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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Creating your own brand AR

Posted: 1/17/2015 12:48:39 AM EDT

Hello all, I am getting started in the cerakote business and would like to work towards having my own brand AR10/15. This isnt something I am trying to do overnight, just looking into what it would take to take this on. Question I have is to do this, do I contact a company who already produces uppers and lowers? Do I pay for the basic design and add my touch then create it on my own, if so, who do I get the rights from? I just dont know where to start my research and would like some input... Suggestions?

Posted: 1/17/2015 12:56:08 AM EDT

[#1]

Why on earth would you start a business like this in such a crowded market?

Posted: 1/17/2015 2:28:10 AM EDT

[#2]

Going after a smaller segment of hunters and long range shooting in different calibers. And where I live the market could support it... But I hear Ya, it will be rough...

Posted: 1/17/2015 3:51:49 AM EDT

[#3]

The AR15 lower market is saturated. If you want to specialize in other calibers why not build using others' lowers? Still a tough market but less risky than the first. Need an FFL to do either though

Posted: 1/17/2015 11:40:04 AM EDT

[#4]

First post nailed it

Quote History

Quoted:
Why on earth would you start a business like this in such a crowded market?

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Posted: 1/17/2015 11:49:26 AM EDT

[#5]

You will have to have a manufacturers license.

Many of the Machine Shops that actually machine lowers, like Aero produce branded lowers for other companies.

Years ago I talked to Tactical Machining they said they would put your name and logo on a lower if you ordered a 100.

Don't know if that is still true.

Posted: 1/17/2015 11:43:32 PM EDT

[#6]

Yep, most of the mfg's will brand lowers for you...as long as you have an FFL, SOT, and you provide the roll stamp or print ready graphics. You will pay about $50-70 each for the lowers ( with a minimum order) Less than 100- price goes up fast. Better off just using someone else's lower and build the uppers to caliber spec. BTW-- you still need an FFL AND MFG SOT. Not cheap thing to start, oh and don't forget your business address, business license, tax info, and all the other things that come with owning your own "mfg". Now if you have a "new" design, or some other gimmick, and you have done you market research, hey, go for it dude!

Posted: 1/18/2015 1:39:11 AM EDT

[#7]

Right on right on... I am aware of the mfg and ffl... I currently in the last stages of starting my cerakote business. My plan as of now is just uppers in other calibers, I just needed to know about the lower info, IF I decide to go that route. Thanks for all the input, all of it. I will with out a doubt take all this into consideration. Anything else anyone wants to add, Im all ears. All so, having been recently retired medically from my LEO career, I still have strong ties to a lot of swat teams and cops, my market is there to make a profit, maybe not be huge and make millions, but something I could easily make a decent living off of.

Posted: 1/18/2015 2:21:20 AM EDT

[#8]

Going to need your FFL to take in rifle for repair, so that one is a given.

Now take a look at the price of the SOT, the insurance on it, then the needed amounts that you will need to order receivers from a sub contractor to get the needed price breaks to make having your own name on a lower cost effective.

Plan Jane lower receivers are selling for as low as $60 right now, so this is not the market to try to jump into alone.

As for one off rifles, then you jump into ammo, and in some causes, may need to produce the ammo as well if what is commercial available is not going to work with the rifles you are creating.

Posted: 1/18/2015 3:37:40 AM EDT

[#9]

Quote History

Quoted:
Going after a smaller segment of hunters and long range shooting in different calibers. And where I live the market could support it... But I hear Ya, it will be rough...

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No it can't.

Posted: 1/18/2015 9:20:54 AM EDT

[#10]

Quote History

Quoted:
Right on right on... I am aware of the mfg and ffl... I currently in the last stages of starting my cerakote business. My plan as of now is just uppers in other calibers, I just needed to know about the lower info, IF I decide to go that route. Thanks for all the input, all of it. I will with out a doubt take all this into consideration. Anything else anyone wants to add, Im all ears. All so, having been recently retired medically from my LEO career, I still have strong ties to a lot of swat teams and cops, my market is there to make a profit, maybe not be huge and make millions, but something I could easily make a decent living off of.

View Quote

You know how to make a million? Spend 2 million. While it could be profitable, you are 6-8 years behind the curve. A "cheap" lower is just that-cheap. Unless you plan on manufacturing thousands of lowers, it's cheaper to get a mfg to roll stamp ones for you. BTW- roll stamps are approximately $500-1000 each. Also remember, SWAT and LEO's are bound by what their dept. says they can carry. If they say Bushmaster, it has to be Bushmaster. Not a clone. I work with a lot of local, state and Gov. LE on a daily basis. It is good work, but they have set rules to what can be done and how. Being that you are in CA, you have more BS to deal with than a lot of us. Not only do you have Fed regs., you have CA draconian regs. If you do enough Cerakote for a reasonable price, you can make a good paycheck. You won't be buying a Ferrari, but you will be making money.

Posted: 1/18/2015 9:27:18 AM EDT

[#11]

Manufactor ITAR cost starting at $2,500 a year, so don't forget to add that into your yearly costs.
As for other costs, just depends, on the direction you need to go with FFL and SOT costs, and what local laws/regs that you will need to jump through/pay for in CA as well.
http://oag.ca.gov/firearms/dlrfaqs

A Class 3 SOT dealer is a dealer of NFA firearms
A Class 2 SOT manufacturer is a manufacturer of NFA firearms
A Class 1 SOT importer is an importer of NFA firearms

Type 1 FFL is a Title 1 dealer or gunsmith
Type 2 FFL is a Title 1 dealer doing business as a pawnbroker
Type 3 FFL is a licensed collector of Curio & Relic (C&R) firearms
Type 6 FFL is a licensed maker of ammunition and reloading components other than Armor Piercing ammunition
Type 7 FFL is a Title 1 manufacturer of firearms, ammunition and ammunition components other than NFA, Destructive Devices and Armor Piercing ammunition
Type 8 FFL is an importer of Title 1 firearms and ammunition
Type 9 FFL is a dealer in Title 1 firearms including NFA destructive devices, but no other NFA
Type 10 FFL is a manufacturer of Title 1 firearms, ammunition and ammunition components, including NFA Destructive Devices but no other NFA, and not including Armor Piercing ammunition
Type 11 FFL is an importer of Title 1 firearms, ammunition and NFA Destructive Devices, but no other NFA

To get a Class 3 SOT status, you need a dealer or manufacturer FFL which includes Type 1, 2, 7, 8, 9, 10 or 11 - and pay a yearly $500 tax due every July 1st.

To get a Class 2 SOT status, you need a manufacturer FFL, which includes Type 7, 10 - and pay a yearly $1000 or $500 (reduced rate for small manufacturers) tax due every July 1st.

To get a Class 1 SOT status, you need an importer FFL, which includes Type 8, 11- and pay a yearly $1000 or $500 (reduced rate for small importers) tax due every July 1st.

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Posted: 1/18/2015 10:00:47 AM EDT

[#12]

Keep in mind, you will probably need to pay the gubment the 11% tax for each firearm you "manufacture".

http://www.ttb.gov/firearms/reference_guide.shtml

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Creating your own brand AR

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