Hi guys,

I will take a trip to my FFL tonight to look at a gun purchased from Frank's Guns. I have 3 days to inspect it and decide to keep it, or send it back.

The gun is an SGW Stopsign converted by Olympic arms.

NEW PIC ADDED OF THE SEAR, does it look crooked?





In terms of issues and things to look out for at the point of inspection. What should I be concerned with and/or look into?

I just want to ensure that I am not getting someone else's problem/lemon.

Thanks in Advance!

Without putting it in a machine to blue print it, here's my short list.

Do other uppers fit or just the one it came with? Is the finish on top of the receiver/buffer tube radius rubbed or worn? Pivot and take down pins are real hard to push? The upper most likely is rubbing the lower.

Is the finish between the front lugs rubbed off or worn? The upper receivers lug could be rubbing.

Do plastic mags fit or just aluminum? Thermold, Magpul, Beta? Mag well could be tight. Does the bolt catch hold the mags in securely? Mag catch pocket could be shallow. Or is the mag catch too deep and mags are harder to put in?

Does the buffer retaining pin work properly? When you close the upper does the bolt carrier push the buffer back into the tube slightly and off the pin? If not the detent is holding the buffer and the pin hole will be elongated after shooting.

Is the bolt hold open lever real loose or sloppy? Does the slot it's in look deformed by it moving forward?

With the upper off can you wiggle the hammer/trigger a lot? Possible worn out holes.

Does the selector detent in the correct 90 degree positions? Does it rub the receiver on the lever side? Possible detent pin hole location is off.

Use pins to see if the timing is acceptable.

Is the buffer tube parallel to the receiver and the charging handle pulls back smoothly? If not, the buffer tube threaded hole is off.

Do the take down pin and pivot pin detents work in and out? Location issues and the counterbore for the rear pin head can me shallow.

Pistol grip mounting screw threads cross threaded, stripped, or crazy tight when un screwing?  Messed up threads.

Look the finish over. Is it uniform and smooth. Look for welded repairs.

Shoot it.

What i looked for when i picked up my Non-Colt RR...

1) Any surface damage, especially spots that look like repairs. Keep in mind there will be some bumps, scratches and faded finish as these rifles are 30+ years old.
2) Magwell fit. Some of the Non-Colt RR have mag fit issues, usually too tight. Check a USGI and Pmag and any others you might want to use. Usually by this point owners have had the mag wells refurbished and this is less common these days.
3) Upper/Lower alignment. My M16 fit the upper it came with fine, but is VERY tight with new production uppers. Most people just file down the inside of the pin hole of the upper, dont touch anything on your $15,000+ rifle
4) Focus on just the lower. The upper, stock, pistol grip mean nothing as they are all replaceable parts. When i got mine i stripped it down to just the lower and completely rebuilt it with brand new parts.
5) Shoot it if youre dealer has a range.

Based on your pic it looks like a pretty solid lower with most of the original finish remaining.


Also, I believe the lowers were manufactured by Olympic Arms as Semi-Auto AR15s and were purchased and converted to full-auto by various companies such as SGW, PAWS, Frankford Arsenal, etc...

What you have is an Olympic Arms, that used to be called Schuetzen Gun Works (SGW) receiver that was not converted by OA or SGW, a lot of people believe that OA or SGW made M16's.  However OA/SGW made  zero transferable M16's before 1986.  now there are some re-manufactured factory OA guns made after 1986 out there, but that's a different story.

So look to see if there is an engraving somewhere else on the receiver of the person or company that actually did the conversion.

What Shermantor said - in the old days it was common to engrave on the barrel under the handguards or on the flat part of the pistol grip tang instead of somewhere visible without any disassembly.

As it's a conversion check to make sure the auto sear was drilled straight though and is regular and level.  I've seen conversions with the sear holes drilled through crooked.

IMO.. Nothing really matters except the lower. Just buying a shooter...? In the case of buying a registered lower you are really just over paying for a stripped lower due to market forces. Everything else is cheep comparatively speaking. That's where the magic happens.
Worn pin holes ?

In the case of just looking for a shooter I would consider an Auto Sear before a registered  Lower. Food for thought.
Maybe someone else that has both will jump in and give a better answer.

Well hes already bought the rifle so it seems silly to back out on the deal now if its mechanically fine.

Non-colt RR, Converted Colt AR15s RR, RLL and RDIAS are all "shooters" as none of them have collectable value.

Just for reference here are the approx. current market prices of M16 type rifles
RR Non-colt $14-16k
RR Colt AR15 Conversion $14-16k
RLL $15-18k
RDIAS $20-25k
RR Colt M16A1 $20-25k
RR Colt M16A2 $25-30k

Years ago RLL & RDIAS used to be the poor mans way to own a M16 but in the last few years their value has rapidly increased, now a Non-colt RR is the cheapest way to get a M16 style rifle, about $7k less than a RDIAS, if you can even find one for sale.

yep, paid on the low end for mine. I just want something that goes bang.... repeatedly. Im not looking to collect guns, Im looking to shoot the crap out of them!!

It looks clean but only testing will tell. Imo the only collection type m16's are prototypes and early models like the 601's.I have a paws in transfer right now, can wait just to lay my P.A.W.S. on it!

Good luck dealing with "frank" even if you do find a problem. Rarely are the guns actually his, and I've had experience when someone wasn't happy with the gun as shipped, the seller(not frank) already spent the money and had nothing to offer the buyer for a refund. YMMV.

Here are some more pics of this DIRTY gun.....
I still have not "accepted" the gun (and have 2 days left to do so)


Things I looked at last night (or verified).

Magwell is in spec to USGI Colt mags only
Hammer doesn't wiggle left to right
Removed the grip, threads are GTG
Dog ears show no cracks
No trigger pin or sear pin holes look worn.
Buffer Retainer seems fine
The upper I built for it fits fine too with no issues.
Bolt hold-open has no more slop than a modern ar15
The Selector lines up perfectly at 90"
no weld or repair marks







To me, the sear looks crooked, taking calipers to measure tonight. The dealer said that even their new MG's they build look like that... anyone?

Man that thing is filthy.

Ran hard and put away wet.  Need to spray some carb cleaner in there to flush all the gunk out.

If it's in spec you should be good to go.  Any luck finding out who the orginal person/company is that converted it?  You may end up finding out via FOIA request after you get it.

For P-Mags, the older ones won't fit my OA/PAWS M16 with out modification, all newer P-Mags fit fine.

does the sear look crooked?

Regardless, im going to run the gun tonight!

Rewelds

A bit hard to tell from the pics, but the sear pin looks straight.  The sear itself looks wonky.  Cheap part to replace.

Wow, yeah that gun is dirty!

The Pin for the sear looks ok, appears maybe the sear plate itself is beat up and needs replaced, they run like $30. They are one of the few m16 parts you actually cant buy without appropriate paperwork, just need to fax/email a copy of your form 4 once you get it.

For reference this is a pic of the sear in my Oly Arms M16.

The buttstock looks like a good one, I sold one for $250 8 or 10 years ago.

Look close at the trigger guard ears for cracks.

I'd keep it if it runs, the sear costs $10...

You're not required to show a form to buy the auto sear - some anal-retentve retailers require it, but the law doesn't.

What???? Is it just a standard CAR stock?

As in the original plastic coated aluminum Colt CAR stock... Classic... Sure looks like it.

How much are they going for currently?

You would think the owner would at least clean it up before he tried to sell it.