Site Notices
8/29/2014 9:08:28 PM
Author
Message
rebs
Offline
Posts: 56
Feedback: 100% (1)
Posted: 3/9/2012 6:49:53 AM
Does anyone make carbide dies for the 223 ?

Are RCBS and Lee dies on par with each other or is one definitely a better die for 223 ?
reelserious
Member
Offline
Posts: 4989
Feedback: 100% (2)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 6:51:19 AM
I think Dillon has them.
finishman2000
Offline
Posts: 1889
Feedback: 100% (45)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 7:28:42 AM
still have to lube
AR-180
Member
Offline
Posts: 5743
Feedback: 100% (1)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 7:36:06 AM
Dillon makes carbide dies for 223. You do still have to lube, but I have never stuck a case with them. I have used Lee, RCBS, and Hornady. Regardless of the type of lube, I have stuck cases in each of these brands except Dillon.
TeeRex
Don't do it in the park.
NRA
Online
Posts: 6253
Feedback: 100% (3)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 7:37:49 AM

Originally Posted By reelserious:
I think Dillon has them.

They are over $152 per set. I personally don't see any benefit that it would bring to loading rifle cartridges.

Dillon even states they are for high volume loaders, and I think they mean far more volume than even the people here who load and shoot a lot.
A fine is a tax for doing wrong, a tax is a fine for doing well.
ScEd1
Offline
Posts: 884
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 8:13:20 AM
Typically when talking carbide rifle dies its the expander ball that has a carbide ring. This should in theory reduce the amount of case neck stretch. Hornady makes one for the RCBS sizing die. Link to example.
helotaxi
Offline
Posts: 1007
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 8:31:42 AM
They make carbide dies as well. Again, they are meant for commercial quantity reloaders. The carbide is used for wear resistance and you still have to lube the cases.
rebs
Offline
Posts: 57
Feedback: 100% (1)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 9:58:24 AM
Thank you for the replies, they are too much for this cowboys budget
Wingman26
Moderator-Oklahoma HTF
NRA
Offline
Posts: 11318
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 3:11:54 PM
Dillon dies for bottleneck rifle calibers come with a carbide expander ball standard. Their carbide 223 dies are intended for commercial loaders and still require case lube.
Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
Site Staff http://mp-pistol.com/boards/
NRA Life
ReefRaider
Member
Offline
Posts: 5228
Feedback: 100% (212)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 8:41:34 PM
[Last Edit: 3/9/2012 8:43:53 PM by ReefRaider]
There are a number of good reasons to use carbide rifle dies. The best one being its the last die in that caliber one will ever buy unless it gets lost. I had a .223 case separate in a carbide die once. I put it in the freezer then let it come back up to room temp. I used the appropriate tap to remove what was left of the case from the die. It came out very easily. One of my carbide .223 dies has had over 290,000 case's though it. I have yet to lose it once.
"There is a fine line between having balls and being a dumb ass" GB

"Machine Gunners - Accuracy By Volume"

eddiesar15
Offline
Posts: 652
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 9:06:01 PM
lee dies are dam good for the money..there carbide...as a matter a fact...I will be the 1st to admitt that i prefer lee to rcbs. the lee decapper makes total sense as to not brk decapping pins.

i wish lee had small base dies though..they do have fl dies
Happy2shoot
Offline
Posts: 56
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 9:10:47 PM
Soooo do you still have to lube the brass when using carbide dies? lolz
JedYonkers
Member
Offline
Posts: 4515
Feedback: 100% (6)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 9:14:26 PM
Originally Posted By eddiesar15:
lee dies are dam good for the money..there carbide...as a matter a fact...I will be the 1st to admitt that i prefer lee to rcbs. the lee decapper makes total sense as to not brk decapping pins.

i wish lee had small base dies though..they do have fl dies

My lee FL die in 223 wouldn't set the shoulder back far enough to chamber or fit a case gauge. I really like their seating die and crimp die. i ended up getting a redding small base die for sizing. Their carbide pistol dies are great though.
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.

~ Theodore Roosevelt 1858-1919

rebs
Offline
Posts: 59
Feedback: 100% (1)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 9:52:56 PM
what is a small base die ?
dumbyhotshot
Offline
Posts: 698
Feedback: 100% (3)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 10:25:42 PM
I accidentally purchased a carbide die from Dillon when I was new to reloading. It has served me well. I lube with lanolin and isoproply alcohol.
ReefRaider
Member
Offline
Posts: 5229
Feedback: 100% (212)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 10:52:17 PM
I have never heard of anyone with a carbide die complain that their die was scratching or galling the brass. To clean a carbide die all I do is run a swab though it.
"There is a fine line between having balls and being a dumb ass" GB

"Machine Gunners - Accuracy By Volume"

Hoser
Offline
Posts: 1208
Feedback: 100% (13)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/9/2012 11:58:38 PM
The Dillon carbide 223 and 308 dies are worth it.

I may have deep pockets for reloading tools, but their carbide 50 BMG resize die aint gonna happen.
Wingman26
Moderator-Oklahoma HTF
NRA
Offline
Posts: 11321
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/10/2012 12:32:08 AM
Absolutely!

Originally Posted By Happy2shoot:
Soooo do you still have to lube the brass when using carbide dies? lolz

As far as the idea you can't wear out a carbide die, while this might be true, you should be able to pass down any regular dies you have to your children, and then their children, and no matter how much they load with it, they won't wear it out.

A standard reloading die that isn't abused will last several lifetimes with no problem.
Cum catapultae proscriptae erunt tum soli proscript catapultas habebunt
Site Staff http://mp-pistol.com/boards/
NRA Life
ReefRaider
Member
Offline
Posts: 5230
Feedback: 100% (212)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/10/2012 10:10:15 AM
Originally Posted By Wingman26:

As far as the idea you can't wear out a carbide die, while this might be true, you should be able to pass down any regular dies you have to your children, and then their children, and no matter how much they load with it, they won't wear it out.

A standard reloading die that isn't abused will last several lifetimes with no problem.



Here's my take on that. A carbide die will be FAR more forgiving of mistakes than a standard die will ever be. Fact is a standard die will never last as long as a carbide one will. Reason for this is simple. Mistakes happen its a fact of life and the reason I have a job.
"There is a fine line between having balls and being a dumb ass" GB

"Machine Gunners - Accuracy By Volume"

eddiesar15
Offline
Posts: 656
Feedback: 0% (0)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/10/2012 10:33:43 AM
Originally Posted By rebs:
what is a small base die ?


its a sizing die that sizing the brass about .002" smaller at the base.
MastaMarksman
Member
Offline
Posts: 1459
Feedback: 100% (4)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/10/2012 11:05:47 AM
Originally Posted By rebs:
Does anyone make carbide dies for the 223 ?

Are RCBS and Lee dies on par with each other or is one definitely a better die for 223 ?


Yes, the higher end die manufactures make carbide die's for .223, Redding & Dillon to name a couple, but you still MUST use lube, I suggest spray lube. You cannot reload bottle neck cases with out lube, the carbide just makes it so that it resizes easier and doesn't grab the case neck on extraction causing it to pull the shoulder out of spec right after it was just resized!

As for RCBS vs Lee, there is no question RCBS are better dies, however RCBS & Hornady die's are at the lower spectrum of quality dies.

Lee, well they are in a class of their own.. They are CHEAP, that's about all I have to say about them, do they work? Sure, but they arn't going to be consistant like higher quality dies, they arn't going to be as well made, etc. You can take a Lee sizing die and a RCBS resizing die and the RCBS weighs about 2x what the Lee die weighs..

I know there are Lee lovers that will come on and try to convince you how wonderfull Lee die's are, I've had them, I've sold them, and I'll never buy them again.. But if you want to find out the hard way, you are welcome to try them out..

Oh and when someone tells you how great the Lee die's are, ask them how old the Lee die's are that they are using, because many people here that LOVE Lee die's have some that are 20-30+ years old, needless to say they were made better back then, the dies they make today are like many products made today vs 20-30 years ago, they are junk..

-Masta
Dear Obama.

I'll Keep My Guns, My Rights and My Money. You Can Keep The "Change"!

1911smith
Member
Offline
Posts: 6472
Feedback: 100% (2)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/10/2012 12:01:23 PM
Originally Posted By MastaMarksman:
Originally Posted By rebs:
Does anyone make carbide dies for the 223 ?

Are RCBS and Lee dies on par with each other or is one definitely a better die for 223 ?


Yes, the higher end die manufactures make carbide die's for .223, Redding & Dillon to name a couple, but you still MUST use lube, I suggest spray lube. You cannot reload bottle neck cases with out lube, the carbide just makes it so that it resizes easier and doesn't grab the case neck on extraction causing it to pull the shoulder out of spec right after it was just resized!

As for RCBS vs Lee, there is no question RCBS are better dies, however RCBS & Hornady die's are at the lower spectrum of quality dies.

Lee, well they are in a class of their own.. They are CHEAP, that's about all I have to say about them, do they work? Sure, but they arn't going to be consistant like higher quality dies, they arn't going to be as well made, etc. You can take a Lee sizing die and a RCBS resizing die and the RCBS weighs about 2x what the Lee die weighs..

I know there are Lee lovers that will come on and try to convince you how wonderfull Lee die's are, I've had them, I've sold them, and I'll never buy them again.. But if you want to find out the hard way, you are welcome to try them out..

Oh and when someone tells you how great the Lee die's are, ask them how old the Lee die's are that they are using, because many people here that LOVE Lee die's have some that are 20-30+ years old, needless to say they were made better back then, the dies they make today are like many products made today vs 20-30 years ago, they are junk..

-Masta


You're just scared my Lee dies will come over and beat your Redding and RCBS dies up.

" God Bless Our Snipers ".
1911smith
Member
Offline
Posts: 6473
Feedback: 100% (2)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/10/2012 12:15:56 PM
[Last Edit: 3/10/2012 12:23:22 PM by 1911smith]
Just gotta shake my head and smile.

Carbide dies are what I bought'em for. Large volume runs.


Not high volume commercial reloading.

Didn't buy'em cause my Lee dies are inferior.

Have never worn out a die of any make.

Running a couple thousand pieces of .223 through carbide sizer die, then trim with RT1200 and finish with M die is almost a pleasure now. Dies mounted on 650 tool head with trim die set to length, not size as a matter of PREFERENCE.

OP, no you don't need carbide. Yes, I have to lube before sizing, yes they were well worth my money spent. Size on ANY brand .223 die, then size with Dillon carbide.

The differences will be noticable. Especially when sizing and trimming a few thousand in 2.5hr setting.
" God Bless Our Snipers ".
MastaMarksman
Member
Offline
Posts: 1460
Feedback: 100% (4)
Link To This Post
Posted: 3/10/2012 12:26:12 PM
Just to be straight.. Lee's pistol Carbide dies work fine.. But resizing straight wall pistol brass isn't a hard task.. Unlike bottleneck brass which does need precision and higher quality dies..

-Masta
Dear Obama.

I'll Keep My Guns, My Rights and My Money. You Can Keep The "Change"!