna love it.


What model did you get?

I have one old MKE AT94 getting cut down right now and apparently I missed it already so I ordered a Z-5P tonight.

As soon as I get the serial number off will go the form 1.

My new 9mm suppressor should be here about the same time as the MKE.

Are you active or retired Military?
Corrections?
LEO?
Zenith has a "Heroes" program.

See that's the opposite of what I heard from him directly last month.

"I would take an educated guess that I will not be able to perform any duties at all in the future."



Either he's changed his mind or he, Atlantic, and his customers aren't really on the same page.  

This is a fairly serious issue, and no one can get a straight answer it seems.  Atlantic is offering Dave's guns for sale and advertising that he's going to handle service afterward, but he's telling others that it's very unlikely he'll be able to offer any service at all.  It's fairly unacceptable that these guns are being offered as though a warranty exists when it may be entirely unlikely that any service will be available.

Seriously, what's the story?  I'm very much in the market for another gun, but I'm tired of being lead around on a leash.  Something isn't right

I have a Turner Fabrications and it has been flawless

Cannot find the info on their site.

Shoot me your email and I can send it to you. They just sent me the info and I mailed it out yesterday to get one. In the PDF it says they will give you a code so you get the discount online, but they told me they were having trouble getting that set up so you print out forms and mail them in.

Speshul Weapunz was an 'interesting' clone manufacturer.

I got an email from Dave Getz today and he backed all guns sold through Atlantic.  They are good to go and apparently, he managed to work something out.

I offer Atlantic Firearms a public apology.  Buy with confidence.

 
Doesn't surprise me.




Atlantic is on my VERY short list of gun dealers I do business with online.




Their reputation for an insistence on quality and customer service is well earned.




I'd go as far to say that I can think of no company that I'd rate higher in both of the categories above.


 

This is great to hear. Thanks!

Getz is a great guy.

Dave Getz is a nice guy, and somewhat local to me.  I was fortunate to be able to buy my k sbr in person.  It functions flawlessly, from day one as well.

If like to get a full-size now, and would but another from Dave, but I guess mke is a good option at this point?  I'm still trying to sort out what they did to block full auto use.

MKE welds a bar on the bottom of the receiver that prevents installation of a full auto bolt carrier and they have a tab where the magwell push pin is so the lowers do not "swing down" and you cannot install a factory select fire trigger box.

Damn.  I don't mind any of that but that lack of "swing down."  I figured that would come worth having a real pin.

I have a MKE Z5K and honestly I don't care if the lower doesn't swing down. The dual push pin lower is more about having proper trigger group to receiver fit than anything. I've owned a few shelf clones over the past decade and it was always a worry that the trigger group shelf might not be installed at the right height if you switched trigger housings.

With my MKE I have zero worry about that. I've changed my factory SEF pack and housing to an ambi navy style and it worked perfectly fine. Fit like a glove. In the past with my Coharie clones and my Vector there has always been slight alignment concerns, mostly on the Coharies... they were built by blind parkinsons patients compared to this MKE.