Thoughts on IMR 4064. *Update with Targets... IMPRESSED

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Thoughts on IMR 4064. *Update with Targets... IMPRESSED

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:08:10 PM EDT

Walmart has 4lbs of it, and I'm out of "plinking .223 powder" I dont want to burn up my Varget and XBR stockpile on 55gr and SS109 reloads.

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:16:10 PM EDT

[#1]

IMR 4064 is not the best choice for .223/5.56x45. Its on the slow side in burn rate, best

suited for .308/7.62x51 through an M1A. I've not been able to find much load data for IMR 4064

in .223/5.56x45.

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:22:02 PM EDT

[#2]

IM me to remind me to see what powder is in some reloaded 5.56 I have.

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:27:00 PM EDT

[#3]

lee reloading manual shows quite a few loads with it. 55 gr. jacketed bullet 23 starting load and 25.7 max compressed load. 2867 fps and 3201 fps.

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:38:31 PM EDT

[#4]

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Quoted:
lee reloading manual shows quite a few loads with it. 55 gr. jacketed bullet 23 starting load and 25.7 max compressed load. 2867 fps and 3201 fps.

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Yeah I found data from everything from a 55gr to an 80gr bullet. Just wondering what people actually think of it.

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:42:46 PM EDT

[#5]

I liked it for my .308 bit it doesnt meter well. electronic dispensers work well with it but hand measurers dont like it. imr 4895 is better for me.

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:44:52 PM EDT

[#6]

I'm always envious of those of you that get powder from Walmart!

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:46:11 PM EDT

[#7]

WTH, I'm going to pick it all up! Thanks for the responses.

Posted: 4/23/2014 1:53:42 PM EDT

[#8]

you cant go wrong with it.

Posted: 4/23/2014 2:17:22 PM EDT

[#9]

long stick powder, terrible metering.

Works well in electronic measures though!

Pretty great for anything medium sized.

Posted: 4/23/2014 2:22:32 PM EDT

[#10]

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I'm always envious of those of you that get powder from Walmart!

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Just got all 4lbs. A little expensive per pound at $25 each, but still cheaper then buying a few pounds + hazmat.

Posted: 4/23/2014 2:32:17 PM EDT

[#11]

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Quoted:
Just got all 4lbs. A little expensive per pound at $25 each, but still cheaper then buying a few pounds + hazmat.

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Quoted:

Quoted:

I'm always envious of those of you that get powder from Walmart!

Just got all 4lbs. A little expensive per pound at $25 each, but still cheaper then buying a few pounds + hazmat.

Are you in the SWPA area?

Posted: 4/23/2014 2:42:37 PM EDT

[#12]

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Quoted:
Are you in the SWPA area?

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Quoted:

Quoted:
I'm always envious of those of you that get powder from Walmart!

Just got all 4lbs. A little expensive per pound at $25 each, but still cheaper then buying a few pounds + hazmat.

Are you in the SWPA area?

State College

Posted: 4/23/2014 3:11:54 PM EDT

[#13]

I'm jealous. Only people with powder around here are small LGSes and they can't get any selection to speak of and its 30+ a pound.

Posted: 4/23/2014 6:16:16 PM EDT

[#14]

I think it's a terrible choice in 223. I tried it once long ago. Not accurate for me.

Had good luck with it in 30-30 (+P Contender loads) and 308.

It meters horrid.

I sold all of mine during the recent component panic.

But if it's all you can find........you do what you have to do.

Posted: 4/23/2014 6:21:46 PM EDT

[#15]

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I think it's a terrible choice in 223. I tried it once long ago. Not accurate for me.

Had good luck with it in 30-30 (+P Contender loads) and 308.

It meters horrid.

I sold all of mine during the recent component panic.

But if it's all you can find........you do what you have to do.

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Oh well, The ammo I'm loading is really for quick mag changes and shooting between different targets at a max of 30-40 yards.

As long as it pokes holes and goes bang.

Posted: 4/23/2014 7:02:22 PM EDT

[#16]

I love using 4064 for 308 but havent had the best results from it in 223/5.56. Most of the loads for it are for light gr bullets. Its on the same lines as Benchmark of A2015 for 223/5.56.

P.S. 4064 dispenses just fine out of my charge master and Ive yet ( knock on wood!) experienced any clumps ect in it.

Posted: 4/23/2014 8:33:55 PM EDT

[#17]

ImR 4064 shines in a lot of places and is fairly flexible. great uses; .30 cal milsurps or any commercial .30 in the medium to large size, pretty much all of them will shoot quite well, the 7.62 mm in the M1a and match bullets is peas and carrots with imr 4064. Works wonderful in your fat barreled .308 bolt guns with 168's and 175's. The .22-250 and .220 swift and .243 win all do great with it. I only tried a few loads in .223 if my memory serves me right. Fighting with the large sticks and small neck combo is quite exasperating. Perhaps with a long drop tube to get it in the case without bridging and spilling would help.

I'm sure it'd shoot well enough in the .223 rem with some work but with the small neck and running out of case capacity for loose packing, I just didn't need it there.

That said, I would surprised if I still wasn't using it 20 years from now. it's old but good. Would like an IMR 4064 super short cut though.

Posted: 4/23/2014 10:29:17 PM EDT

[#18]

We just had a thread on 4064 and .223 loads.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_6_42/422770_Who_uses_IMR_4064_for__223_.html

I got ~2 MOA results with cheap 75 gr Prvi bullets.

With 77 gr Sierra Match Kings ... it's looking great so far.

I do use an electronic dispenser. The long grains can take some convincing to get into the case. If I can consistently get results like my initial workup suggests (see the other thread) I will be loving 4064.

Posted: 4/24/2014 9:55:45 AM EDT

[#19]

Wal-Mart!? I wish my local WM had powder. I've never tried 4064 in .223 but my .308 loves it. 175 grain HPBT bullets and IMR 4064 go together like peas and carrots.

Posted: 4/24/2014 5:36:03 PM EDT

[#20]

I absolutely love it in 308, 223 not so much.. but my 308 I usually hand trickle.

Nice score!

Posted: 4/24/2014 5:55:13 PM EDT

[#21]

4064 is one of the few powders that will get a 7-08 past 3000 fps with 130 grain bullets. Not the best choice for .223.

Posted: 4/26/2014 6:17:30 PM EDT

[#22]

Ok, with this thread, thought I'd try AA4064 with some 223 loads (I didn't have any IMR4064 on hand but had some AA4064). I recently rebarelled a colt I had with a 1/7 5.56 DD 16 inch barrel. This was the first outing with this barrel. The rifle still has the crappy stock colt trigger so i'm surprised I shot as well with the trigger.

Anyway, standard loading precautions apply, this load is only safe in my rifle. Note that I could not find data for this load so I worked it up. I did not see any pressure signs.

Loads were:

Midway USA seconds (hornady) 55 gr SP bullets, loaded to cannelure
Wolf SRM primer
Mixed LC year cases
AA4064 powder with ladder loads from 24 to 25.2 in .4 gr increments
weather was about 45 degrees with about a 10 MPH wind, gusting to about 15 ish.
Targets shot from a bench at 100 yards, 3x9 leupold scope

I was able to chrono these loads. Here are my numbers:

Load/Ave/Ex Spread/Std dev/Hi-Low

24.0 grs /2377/67.7/1.19/2409/2341
24.4 grs/2396/56.2/0.86/2429/2313
24.8 grs/2451/61.5/0.98/2479/2418
25.2 grs/2503/46.3/0.81/2530/2483

The 24.4 load measured .823 (5-shots)
The 25.2 load measured 1.003 (5-shots)

Its not moving very fast but for a nice 100-200 yard load for training/plinking, it should work just fine. I have about 500 of these bullets and I'll likely just load them up with the aa4064 as I have some for my garands and aa4064 has been in stock every few months so I should be able to get more. Can't say that about H335 or TAC

Posted: 4/26/2014 6:26:22 PM EDT

[#23]

Damn, thats slow as hell from a 16" barrel.

I think the 24gr reloads of varget I made with 55gr bullets were going 2500.... in my 11.5" barrel.

Posted: 4/26/2014 9:42:38 PM EDT

[#24]

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Damn, thats slow as hell from a 16" barrel.

I think the 24gr reloads of varget I made with 55gr bullets were going 2500.... in my 11.5" barrel.

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Yea, I had some 69 gr loads with xterm that averaged 2776 from this barrel. It's slow and I could have tried more powder but even at 25.2, the case is getting pretty full. This powder may be better suited to heavier bullets more so then 55 gr ones. If I get some time in the next few weeks, I may try some 77 grs bullets with the powder and see what that does. Work just gets in the way...

Posted: 4/28/2014 1:26:02 PM EDT

[#25]

Not to hijack the thread, but is IMR 4198 any better for .223 or 5.56? One of my local gun stores has this and IMR4064 in stock, but it's about $32 per pound.

Thanks for helping out a reloading newb.

Posted: 4/28/2014 5:29:34 PM EDT

[#26]

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Not to hijack the thread, but is IMR 4198 any better for .223 or 5.56? One of my local gun stores has this and IMR4064 in stock, but it's about $32 per pound.

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Thanks for helping out a reloading newb.

You really should start your own thread to ask this.

This being an IMR-4064 thread.

Posted: 4/28/2014 5:34:27 PM EDT

[#27]

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Quoted:
Not to hijack the thread, but is IMR 4198 any better for .223 or 5.56? One of my local gun stores has this and IMR4064 in stock, but it's about $32 per pound.

Thanks for helping out a reloading newb.

View Quote

My Nosler manual actually has data for that.

Posted: 4/28/2014 5:34:56 PM EDT

[#28]

Loaded up some ammo from 23-25gr. Starting "crunching" at 24.5grs with SS109's.

Whenever it stops raining I will go and chrono.

Posted: 4/29/2014 2:37:25 AM EDT

[#29]

Quote History

Quoted:
My Nosler manual actually has data for that.

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Quoted:

Quoted:

Not to hijack the thread, but is IMR 4198 any better for .223 or 5.56? One of my local gun stores has this and IMR4064 in stock, but it's about $32 per pound.

Thanks for helping out a reloading newb.

My Nosler manual actually has data for that.

Thanks! Didn't really want to start a new thread for what I thought could be a quick answer. My bad.

Posted: 5/1/2014 1:31:51 PM EDT

[#30]

WOW. Am I impressed right now... I dont know if its the powder, of the SS109's w/o cannelure... but Holy Crap!

Posted: 5/1/2014 1:57:11 PM EDT

[#31]

So this was the first tiem I was every seriously tempted to stop shooting a group. The second group was .213 moa without shot #5. I'm not going to make excuses, but I was having a hell of a time shooting consisently with an AR pistol and a Geissele S3G. While the Geissele S3G trigger is sweet, its not for precision shooting

Posted: 5/1/2014 2:34:24 PM EDT

[#32]

Chrono:

11.5" Carbine Barrel

23.0gr: 2176
23.5gr: 2282
24.0gr: 2337
24.5gr: 2401
25.0gr: 2496

18" Midlength Barrel

23.0gr: 2429
23.5gr: 2517
24.0gr: 2600
24.5gr: 2645

Posted: 5/1/2014 2:37:05 PM EDT

[#33]

Wow! Those look great! I shot a few imr-4064 .223 loads a few weeks ago with good results too.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Posted: 5/1/2014 2:46:31 PM EDT

[#34]

Grim, Nice work !!! So many nay sayers yet you forged on and ended with very nice results. I've been there a few times myself.

One thing to point out. The fact there is published data from reliable sources should be a sign that there is at least a possibility of getting good results. With all the possibilities out there they usually don't waist time publishing data that yields poor results.

Posted: 5/1/2014 4:17:07 PM EDT

[#35]

Thanks for starting/posting this thread OP!

I too have been wondering about 4064. I have a devil of a time finding my normal go to powders these days. However you can't swing a dead cat around here without knocking over a case of 4064.

I'm ready to try it out now.

Posted: 5/1/2014 5:20:31 PM EDT

[#36]

FYI: The PMC brass showed NO pressure signs even on the 25.0gr reloads. But You can't really fit more powder in there. 25.5 might be doable.

Posted: 5/1/2014 7:13:05 PM EDT

[#37]

Redacted.

Posted: 6/11/2014 2:12:43 PM EDT

[#38]

Still impressing me... about a 1" plastic ball at 200 yards, 2/3 hit. The miss was close and may have been my fault as the target was swinging.

I was playing with my DSLR, I finally figured out how to use the "digital" zoom on it which is a cropped video at 640x480, it was 80% humidity so I was trying to pick up the bullet trace.

Posted: 6/11/2014 2:56:28 PM EDT

[#39]

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Quoted:

Still impressing me... about a 1" plastic ball at 200 yards, 2/3 hit. The miss was close and may have been my fault as the target was swinging.

I was playing with my DSLR, I finally figured out how to use the "digital" zoom on it which is a cropped video at 640x480, it was 80% humidity so I was trying to pick up the bullet trace.