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Posted: 1/23/2014 8:23:14 AM EST
Anyone get a chance to see this thing in person?

Looks very promising...

The simple fact that I can sit it next to me on a bench and just start shooting is exciting. I just need to know the price now...

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Posted: 1/23/2014 10:19:09 AM EST
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Posted: 1/23/2014 11:07:52 AM EST


Looks super-cool. I wonder about the cost... looks really expensive. If it's less than the magnetospeed, I'm interested.

-ZA
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Posted: 1/23/2014 11:16:17 AM EST
RIP, Jeff.
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Posted: 1/23/2014 11:50:14 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Eric802:
There is a thread about it over on Sniper's Hide. Someone there talked to the guys at the booth at SHOT, sounds like it's going to be $400-$450.

I wonder how it would work at a busy range with another guy shooting 4 feet to your right or left.
View Quote


That's probably pretty close, would have guessed $400-$600, in other words, not inexpensive.
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Posted: 1/23/2014 2:10:29 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Eric802:
There is a thread about it over on Sniper's Hide. Someone there talked to the guys at the booth at SHOT, sounds like it's going to be $400-$450.

I wonder how it would work at a busy range with another guy shooting 4 feet to your right or left.
View Quote


That's magnetospeed price.... Call me interested. I signed up for their newsletter.
I almost pulled the trigger on a magnetospeed, but I couldn't get over the fact that I couldn't use it with
a pistol or a bow (yes, I'm also an archer), and most importantly, couldn't use it during load work ups.

ZA
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Posted: 1/23/2014 2:13:55 PM EST
How does it differentiate between smoke and bullets?
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Posted: 1/23/2014 4:56:31 PM EST
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Originally Posted By ZA206:


That's magnetospeed price.... Call me interested. I signed up for their newsletter.
I almost pulled the trigger on a magnetospeed, but I couldn't get over the fact that I couldn't use it with
a pistol or a bow (yes, I'm also an archer), and most importantly, couldn't use it during load work ups.

ZA
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ZA206:
Originally Posted By Eric802:
There is a thread about it over on Sniper's Hide. Someone there talked to the guys at the booth at SHOT, sounds like it's going to be $400-$450.

I wonder how it would work at a busy range with another guy shooting 4 feet to your right or left.


That's magnetospeed price.... Call me interested. I signed up for their newsletter.
I almost pulled the trigger on a magnetospeed, but I couldn't get over the fact that I couldn't use it with
a pistol or a bow (yes, I'm also an archer), and most importantly, couldn't use it during load work ups.

ZA




Why can't it be used for load work ups?
I WILL NOT COMPLY
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Posted: 1/23/2014 5:59:47 PM EST
What I like is the velocity as the projectile goes down range. You get muzzle velocity and velocity at all the other distances, too. It is akin to having multiple chronographs at various distances downrange.
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Posted: 1/23/2014 6:02:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/23/2014 6:05:42 PM EST by Trollslayer]
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Originally Posted By RugRat:
How does it differentiate between smoke and bullets?
View Quote


It probably cannot "see" the smoke. The particles are too small and the radar goes right through the smoke.



I'm wondering what frequency it operates at that it can "see" a light weight, small caliber projectile.

5 mm diameter bullet is ~ 1/2 wavelength, therefore the wavelength is ~10 mm (1 cm, .01 m). That's 30 GHz.
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Posted: 1/23/2014 6:11:15 PM EST
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Originally Posted By StretchMaK:




Why can't it be used for load work ups?
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By StretchMaK:
Originally Posted By ZA206:
Originally Posted By Eric802:
There is a thread about it over on Sniper's Hide. Someone there talked to the guys at the booth at SHOT, sounds like it's going to be $400-$450.

I wonder how it would work at a busy range with another guy shooting 4 feet to your right or left.


That's magnetospeed price.... Call me interested. I signed up for their newsletter.
I almost pulled the trigger on a magnetospeed, but I couldn't get over the fact that I couldn't use it with
a pistol or a bow (yes, I'm also an archer), and most importantly, couldn't use it during load work ups.

ZA




Why can't it be used for load work ups?



You most certainly can use it for load work ups, it may or may not shift your POI it will NOT affect your group size.
Originally Posted By EvilApplesauce:The kess they jnie the better
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Posted: 1/23/2014 7:58:17 PM EST
I would suspect Ka band, much like police radar and very directional.
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Posted: 1/23/2014 9:22:08 PM EST
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Originally Posted By scorps:
I would suspect Ka band, much like police radar and very directional.
View Quote


I think you've got it.

The Ka band (Pronounced: "Kay-Ay Band") covers the frequencies of 26.5–40 GHz,[1] i.e. wavelengths from slightly over one centimeter down to 0.75 centimeters.[2] The Ka band is part of the K band of the microwave band of the electromagnetic spectrum. This symbol refers to "K-above" — in other words, the band directly above the K-band. The 30/20 GHz band is used in communications satellites, uplink in either the 27.5 GHz and 31 GHz bands,[3] and high-resolution, close-range targeting radars aboard military airplanes. Some frequencies in this radio band are used for vehicle speed detection by law enforcement.[4] Kepler Mission uses this frequency range to downlink the scientific data collected by the space telescope.

The designation "Ka-band" is from Kurz-above, which stems from the German word "kurz" meaning short.[5]
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Posted: 1/24/2014 6:58:58 AM EST
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Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:



You most certainly can use it for load work ups, it may or may not shift your POI it will NOT affect your group size.
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Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
Originally Posted By StretchMaK:
Originally Posted By ZA206:
Originally Posted By Eric802:
There is a thread about it over on Sniper's Hide. Someone there talked to the guys at the booth at SHOT, sounds like it's going to be $400-$450.

I wonder how it would work at a busy range with another guy shooting 4 feet to your right or left.


That's magnetospeed price.... Call me interested. I signed up for their newsletter.
I almost pulled the trigger on a magnetospeed, but I couldn't get over the fact that I couldn't use it with
a pistol or a bow (yes, I'm also an archer), and most importantly, couldn't use it during load work ups.

ZA




Why can't it be used for load work ups?



You most certainly can use it for load work ups, it may or may not shift your POI it will NOT affect your group size.


Is that your experience with it? Something hanging off the end of the barrel would seem to effect the harmonics and group
size. I don't have one, but I've seen this issue brought up. I don't give a darn about POI changes, that's a non-issue.

-ZA
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Posted: 1/24/2014 7:01:11 AM EST
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Originally Posted By ZA206:


Is that your experience with it? Something hanging off the end of the barrel would seem to effect the harmonics and group
size. I don't have one, but I've seen this issue brought up. I don't give a darn about POI changes, that's a non-issue.

-ZA
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ZA206:
Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
Originally Posted By StretchMaK:
Originally Posted By ZA206:
Originally Posted By Eric802:
There is a thread about it over on Sniper's Hide. Someone there talked to the guys at the booth at SHOT, sounds like it's going to be $400-$450.

I wonder how it would work at a busy range with another guy shooting 4 feet to your right or left.


That's magnetospeed price.... Call me interested. I signed up for their newsletter.
I almost pulled the trigger on a magnetospeed, but I couldn't get over the fact that I couldn't use it with
a pistol or a bow (yes, I'm also an archer), and most importantly, couldn't use it during load work ups.

ZA

My Experience and the experience of several other people


Why can't it be used for load work ups?



You most certainly can use it for load work ups, it may or may not shift your POI it will NOT affect your group size.


Is that your experience with it? Something hanging off the end of the barrel would seem to effect the harmonics and group
size. I don't have one, but I've seen this issue brought up. I don't give a darn about POI changes, that's a non-issue.

-ZA

Originally Posted By EvilApplesauce:The kess they jnie the better
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Posted: 1/24/2014 9:16:12 AM EST
If all the advertised characteristics prove real with no detrimental issues creeping in, this may well be worth the money. The velocity versus distance feature alone would have added value. That it is insensitive to lighting and wind conditions has value (big value, IMO).
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Posted: 1/24/2014 9:51:13 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Trollslayer:
If all the advertised characteristics prove real with no detrimental issues creeping in, this may well be worth the money. The velocity versus distance feature alone would have added value. That it is insensitive to lighting and wind conditions has value (big value, IMO).
View Quote


Not having to worry about light would be huge for me. Same goes for wind.
Originally Posted By swingset
No one wants to eat right and exercise, and lower their stress levels, all of which will come in a lot more handy than a home defense carbine and chest rig

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Posted: 1/24/2014 10:34:19 AM EST
RIP, Jeff.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 10:57:44 AM EST
I checked it out at SHOT, they looked really cool, and the velocity at various ranges looked extremely useful.

I asked about what kind of range was typical, they said rifle bullets generally out to at least 100 yards, and larger pistol bullets out to sometimes 175 or so.

I don't think they're on Ka band with the traffic radars, they'd need a specific type approval for those frequencies. But it's possible. My guess would be the nearby 24GHz ISM band, which is a worldwide ISM allocation.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 11:08:40 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/24/2014 11:17:04 AM EST by scorps]
IIRC, Ka could track the screws that hold your eyeglasses together. On the other hand - due to the frequency - moisture in the air could limit it's capabilities.

The ad says 100 yards - which could be a product of safety, transmitter output power, or just the .gov. I am sure that receiver sensitivity nor processing power would be an issue.


edit to add:
Moisture meaning fog etc.
Radar operates on the same principles as laser, just at a different wavelength. A flashlight can't see through fog or smoke, but ULF works through the Earth
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Posted: 1/24/2014 11:13:45 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Gamma762:
I checked it out at SHOT, they looked really cool, and the velocity at various ranges looked extremely useful.

I asked about what kind of range was typical, they said rifle bullets generally out to at least 100 yards, and larger pistol bullets out to sometimes 175 or so.

I don't think they're on Ka band with the traffic radars, they'd need a specific type approval for those frequencies. But it's possible. My guess would be the nearby 24GHz ISM band, which is a worldwide ISM allocation.
View Quote

Any reason you couldn't set it out at 800 yards and shoot past it?
Originally Posted By EvilApplesauce:The kess they jnie the better
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Posted: 1/24/2014 11:17:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/24/2014 11:17:48 AM EST by Gamma762]
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Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:

Any reason you couldn't set it out at 800 yards and shoot past it?
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Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
Originally Posted By Gamma762:
I checked it out at SHOT, they looked really cool, and the velocity at various ranges looked extremely useful.

I asked about what kind of range was typical, they said rifle bullets generally out to at least 100 yards, and larger pistol bullets out to sometimes 175 or so.

I don't think they're on Ka band with the traffic radars, they'd need a specific type approval for those frequencies. But it's possible. My guess would be the nearby 24GHz ISM band, which is a worldwide ISM allocation.

Any reason you couldn't set it out at 800 yards and shoot past it?

Don't see why not. Set it behind a suitable barrier for protection. Just add whatever "tare" range to the indicated ranges.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 11:24:09 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Gamma762:

Don't see why not. Set it behind a suitable barrier for protection. Just add whatever "tare" range to the indicated ranges.
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Originally Posted By Gamma762:
Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
Originally Posted By Gamma762:
I checked it out at SHOT, they looked really cool, and the velocity at various ranges looked extremely useful.

I asked about what kind of range was typical, they said rifle bullets generally out to at least 100 yards, and larger pistol bullets out to sometimes 175 or so.

I don't think they're on Ka band with the traffic radars, they'd need a specific type approval for those frequencies. But it's possible. My guess would be the nearby 24GHz ISM band, which is a worldwide ISM allocation.

Any reason you couldn't set it out at 800 yards and shoot past it?

Don't see why not. Set it behind a suitable barrier for protection. Just add whatever "tare" range to the indicated ranges.

If this had been out I wouldn't have bought the Magneto if does work properly. This will allow perfect BC modeling of your bullet with your load in your rifle.
Originally Posted By EvilApplesauce:The kess they jnie the better
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Posted: 1/24/2014 11:45:51 AM EST
RIP, Jeff.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 12:04:22 PM EST
Oh I am still happy with it, but the ability to get speed at distance is something I consider really important. I can still figure it out by comparing actual bullet drop versus calculated.
Originally Posted By EvilApplesauce:The kess they jnie the better
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Posted: 1/24/2014 12:08:39 PM EST
tag for interest
"Rome's glory by way of the Greeks came,
America's by cutting the English cord,
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Posted: 1/24/2014 12:08:44 PM EST
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Originally Posted By ZA206:


Is that your experience with it? Something hanging off the end of the barrel would seem to effect the harmonics and group
size. I don't have one, but I've seen this issue brought up. I don't give a darn about POI changes, that's a non-issue.

-ZA
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Originally Posted By ZA206:
Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
Originally Posted By StretchMaK:
Originally Posted By ZA206:
Originally Posted By Eric802:
There is a thread about it over on Sniper's Hide. Someone there talked to the guys at the booth at SHOT, sounds like it's going to be $400-$450.

I wonder how it would work at a busy range with another guy shooting 4 feet to your right or left.


That's magnetospeed price.... Call me interested. I signed up for their newsletter.
I almost pulled the trigger on a magnetospeed, but I couldn't get over the fact that I couldn't use it with
a pistol or a bow (yes, I'm also an archer), and most importantly, couldn't use it during load work ups.

ZA




Why can't it be used for load work ups?



You most certainly can use it for load work ups, it may or may not shift your POI it will NOT affect your group size.


Is that your experience with it? Something hanging off the end of the barrel would seem to effect the harmonics and group
size. I don't have one, but I've seen this issue brought up. I don't give a darn about POI changes, that's a non-issue.

-ZA


That's my experience with the magnetospeed. I use mine for load workups and if it changes my POI I'm not noticing it. It doesn't seem to have any real effect on my groups or POI.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 12:25:51 PM EST
A MagnetoSpeed is quite likely to change your POI. It is also quite likely to change it differently if the bayonet strap is tightened or loosened, or moved from the spot previously attached. While I have targets to show that on 30-06 and an AR15, I can't say whether or not there is a change in group size or structure - that's a much higher hill to climb.

But all that is just anecdotal evidence - here's what the manufacturer says (not citing their own studies, but apparently from their collection of anecdotal data lol)::

=====================
Can the MagnetoSpeed affect barrel harmonics (e.g. the location and size of my shot grouping)?

Last Updated: Dec 31, 2012 12:41PM CST

Yes, with most guns you will be able to see a shift in your point of impact. Some people say it has no affect on their guns so it seems to be a case by case basis. Group sizes seem to be relatively unaffected though by the MagnetoSpeed.
=====================

Can't wait to hear some reviews of the Labradar :)
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Posted: 1/24/2014 1:58:03 PM EST
Anyone have a link to how this works or a video in action?
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Posted: 1/24/2014 2:02:12 PM EST
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Posted: 1/24/2014 2:08:42 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AeroE:
Cool idea.

The range might be limited to power and wind considerations; there's no point trying to measure a bullet that's blowing off course.

I'll have something to study about.

View Quote


why would wind deflection make the velocity data irrelevant?
Originally Posted By EvilApplesauce:The kess they jnie the better
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Posted: 1/24/2014 2:33:32 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/24/2014 2:34:44 PM EST by AeroE]
It is not easy to explain Liberty to those that are not familiar with Liberty. Kevin Jamison, on explaining firearm regulation to a Massachusetts lawyer. Jeff City, Mo 18 Apr 13.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 2:47:08 PM EST
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Originally Posted By AeroE:


The bullet will blow out of the line of sight of the RADAR at long ranges. Not always, but often enough. Eliminate the headache altogether by limiting the practical range of the instrument.

Relevance has nothing to do with the problem if the speed can't be measured at all.
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Originally Posted By AeroE:
Originally Posted By MTNmyMag:
Originally Posted By AeroE:
Cool idea.

The range might be limited to power and wind considerations; there's no point trying to measure a bullet that's blowing off course.

I'll have something to study about.



why would wind deflection make the velocity data irrelevant?


The bullet will blow out of the line of sight of the RADAR at long ranges. Not always, but often enough. Eliminate the headache altogether by limiting the practical range of the instrument.

Relevance has nothing to do with the problem if the speed can't be measured at all.

Gotcha did not understand what you were saying.
Originally Posted By EvilApplesauce:The kess they jnie the better
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Posted: 1/24/2014 3:07:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/24/2014 3:20:19 PM EST by TCBA_Joe]
Neat

I sent this to one of our engineers. Looks like it might be the perfect solution to indoor velocity measurements and the terror of possibly shooting a chronograph.

ETA: Wonder if it could do rate of fire
Please, call me Joe

There is definitely something perverse about two men who carry guns 24/7 being so happy that others are giving theirs up. -happycynic

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Posted: 1/24/2014 3:12:29 PM EST
I sent them an info request.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 5:48:02 PM EST
Some pics of the thing in person (thanks to mygunculture)

Note the velocities shown down range in the second photo...



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Posted: 1/24/2014 6:27:15 PM EST
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Originally Posted By ZA206:
Is that your experience with it? Something hanging off the end of the barrel would seem to effect the harmonics and group
size. I don't have one, but I've seen this issue brought up. I don't give a darn about POI changes, that's a non-issue.

-ZA
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this has been tested and verified. it does not affect group sizes. POI changes are minimal. it's not heavy like a suppressor.
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Posted: 1/24/2014 6:36:15 PM EST
this thing looks cool, but it also looks HUGE.

the great thing about the magnetospeed is it's tiny compared to any other chronograph. i can throw it in my range bag and it hardly takes any space. it's also extremely light.
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Posted: 1/25/2014 8:08:41 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Gamma762:
I don't think they're on Ka band with the traffic radars, they'd need a specific type approval for those frequencies. But it's possible. My guess would be the nearby 24GHz ISM band, which is a worldwide ISM allocation.
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We were just guessing at the approximate wavelength based upon what they needed to do. I said 30Ghz, which happens to be Ka band with a lot of commercially available products. None of that is definitive, it's just a WAG.
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Posted: 1/25/2014 8:55:56 AM EST
I retired my Oehler due to set up time, if this chrono pans out it will replace my Magneto.
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Posted: 1/25/2014 1:32:44 PM EST
I received a response from them today.

Steve,

Thank you for your question.

The LabRadar accuracy will not be affected by other shots being fired into your radar beam. Part of the technology built into the system allows it to determine if the shot came from very near the radar unit or if it came in from another location. Since the radar beam is only active for a fraction of a second it is nearly impossible for you to receive a velocity from another shooter nearby.

Retail pricing is expected to be $499.00 USD. We will be finalizing our pricing very soon. The radar is expected to be available for purchase in May 2014.

The batteries should last several hundred shots, if you don’t want to use batteries; we will offer a supplemental external rechargeable battery pack. The exact number of shots is dependent on how long the display is left active during shooting breaks, etc.

If you have any other questions let us know.
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Posted: 1/25/2014 3:56:05 PM EST
Solar power!
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Posted: 1/25/2014 4:19:57 PM EST
Do want! There is a decent video on their website. http://www.mylabradar.com/
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Posted: 1/25/2014 7:49:52 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Weber:
I received a response from them today.

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Originally Posted By Weber:
I received a response from them today.

Steve,

Thank you for your question.

The LabRadar accuracy will not be affected by other shots being fired into your radar beam. Part of the technology built into the system allows it to determine if the shot came from very near the radar unit or if it came in from another location. Since the radar beam is only active for a fraction of a second it is nearly impossible for you to receive a velocity from another shooter nearby.

Retail pricing is expected to be $499.00 USD. We will be finalizing our pricing very soon. The radar is expected to be available for purchase in May 2014.

The batteries should last several hundred shots, if you don’t want to use batteries; we will offer a supplemental external rechargeable battery pack. The exact number of shots is dependent on how long the display is left active during shooting breaks, etc.

If you have any other questions let us know.


I got the same response with this additional information,

"The distances displayed on the back of LabRadar will be user definable. The exact parameters have not yet been finalized, but we anticipate they will meet the needs of most shooters."

$500...yikes. I suppose it won't be so bad if I sell my magnetospeed and shooting Chrony.
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Posted: 1/25/2014 9:58:13 PM EST
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The LabRadar accuracy will not be affected by other shots being fired into your radar beam. Part of the technology built into the system allows it to determine if the shot came from very near the radar unit or if it came in from another location. Since the radar beam is only active for a fraction of a second it is nearly impossible for you to receive a velocity from another shooter nearby.
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A local sensor to trigger the radar and squelch nearby shooters.....
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Posted: 1/26/2014 3:50:24 AM EST
Yep, I think this is the chrono I have been waiting for. Will still want to see how it can be set up on the range I use, but it looks promising. Price is steep, but likely to come down.

And to think someone was giving me grief about not having chrono readouts display on a tablet. ?? I was just thinking about remote display so I could read the darn thing and have it recorded.
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