What are the reasons for a shorter barrel other than weight or for HD use?

Fun, fun, fun, fun, close quarters, fun, fun, fun.....

Hope you get lots of replies...I've wondered the same thing. SBR's seem to be very popular on here.

Compactness for CQC, vehicle borne ops, sometimes easier to carry & lighter, etc. Many shooters, including myself, just don't like long barrels. Arcane barrel length restrictions from the 1930's is just stupid.

Looks cool

Less to manage when hiking through forest, or moving through vehicle or home

They're lighter and easier to maneuver in tight areas

A neat thing about AR SBR's is that the lower is the registered part.
So theoretically you can switch to a short 9MM barrel/set up or dedicated .22 and they are legal.

Correct ?

Being that I don't own anything  less than 16, sure makes me look hard. Does definitely  seem ideal for all of the above

Correct. Also, shorter barrels are more comfortable to suppress than long barrels. My 10.5" upper with a silencer is 15".

They tend to be......"handier". I have several AR-15's in several calibers. I have a 7.62x39mm AR, two 5.45x39mm AR's (one is a 12.5" SBR, the other is a 16", a 10.3" Daniel Defense SBR and a 11.5" Colt 6933 as well as Colt AR15's with 16" barrels and a particular favorite 18" Noveske SPR with an ACOG mounted on top...

The rifle I take every single time I shoot is my 10.3" DD SBR. It's more enjoyable and just as accurate out to 200 yds. Also a big plus I've never heard mentioned, it is easy on my AR500 steel targets because of the reduced velocity. The hardened steel targets do not get dimpled shooting hot NATO 5.56x45mm ammunition.

SBR's tend to be outstanding car/truck guns. Again they are just handy. If you have several AR-15's one of 'em ought to be a short barreled version. The one SBR that has eluded me is a 10.5" barreled 7.62x39mm. Likely I'll wind up with one of the newly introduced SIG Xi or the IMI ACE in 7.62.

Easier to maneuver around corners inside the home with a shorter barrel in an HD situation.
You should be fine with a 16 inch barrel, it's better than doing it with a 20 inch barrel like the M16.
Although Marines do it with an M16, and Marines kick ass.

If sight radius is not an issue, they'll do pretty much everything a longer barrel will do.

Actually , I had in mind more favorable for hd, but the other reasons also. I know they had to shine in other situations. If no more than preference.

The reason that the military is using so many is simply because urban combat is the current reality.  

The reason so many people are using them on this forum is for two reasons.
1.  The military is and in general civilian trends follow military trends.  
2.  Because they are fun as hell.  With a suppressor they don't stick out 5 feet and without a suppressor they scare children which is always a +

This ... The ol A2 stock laid on top of the shoulder to suck up a little extra length.

OP lots of advantages to a shorter barrel, less front heavy, more maneuverability, easier to get in and out of a car with or move in car with, and the list goes on.

For me, it was mainkly as a suppressor host for my HD gun. NFA takes BRD to a whole different level..

it's more comfortable for me to handle, a 16 inch gun with a quad rail is a bit too heavy in the front. even though it's actually lighter than my 11.5 inch pistol with a tube because of the sig brace.

once i saw the pistol n sig brace i pretty much lost interest in my rifle, the shorter barrel is just too cool. and it fits sideways straight through a door frame so moving around with it won't be an issue.

i won't go the SBR route because $200 to a government agency that works against my interests is not something i'm really interested in. but with the brace it's a similar concept.

as was mentioned the accuracy isn't' really any worse and i'm rarely trying to kill anything so by going with a shorter barrel i give up nothing n gain mobility and comfort, i set up my afg pretty much at the beginning of the railso a longer barrel really does weigh things down up front since i'm basically holding the middle of the rifle.

...at a much lower velocity.

Yes....registered and TAXED.

With a pistol round; 9MM for example, is the velocity really that much reduced ?
I understand with a rifle round it can be expected but pistol cartridges were made for short barrels to begin with.

I am not a huge fan of REALLY short rifles (Less than 10.5") because really after the 11.5/12.5 lengths you start losing a decent amount of velocity.  From what I have seen, between the 10.5" and 11.5" you are going to lose about 110-140FPS (depends on ammo... heavier the gr, the less velocity gain you will get) for that 1".  When you move from the 11.5" to the 14.5" you gain about 170FPS (or 56FPS per inch).  Then you get 55FPS per inch going from 14.5" to 16" and about 25FPS per inch going from 16" to 20".  So you lose about 250 total FPS going from an 11.5" AR to a 16" AR.  

So you have to look at what you are going to use your AR for to see if that velocity difference is worth the extra length.  If you are shooting for fun, short barrels are pretty damn fun; if you are building a HD rifle, the range will be so short that the velocity lost between these various lengths really means very little.  And if you are building a SHTF rifle, you just really need to think about what you want/where you live.  Hypothetically speaking, if your 16" rifle is a 600m rifle, an 11.5 or 12.5 would probably be about a 475-500m rifle.  If you think that you will get that much benefit from having that extra 100 meters at the expensive of portability, go for it.  Personally, I think that being able to easily use a rifle in tight spaces such as a vehicle is worth the tradeoff in velocity.  However, there are certain ground positions that are easier to achieve into with a longer rifle.  This kinda goes over a few things about the benefits of the non-NFA length (http://modernserviceweapons.com/?p=7498) but to me, it is a half hearted write up.  You are much more likely to get attacked in your home or your vehicle than anywhere else and I suppose this would likely remain true for some type of temporary unrest period due to some unknown situation.  At these distances (no more than an extremely/overly generous 200 yards) your 12.5, 11.5, or even 10.5 is going to be effective.  Even at most hunting distances, these shorter barrels will perform more than adequately.  I think where the extra length really helps is in large open spaces, and I just don't think you are going to get these in any HD/SHTF scenario unless you live on a farm.  Just my opinion.

For the ranges a average joe would ever use a rifle. A SBR makes more sense

...and unavailable is CA

SBRs are nice to have.

This one...


and this one.

Yes, modern bomb proof optics have changed the game

Oh come on, now.  You know you would get one

Oh wait, the Sig Brace is the same thing, I forgot

A 10.5-12" is nice for HD/close range use.

A 14.5-16" is good for a few hundred yards or more and has great versatility.

18-20" is great for longer ranges, varmint, or competition use.

A 7-8" is great for pure fun and ease of transportation.  

With proper ammo selection any can work for SD use.

Not really, unless you consider in the area of 100 FPS between a 20" and 16" "much lower."

http://www.ar15.com/content/page.html?id=213

If the military was that concerned about the difference they'd still be using all 20" rifles.

I think he was referencing the recent popularity of 10-12 inch ar barrels.

So is your car, but I'm willing to bet you don't ride a bicycle everywhere.

I have come to realize I can do everything I need to do with my 10.3" that I would do with a 16", 18" or whatever else. It's shorter, lighter, it isn't a mile long with my can mounted, I can move through tight areas and in and out of vehicles more easily, and it is no less accurate. The negligible muzzle velocity that I lose is made up for with proper ammo selection. 55gr Hornady Urban TAP, Prvi Partizan 75gr OTM, Black Hills 77gr OTM are some favorites of mine and will all get it done.

That said, I will own longer guns again in the future, but not out of necessity. I could get by with just my 10.3" for the rest of my life if for whatever reason that was all I could ever afford to have.

cause its the hotness and really handy / fun

DSC_4715 by The Dorsal Fin, on Flickr

videos all over youtube of 12"ers hitting at 600yds

11.5" is my HD weapon.

The 7.5" pistol is for fun the 10.3" is for HD.  I have a Can on the way (8 months to go) for the 10.3!!

Producers of large fire balls = fun.

Nevermind, I didn't read this correctly.

ETA: To answer the original question: because I can!

12" barrels have a great deal more velocity than a 10" so the 10-12".  You gain more velocity going from a 10.5" to an 11.5" than you do going from a 16" to a 20".  Its hard to beat a 12.5" (my SBR is an 11.5 but still pretty good ballistics for the size).  If I have to have one rifle for everything... its an 11.5 or 12.5 but if it is going to be a dedicated outdoor rifle w/ no vehicle use.... probably would go 16".

Yep. Too many people equate barrel length with distance - which surely is not the case.

The only argument I've heard that would truly validate a longer barrel being needed for distance in pretty much any real life scenario for a civilian would be for those guys who like turning prairie dogs into red mist at hundreds of yards away.

Aside from that, no civilian is going to practically need anything longer than a 14.5" rifle - and most would never need more than a 10.3" rifle.

I personally no longer own any 223/556 ARs longer than 14.5 inches.

Yeah, yeah,  yeah...but it's far from ideal.

Accuracy and effective range are two totally different things.

F that... prairie dogs will give you pneumonic plague.  

Good point.... if are shooting groups at long range (or small animals at long range) every little bit of velocity is nice because it limits the time the round is exposed to the elements but if you can hit it with a 20" you can probably hit it with an SBR.  It will just require a little more holdover.

My only SBR is an AK104 clone built on a Form 1 on an Arsenal SLR-107CR with a 12.5" barrel. Its very easy to manipulate in confined spaces, transport, and is pretty simple to conceal with its folding stock. I really like the rifle, but I doubt that I will ever go through the hassle and expense of doing another SBR as I find a 16" setup to be reasonably compact for home defense, range use as it is. Currently, my shortest AR is a 16" mid-length. That's not likely to change anytime soon.

It's for those who are use to using  "smaller equipment",  
It takes a real man to handle Carbine and Rifle length tools.


To be honest with you, I think the advantages are pretty obvious and well stated already, they are easier to handle in confined areas, that and they look bad azz.

Obviously for close quarters combat. But they are also handy for reducing a rifles weight as well as being paired with a Suppressor. My Mk18 with direct thread gemtech GMT 556 LE + mil spec buffer tube is about 2-3 inches shorter than my old 16" AR15, weighs about 4 ounces less and is about as loud as a .22lr. The suppressor will also reduce recoil and muzzle flash.

The bad side is the reduces velocity. But the suppressor helps with back pressure and increase the velocity some and if used at less than 100 yards it will still have more than sufficient velocity.

Thinking bout buying a MK18 pistol and adding the brace....no SBR allowed here

Always wanted a 6933,glad I have one now

Correct.  If I wanted a 300-400fps drop in velocity and .22 Hornet performance, I'd go with .22 Hornet instead of .223.

It's about the feel and handling characteristics, as well as mounting a suppressor without being as long as a Brown Bess

Man's got jokes

Not quite... it is shocking that a 35gr projectile going 200FPS faster doesn't have the same energy tho

Help me here, I'm being told the Colt 6721 is a 14 and half barrel. I can find nothing to back that up. Is that wrong? yep it is, just found it, no 14.5

1. Increased accuracy / stability...if you're adding a stock to a pistol.

2. Recreating historically accurate 'look' of various guns, like the semi-auto Thompsons...a 16" bbl thompson is a crime against humanity.

3. Less OAL means you can put a suppressor on a rifle without it being 4+ feet long.

4. Because I haven't been able to legally own one my entire adult life (WA resident, recently legalized)

All of that said, I have no use for SBRs in 556. Slow moving .224 isn't all that appealing. At some point you might as well just use a 22lr.

Great for HD, and more manueverable in close spaces. yada yada yada.

REAL reason:

It makes my Johnson barrel look bigger in my nude shots.

Shorter, more compact, lighter, easier use in vehicles, even with a can less than 16"

See below 16" on top then 12, 10.5, 7.5