Full disclosure: about 3 years ago I bought a gamo silent cat .22 for large grey squirrel problem at the house. I've killed well over a dozen with it and about 65% were one shot kills.

That said, the lack of precision has caused a lot of misses and a couple of wounding shots as well. So I'm ready to move up and I have read the sticky FAQ on this page. As much as I'd like a PCP a Springer is what it'll be.

Most of my shots now are from a minimum of 30 yds to a max of maybe 75 yds.

I'm leaning towards the AoA deals of either the HW95L pkg at 489 or the HW97L pkg at 609.  

Questions:
I have not decided on .177 or.22 but leaning toward .22 due to my positive experience with it in immediate kills. The FAQ implies that the 177 shoots flatter but will it have enough energy at the distances I'm shooting? Some of these greys are the size of a cat.

Will I notice the difference in performance (and is it worth it) between the hw95 and hw97?  Specifically how much variation is caused by using the barrel to cock it vs the underbarrel cocking?  

I like the AoA pkg because I don't have to pick and choose and the price seems good. Am I missing anything by going this route?

If you have to shoot in much wind and you are going out past 40 yards, I am guessing you will want the HW97 in .22 for the accuracy.

I would still guess you should be into a PCP if you are routinely going out past 40 yards. One that will take a .22 or .25 up to the edge of sonic would be the best for killing at those distances.

Some of the PCP rigs are inexpensive and yet offer amazing performance. I would try to persuade you to reconsider, but as a spring gun addict, believe me I understand wanting to hunt with a springer.

The best of the best in spring guns are difficult to find or can be very expensive.

For example, the TX-200 SR or the Whiscombes are the most accurate in the category with decent killing power, but they are difficult to come by. These are both semi-recoilless.

The Whiscombes came with multiple bbl set options and tuners back in their day. Their power could be dialed in to a degree with the number of cocking strokes and restrictors.

Several models were above 20 ft*lbs and could take heavier pellets to the edge of sonic in .22 and .25.

That is not to say you can't master this with a well tuned HW97 (or even an HW77 if you can find a good one). The best examples are roughly twice as good as an average one.

That is roughly on the order of 1 MOA for a good one and 2 MOA on average, once you go past 40 yards. Of course you have to do your part and also sort pellets to make that happen.

The difference between easy versus more difficult, when discussing field target courses, divides at 1" at 40 yards. Just to give you an idea of what separates the men from the boys so to speak.

The HW97 (and HW77) as well as the TX200, all come in calibers above .177 and the heavier domed pellets like the Kodiaks and JSBs do well in these. These are known for being able to compete at the higher levels in the field target games when they are in capable hands. That also means they kill small game at the distances you were asking about.

Windage will be the main challenge in the end. Good Luck in any case, aim small and miss small.

I'm with the above recommendation of going to the .22 instead of the .177.  Though I really like the .177, the .22 will give you better ballistics at ranges beyond 40 yards.  Even with a lower initial velocity, the .22 will be going faster at longer ranges.  

There is a free airgun ballistics downloadable program here that you can use today to compare performance.  

The .25 will surpass the .22 in down range performance.  But, in a spring gun they become very difficult to shoot well.  If you go the PCP route, I'd then recommend the .25 over the .22 for the type of hunting/pest control you are doing.

Here is a video of a couple guys in England testing out the Walther Terrus, the guns big brother is the Parrus, the numbers are impressive IMO. It may not be in the same league as others mentioned though.

Dang it!
I even read the FAQ so I wouldn't ask stupid questions and now you guys are suggesting a PCP rifle to me!  ARRGGGHH! lol  

After reading the posts up above I guess I should be reasonably happy with my accuracy on the gamo since it's not much worse than what you're predicting at 50-75 yds.

I'm not opposed to a PCP but it seems a little like overkill and I'd rather not spend $750 to kill some squirrels.
To be honest I was looking at the springers because they're generally cheaper and simpler to operate (ie, no pump required) but I'm NOT a huge fan of the 'sproing' action.

(Also I was wrong about that HW97, it's not a pkg at that price so I'm still going to have to pay for rings and a scope (figure $100+ minimum) so that's more like $700)

Because of our location I don't normally have to deal with wind and I'll probably be getting a .22 just for the hell of it (.25 seems a little too exotic for some reason).

So I'm curious, for ~$450 i'll have a decent hw95L package or will a marauder at ~$600+ (with accessories) be a more accurate and precise rifle?

I think that both will get you about 2 MOA out of the box at reasonable ranges (~50 yards).  With a very good lot of pellets that the particular rifle likes, you may get substantially better precision than just 2 MOA.  The HW95 will be quite a bit more difficult to shoot well, but once you learn how, the technique will help you in general.  

The primary advantage of the Marauder is that you can tune it for different fill pressure levels and velocity.  Few spring guns can be tuned by the user, and usually take changing springs and other internal parts. The Marauder can be tuned down to  below 10 meter rifle power (8.3 grain pellet at 600 ft/s in .177) and up from there to put medium weight pellets at or slightly above the speed of sound.  This high velocity, however, is not conducive to good accuracy as the pellet will behave badly when pushed this fast.   The high power also requires a higher fill pressure and sacrifices shot count per fill.

A steroid pumper might just be the ticket, its probably not a lot of fast n furious action anyways.

Now I really need to go rezero my gamo at 50 yds and se what I get. Definitely worse than 2 moa but I'm not sure how much...

Regarding shot count, the most I get at one sitting is probably 3-4 shots so recharging isn't much concern and I don't want to go near song sonic anyway due to the neighborhood.

Just wondering if its worth the extra expense now.....  

If you get a Marauder, you will wind up not limiting yourself to just the few critters that pop into view.  You will find yourself with all kinds of fun inanimate targets set up along with a silent pellet trap---the neighbors will probably never know you are shooting stuff.

If you are thinking about a Marauder then think about spending the extra $50 or so and get the Armada. It is essentially a Marauder but it is fully railed so it will take any fancy lasers or night vision gear. I just got mine running and I'm killing pests 24 hours a day now. If you don't have any NV then it may not matter but airgun guys come to the NV forum for help with Marauders, etc. and there is not much we can do to help them. The Armada only has minor quirks for optics fitting upgrades.

The Armada is an ugly beast and I love her. She has not failed to take a pest that I had the ability to develop a firing solution for. If you ever hope to hunt at night then I HIGHLY recommend the Armada.

Since I initially wrote this I've checked zero, accuracy and precision on the gamo at 10m, 20m and 30m.

Basically it's about a 6-8 moa rifle at all distances.  

That was eye-opening and had been a little deceptive because for what I'm doing at 10-20m (killing squirrels) it's been "good enough" for kill shots in a zone of 1"-2" mostly, but beyond 20m it quickly gets very unpredictable and the lack of precision really shows.

So basically I ignored the FAQ and went with the thread advice to pick up a PCP Benjamin Armada.  

Normally I still wouldn't have done it but I found it on clearance for $400 delivered and figured 'what the hell'...so hopefully this isn't a crappy one that got sent back or something! lol
I see the Hill is a highly rated pump (a little eye-watering at the price though!) so help me out with saving a little on the scope. Any particularly good deals out there on an appropriate scope or should I just go to Amazon and pick up a leapers or something?

One of the least expensive scopes that seem to do quite well is the ~$75 4-16x Centerpoint that is usually available at Walmart.  It focuses down to 5 yards (which is closer than you need) out to infinity.  Some samples may have a loose focusing eye piece, but this is solved by taping it up after you  focus the crosshairs to your eye. I have one which is loose while the second is nice and smooth without wobble---typical Chinese quality control.  The glass is generally good enough for the kind of shooting one does with an airgun.

ETA: The Armada is just as tunable as the Marauder, but you do have a lot more things to take apart to do it.  However, before you decide that you want to tune it, shoot it quite a bit first on its factory tune.  Then decide why you want to tune it.  The reasons for tuning are the following:  change to a lower fill pressure to make it easier to hand pump; change the velocity; improve the shot count per fill; improve the accuracy/precision.

For $400 I would have grabbed another Armada. I love this thing. I have mine decked with iron sights, a White/IR dual spectrum light, IR laser - and I can swap an ACOG for daylight and a PVS-4 for night shooting. This thing is fully capable 24 hours per day.

I just added a $10 cantilever 14 slot Picatinny riser that I shortened to 11 slots. This helps me to mount my scope further to the rear above the magazine. The magazine slides out of the gun to the side so it is OK to have the scope above it. The rear Picatinny section has my iron sight on it so I could not use that for the scope - it wouldn't fit the ACOG anyway.

I am not always lurking here. Give me a bump if there is anything you need to know. ArimoDave helped guide me into the Armada but he seems like more of a target shooter than a field hunter so he may not do all of the goofball stuff that I do.

I got the Hill Pump that Dave recommended. It is expensive but it has performed admirably.

Right now it looks like my gun likes to shoot the Crosman Premier 14.3 grain pellets with the reservoir at 2200 to 2700 PSI. Your results may vary.

By FAQ, I'm assuming you're referring to the 10 million words post I wrote. FWIW, if you had told me you wanted to shoot at 75 yards I would have said that you should buy a PCP. Spring guns are great under about 35 yards. Beyond that, you probably need to step up.

The "10 Million Words" post was a beautiful post but I still think some decent firearm shooters are going to get frustrated by the differences in shooting spring guns. The PCP, though it does require some ancillary gear, is a dream to shoot and should not frustrate a shooter that is expecting accuracy that he knows he could achieve with a firearm. Further, being able to bolt-cycle through a ten round magazine is very convenient. I don't see PCP as inconvenient or burdensome. From my perspective it just moves the burden of generating pressure from one place to another. If I am mowing down pests then I don't want to take the time for cocking a spring gun.

PCP air guns are definitely a whole easier to shoot and probably the only viable option if you really want to stretch out the distance or up the power considerably. Spring guns a separate discipline. The fact that a fella knows how to shoot a firearm rifle does mean he's going to be successful with a spring gun. It's a whole different animal with its own required skills, techniques and . . . this is a biggy . . . limitations. The guy who really enjoys a spring gun probably is a minimalist at heart and takes satisfaction in getting by with the LEAST amount of power to do the job and he's also willing to accept that there are things he probably just shouldn't try to do. He's also willing to take the time and put in the effort to learn to shoot the thing. They're not the best choice for somebody who expects instant gratification.

Yes Bladeswitcher that's what I was referring to, I appreciate the effort that went into posting it so thanks for that.  
I'm quite glad to hear that you'd also recommend a pcp given the distances involved, that was my main concern really that it was either 'overkill' or my expectations were not reasonable.

I have some known distance points in the yard that the squirrels frequently cross and at this point they're very wary and it's hard to get any closer than 30m in the best case before they run off.

Also thanks to the other folks giving feedback here, Arimo and SOT, I appreciate the info assistance. Honestly I had no idea pellet guns were as sophisticated until I started poking around here. I think it's just a little hard to believe I spent almost $300 on what looks like a bicycle pump.. lol

To SOT's point I'm a decent rifle shooter and while the spring gun "seemed" okay for my near distance uses, it's hard to know how much is due to my shooting style with a springer vs. inherent mechanical accuracy/lack thereof. I'll definitely get back if I'm struggling with anything on setup or use.

I started with an Umarex springer, but I should have just started PCP.  At my age you'd think I'd know enough about myself to know what a dilettante I am and that once I started I'd have to go somewhat hard core.

Sold that and I went full on PCP with an expensive SCBA tank (I recently bought another so I can cascade), bought an FX T12 which I recently replaced with an FX Streamline and a Taipan Veteran in .25.

_If_ I weren't That Guy and knew that I would be fine with something entry level but not too basic for plinking, the Hammerli 850 + a tune and mods to accept a large CO2 tank would probably be my choice knowing what I know now.

The main advantage of a PCP (no recoil, funky ass artillery hold), but uses paintball level power plant so easy to find fills and no $5-$700 SCBA tank to buy into.  500 shots or so per fill, sufficient power for bird hunting at reasonable range, etc...

Even without the big CO2 tank it's still pretty handy, just carry a handfull of the CO2 cartridges with you, they aren't cumbersome at all.

So all my stuff came in this wk and I put it together today for a quick sighting in and test run.

WOW.

Yah no comparison to any air rifle I've ever shot. At fifty yards it does a smaller group than my gamo Springer at ten. Also ridiculously quiet!

Didn't take long to pump up from its 1000 psi shipping pressure and only a dozen or so after the 30 shot trial.

Only downside so far is that it's pretty heavy. I also wish the bolt action was a little smoother. It's kind of notch without noticeable detents.

But overall wow, good choice I think. Loving it so far.

How big was your grin after letting off the first shot?  I know you wore one on your face for a while.  

Was it this , or this , or this .

Success!!!  

So since Spring I've had one asshole squirrel that chewed his way into the attic of my spare garage. This entry point is out of my normal line of sight on the backside of the building and he goes through the front yard (which is less commonly observed) so I rarely see him.  Missed twice with the old Gamo and I've placed baited traps out along his route but he's very skittish and has kept away from them, then last week he started chewing on the highest eave of our house.

He's been a worthy opponent but today he saw his last sunrise.

I got home and around dusk he's usually heading back to the garage so I walked the perimeter of the front yard looking for him and after about 20 min heard some chatter up in the trees nearest the garage so I wandered over there.
The trees by now are heavily leafed and I saw some debris falling and then caught site of his tail as he moved along a limb about 40 ft up in the tree. I estimated that the slant distance from me to him was probably 35yds and he was slightly obscured behind a cluster of broad leaves.  I could see his tail and torso and projected about where I thought his shoulder would be and fired the Armada.

Instantly dropped straight to the ground and into the creek.

Behind the leaves he must've been turned slightly towards me because the pellet went into his left eye and instantly killed him.

This made the purchase 100% worth it. like a laser, zero recoil and no noise. wow.

He was a worthy adversary but I'm glad he's dead.

Graphic - dead squirrel
Click To View Spoiler

Cool !