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Posted: 5/19/2016 10:53:50 PM EDT
[#1]
Anyways I am done with this thread, there is no middle ground at all. No compromise or agreeing to disagree, only my ad nauseam crusading.
Differences can cause growth. But being close minded with dishonest intentions is not internet serious for me to go tit for tat all night to argue against with. I have the caliber I want, it's perfect in every way and will do the job better for me, end of story. I have one caliber that feeds four rifles that has a load tailored to it that gibes me the best performance and eases the logistical chain and streamlines everything that is proven to do it's job well and has a proven track record of giving dirt naps and is also used by the FBI, DEA, CAG, and so on, etc. But the internet tells me that they know moar and better then those who do this for a living everyday. Adios. |
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Posted: 5/20/2016 5:38:11 AM EDT
[#2]
LOL. I like how the 2 highlited parts make you look silly in your argument.
You say the internet is wrong. and you are right, Quote HistoryQuoted:
But the internet tells me that they know moar and better then those who do this for a living everyday. Adios. Quote HistoryQuoted:
But the internet tells me that they know moar and better then those who do this for a living everyday. Adios. But before that you said the internet proves you are right. LOL. . Quoted:
And yet none at all on my favorite channels on YouTube. Huh. this argument is as dumb as 9x19 or .45 debates. Both will kill, choose wisely. But to say either or is better is seriously 
I've done the research, 5.56 makes the most sense to me. It isn't a silver bullet. 300 BO is not a silver bullet either. I tried it once, was nothing special and it costs more. It didn't do anything better for me that .223 already does and gives me more range with better ballistics and it's cheaper all around. But then the question is, are the youtube channels you are watching using properly calibrated ballistics gel? you do know that according to a youtuber here on arfcom, there are only 2 youtube channels that use properly calibrated ballistics gel. nobody else does. According to him. I also like how you lump all 300blk guys as uncompromising and only you are willing to see facts. Reminds me of 6.8forums. but anyhow. reality check one can take 5.56, 7.62x39, 6.5grendal, 6.8spc, 300 blackout, 7.62x40, .270 wolverine with similarly constructed bullets, and put them in the hands of 100 shooters and fire them all at 100 yds into either flesh or the aforementioned ballistics gel, and 87% of them would not be able to tell the difference in firing them, nor in the bullet wound they produced. of those 13% that could 87% of them are liars, so the remaining 13%of the 13% might be able to guess with 87% accuracy which was which. But that might be a high percentage. And there are plenty of youtube videos out there on 300blk using ballistics gel. Funny thing is, the ones that slam 300blk, it is funny how their ballistics gel test do not reflect my real world use and documentation on flesh. But in the age of the interwebs, the only way to be taken seriously is to have a youtube channel and questionably calibrated ballistics gel. Carry on with your bad self. shoot what you like. |
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Posted: 5/20/2016 6:42:15 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Anyways I am done with this thread, there is no middle ground at all. No compromise or agreeing to disagree, only my ad nauseam crusading. Differences can cause growth. But being close minded with dishonest intentions is not internet serious for me to go tit for tat all night to argue against with. I have the caliber I want, it's perfect in every way and will do the job better for me, end of story. I have one caliber that feeds four rifles that has a load tailored to it that gibes me the best performance and eases the logistical chain and streamlines everything that is proven to do it's job well and has a proven track record of giving dirt naps and is also used by the FBI, DEA, CAG, and so on, etc. But the internet tells me that they know moar and better then those who do this for a living everyday. Adios. There is no such thing as moar. This is tech, not GD, remember? Anyway, when it comes down to inch for inch there's just no comparison. An 8" .223 just loses too much in velocity and gains too much in noise |
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Posted: 5/20/2016 9:25:52 PM EDT
[#4]
It's a simple equation for me.
When it comes to terminal ballistics out of a SBR, the .300blk using the 110gr Blacktips is probably the best option currently available. Fantastic terminal ballistics out to 300+ yards and barrier barrier blind. That makes it the ideal carbine round for a short-term defensive situation. I keep a decent supply of .300blk Blacktips for this reason, and my 10.3" .300blk SBR would likely be my go-to for a violent situation. However; 5.56 is superior to .300blk when it comes to ammo cost and availability. Therefore, 5.56 is a better option for training/practice purposes. Additionally, I keep a decent supply of defensive .223 ammo. If a situation goes beyond the amount of ammo I have set aside for .300blk, then 5.56/.223 is my backup. So, 5.56 for training/practice/long term SHTF. .300blk for short term defensive situation. |
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Posted: 5/21/2016 1:33:32 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I started off with a 223 sbr and have since converted both of mine to 300 Blk. I absolutely love it. First of all, it is quieter. Much, much quieter. I'm not talking about with a suppressor, I'm talking about with normal ammo and a normal barrel. 223 SBRs sound like a flash bang 2 feet in front of your face while 300 just sounds normal. Throw in a suppressor and it's no comparison. Next is performance. There is simply no 223 projectile that even remotely compares with the performance of the Barnes tac-tx 110gr bullet. The ballistics gel performance is outstanding, damn near blows the gel apart. 30 rounds of that is one of the deadliest home defense scenarios I can think of. Cost is obvious an issue, but that doesn't stop people from shooting AR10s. I can reload the 300 for blackout 30% more using the speer TNT compared with Hornady 55gr sp. Thats not a big deal for me for plinking. I don't care about how much the Barnes ammo is, I use it for HD only. It's disingenuous to say the 300 is too expensive because the subsonic rounds are expensive because you don't even have that option with the 223. That doesn't even make any sense.... If you are really worried about cost start reloading and cast your own boolits with powder coating and you pay virtually nothing. It costs me $0.05/rd to reload my 300 subsonic (lead is free, only pay for primer and powder). So to me, comparing SBRs in 223 and 300 it is no comparison whatsoever. I still prefer 223 in a full size platform and for precision shooting, but for SBR I'll never own a 223 again. Barnes Tac-tx ballistics gel test  https://youtu.be/nsRUfA1_AlwI was waiting for a Barnes 110gr video!  Unfortunately, the Barnes 110gr is not representative of what to expect from the 300 Blackout in general. That's why the 300 Blackout crowd is so madly in love with it and they post THIS video to defend the choice. It's also probably why Lehigh Defense is coming out with a copper bullet too. It IS a great load... but it's one load from one manufacturer. Once ammunition design matures a bit, I'll probably buy in.
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Posted: 5/21/2016 1:47:28 PM EDT
[#6]
5.56 ammo is cheaper than .300 blackout.
External and terminal performance is better in 5.56. 5.56 may not suppress as well as .300 blackout, but a .30 projectile traveling at suppressor ideal subsonic speed is basically just a pistol round, and I prefer my MP5 for that. |
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Posted: 5/22/2016 10:52:50 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was waiting for a Barnes 110gr video! Unfortunately, the Barnes 110gr is not representative of what to expect from the 300 Blackout in general. That's why the 300 Blackout crowd is so madly in love with it and they post THIS video to defend the choice. It's also probably why Lehigh Defense is coming out with a copper bullet too. It IS a great load... but it's one load from one manufacturer. Once ammunition design matures a bit, I'll probably buy in.sure it is. it represents what an expanding, non-fragmenting supersonic round will do. to say its the only one thats capable and base your choice on that shows your ignorance. |
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Posted: 5/22/2016 12:07:40 PM EDT
[#8]
Im trying to figure out what everyone is arguing about?
I would much rather kill a deer with a .300blk using a 125gr sst than a .556 us any soft point. I've tried both and always take my 300blk deer hunting. I didn't have very good luck using 556. |
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Posted: 5/22/2016 12:24:46 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was waiting for a Barnes 110gr video! Unfortunately, the Barnes 110gr is not representative of what to expect from the 300 Blackout in general. That's why the 300 Blackout crowd is so madly in love with it and they post THIS video to defend the choice. It's also probably why Lehigh Defense is coming out with a copper bullet too. It IS a great load... but it's one load from one manufacturer. Once ammunition design matures a bit, I'll probably buy in.Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I started off with a 223 sbr and have since converted both of mine to 300 Blk. I absolutely love it. First of all, it is quieter. Much, much quieter. I'm not talking about with a suppressor, I'm talking about with normal ammo and a normal barrel. 223 SBRs sound like a flash bang 2 feet in front of your face while 300 just sounds normal. Throw in a suppressor and it's no comparison. Next is performance. There is simply no 223 projectile that even remotely compares with the performance of the Barnes tac-tx 110gr bullet. The ballistics gel performance is outstanding, damn near blows the gel apart. 30 rounds of that is one of the deadliest home defense scenarios I can think of. Cost is obvious an issue, but that doesn't stop people from shooting AR10s. I can reload the 300 for blackout 30% more using the speer TNT compared with Hornady 55gr sp. Thats not a big deal for me for plinking. I don't care about how much the Barnes ammo is, I use it for HD only. It's disingenuous to say the 300 is too expensive because the subsonic rounds are expensive because you don't even have that option with the 223. That doesn't even make any sense.... If you are really worried about cost start reloading and cast your own boolits with powder coating and you pay virtually nothing. It costs me $0.05/rd to reload my 300 subsonic (lead is free, only pay for primer and powder). So to me, comparing SBRs in 223 and 300 it is no comparison whatsoever. I still prefer 223 in a full size platform and for precision shooting, but for SBR I'll never own a 223 again. Barnes Tac-tx ballistics gel test https://youtu.be/nsRUfA1_AlwI was waiting for a Barnes 110gr video! Unfortunately, the Barnes 110gr is not representative of what to expect from the 300 Blackout in general. That's why the 300 Blackout crowd is so madly in love with it and they post THIS video to defend the choice. It's also probably why Lehigh Defense is coming out with a copper bullet too. It IS a great load... but it's one load from one manufacturer. Once ammunition design matures a bit, I'll probably buy in.Barnes isnt the only one who loads their bullet. Off the top of my head, HPR, Wilson Combat, and Gemtech load it. Oh... and so do I. Just got this box of 50 yesterday for $30. I cut LC 556 brass that i pick up off the ground at the range. I'm looking at most .75 round for awesome ammo tailored to my gun that gives me less than MOA? Cant beat 300 BO SBR when deer hunting in the swamp. Draging a deer across 3 ft deep rivers, the rifle isnt even a factor. straps easily on the tree climber. 
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Posted: 5/22/2016 2:47:26 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Im trying to figure out what everyone is arguing about? I would much rather kill a deer with a .300blk using a 125gr sst than a .556 using any soft point. This. Get both |
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Posted: 5/22/2016 2:56:42 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Ammo cost. I know you are trying to ignore it, but you simply cannot. This. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 9:07:48 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
sure it is. it represents what an expanding, non-fragmenting supersonic round will do. to say its the only one thats capable and base your choice on that shows your ignorance. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I was waiting for a Barnes 110gr video! Unfortunately, the Barnes 110gr is not representative of what to expect from the 300 Blackout in general. That's why the 300 Blackout crowd is so madly in love with it and they post THIS video to defend the choice. It's also probably why Lehigh Defense is coming out with a copper bullet too. It IS a great load... but it's one load from one manufacturer. Once ammunition design matures a bit, I'll probably buy in.sure it is. it represents what an expanding, non-fragmenting supersonic round will do. to say its the only one thats capable and base your choice on that shows your ignorance. Yes... and so far, it's the only one (we'll have to see how Lehigh Defense's projectile does). I swear to God, 300 fanboys are as bad as the 6.5 Grendel fanboys. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 9:16:15 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Barnes isnt the only one who loads their bullet. Off the top of my head, HPR, Wilson Combat, and Gemtech load it. Oh... and so do I. You're missing the point. Barnes is the SOLE SOURCE for that bullet. I don't care how many people load it. If Barnes were to somehow disappear tomorrow, so would the one really effective anti-personnel load. When more LARGE ammunition manufacturers start loading projectiles with similar characteristics (instead of just loading bullets made for use with the .308 Winchester), the 300 Blackout will start to really have my interest. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 12:23:57 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're missing the point. Barnes is the SOLE SOURCE for that bullet. I don't care how many people load it. If Barnes were to somehow disappear tomorrow, so would the one really effective anti-personnel load. When more LARGE ammunition manufacturers start loading projectiles with similar characteristics (instead of just loading bullets made for use with the .308 Winchester), the 300 Blackout will start to really have my interest. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Barnes isnt the only one who loads their bullet. Off the top of my head, HPR, Wilson Combat, and Gemtech load it. Oh... and so do I. You're missing the point. Barnes is the SOLE SOURCE for that bullet. I don't care how many people load it. If Barnes were to somehow disappear tomorrow, so would the one really effective anti-personnel load. When more LARGE ammunition manufacturers start loading projectiles with similar characteristics (instead of just loading bullets made for use with the .308 Winchester), the 300 Blackout will start to really have my interest. Just getting into .300 myself but I don't really believe your statement. There are a few other factory loads out there that do a pretty good job and are still pretty accurate out of short BLK barrels. One that comes to mind is the 125gr Sierra TMK loaded by Black Hills, which was developed IIRC for the Blackout cartridge. At a recent range trip, I was able to obtain 1.5ish MOA 10 shot group @ 100yds with the BH load. The Barnes 110 TAC-TX was about 1.3 MOA. I wasn't expecting stellar sub MOA accuracy as it was tested out of an 8" barrel but was pleasantly surprised by both of these loads. So yes, if Barnes disappeared tomorrow the TAC-TX would disappear shortly after, but other bullet makers and ammo manufacturers would (and are) stepping into the market as the BLK gains popularity. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 12:50:26 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This. Get both Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Im trying to figure out what everyone is arguing about? I would much rather kill a deer with a .300blk using a 125gr sst than a .556 using any soft point. This. Get both Yep. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 1:02:10 PM EDT
[#16]
I've killed hundreds of animals with by 556 sbr's. Works for me. I may build a 300 someday just because.
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Posted: 5/23/2016 6:15:27 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes... and so far, it's the only one (we'll have to see how Lehigh Defense's projectile does). I swear to God, 300 fanboys are as bad as the 6.5 Grendel fanboys. i give up...
http://300aacblackout.com/resources/300AACBlackout06OCT2010.pdf |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 8:50:09 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're missing the point. Barnes is the SOLE SOURCE for that bullet. I don't care how many people load it. If Barnes were to somehow disappear tomorrow, so would the one really effective anti-personnel load. When more LARGE ammunition manufacturers start loading projectiles with similar characteristics (instead of just loading bullets made for use with the .308 Winchester), the 300 Blackout will start to really have my interest. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Barnes isnt the only one who loads their bullet. Off the top of my head, HPR, Wilson Combat, and Gemtech load it. Oh... and so do I. You're missing the point. Barnes is the SOLE SOURCE for that bullet. I don't care how many people load it. If Barnes were to somehow disappear tomorrow, so would the one really effective anti-personnel load. When more LARGE ammunition manufacturers start loading projectiles with similar characteristics (instead of just loading bullets made for use with the .308 Winchester), the 300 Blackout will start to really have my interest. you dont think V-max or Varmageddon would be effective anti-personnel load? I like the barnes for hunting white tail so I'm not spitting bits out at dinner, but have the Varmageddon for defence. It explodes even at BO speeds. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 9:27:21 PM EDT
[#19]
I like my 5.56 SBR, but I don't feel it is very potent past 75yds as it has a 10.5" barrel. I absolutely wouldn't expect it to perform at 200yds. Additionally, it is loud.
I found 300BLK and believe I probably got suckered into it before I did all my homework. I wanted a quieter way to shoot coyotes and pigs in the pasture near my house. I expected to only shoot subsonics. I was told the 300BLK far surpasses a suppressed .45 because it is a spitzer bullet that will fly much more accurately than a .45 slug and will fly further retaining its velocity quite well. I had high hopes for my 10.5" 300BLK, but soon realized my hopes were misplaced. First, I can't get subsonics to group worth a damn. Second, terminal ballistics suck for commercially available subsonic loads. So, I'm kind of at a loss as to what I should do with my 300BLK SBRs. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 9:29:10 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like my 5.56 SBR, but I don't feel it is very potent past 75yds as it has a 10.5" barrel. I absolutely wouldn't expect it to perform at 200yds. Additionally, it is loud. I found 300BLK and believe I probably got suckered into it before I did all my homework. I wanted a quieter way to shoot coyotes and pigs in the pasture near my house. I expected to only shoot subsonics. I was told the 300BLK far surpasses a suppressed .45 because it is a spitzer bullet that will fly much more accurately than a .45 slug and will fly further retaining its velocity quite well. I had high hopes for my 10.5" 300BLK, but soon realized my hopes were misplaced. First, I can't get subsonics to group worth a damn. Second, terminal ballistics suck for commercially available subsonic loads. So, I'm kind of at a loss as to what I should do with my 300BLK SBRs. Switch the barrels to 556? Or sell the uppers? Build 556 uppers? |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 9:55:37 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Switch the barrels to 556? Or sell the uppers? Build 556 uppers? Quote HistoryQuoted:
.
So, I'm kind of at a loss as to what I should do with my 300BLK SBRs. Switch the barrels to 556? Or sell the uppers? Build 556 uppers? I'll probably just hold on to them, hoping for more economical expanding bullets at subsonic speeds. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 10:00:02 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like my 5.56 SBR, but I don't feel it is very potent past 75yds as it has a 10.5" barrel. I absolutely wouldn't expect it to perform at 200yds. Additionally, it is loud. I found 300BLK and believe I probably got suckered into it before I did all my homework. I wanted a quieter way to shoot coyotes and pigs in the pasture near my house. I expected to only shoot subsonics. I was told the 300BLK far surpasses a suppressed .45 because it is a spitzer bullet that will fly much more accurately than a .45 slug and will fly further retaining its velocity quite well. I had high hopes for my 10.5" 300BLK, but soon realized my hopes were misplaced. First, I can't get subsonics to group worth a damn. Second, terminal ballistics suck for commercially available subsonic loads. So, I'm kind of at a loss as to what I should do with my 300BLK SBRs. You can kill stuff way past 75yds with a 10.5" 5.56. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 10:06:37 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I like my 5.56 SBR, but I don't feel it is very potent past 75yds as it has a 10.5" barrel. I absolutely wouldn't expect it to perform at 200yds. Additionally, it is loud. SOCOM might disagree with your limited experience |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 10:26:32 PM EDT
[#24]
My 5.56 SBRs are just fine for the range and for any game I'll find in the midwest provided I do my part and use suitable ammo. There is no reason to get myself a .300 Blk rig so I have to go buy different ammo for it and label my magazines to prevent myself (or a friend) from a ka-boom.
.300 Blk is cool and all for SBR/pistols and for trying to make a gun as quiet as possible. But, if I was building an AR-15 for hunting I wouldn't stop at .300 Blk when you can get a 6.8 SPC for the same effort (barrel). I'd also need a 6.8 BCG and magazines which provide the added bonus of decreased likelihood of killing someone due to loading a .300/6.8 in a .223. |
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Posted: 5/23/2016 10:33:49 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You can kill stuff way past 75yds with a 10.5" 5.56. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I like my 5.56 SBR, but I don't feel it is very potent past 75yds as it has a 10.5" barrel. I absolutely wouldn't expect it to perform at 200yds. Additionally, it is loud. I found 300BLK and believe I probably got suckered into it before I did all my homework. I wanted a quieter way to shoot coyotes and pigs in the pasture near my house. I expected to only shoot subsonics. I was told the 300BLK far surpasses a suppressed .45 because it is a spitzer bullet that will fly much more accurately than a .45 slug and will fly further retaining its velocity quite well. I had high hopes for my 10.5" 300BLK, but soon realized my hopes were misplaced. First, I can't get subsonics to group worth a damn. Second, terminal ballistics suck for commercially available subsonic loads. So, I'm kind of at a loss as to what I should do with my 300BLK SBRs. You can kill stuff way past 75yds with a 10.5" 5.56. Yep, infact you can get fragmentation of 77gr TMK out to ~250yds and Fusion MSR/Gold Dot out to ~300yds. What are you using...XM193 and XM855 for self defense ammo?
Which .300 BLK subsonic loads have you tried? If it's really important to you to get expansion of a subsonic, you should think about the Lehigh 194gr. |
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Posted: 5/24/2016 9:33:59 AM EDT
[#26]
I'm not trying to preach, but just sharing my understanding so you know who you are talking to. First off, it was more than 5 yrs ago when I last studied up on terminal ballistics for 5.56 out of short barrels. I'm not even familiar with the TMK or other round listed above.
I keep 77gr SMK in my shorty. My 'experience' is limited to just ONE hunting trip with it (where I actually shot something!) I jumped 30 or more hogs around 50 yards away. I shot my first hog standing still (50yds), shot the second as it ran laterally (50yds), and the third as it ran away (75yds?) It made it pretty far after being shot. The others were either not shot (I could have missed as they were around 100+ yards away) or the bullet didn't do more than punch a hole, allowing them to run off and die elsewhere. 
I killed a coyote on the same hunting trip at 30yds. So my VERY limited experience matches what I have been told regarding terminal performance out of short barrels. I'm here to learn. I'm just sharing my thoughts experiences. |
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Posted: 5/24/2016 10:37:53 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm not trying to preach, but just sharing my understanding so you know who you are talking to. First off, it was more than 5 yrs ago when I last studied up on terminal ballistics for 5.56 out of short barrels. I'm not even familiar with the TMK or other round listed above. I keep 77gr SMK in my shorty. My 'experience' is limited to just ONE hunting trip with it (where I actually shot something!) I jumped 30 or more hogs around 50 yards away. I shot my first hog standing still (50yds), shot the second as it ran laterally (50yds), and the third as it ran away (75yds?) It made it pretty far after being shot. The others were either not shot (I could have missed as they were around 100+ yards away) or the bullet didn't do more than punch a hole, allowing them to run off and die elsewhere. <a href="http://s3.photobucket.com/user/jerrellwise/media/222F2318-C5FE-4851-AAB6-FFBDE000EF2B_zpsmphsnw6w.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y95/jerrellwise/222F2318-C5FE-4851-AAB6-FFBDE000EF2B_zpsmphsnw6w.jpg</a> I killed a coyote on the same hunting trip at 30yds. So my VERY limited experience matches what I have been told regarding terminal performance out of short barrels. I'm here to learn. I'm just sharing my thoughts experiences. Of course, no problem here. I'm just sharing my experience with some different premium 5.56 loads; Not trying to bust your chops or anything but the SMK bullet isn't really made to expand at any velocity. The TMK isn't either but there have been many tests, including by Jeff at Black Hills and the tests say that the TMK will get pretty reliable expansion down to 1900fps. Here's a thread I started last fall after I finished my 10.5 with quite a few loads velocity tested. In a nutshell, the Black Hills loaded TMK get's ~2419fps out of my 10.5" 5.56 barrel and JBM ballistics puts it at 1923fps at 250yds. The Fusion MSR gets ~2515fps under the same conditions which puts expansion around 280yds reliably, and a bit further with sporadic/diminishing results. I haven't fully explored a few other loads that I velocity tested in my 10.5 but by all accounts, the Barnes 62gr TSX and 70gr TSX should have similar performance to the two above rounds. Regarding this thread and the cost of premium 5.56 vs premium .300 BLK, they are actually pretty similar in price so to my way of thinking, I am invested in both calibers for some different capabilities. Now if people want to talk cheap plinking or subsonic .300 for suppressed use, yes .300 will be more expensive but not prohibitively so for many users. That's the reason I've been saying "get both" since page one. 
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Posted: 5/24/2016 12:56:22 PM EDT
[#28]
One of my old threads about hunting hogs with a 12.5" 5.56. Link
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Posted: 5/25/2016 1:50:28 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryJust finished reading the linked thread. I was interested in reading about 100+ yard shots with 5.56 out of SBRs. I didn't see any. One 100yd shot, but it sounded like the bullet didn't perform, as the hog ran another 100yds with a lung shot and had to be finished. You use an 18" with heavy bullets ~200yds? This doesn't seem to contradict my earlier statements. Am I missing something ? |
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Posted: 5/25/2016 1:59:18 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just finished reading the linked thread. I was interested in reading about 100+ yard shots with 5.56 out of SBRs. I didn't see any. One 100yd shot, but it sounded like the bullet didn't perform, as the hog ran another 100yds with a lung shot and had to be finished. You use an 18" with heavy bullets ~200yds? This doesn't seem to contradict my earlier statements. Am I missing something ? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just finished reading the linked thread. I was interested in reading about 100+ yard shots with 5.56 out of SBRs. I didn't see any. One 100yd shot, but it sounded like the bullet didn't perform, as the hog ran another 100yds with a lung shot and had to be finished. You use an 18" with heavy bullets ~200yds? This doesn't seem to contradict my earlier statements. Am I missing something ? Yes. Several of those hogs were killed at 100yds or more with a SBR. Maybe I forgot to detail those specific ones or you missed them. |
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Posted: 5/25/2016 2:18:03 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes. Several of those hogs were killed at 100yds or more with a SBR. Maybe I forgot to detail those specific ones or you missed them. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Just finished reading the linked thread. I was interested in reading about 100+ yard shots with 5.56 out of SBRs. I didn't see any. One 100yd shot, but it sounded like the bullet didn't perform, as the hog ran another 100yds with a lung shot and had to be finished. You use an 18" with heavy bullets ~200yds? This doesn't seem to contradict my earlier statements. Am I missing something ? Yes. Several of those hogs were killed at 100yds or more with a SBR. Maybe I forgot to detail those specific ones or you missed them. Ok, that's good! There were a few without descriptions. So, your EXPERIENCE (and you obviously have a ton of hog hunting experience!) is that M193 out of a 12.5" barrel will effectively drop a hog out to 150yds? DRT or <20yds? |
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Posted: 5/25/2016 3:25:07 PM EDT
[#32]
Cost, it's a lot more expensive when you shoot a good amount.
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Posted: 5/27/2016 8:53:28 PM EDT
[#33]
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Ok, that's good! There were a few without descriptions. So, your EXPERIENCE (and you obviously have a ton of hog hunting experience!) is that M193 out of a 12.5" barrel will effectively drop a hog out to 150yds? DRT or <20yds? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Just finished reading the linked thread. I was interested in reading about 100+ yard shots with 5.56 out of SBRs. I didn't see any. One 100yd shot, but it sounded like the bullet didn't perform, as the hog ran another 100yds with a lung shot and had to be finished. You use an 18" with heavy bullets ~200yds? This doesn't seem to contradict my earlier statements. Am I missing something ? Yes. Several of those hogs were killed at 100yds or more with a SBR. Maybe I forgot to detail those specific ones or you missed them. Ok, that's good! There were a few without descriptions. So, your EXPERIENCE (and you obviously have a ton of hog hunting experience!) is that M193 out of a 12.5" barrel will effectively drop a hog out to 150yds? DRT or <20yds? Why even use m193 to hunt?!
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Posted: 5/27/2016 9:45:09 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why even use m193 to hunt?!
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Just finished reading the linked thread. I was interested in reading about 100+ yard shots with 5.56 out of SBRs. I didn't see any. One 100yd shot, but it sounded like the bullet didn't perform, as the hog ran another 100yds with a lung shot and had to be finished. You use an 18" with heavy bullets ~200yds? This doesn't seem to contradict my earlier statements. Am I missing something ? Yes. Several of those hogs were killed at 100yds or more with a SBR. Maybe I forgot to detail those specific ones or you missed them. Ok, that's good! There were a few without descriptions. So, your EXPERIENCE (and you obviously have a ton of hog hunting experience!) is that M193 out of a 12.5" barrel will effectively drop a hog out to 150yds? DRT or <20yds? Why even use m193 to hunt?!
Maybe because it works. I bet you wouldn't like getting one to the chest. But nothing but Barnes and other expensive shit works when we talk on the internet without actually having any real world experience.
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Posted: 5/28/2016 12:30:32 PM EDT
[#35]
I shot both .223/556 and 300 blackout. Liked both platforms but I prefer shooting .223/556 I guess it's personal preference.
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Posted: 5/30/2016 2:55:54 PM EDT
[#36]
Holy shit.
Get a 5.56 SBR for the range and use it defensively if you want to. I have read great things about the 50 grain TSX and others. Get a 300 BLK upper for aformentioned SBR and use it if you want to for hunting medium game. With a full length rifle, 5.56 is great. For an SBR, 300 is better but the 5.56 is no slouch, especially with good ammo. |
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Posted: 6/1/2016 10:40:12 AM EDT
[#37]
5.56 has better barrier penetration than most 300 blackout
556 has better long distance performance. Suppressors are shorter and lighter for 5.56 The main upside to 300 is its ability to be suppressed but that give you pistol Caliber performance. |
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Posted: 6/1/2016 2:48:24 PM EDT
[#38]
I guess I am different than the vast majority here. I shot 300blk and ever since I have wanted to get rid of my 5.56 rifles. The suppression alone is worth the extra cost for me. I am also getting into reloading to get the cost down. 5.56 suppressed is fun but nothing like 300blk.
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Posted: 6/2/2016 2:13:27 AM EDT
[#39]
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5.56 has better barrier penetration than most 300 blackout 556 has better long distance performance. Suppressors are shorter and lighter for 5.56 The main upside to 300 is its ability to be suppressed but that give you pistol Caliber performance. Can you please sight your sources... Point 1 is relative. What barriers are you talking about? Armor, drywall, gel, etc. Point 2 also relative. What distances? 600 yards, yes I would then agree. Point 3 is just wrong. 300 Blk can be used with most pistol cans. So not believing it. Point 4 most pistol calibers do not have the same impact energy, or terminal ballistics as 300 Blk. So not believing this one either. To other post about military kills, blah, blah, blah. Why again is the military using 5.56. Is it because 30-06 was crap. Maybe one of the biggest benefits is weight. Most military rounds fired miss there targets so its better to carry more ammo. Not to mention Nato rules, etc... Also lets compare 5.56 self defense round price to that of 300 Blk black tips, I'm not seeing much price difference. Everyone is using plinking tula prices to compared to barnes black tips. Seems fair right ... If you reload and cast your own, 300 Blk might use more of your lead, but less of your powder, and can be easier on your brass, etc...
Yes I like 300 Blk, but I also like 5.56. Lets just be real, and be accurate. They both have there places. As to the Ops question, of the 2 options 5.56 or 300 Blk, 300 Blk has my vote. Even suppressed 5.56 indoors, is loud, and most of my shooting is less than 200 yrds. To me 300 Blk has more advantages then cons. To justify there minimal if any price difference. |
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Posted: 6/2/2016 2:09:22 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll probably just hold on to them, hoping for more economical expanding bullets at subsonic speeds. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So, I'm kind of at a loss as to what I should do with my 300BLK SBRs. Switch the barrels to 556? Or sell the uppers? Build 556 uppers? I'll probably just hold on to them, hoping for more economical expanding bullets at subsonic speeds. If you reload http://www.makerbullets.com/proddetail.php?prod=308200SBLK |
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Posted: 6/2/2016 8:51:03 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can you please sight your sources... Point 1 is relative. What barriers are you talking about? Armor, drywall, gel, etc. Point 2 also relative. What distances? 600 yards, yes I would then agree. Point 3 is just wrong. 300 Blk can be used with most pistol cans. So not believing it. Point 4 most pistol calibers do not have the same impact energy, or terminal ballistics as 300 Blk. So not believing this one either. To other post about military kills, blah, blah, blah. Why again is the military using 5.56. Is it because 30-06 was crap. Maybe one of the biggest benefits is weight. Most military rounds fired miss there targets so its better to carry more ammo. Not to mention Nato rules, etc... Also lets compare 5.56 self defense round price to that of 300 Blk black tips, I'm not seeing much price difference. Everyone is using plinking tula prices to compared to barnes black tips. Seems fair right ... If you reload and cast your own, 300 Blk might use more of your lead, but less of your powder, and can be easier on your brass, etc...
Yes I like 300 Blk, but I also like 5.56. Lets just be real, and be accurate. They both have there places. As to the Ops question, of the 2 options 5.56 or 300 Blk, 300 Blk has my vote. Even suppressed 5.56 indoors, is loud, and most of my shooting is less than 200 yrds. To me 300 Blk has more advantages then cons. To justify there minimal if any price difference. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
5.56 has better barrier penetration than most 300 blackout 556 has better long distance performance. Suppressors are shorter and lighter for 5.56 The main upside to 300 is its ability to be suppressed but that give you pistol Caliber performance. Can you please sight your sources... Point 1 is relative. What barriers are you talking about? Armor, drywall, gel, etc. Point 2 also relative. What distances? 600 yards, yes I would then agree. Point 3 is just wrong. 300 Blk can be used with most pistol cans. So not believing it. Point 4 most pistol calibers do not have the same impact energy, or terminal ballistics as 300 Blk. So not believing this one either. To other post about military kills, blah, blah, blah. Why again is the military using 5.56. Is it because 30-06 was crap. Maybe one of the biggest benefits is weight. Most military rounds fired miss there targets so its better to carry more ammo. Not to mention Nato rules, etc... Also lets compare 5.56 self defense round price to that of 300 Blk black tips, I'm not seeing much price difference. Everyone is using plinking tula prices to compared to barnes black tips. Seems fair right ... If you reload and cast your own, 300 Blk might use more of your lead, but less of your powder, and can be easier on your brass, etc...
Yes I like 300 Blk, but I also like 5.56. Lets just be real, and be accurate. They both have there places. As to the Ops question, of the 2 options 5.56 or 300 Blk, 300 Blk has my vote. Even suppressed 5.56 indoors, is loud, and most of my shooting is less than 200 yrds. To me 300 Blk has more advantages then cons. To justify there minimal if any price difference. You can't argue #3. Pistol cans are subs only. |
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Posted: 6/2/2016 9:04:55 PM EDT
[#42]
Certain pistol cans are rated for BLK supers and subs. I humbly submit the SiCo Omega 9K...That's actually one of the reasons I bought a 9K, to share between my Scorpion Evo and BLK builds.
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Posted: 6/2/2016 9:27:50 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Certain pistol cans are rated for BLK supers and subs. I humbly submit the SiCo Omega 9K...That's actually one of the reasons I bought a 9K, to share between my Scorpion Evo and BLK builds. Learn something new every day. Although I'm not sure I'd call a 1.5" full welded a pistol can. Does SiCO call it a pistol can or a Subgun can that can work on a pistol in a pinch? ETA: no dog in this fight. Or maybe I have two dogs in this fight, haha. GET BOTH |
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Posted: 6/2/2016 10:16:45 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Learn something new every day. Although I'm not sure I'd call a 1.5" full welded a pistol can. Does SiCO call it a pistol can or a Subgun can that can work on a pistol in a pinch? ETA: no dog in this fight. Or maybe I have two dogs in this fight, haha. GET BOTH Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Certain pistol cans are rated for BLK supers and subs. I humbly submit the SiCo Omega 9K...That's actually one of the reasons I bought a 9K, to share between my Scorpion Evo and BLK builds. Learn something new every day. Although I'm not sure I'd call a 1.5" full welded a pistol can. Does SiCO call it a pistol can or a Subgun can that can work on a pistol in a pinch? ETA: no dog in this fight. Or maybe I have two dogs in this fight, haha. GET BOTH Sico calls it a pistol can, along with the Hybrid.  I have both in jail right now lol.
Oh yeah, and the 9K is 1.475", not 1.5"  ...But I only ever plan on using both on rifles and subguns.
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Posted: 6/3/2016 12:04:23 AM EDT
[#45]
Liberty also makes several super rated pistol cans. Silencerco's Omega is not much bigger, or weightier for this statement unless you are comparing it to mini cans which mfg's recommend for 14.5" or greater, and which are not doing as much for a short sbr. Also alot of 5.56 cans are only rated down to 10.5" (And 10.5" is as short as most would go to keep the reason for using 5.56) vs 7.5" for 300 Blk, thats 3" of length and barrel weight. Just being real.
300 Blk has more options for a larger range of suppressors, than 5.56 can use. 
As you can see if using a flat endcap it would not make much difference. Omega 7.62 14 oz. 
Saker k 5.56 14.7 oz. 
SDN-6 20 oz. Saker 5.56 18 oz. |
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