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RedZ71
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Posted: 7/2/2012 10:41:54 AM

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well, i took my Garand out this past weekend, but put about 20-30 rounds thru it. it was short stroking when i fired. the empty would be ejected, but the new round would be not inserted. if i pull back on the operating rod handle and draw it all the way to the rear, it inserts the new round fine, and fires.

when i got it home, i pulled it apart and did the operating rod test, and when i tilt it back, it only slides back about 80-85% on its own. if i pull it down it will go to the end of the track. when i tilt the other way, i have to push it out of the initial 15%, but then it slides normally into the locked bolt position.

so it sounds like i have a bent operating rod :(

my questions are, what are the common ways an op rod would get bent? i wonder if i did something wrong?
Fincho
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Posted: 7/2/2012 10:47:36 AM
what were you shooting out of it?

only thing i ever heard of bending an op rod was "hunting loads"
RedZ71
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Posted: 7/2/2012 11:00:30 AM
i have shot some green and yellow box Springfield 30-06 soft tip ammo, but it was only about 8-16 rounds or so. i was shooting 30-06 ball that was marketed as garand load, supposed to be correct weight bullet and correct power load.

would 8-16 rounds of the soft tip damage the op rod?
Fincho
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Posted: 7/2/2012 11:36:04 AM
Originally Posted By RedZ71:
i have shot some green and yellow box Springfield 30-06 soft tip ammo, but it was only about 8-16 rounds or so. i was shooting 30-06 ball that was marketed as garand load, supposed to be correct weight bullet and correct power load.

would 8-16 rounds of the soft tip damage the op rod?


well its hard to say for sure but 8-16 rounds could have caused the problem especially if the powder was too fast or too slow. Garands need a power with a burn rate somewhere near IMR 4895.

\i have read some guys who use 150 coreloks in their garand without damage and it sounds like you may have been using such a round. Remington doesn't recommend you shoot corelocks out of a garand either-way.

While it doesn't help you now my .02 would be get the op rod fixed or replaced and stick to HXP o Garand specific factory or handloads, or get a adjustable gas plug)

M1G
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Posted: 7/2/2012 8:27:42 PM
Did you do tilt test with trigger assembly removed?
Is rifle clean and properly lubed?
Is gas screw tight?
Ever replace Op Rod Spring??
DudeRN
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Posted: 7/2/2012 8:36:27 PM
were you shooting the garand ammo while using an adjustable gas plug?
faawrenchbndr
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Posted: 7/2/2012 9:18:03 PM
Originally Posted By RedZ71:
i have shot some green and yellow box Springfield 30-06 soft tip ammo, but it was only about 8-16 rounds or so.
i was shooting 30-06 ball that was marketed as garand load, supposed to be correct weight bullet and correct power load.

would 8-16 rounds of the soft tip damage the op rod?


Could have VERY easily bent the op rod with this. Not designed for this ammunition,
Get on the CMP Forum, there are a few members with the jig to straighten your op rod.

Do NOT shoot commercial ammo without an adjustable gas plug!
Not even ONE cartridge!
M1G
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Posted: 7/3/2012 5:15:26 AM
There aernt any members on the CMP forum that have the jig to check Op Rods that I know of
It would have to be sent to Columbus Machine
I would get to excited yet, dont even know if that is whats causing short stroking
A Op Rod can slightly rub and not cause any problems. His could have been rubbing all log
The OP needs to check the things I listed first
30Caliber
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Posted: 7/4/2012 8:01:11 AM
[Last Edit: 7/4/2012 8:02:07 AM by 30Caliber]

Originally Posted By M1G:
There aernt any members on the CMP forum that have the jig to check Op Rods that I know of
It would have to be sent to Columbus Machine
I would get to excited yet, dont even know if that is whats causing short stroking
A Op Rod can slightly rub and not cause any problems. His could have been rubbing all log
The OP needs to check the things I listed first

+1

Also.... Has it worked flawlessly in the past or is this the first time you've shot it?
RedZ71
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Posted: 7/4/2012 5:20:10 PM
Originally Posted By 30Caliber:

Originally Posted By M1G:
There aernt any members on the CMP forum that have the jig to check Op Rods that I know of
It would have to be sent to Columbus Machine
I would get to excited yet, dont even know if that is whats causing short stroking
A Op Rod can slightly rub and not cause any problems. His could have been rubbing all log
The OP needs to check the things I listed first

+1

Also.... Has it worked flawlessly in the past or is this the first time you've shot it?


i dont recall any problems with it with the corelock ammo. i remember the gleeful PING as the en block ejected, I'm 99% sure it happened on its own and i didnt have to cycle it.


op rod test will slide to about 85-90% on its own, then hangs up. you can operate it manually to the full length of the channel.
RedZ71
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Posted: 7/4/2012 5:22:26 PM
Originally Posted By M1G:
Did you do tilt test with trigger assembly removed?
Is rifle clean and properly lubed?
Is gas screw tight?
Ever replace Op Rod Spring??


its clean and lubed, and behaves exactly as it did when it was filthy.

gas screw was tight enough not to back out... if it was the exact tight it was supposed to be is beyond me. i just cranked it down because i was afraid of losing it somewhere in 38 acres i was hiking.

replacing the op rod spring might be reasonable, but as i said before, the op rod doesn't travel the full length on its own in the tilt test.
M1G
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Posted: 7/4/2012 8:02:02 PM
[Last Edit: 7/4/2012 8:02:51 PM by M1G]
Did you do the tilt test with the trigger assembly removed?
If not hit will hit and hang up on the hammer.
JJREA
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Posted: 7/5/2012 4:02:56 PM
[Last Edit: 7/5/2012 4:06:02 PM by JJREA]
Did you get a new stock for it? It could be rubbing somewhere. However, if this is a new problem and you've shot it before, I would suspect that's not the case. But I'm not clear on if the rifle has cycled successfully in the past. Is this a new rifle to you?

Also, is it lubed well? And yeah, I would check the gas plug again.

FWIW, I've shot a little bit of core lokt through mine and never had problems. In fact, I shot hotter stuff than that in the beginning not knowing any better. IMHO, a bent op rod is probably the last deduction I'd come to. It's possible, but I would exhaust all other avenues first. Just my two cents.

Also, if it was managed recoil loads, it won't cycle properly. Not enough poop to them.
rcav8r
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Posted: 7/5/2012 8:18:22 PM
Couple of months ago, I had a problem with the op rod rubbing on the stock where the handle goes through the slot in the stock. This rifle had worked fine before, but I guess the wood started swelling over time, and the op rod started rubbing on the stock, so when I discovered that, I simply sanded it down.

It too me awhile to figure this out, since the rifle was passing the tilt test. It wasn't until I was slowly inserting the trigger guard with my other hand on the stock in the area of the op rod that I realized what was going on.
JJREA
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Posted: 7/6/2012 1:42:48 PM
[Last Edit: 7/6/2012 1:44:04 PM by JJREA]
Well, I was thinking it wasn't viable if it hasn't happened before, but you bring up a good point. It's summer now and maybe the heat and humidity caused the wood to expand some. That's where I would look first. Only because when I got mine from the CMP, it did the exact same thing and I had to sand mine down just a hair to get it to function right.
M1G
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Posted: 7/6/2012 2:08:10 PM
[Last Edit: 7/6/2012 2:10:02 PM by M1G]
Op Rod has to rub real darn hard to cause short stroking unless other parts are close to being out of spec
You never answered me, did you do the tilt test with the trigger group installed??
If you are THE BOLT WILL RUB ON THE HAMMER when sliding rearward .
JJREA
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Posted: 7/6/2012 3:15:39 PM
Well, maybe my first session had bad lubing techniques also. I don't recall. But I do remember it rubbing a bit on the stock.

But I agree, what about the tilt test, did he do it with the trigger group out?
RedZ71
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Posted: 7/16/2012 2:43:27 PM
Originally Posted By M1G:
Op Rod has to rub real darn hard to cause short stroking unless other parts are close to being out of spec
You never answered me, did you do the tilt test with the trigger group installed??
If you are THE BOLT WILL RUB ON THE HAMMER when sliding rearward .


sorry, been away from this topic a bit. no , i didnt tilt with the trigger installed, but i will try it.

thanks,
M1G
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Posted: 7/16/2012 3:24:45 PM
Op Rod will hang up with trigger group installed
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlIoxbtdPXY
Brazos
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Posted: 7/16/2012 4:27:39 PM
OP, are you using grease or oil on the rifle? Using oil instead of grease can cause damage very quickly to the oprod.
DRich
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Posted: 7/16/2012 5:37:14 PM
I saw quite a few bent op rods when I was a volunteer at CMP. The usual story was, "I just shot a few rounds of hunting ammo." The M1 is a tough rifle, but is very intolerant of incorrect port pressures.
leemozoid
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Posted: 7/17/2012 10:10:14 PM
[Last Edit: 7/17/2012 10:13:57 PM by leemozoid]
There are three general causes of the condition described by the OP.

1. Insufficient gas impulse being delivered to the oprod. This can be caused by a fouled gas port, an undersized or worn oprod piston, gas leakage from excessive wear to the cylinder, a leaky "poppet" on the lock screw and/or the ammo.
2. Excessive binding in the operating system. The description of the OP of his "tip test" results indicates that there isn't sufficient binding to be the cause.
3. A fouled chamber which would create friction on the fired case.

I have hunted for years with Remington Core Lokt ammo in M1s. It is highly unlikely that this ammo would cause any damage to the rifle. I would start with a detailed cleaning of all of the gas system components, the barrel and chamber followed up with a more detailed examination of the gas system. The piston should be concentric and a minimum of .526 OD. A quality micrometer will determine this. A gas cylinder gauge will be needed to check it for wear on it. I would replace the gas cylinder lock screw with a WW2 "solid" to eliminate that as a problem. I've heard that a belted .338 magnum case can be used as a poor man's cylinder gauge. When I was actively performing I&R for veterans organizations in MO I always kept a good supply of spare parts on hand. Good luck. These things can be challenging but in the long run easily corrected once diagnosed and a great opportunity to learn more about the actual function of your rifle.