First and foremost, I'm an amateur. I'm reading, watching videos, learning. That said, I'm ready to get my hands dirty. I'd like to buy a used reasonably priced decent quality mill.

I've begun the Google search but am curious if I'm missing something and someone can direct me to a machine auction or military surplus auction site.

Thanks for any information in advance. If you can suggest any good books or other valuable information sources I'd also appreciate it.

Mill Link

What kind of mill are you wanting, or more so what do you plan on doing with it? Do you want a bridgeport sized mill? A Clausing 8520 size mill? Or one of the various Chinese mini mills? Craigslist is where I got both my Excello mill and South Bend lathe.

To start I'll probably just get a mini mill. Projects in mind are 80% lowers, accessories for my rifles(rail sections etc) and toys for my son. Start small, work from there.

I'd personally be looking at a G0704 or G0759. But that's me.

Zach

G0704 is good. It's light enough that it can be easily moved, but heavy enough that it has some stiffness. Not stiff like bridgeport or really large machines but for apartments it will work. I'm trying to do a remington 700 receiver from scratch with it.

Also G0704 can be modded to increase its work envelope without affecting its rigidity too much. Something as simple as taking the head saddle off, and putting it back on backwards will increase its Z axis travel by at least 6 inches.

I have the 704.  I am still learning how to mill with it.  Save up for tooling as that will cost as much as the mill.

I have one of those mini-mills. And I'd say go ahead and skip the mini and get a Grizzly G0704 or Precision Mathews PM25-MV. The PM is similar to the 704 but a better machine for just a little more. What you can do with them is vastly superior to what a mini-mill can handle and infinitely more ridged than the mini.

Go as big as room and money will allow. I bought a smaller table Bridgeport then bought a full size Wells index .
You will be doing projects you never thought of hell my wife has made craft project on it.

It also depends on your budget. You can buy a bridgeport for 1000 dollars, if you have the means to transport it (it weights as much as a car), the means to support it (you will not do this in a 3rd floor apartment), 3 phase power, etc.. You will also have to deal with rusted table, ways, leadscrew (meaning they may need replacement, not a trivial sum). So your 1000 dollar bridgeport will end up costing at least 3000 more, and more still if you have to rent a truck and possibly more space for it.

G0704 is ready to go, or maybe not completely (you will want the belt drive kit from Benchtop Precision) but it's light enough that you can carry it up to a third floor apartment by yourself (will require disassembly, which you will want to anyways to clean it), it has enough work envelope with mods to almost compete with a bridgeport. It may not be as stiff as a bridgeport but with sharp cutters and lighter feed, it is just as good. Motor can be upgraded by the way for a 3 phase 1.5HP if you want more power and retain speed control.

If you got the space and support for a knee mill you're probably better off buying those Bridgeport clones from Grizzly. They will truck it to you for a modest fee and they'll be brand new, meaning no rusted part to remachine or replace. They will also be single phase or 3 phase with appropriate controllers included to run from single phase.

I started with that HF mini mill as well. I shouldn't really say started as it was too much of a frustration for me and I lost interest in machining at home. I guess it would be fine for 80% lowers. It was horrible for the stuff I was trying to do. I beat that thing up for about a month before backlash in the X-Y got ridiculous and then the spindle bearings took a shit.

A few years ago I found a local machine shop that was pretty much giving away an old Index 45 mill and paid a guy with a bobcat to help me move it into the garage. Man what a difference. I actually enjoy making parts on it.

Variable Frequency Drives have made 3-phase no longer a significant barrier.

They are far cheaper and easier to use than even a static (let alone rotary or idler) ever was.

You can feed 240 V single phase into a VFD and easily generate real 3-phase.

And not even bother with the VFD function.

And unlike idlers and many rotary converters make decently matched 3-phase.

I should have mentioned this the VFD gives you infinite speed control that you don't get with older machines.

Freight from OH to CO will probably be a deal breaker but I deal with this outfit regularly, both buying from them for business/personal and selling used equipment to/through them.  They often have reasonably priced, good looking Bridgeports and clones.



http://hgrinc.com/





If you're going to buy a mini-mill just buy a new one.  The Little Machine Shop model gets decent feedback.

Clearance under the collet quickly becomes what you need.

At least grizzly stopped the emphasis the round column junk.

It does NOT preserve alignment if the head is adjusted.

No experience with the square ones but they at least have a chance.

Bridgeport parts are not hard to find.

Some parts can be painfully expensive for popular models though.
The NOS is long gone for some parts.

Certain crank handles are a real PITA to find.

I could almost swear they changed sizes for customs and low volume units just to stop part swapping.

Easier to make something from stock pieces than find an original.

At least it gives you something to work on.

You may find one good-2-go.

Lower priced units often need 'work.'

That's why you can get the G0704 and do the flip mod. You remove the part that the head is bolted to, slide it off and then install it backwards. This boosts the space under the collet from a lowly 13 inches (which is kinda low) to about 18.5 inches. Best part is this mod is easy to do and requires no new parts or expensive mods.

They even do the Y axis spacer mod to it, but to me that's a little over the top as the parts can cost quite a bit if you have someone make it for you.

If you find a way to mill the slot in the column a little longer on the bottom end you will be able to move the head until the spindle touches the table... I don't consider this important since things like ER collets, vise, etc. add considerable space but for those who mill stuff clamped directly to the table, it's important.

I've done the Y axis and head spacer mod, while it greatly increases travel, I wouldn't advise it, in my case, it made it far less rigid and cannot take as heavy of a roughing cut.

As for your second statement, if you use the Tormach style TTS holders, which are quite nice, especially if you don't already have R8 collets, the touching the table isn't an issue anymore.  Though you do lose a bit of max Z clearance, really becomes an issues with drills, though I use stubby drills, added benefit, don't always require spotting with those.

I just added DRO to my Grizzly 704.  Definitely an improvement.

Bridgeport or other knee mill if you got a large first floor apartment, or a house with a spare garage (or an empty house with no wife or significant other to complain about), or preferably an abandoned warehouse. You are not going to move a bridgeport up a stair... well actually second floor shops do exist and it seems any machine one ton or thereabouts can go on a second floor (I saw a gunsmith shop on a second floor). It may be worth it but I think to save you some trouble of getting a used machine up and running Grizzly does sell decent knee mills... they're worth a look if you don't want to mess around but want a knee mill ready to go.

For the rest of us G0704 is not a bad deal considering that the next step up is a round column mill drill, and they have the problem of losing zeros when you move the head at all. Square dovetail column mills don't have this problem. G0704 isn't bad because even though it's 100lbs lighter than a X3 it has the same stiffness.

You just have to learn the limitation around your machine.

For general gunsmithing having a big enough lathe is more important than having a large mill unless you're going to manufacture firearms receiver from scratch.

That gunsmith shop I mentioned has a Jet round column mill/drill in their shop... and a 10" southbend lathe. I think (or bet) the lathe get used a lot more. The mill is probably only used for installing scopes.

You can probably install a bridgeport in a second floor apartment if you got an army of men, and disassemble the machine and moving it up the stairs in pieces (so you won't need to carry the entire 2000lb weight). You will probably want to brace up the floor (lots of 2x4 bundled together to form a strong floor board, spanning as many  joists as you can) before the move. You'll have to find a way to tie 220v to your mill and a VFD to convert it to 3 phase. Most apartment will not have readily accessible 220v lines. It's a lot of hassle for a machine that is only about 20% better than a X3 type machine anyways (most the advantage being speed, the ability to do heavy cuts without chatter) with respect to gunsmithing.

I've decided I'm buying a PM-25.  I simply don't have the room or the need for a full size machine at home, if I'm doing a full size job, I'll use the equipment at work.  All I want to do at home is make precisely located holes and mill slots for knife guards.  From the research I've done it will work well for that.  Additionally it's 110v which is a plus since my 2x72 grinder, heat treat furnace and air compressor take up all my 220v access.