You have to understand the law and the wording of law.

Assuming your scenario has actually happened; There is no innocent seller or buyer regardless if they know they are innocent and even if they don't have malicious intent.

If you are in possession of an unregistered machine gun then you are in violation of the NFA. Even if you have absolutely no idea you're in violation or not, you are in violation. Unfortunately they didn't put the word "knowingly" in 5862(d)

Title 26 Section 5861(d) makes it a crime, punishable by up to 10 years in prison, see § 5871, for any person to possess a firearm that is not properly registered.

The ATF only approves the transfer. They have no idea if the firearm in its present condition is in violation of the law unless it's investigated. And even if the ATF approves the transfer, this still doesn't mean the NFA item is legal.

Basically anyone with it has a great chance of going to jail.

actually, it is you that have to understand which law we are talking about.

There is an innocent seller and buyer.  If you read the law, there is an intent element to the crime.

In the civil case, there is the person who knew that he had altered the machinegun.  Obviously he is not innocent.

but the guys who came after him and knew nothing . . they would not be culpable.

Therefore, we are talking about the civil side of this.

Who pays and who gets hosed.

The other issue:  When does the innocent buyer incur damage?

Does he take it to the BATFE and ask for a ruling?

Is it legal if they don't seize it?


Seriously, this is a problem that is far reaching.

As I recall, in Staples v. United States, 511 U.S. 600 (1994), the Supreme Court said that the government had to prove Mr. Staples knew he was in violation of the law by possessing an unregistered machine gun.

exactly, hence why I am not worried about the criminal aspects of this.

Saw on another forum that "Frank" pulled the auction and was going to inform the buyer, but shouldn't he also inform the ATF that this was a cutup LL which was welded to a DIAS body?

Why should he do work for them???

 

okay, so anytime someone sees something that they THINK is illegal . . you should call the BATFE and the cops?

Like, if you are at the range and you see someone shooting a rifle with a short barrel . . you should call the BATFE and the cops because you THINK it may be illegal?

I'm not. MYOB. I have no reason to invite the man into my life. Some guy has a gun at the range? As long as he isn't pointing it at me or others I don't care. Is it properly registered? Don't care.

US title 18(? I'm on my phone so lookup capabilities aren't easy) 922 section O says the same thing about possession and exempts government and pre may.

And with the staples case, you're looking at case law situation. In other words "let the courts handle it"


I'll tell you what, be the innocent buyer and I'll contribute $100 to your legal fund when it's required.  

I can't speak for the civil side. The end buyer gets hosed.  I'm sure the ATF will look into investigating up the line of transfers because they have nothing better to do when they aren't signing stamps and shipping guns to mexico.

Holy shit!