Hey guys, I need some help concerning sights for Titan 415 uppers.  I just bought a couple of Titan 415 uppers http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=475233306 on Gun Broker from Todd.  I just couldn't pass up complete piston uppers for $610 each.  But these uppers don't come with iron sights.  RTG has a set of http://www.robertrtg.com/store/pc/416-417-SIGHT-SET-HK-PICATINNY-223p87.htm iron sight for  picatinny rail mount.  According to one of the posts here http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_3_118/458441_.html&page=3 the post at the top of the page states "upper receiver is .065 taller than that of the HK416".  My understanding is the 416 is the standard A3 height.  So where can I get sights the right height to put the sights where they should be?  Any help would be appreciated.

Scott

The HK416 is not the standard AR height; it's slightly higher. The 415 is .065" higher than that.

Any AR sights will work, they just need to be level with each other. The "sight line" will obviously be a little higher relative to the stock comb, but that's not really a problem for most people.

But isn't the sights being higher than standard be the "rub"?  Yes I could sight in a standard set of AR sights for a certain distance, but the hold over or hold under would be different than any other AR I have, because the offset between the center of the bore and the height if the sights is higher than standard iron sights.  I've sighted in most all of my AR uppers at 50 years.  So the hold over or under would be the same for the same distances.  To have the same hold over points with these two Titan uppers I'd need to have lower profile sights so the center of bore to sight height would be the same as standard.  I suppose I could modify two sets of iron sights to give me the standard sight height.  But that would take some custom work.  If someone knows of a source for Titan sights, or at least sights the same height as Titan, I'd think that would be cheaper and easier than trying to build them myself.

Scott

You're right; the holdovers would be different. I don't know how much of a difference the .065" would make if you used HK416 sights. They only go to 400m. Probably could determine the difference using a ballistics calculator. I'm not aware of any sights specifically made for the Titan, since it's unique (I think). The HKParts says "28.4 sight line" on their site, for the 416 sight.

Yes, the HK 416 sights are cool.  I just don't know as I would spend $350-$400 ($200 for the rear and $150-$185 for the front sight) on a set of HK 416 sights and then be off because of that extra .065" of height.  I wonder if the flip up front sight http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/Front-Folding-Sight-28mm-HK-416-MR556-p26.htm would mount on the gas block of the Titan upper?  Then I'd only have to custom make the rear sight.  Hell, for the same money as the HK iron sights, I could buy a low miles EOTech sight and not worry about Iron sights.  YMMV.

Scott

Where are you seeing the sites for that much?

RTG has then all day for less 130 I believe.

but I am in the same boat on sites for my Titan 415

Personally, I would just get some AR sights that don't have built-in preset distance elevation points, like maybe Troy lo-pro's. Then I'd just "Kentucky elevate" as needed beyond my basic zero, when not using my EOTech, ACOG, or whatever optic.

Are these uppers any good? Information seems to be sparse.

I've been super happy with mines so far. Accuracy has been pretty good and I've installed on my suppressor on it permanently.

Thanks for the info I might just have to pick up one of the 14.5" uppers regardless of the Toad connection.

Didn't someone buy the titan tooling and is getting ready to go into production?

That would explain the sudden emergence and offloading of these titan uppers.

I think I'd rather wait and have a warranty.

I'm waiting to see if they drop the upper height .065".

It is hard not to answer sarcastically, but I'm trying not to.  If you click on the red highlighted text in my post above and in the "KitBuilder" post directly above that, you would link to HK Parts.  They have actual HK 416 sights.  Yes as I posted RTG does have cheap sights.  HK 416 sights are lower because the 416 rail and upper receiver is higher than standard.  Is the RTG sights even the right height for a 416?  And the RTG rear sight looks like it is a surplus roller lock sights.  So is the rear sight a 5.56X45 or a 7.62X51 surplus sight?  Would these sights be a good on a subgun.

So buy a set and tell me how they work. on your upper.  I live in Las Vegas and shoot on BLM south of town.  I want to shoot 300 meters.  The HK 416 sights are set up to 400 meters.  But the Titan needs even lower sights.  I don't know as I want iron sights in the way and would spend the money on the Troy sights.



My limited understanding is Todd is retiring in HI and selling off all this gun stuff he has.  It is my understanding that back when these uppers first came out they where double this price.



It is my understanding that the height difference is so they don't have any patent issues with HK.  If someone actually starts producing this upper again, who knows?  LWRC makes a great product.  But at $610 per example you could buy three of these Titan uppers for about the cost of one LWRC (at least according to the LWRC website).  This was a couple of years ago, but the Agency price for a complete 416 was around $1,700 each.  I don't know as HK sells just uppers.  There would be difficulty in importing the barrel without a machinegun receiver attached.  YMMV.

Scott

I'm sorry for resurrecting this thread but once again.


Can someone recommend for me once again which BUIS to buy to properly use on the Titan?

Just get those sites from HKparts?

End of story, and it will work as long as I zero it correctly?

I'd get troy micros.

This is a very good option.  I am running magpul BUIS for the time being.  I got the hk 416 sights from RTG a long time ago.  The only issue I got with the HK sights is that it does not allows my red dots to do 1/3 co-witness. I goes over the hk sights too high and I would need to get one of my dots down to absolute co-witness level.

There is the rub.  I know of no where that is selling actual Titan sights.  The Titan rail is .065" higher than the HK 416/MR556.  and the HK top rail is higher than the standard AR flat top receiver.  So to spend the big money on the actual factory HK sights, but they will not be correct for the Titan upper because the the height to bore center different.  Now if the flip up sight was used in the front and the rear sight was modified to be 0.065" lower, then the factory sights would get me to 400 m with the Titan.

On the other hand, if you just want to shoot to 100 yards, buy the RTG sights, zero them there, and hold a little lower for closer shots.  I'm looking to shoot to shoot to 300 m.  I would spend the money on the factory sights, but I'd need to modify them to get them to work.  

Scott

Well I think I have a partial fix, at least for the front.  I bought a used 416 rail.  So I can mount a standard 416 front sight on the top rail of a 416 rail.  So now I just have to modify the rear sight.  YMMV.

Scott