 brboyer 
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Joined: Mar 2010  FL, USA
 Posts: 130 Feedback: 0% (0) |
Posted: 6/22/2012 11:27:37 AM
[Last Edit: 6/22/2012 1:22:19 PM by brboyer]
THE IMAGE ABOVE IS A PAID ADVERTISEMENT What legal requirements (record keeping, NICS, etc) are there for a Florida FFL that offers 'shipping' services for Florida resident non-licensees? Like shipping a gun I sold to another resident of Florida. Also if I am attending a competition in another state (or hunting) and I have in the past shipped all my crap to myself in care of the hotel in that other state. Now using an FFL, does that open up the whole interstate transfer situation? UPS Tariff:
http://www.ups.com/media/en/terms_service_us.pdf Effective January 2, 2012 3.6 Firearms and Ammunition UPS accepts packages containing firearms (as defined by Title 18, Chapter 44, and Title 26, Chapter 53 of the United States Code) only (a) between licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, and licensed collectors (as defined in Title 18, Chapter 44 of the United States Code), and government agencies; and (b) where not otherwise prohibited by federal, state, or local law from (i) an individual to a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer or licensed collector; and (ii) from a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to an individual. The shipper shall comply with and shall ensure that each shipment containing firearms complies with all federal, state, and local laws applicable to the shipper, recipient, and package. FedEx Tariff:
http://www.fedex.com/us/service-guide/terms/express-ground/index.html Effective January 2, 2012 FedEx Express will transport and deliver firearms as defined by the United States Gun Control Act of 1968, between areas served in the U.S., but only between: Licensed importers; licensed manufacturers; licensed dealers; licensed collectors; law enforcement agencies of the U.S. or any department or agency thereof; and law enforcement agencies of any state or any department, agency or political subdivisions thereof; or Where not prohibited by local, state and federal law, from individuals to licensed importers, licensed manufacturers or licensed dealers (and return of same). |
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Circuits
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Joined: Jan 2001 CO, USA
Posts: 6097 Feedback: 100% (21) Link To This Post |
Posted: 6/22/2012 5:08:53 PM
Just sidestep the issue and get a C&R FFL - then if UPS or FedEx bitch at you, you can show them you're a licensed collector. Would that be worth $30 every three years to you?
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DogtownTom
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Joined: Mar 2007 TX, USA
Posts: 2496 Feedback: 100% (18) Link To This Post |
Posted: 6/22/2012 6:03:04 PM
Originally Posted By brboyer:
With FedEx and UPS starting to follow their published tariffs more closely, ie refusing shipment from/to non-FFLs, I have a question. UPS posts conflicting information on their website: http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/resources/ship/packaging/guidelines/firearms.html?srch_pos=3&srch_phr=handgun Shipping Firearms
Special Procedures for Shipping Firearms Use These UPS Services for Your Firearm Shipment UPS accepts packages containing firearms (as defined by Title 18, Chapter 44, and Title 26, Chapter 53 of the United States Code) for transportation from and between licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, and licensed collectors (as defined in Title 18, Chapter 44 of the United States Code), law enforcement agencies of the United States (or of any department or agency of the United States), law enforcement agencies of any state or department agency (or political subdivision of any state), from and between persons not otherwise prohibited from shipping firearms by federal, state or local law, and when such shipment complies with all federal, state and local laws applicable to the shipper, recipient, and package. What legal requirements (record keeping, NICS, etc) are there for a Florida FFL that offers 'shipping' services for Florida resident non-licensees? Like shipping a gun I sold to another resident of Florida. Whether the FFL ships interstate or intrastate...........exact same rules apply. If you live in Pensacola, sold a gun to someone in Key West and have your local dealer ship it for you, he can only ship to another dealer in Key West. The ONLY time a dealer can ship to a nonlicensee is the return of a fiream for repair. Also if I am attending a competition in another state (or hunting) and I have in the past shipped all my crap to myself in care of the hotel in that other state. Now using an FFL, does that open up the whole interstate transfer situation?
Yes it does. Only YOU can ship a firearm addressed to yourself in another state. |
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Posted: 6/22/2012 6:19:02 PM
[Last Edit: 6/22/2012 6:25:57 PM by brboyer]
Originally Posted By DogtownTom:
Originally Posted By brboyer:
With FedEx and UPS starting to follow their published tariffs more closely, ie refusing shipment from/to non-FFLs, I have a question. UPS posts conflicting information on their website: http://www.ups.com/content/us/en/resources/ship/packaging/guidelines/firearms.html?srch_pos=3&srch_phr=handgun Shipping Firearms
Special Procedures for Shipping Firearms Use These UPS Services for Your Firearm Shipment UPS accepts packages containing firearms (as defined by Title 18, Chapter 44, and Title 26, Chapter 53 of the United States Code) for transportation from and between licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, and licensed collectors (as defined in Title 18, Chapter 44 of the United States Code), law enforcement agencies of the United States (or of any department or agency of the United States), law enforcement agencies of any state or department agency (or political subdivision of any state), from and between persons not otherwise prohibited from shipping firearms by federal, state or local law, and when such shipment complies with all federal, state and local laws applicable to the shipper, recipient, and package. Yeah, that's the language from the 2011 tariff. What legal requirements (record keeping, NICS, etc) are there for a Florida FFL that offers 'shipping' services for Florida resident non-licensees? Like shipping a gun I sold to another resident of Florida. Whether the FFL ships interstate or intrastate...........exact same rules apply. If you live in Pensacola, sold a gun to someone in Key West and have your local dealer ship it for you, he can only ship to another dealer in Key West. The ONLY time a dealer can ship to a nonlicensee is the return of a fiream for repair. That is what I thought. Also if I am attending a competition in another state (or hunting) and I have in the past shipped all my crap to myself in care of the hotel in that other state. Now using an FFL, does that open up the whole interstate transfer situation?
Yes it does. Only YOU can ship a firearm addressed to yourself in another state. I was thing this was the case..I'd love to see some case law on this one Using an 'agent' to ship. So the FFL would have to enter the firearms into his bound book in the above situations? Can we reasonably assume that there was some high level 'discussion' between the .gov and FedEx and UPS that resulted in the modification of their tariff's? |
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DogtownTom
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Joined: Mar 2007 TX, USA
Posts: 2497 Feedback: 100% (18) Link To This Post |
Posted: 6/22/2012 7:59:45 PM
[Last Edit: 6/22/2012 8:07:22 PM by DogtownTom]
Originally Posted By brboyer:
Yes it does.
Only YOU can ship a firearm addressed to yourself in another state. I was thing this was the case..I'd love to see some case law on this one Using an 'agent' to ship. Federal law is clear........ONLY YOU.......no "agent", no brother in law, not your momma or anyone else. If anyone other than you were to ship that firearm it becomes an illegal interstate transfer and a Federal crime. So the FFL would have to enter the firearms into his bound book in the above situations?
Anytime a dealer receives a firearm he is required to enter the firearm as an aquisition into his bound book. When the dealer ships it out he records it as a disposition. Can we reasonably assume that there was some high level 'discussion' between the .gov and FedEx and UPS that resulted in the modification of their tariff's
Doubtful. Most likely a low level peon that couldn't copy and paste very well. But conspiracy theories are always entertaining  |
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