"Project Carbine:" Rebuilding an M1 Carbine in really rough shape - Page 1

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - "Project Carbine:" Rebuilding an M1 Carbine in really rough shape

Posted: 4/26/2016 7:02:09 PM EDT

If you followed my "Project Garand" thread you saw a really crap Garand turn into a shooter. Monday morning I ran my co-worker who I acquired the Garand from. I showed him pictures of the finished project. He liked what he saw and I was extremely grateful for the deal he gave me... He than said he was looking for an AR upper and I happen to have an extra BCM standard M4 upper in my safe. After a little more talking he told me he had an M1 carbine from the same place in the same condition as the Garand. I knew this would likely be a bad trade on my part but being a believer that one good turn deserves another(Garand for $150)I accepted the trade.

So here's what I got. The gun itself is a 1943 Quality Hardware. The barrel is a 1943 Underwood(likely original to the gun) and the trigger group is a Saginaw. The rifle is a mixmaster with an "improve barrel band and safety. My goal is to the same honest restoration to this one as a fitting compliment to my Garand.

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Posted: 4/26/2016 7:44:52 PM EDT

[#1]

Read through your other thread and nearly called dupe on this one. Then I realized it's an M1. Carry on, you did nice work on the Garand and I can't wait to see what you do with this.

Posted: 4/26/2016 8:06:17 PM EDT

[#2]

Doesn't look bad at all. Only thing I see is it appears somebody painted it black and the paint is wearing off.

Posted: 4/26/2016 9:29:24 PM EDT

[#3]

I've just started tearing into it... The one thing that stands out as a negative with this gun is that whoever painted it black obviously stripped it to bare metal first. Once I degrease it it almost immediately starts to rust. The upshot is that this thing is a real mixed up mess of parts so I don't feel particularly bad about blueing it.

So far parts missing are:

Buttplate and screw
Recoil block, screw and washer
Stock
Front band spring
Sear spring

Parts to replace:
Recoil spring
Ejector/spring
Extractor spring

The gas piston moves but it isn't smooth so it will be soaking overnight. I'll continue to update daily. Any input or comments are appreciated. Thanks!

Posted: 4/26/2016 11:33:51 PM EDT

[#4]

Did you ask him if they were in a fire?

How does the bore look?

I will enjoy watching this project also.

Good luck.

Posted: 4/27/2016 12:05:19 AM EDT

[#5]

The bore looks great on this one. I asked about fire the previous owner didn't believe so. My assumption is that he is correct as the smallest springs in both of these rifles are still perfectly functional. In my experience it doesn't take much heat for little springs to lose power/temper.

Posted: 4/27/2016 2:40:39 PM EDT

[#6]

Holy crap, that way that keeps the op slide spring captive in the receiver, that's like an early style. Or maybe that's just how quality hardware did it. I remember reading that in the book I have. Duff's I think it is. But most of the time there just a channel there, machined into the receiver.

Dude, it's very cool. Work your magic!

I'm curious if you're going to break the bolt down. And how? It is a thing....... You usually need the bolt tool. Or 4 hands. Seriously. At least 3 hands.

Posted: 4/27/2016 2:54:34 PM EDT

[#7]

Breaking the bolt down is no big deal! Putting it back together took 10 minutes of patients and muffled profanity.

Posted: 4/27/2016 9:07:36 PM EDT

[#8]

Roll mark pic:

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Posted: 4/28/2016 5:15:50 PM EDT

[#9]

Quote History

Quoted:
Breaking the bolt down is no big deal! Putting it back together took 10 minutes of patients and muffled profanity.

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Do you have Three or four hands? Or did you use the tool? You must have a trick that I don't know about. Of course I never used my vice, which might've helped. It's outside and my gun bench is in the basement. I need to change that. LOL.

Posted: 4/28/2016 7:54:31 PM EDT

[#10]

I wouldn't blue it. Bead blast and park it light gray.

Posted: 4/28/2016 9:53:25 PM EDT

[#11]

Quote History

Quoted:

Do you have Three or four hands? Or did you use the tool? You must have a trick that I don't know about. Of course I never used my vice, which might've helped. It's outside and my gun bench is in the basement. I need to change that. LOL.

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
Breaking the bolt down is no big deal! Putting it back together took 10 minutes of patients and muffled profanity.

Do you have Three or four hands? Or did you use the tool? You must have a trick that I don't know about. Of course I never used my vice, which might've helped. It's outside and my gun bench is in the basement. I need to change that. LOL.

No actually my saving grace was one of the bolts that sticks out of my reloading press on my bench. It was just the right size to hold the ejector in. A piece of tape held the firing pin from backing out; then all I had to do was hold the extractor spring down with a screw driver and ouch down the extractor. It takes some tough tumbs

and finely tuned stubbornness.

Posted: 4/28/2016 10:57:44 PM EDT

[#12]

So today 3 parts showed up for this project: the buttplate/screw, recoil plate/bolt/nut, and the gas piston wrench.

The gas port was plugged on this rifle and I tried soaking it in a few different things with no luck. After reading a bunch of stuff about removing the gas piston I was a little nervous about this step. Much to my surprise it came out with little difficulty. A piece of advice: take it out like you are running a tap(turn forward/ then backward). This smoothed out the staking and the nut had no damage. Cleaning the piston/port/ and cylinder was uneventful and I put it back together using blue locktite. I will restake it after function testing.

Tonight's other project was to finish the stripped metal parts. My goal is for this carbine to be a companion piece to my Garand so I wanted the finish to match. In order to match the Garand's patina I applied cold blue to the entire gun in small sections then steelwooled (#1 steel wool soaked in Rem-Oil) the finish back of until it had the look I was going for. It's really close to my Garand and look better than the bare metal pictured above. I think it turned out pretty well.

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Posted: 4/28/2016 11:41:25 PM EDT

[#13]

Heck yeah that looks good!!! Great job!!!!

Posted: 4/29/2016 7:58:50 AM EDT

[#14]

Quote History

Quoted:
Holy crap, that way that keeps the op slide spring captive in the receiver, that's like an early style. Or maybe that's just how quality hardware did it. I remember reading that in the book I have. Duff's I think it is. But most of the time there just a channel there, machined into the receiver.

Dude, it's very cool. Work your magic!

I'm curious if you're going to break the bolt down. And how? It is a thing....... You usually need the bolt tool. Or 4 hands. Seriously. At least 3 hands.

View Quote

As for the recoil spring tube: after some research I found out that Quality Hardware was the only manufacturer to stick with the old style detachable tube. One thing that differs they changed the design slightly to eliminate possible cracking issues. I have to admit I know less about carbines than I do Garands. As with the Garand project learning about a system and then applying it teaches you a lot! I'm pretty solid on the Garand system(now) and hopefully I will be as proficient on the carbine when I'm finished. My dad owns one as well and I like to be able to be the family armorer and at least be able to maintain the guns we have around. I'm planning on having him drop his off at some point so I can give it a once over after I finish this one.

Posted: 4/29/2016 1:29:05 PM EDT

[#15]

IMHO, the bolt is a the weak link on the carbines. I had to rebuild mine a coupe times with not a lot of rounds through it. Well, the mags too, they can be finnicky.

Posted: 4/29/2016 9:24:32 PM EDT

[#16]

You did well with your M1 Garand, and I look forward to your Carbine project

Parkerized finish is really the only one that feels right, blued or paints

Posted: 4/29/2016 10:46:24 PM EDT

[#17]

New blueing I would agree but I'm pretty partial to worn bluing.

Posted: 4/30/2016 12:26:14 AM EDT

[#18]

The only thing that "should" be blued on a carbine, is the bolt. That's how they did at least.

Posted: 4/30/2016 7:53:18 AM EDT

[#19]

Here is a side by side of my Garand with its original worn patina and the carbines new, old finish. I've got lots of guns with nice finishes and I really am more drawn to old weird/worn finish. On the other hand I like nice even oil finishes on stocks.

. Anyway I think it's going ok for a construction worker not a gunsmith!

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Posted: 4/30/2016 11:28:00 AM EDT

[#20]

Good job, they match up well.

Where are you getting the stock?

We need a rage report.

Posted: 4/30/2016 2:19:18 PM EDT

[#21]

I'm getting an unfinished stock from Fulton armory. All my springs are coming from there as well.

Posted: 5/2/2016 9:07:28 PM EDT

[#22]

My stock showed up today along with all my new springs. I'm glad to be back on this project. I fitted it tonight and applied stain. Here's a picture of the stock raw.

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Posted: 5/2/2016 9:38:14 PM EDT

[#23]

That grain is beautiful

Posted: 5/2/2016 10:04:42 PM EDT

[#24]

OP, where did you get the stock?

Posted: 5/2/2016 10:54:33 PM EDT

[#25]

Fulton armory. It's got Boyd's markings. I like it the grain pattern it will match my Garand almost perfectly.

Posted: 5/2/2016 11:27:55 PM EDT

[#26]

Quote History

Quoted:

Fulton armory. It's got Boyd's markings. I like it the grain pattern will match my Garand almost perfectly.

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It is nice. did it take much fitting?

The wheels are turning...

Posted: 5/3/2016 12:43:20 PM EDT

[#27]

It really wouldn't have taken any fitting at all... I did however relieve the area under the charging handle to avoid future wear and the nose to allow easier removal of the barrel band.

Posted: 5/3/2016 5:50:17 PM EDT

[#28]

Staining complete: finish starts tonight.

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Posted: 5/5/2016 12:21:40 PM EDT

[#29]

looks nice

Posted: 5/6/2016 9:31:21 PM EDT

[#30]

I took the project Carbine out for the first time today.
I fired 75rds with no malfunctions. I zeroed the rifle and
then burned the rest of my ammo up shooting my steel plate
offhand @ 25, 50, and 100. This was after shooting my
Garand so a couple things stood out. First compared to the
Garand this thing feels like a toy! You can spray bullets @25yds
due to the lack of recoil. Secondly compared to the Garand the
trigger is strikingly bad. Lastly it's way more work to get hits at 100
with this rifle. Between the trigger and lack weight it's a challenge
to get it to settle down.
Here is a picture with 4 casings in the air:

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And here is a pic with its big brother:

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In closing I'm completely satisfied with how this project turned out. The little carbine is a blast and runs like a top...
But if I had to choose I'd take the Garand every time!
Thanks for following along

Posted: 5/6/2016 11:31:44 PM EDT

[#31]

Nice job! I built up a barreled receiver from the CMP several years ago, and enjoyed learning about the weapon. Enjoy it.

Posted: 5/7/2016 11:30:18 AM EDT

[#32]

Great pics!

U would take the garand over the carbine indoors? I would take the carbine over the garand for 50 yards and under any day. But I just like light weight and low recoil. But yeah, when u start trying to shoot at distance, the garand will shine. I have shot my carbine at 300 though. I had to adjust for a lot of windage for some reason.

We had two targets somewhat close together and I was aiming at the other target to get hits on mine. Lol. I think it had someting to do with the fact that my rear sight is pretty far off set to one side but the sight is somewhat centered to zero at 100. I guess that was common. Or the wind was pushing it farther than I thought it should. Or its because I cant remember if it was 300 or 400 we shot at. I remember we were really trying to stretch its legs though.

Posted: 5/7/2016 12:38:49 PM EDT

[#33]

Quote History

Quoted:
Great pics!

U would take the garand over the carbine indoors? I would take the carbine over the garand for 50 yards and under any day. But I just like light weight and low recoil. But yeah, when u start trying to shoot at distance, the garand will shine. I have shot my carbine at 300 though. I had to adjust for a lot of windage for some reason.

We had two targets somewhat close together and I was aiming at the other target to get hits on mine. Lol. I think it had someting to do with the fact that my rear sight is pretty far off set to one side but the sight is somewhat centered to zero at 100. I guess that was common. Or the wind was pushing it farther than I thought it should. Or its because I cant remember if it was 300 or 400 we shot at. I remember we were really trying to stretch its legs though.

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I guess the standpoint I was considering was the WW2 solider being married to one rifle for the campaign. Considering the different situations you would encounter I would rather have the Garand. Now for jungle fighting where shots are close and rain happens a lot I'd pick the carbine. It's really light and handy. It also is really easy to break down if it's wet. Inside only the carbine would be a good choice because it's so short, light, and handy. Also as you can see above its really easy to shoot fast. Of the 4 shots fired in the pic above 3 were hits on a 12" plate. That would be solid shooting with a comped AR with an optic!

On the other hand 4 hits of .30 Carbine on a 1/2"x12" Ar500 plate barely causes it to wiggle. 2 shots from the Garand and it knocks my target stand over!

Posted: 5/7/2016 8:59:18 PM EDT

[#34]

I hear that. I peronsally think a GP military rifle should be able to reach out and touch someone if you need to. Because I've read enough combat books that show engagements can happen past 25 meters. I've got no experience past deer hunting though. But even in WI, long shots can be common. Well you know that.

Posted: 5/7/2016 9:10:20 PM EDT

[#35]

Quote History

Quoted:
I hear that. I peronsally think a GP military rifle should be able to reach out and touch someone if you need to. Because I've read enough combat books that show engagements can happen past 25 meters. I've got no experience past deer hunting though. But even in WI, long shots can be common. Well you know that.

View Quote

Same here. But that's a good analogy: I know I feel a lot better in a swamp with my 300 than in a beanfield with a 45/70!

Posted: 5/7/2016 10:58:02 PM EDT

[#36]

Great job on the refurb. "Little Brother" looks awesome. You can be quite proud of that work.

Posted: 5/7/2016 11:47:42 PM EDT

[#37]

Quote History

Quoted:

Same here. But that's a good analogy: I know I feel a lot better in a swamp with my 300 than in a beanfield with a 45/70!

View Quote View All Quotes

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
I hear that. I peronsally think a GP military rifle should be able to reach out and touch someone if you need to. Because I've read enough combat books that show engagements can happen past 25 meters. I've got no experience past deer hunting though. But even in WI, long shots can be common. Well you know that.

Same here. But that's a good analogy: I know I feel a lot better in a swamp with my 300 than in a beanfield with a 45/70!

Well you just lob that .45-70 over the cornfields with a ladder sight. "incoming". The deer can hear it coming. LOL.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - "Project Carbine:" Rebuilding an M1 Carbine in really rough shape

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