Hi All,

First post but I plan to spend a lot more time here, lots of good info.  

So I've spent the last month researching gun safes and have narrowed it down to these two.  I'm now an internet safe expert, I've even gone and kicked a bunch of tires.  If I could stretch the budget I'd be picking something else but I'm already pushing it with the Boss.  The consensus is that RSCs in my price range only offer so much security and the differences probably aren't worth fighting about.  

Things I wanted
- 1 hour fire protection minimum
- decent RSC security
- 60x30x24 footprint
- sold by a solid company
- flexible interior
- price $1200 - $1500  for just the safe/tax  - delivery adds to this significantly

I've narrowed it down to the Liberty Franklin and the Browning Hunter HR-26 (textured charcoal).  Ive done the pros and cons thing and will highlight a few for you.

- Both 11g bodies and composite doors though the Browning has tighter gaps and external hinges which I like.
- Both made in the USA.  
- Both are 60+ minute fire rating, Franklin is 75 minutes but still only has 2 layers in the walls.

- Browning has reinforced door jam/frame for locking bolts, seems sturdier than Liberty's frame which looks a little weak to be honest
- Browning has pry stop reinforcement on the 2 bolts closest to the corners (open side) which look better than Liberty
- Liberty has active bolts on all 4 sides, Bronwing doesn't have bolts on bottom and the hinge side are all fixed.  Haven't been able to determine if fixed bolts are really that bad.
- Liberty has a track record, the Browning Hunter models not so much, at least I can't find many reviews


Don't know if I'm up for it, but, I just heard today, there's a 3rd option for a used National Security safe about 10 years old for $1450.  Far away but if I could get the price down it could come in cheaper than the other 2 when all said and done but may need to have the lock checked out combo changed.  Not sure how good the fire rating is on it.


I Appreciate your help

In before "that's not a safe"

I second that.

These two safes are pretty close to one another but I am not really sure of the Browning's cost to you but a dealer nearby is selling his at $1899 and his Liberty Franklin in that size runs $1499(Able Ammo)
I like Browning's modular interior and the door mounting area for long guns is nice but it also makes you give up shelf space because of the space it requires when the door is closed.
I also like the fact of Browning's outer hinges as it truly makes a difference in getting things in and out of the gun safe.
I generally recommend the Franklin model when people are looking for a gun safe in this size because it has a lot of features like the door storage,lighting,11 gauge steel and good bolt coverage.
The Liberty does not have a reinforced frame like the Browning which is something Liberty ought to possibly add.
On the other hand Liberty's locking mechanism is possibly a bit better than the force deflector system on the Browning.
However they both employ anti pry tabs which really helps these composite built up refrigerator type doors.
Plate steel doors are always going to be better and stronger.
Liberty is well known for customer service but I'm not as sure about Browning's as I have heard a few complaints on gun boards a couple of times about the lack off support.
Could be just sour grapes but I thought I would mention it.
I would not give the dead bolts a second thought as even my Amsec BF uses them.

If you have not looked at Amsec's SF model give it a look.
It uses a 1/4 inch plate steel door and has a similar fire protection as the others you are looking at and 14 solid four way bolts around the door.
Both of those two safes you are looking at are very good for that price range.
Make sure you bolt them down in an area that limits a pry attack and you will mostly be good to go.
I had to get that last sentence in before the gun board over analyzers come in with tales of fire axes,sledge hammers,sawzalls,five foot crow bars,and blow torches get in on the conversation which most residential burglars never use.
Good luck.

Maybe you could get this?

60x30x22 footprint, 10ga construction, 120 minute fireproof, UL RSC and UL Lock
http://www.wayfairsupply.com/Winchester-Safe-2-Hr-Fireproof-Silverado-Premier-Electronic-Lock-Gun-Safe-S-60-WSF1012.html

Wayfair supply seems to have 10% off coupons.  If they do apply (haven't read the details) it'll bring the total down to $1475 shipped, though you might need to add the $50 liftgate option.

I'm not entirely sure how to get the 10% off coupon to appear.  I visited their site to look at the safes a few times, and then after that I saw Wayfair supply ads everywhere offering me 10% off.  They were on Facebook, random websites, and even at the bottom of forum posts on this website.

The Sturdy safes are excellent no doubt, but with fire liner are way more than I can spend.

There's a local shop having a great sale so the Browning is #1400 out the door in textured charcoal while the Franklin is $1445 out the door in gloss burgundy finish.  About the same money. I just checked Able but with shipping it's quite a bit more money.

I appreciate the in depth response heeler1.  I agree that they're probably pretty similar performance wise.  Interesting to hear about Browning not being as responsive as Liberty on the support side of things, I definitely value good customer support.

The same store carries summit but is out of stock on the size I'm looking for so sale won't apply.  It has plate steel and looks like an all around better safe but I have to select from what's in stock.  I'll look at the AMSEC as well.

I do plan to bolt it down, but it's a plywood/carpet floor, so still trying to figure out the best way to do so.

Thanks

I have dealt with both companies, and unless anything has changed recently, both have good customer service.

Between the two, I would tend to lean towards the Browning.  External hinges are a better design, the Browning will tend to have a better fit and finish, and Browning also tends to have better interiors.

Can the liberty Franklin doors hold up to a pry attack?  Just doesn't seem like much strength in the frame to stop the bolts from breaking through but that's just my gut instinct.  Lots of people love them Liberty's, so maybe I'm wrong.

Most people who love their safe has never used their safe for its intended purpose.  It's like saying I'm happy with the gun that I have never shot, or the TV that I have never plugged into the wall and turned on.  Safes are designed to protect assets from theft and/or fire.  Unless a safe has been burned or attacked, you'll never really know how happy you are with it.  



There's a lot more to it than just the door frame.  The next time you go out to look at these safes, open the doors.  Assuming you're right handed, put right knee half way up the opening edge of the door, and your right hand on the top opening corner.  Push with your knee and pull with your hand.  Watch to see if the door flexes.  Then imagine if it flexes that much when you push and pull on it by hand, how much it will move when you put a big pry bar on it.

a1 - you make a great point about not knowing how good it is until it's put to the test and I imagine most folks never have to put it to the test.

I'll swing by the store tonight and do the flex test, that may help me decide between the 2 or worse decide to move on to something different altogether.

BTW, I've been trying to get hold of Browning Customer service to ask a couple of questionsand so far not impressed.  Called yesterday, some kind of state holiday so they were closed.  Call back today and on hold for a good 15 minutes, the CS Rep couldn't answer, transferred me to the safe department where I was prompted to leave a message.  Hopefully I'll get a call back.

Most gun safe manufacturers know very little about safes.  This includes their own products more often than not.  Unless it's information they can find in company literature, they will likely have a difficult time answering your questions.

As far as Browning's customer service just remember what I read was internet board chatter which may or may not have merit.
Browning's USA made gun safes are very nice.
And that dealer is giving you a very good price on either.
One last thing.
If you talk to someone at Browning CS please ask them to give you the metal thickness of the door inner steel panel on that model and let us know what it is.
I have never been able to get a confirmation on their Medallion or Platinum series inner door steel panel thickness.

Check out Security Products safes  in Elm Mott TX I one on the way now .

Well, didn't hear back from Browning but I had to pull the trigger as sale ended yesterday.  I went with the Browning HR-26 and will try Customer Service again Monday and hopefully they'll be able to answer my questions though it sounds like it may be wishful thinking.  

I've seen conflicting information online and in the catalog and for some things no information.  So, the things I want to ask / confirm  are:

- the metal thickness  on exterior of door
- the metal thickness on interior door plate
- is the interior door plate a full plate
- is this considered their duo-form door
- are the body welds continuous


Probably a little too late, but I did check out Security Products and their stuff looks good but not sure on price as you have to submit a price quote to see how much they cost.  I did submit a price request and am curious to see what they come back with.

Well you did pretty damn good considering the price you bought that Browning for.
As far as the door goes  it is the one inch formed door.
The Duo-Formed door is 1 and 5/16 of an inch and that door goes on the more premium models.
The info given on your safe at Able Ammo shows it has a inner door plate but only Browning can give you more info.
Also according to Browning all their USA built safes are fully welded.
I got that off of one of the promotional videos they have on their gun safe website.
You did good so don't go and get buyers remorse.
You have bought yourself a really nice gun safe.

Thanks Heeler -

I'm over the analysis and research now and just want to get it delivered and load it up.  You've confirmed some of the information I've seen, but I plan to follow up with Browning just cuz.  No remorse here, I'm pleased with the deal.

Thanks to all for the help.

You'll love your Browning!  I have the Silver and couldn't be more pleased with it.  Great safe and the modular interior is great to have.

Thanks for moral support