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Posted: 5/28/2014 12:43:02 PM EDT
Its a Sears, Model 54, caliber 30-30.
My Grandpas "Carbine"
But what is the hype about "Pre64" Model 94s?
Link Posted: 5/28/2014 1:10:02 PM EDT
[#1]
In a nutshell, the basic difference is that pre '63 was manufactured from forged steel, in '64 above sn. 1,650,000 approx. stamped metal was used.






Another big  change was in the '80's when Win. was bought out by USRC, then the ejection pattern was changed to offset and the cross bolt safety was introduced.  Along the way from '64 some MIM parts have been used, and the steel butt plate turned into plastic.







Of the changes that Win.along the way, some were adopted some dropped.  Now that the rifle is being made by Miroku, it's being made with a Forged receiver again.
















 
Link Posted: 5/29/2014 4:25:32 AM EDT
[#2]
The post 64 rifles were just as good in every way but manufactured in a way that was considered at the time to be cheap and that created a very big rift among Winchester fans.  The pre 64 rifles will demand a premium from then on but there's no performance difference between the 1963 and the 1964.  There were no Sears "JC Higgins" models manufactured before 1964 so they are not collectable in that way.  They generally bring $50-100 less than a comparable Winchester 94 marked rifle despite being the same rifle with a different manufacturer, model and serial number than the Winchester 94.
Link Posted: 5/29/2014 11:09:55 AM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
In a nutshell, the basic difference is that pre '63 was manufactured from forged steel, in '64 above sn. 1,650,000 approx. stamped metal was used.

Another big  change was in the '80's when Win. was bought out by USRC, then the ejection pattern was changed to offset and the cross bolt safety was introduced.  Along the way from '64 some MIM parts have been used, and the steel butt plate turned into plastic.

Of the changes that Win.along the way, some were adopted some dropped.  Now that the rifle is being made by Miroku, it's being made with a Forged receiver again.
 
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Exactly what I was looking for.
Thank You
Link Posted: 5/30/2014 9:29:22 PM EDT
[#4]
There were some differences that were major or minor depending on who you talked to.

1) Purists will tell you the real slump in quality occurred during WWII with the Post WWII Winchesters not having the same degree of hand fitting as the pre-WWII Winchesters, so the serious snobs and collectors will show a preference for pre-WWII Model 94s.

2) In 1964 Winchester made some changes to decease production costs, including the use of some stamped parts and roll pins instead of solid pins.   The stamped lifter was the most offensive of the stamped parts.   Big W almost realized it had seriously stepped in it and within a couple years the milled parts and solid pins were back.

3) Another less obvious change was a switch to a sinter forged receiver.  It gets a lot of hate but the engineering is actually sound, and the receivers are both very strong and well made.  The sinter forging process starts with powdered metal (which actually allows more control of the allow, that is then molded under intense heat and pressure in a die.  The forging that results is very close to the final dimensions and thus reduces machining costs.   The problem with them was not strength, but rather how they were "blued".  There were three different processes used from 1964 through 1981:

Years           Serial Number Range    Process
1964-1968 - 2,700,000 - 3,185,691 - Du-Lite 3-0 Process
1968-1972 - 3,185,692 - 3,806,499 - Black Chrome Plate
1972-1981 - 3,806,500 - 5,024,957 - Win Blue/Oxiblak

The sinter forged receivers from 1964-81 had a high amount of chrome in them and with a traditional bluing process, it results in a copper or purple color.  The early receivers from 1964-68 were blackened using the Du-Lite 3-0 process.  The receivers made from 1968-72 were black chrome plated, while the 1972-81 receivers were plated with iron to allow them to be blued in a normal manner.  The problem with refinishing the 64-68 receivers with a normal bluing process is an even copper to plum color.   The problem with the 1968-81 receivers is the the polish and prep for bluing will remove the chrome plating or the iron plating (usually unevenly) resulting in a mottled plum color on the finished piece.

All of the above can be refinished, but that's best done by either using the  Du-Lite 3-0 Process, or by re-plating with iron before re-bluing normally.  You just need to take them to someone who knows show to do it properly.

4) In 1982, USRAC switched to 4144 steel on the Model 94 and they can be refinished normally.

5) However, USRAC also switched to the angle eject (AE) model which ejects the case to the side to allow a scope mounted over the center of the receiver, and the receivers were drilled and tapped for scope mounts.

Below is a 1973 Model 94 Carbine (top) and a 1982 color case hardened AE Model 94 Trapper.  You can see the AE cut in the receiver on the bottom carbine, and you can see where the black chrome plating has gotten pretty thin in some areas in the 1973 carbine:

   

6) Around the same time Olin sold the New Haven plant to the employees who formed USRAC and produced "Winchester" rifles under license to Olin.   They also switched to a rebounding hammer on the Model 94, which you can also see in the above picture as it does not rest all the forward against the bolt.  This did away with the traditional half cock operation, and the heavier springs needed resulted in slightly heavier trigger pull.

7) In 1989, USRAC went bankrupt, and was acquired by Herstal (the parent company of FN and Browning).  They kept it limping along at New Haven until 2006.

8)  The cross bolt safety was added in 1992 and it was not well received, although it is not actually all that unsightly and the rifles from that era were still very well made.    

9) In 2002, the cross bolt safety was replaced by a slightly less offensive tang safety.

10) In 2006 Herstal/Browning closed the US plant closed and Browning then licensed the Winchester name from Olin and moved the production of the Winchester lever guns to Miroku in Japan, but the Model 94 was not one of them and was discontinued.  

11) In 2010, Browning started making the Model 94 again, produced by Miroku.  Miroku builds quality firearms, and they are better than what was coming out of New Haven toward the end, but they get unfairly saddled with the "Japchester" moniker by the purists, and they are pretty pricey starting at about $1100.  

------

In the overall  scheme of things the 1964-81 Model 94s represent some of the best values out there for a Model 94 that will be used as a shooter.  They have the classic Model 94 look and operation with a half cock notch and none of the rebounding hammer or lawyer safeties added later.  And they also do not have the collector value of the pre-64 Winchesters and can consequently be found at good prices.







Link Posted: 7/10/2014 9:05:35 PM EDT
[#5]
Reminds me I was suppose to ask something in here a long time ago. I picked up a Winchester 94 because the price was right and then decided it probably had some age on it. Does anyone know where the Winchester 94 serial # database is or can tell me approximate manufacture date of serial #1949xxx ? Thanks.
Link Posted: 7/12/2014 1:37:39 AM EDT
[#6]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Reminds me I was suppose to ask something in here a long time ago. I picked up a Winchester 94 because the price was right and then decided it probably had some age on it. Does anyone know where the Winchester 94 serial # database is or can tell me approximate manufacture date of serial #1949xxx ? Thanks.

View Quote
1952



http://www.winchesterguns.com/support/files/images/wfa/2012-All/2012-Articles/Winchester-Manufacture-Dates-by-Year----2012-Scanned-Documents.pdf



 
Link Posted: 7/13/2014 1:56:41 PM EDT
[#7]
Thanks for the info. Guess when they rib me about my semi's next time I can tell them about my old Winchester
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