Is there a manufacturer that makes one or do I need to find an original?

Thanks.

After edit.

So a local FFL is selling this Ingram made MAC10/45 with five mags for under $6K.  From what I have researched those are normally going for around 7.5-8K plus.
I know him as my company did the network for his new shop.  I was given second dibs after my boss turned it down.  If I pass, then on open market.

My dad has a Ingram MAC 10/9mm, IMI Uzi, and M16 Colt Commando, but I wanted one of my own.

So good deal?
Thanks.

Just paid for it and sent in papers!!

Gemtech Viper

I'm a fan of Bowers. I can do 300bo supersonic it It too. It is heavier than some though.

Yeah that's a good deal for a private transaction. 7-8k is a bit high, those are like gunbroker prices

Yes, anything (M10 or M11 related) in the fives is a Buy It Now. Do it.

ETA: this thread, and my own advice, earned me another M11/9 today. MG-buying is the best buying.

Thanks for the input!!

Just got back from paying for it.

good deal

I picked up a M-11 & factory suppressor... Plus a Lage upper and 8 mags for $4,500 last week

A friend told me about one of his tenants that needed some cash... Needless to say, I didn't screw around


The price of these little SMG's is going to skyrocket when they introduce the 5.56 upper

No wonder they needed some cash, they make horrible financial decisions. They could've gotten a sale equally fast at $6,000 right now for just the M-11.

Good buy for you, and good buy for the OP as well.

From what I read, the 5.56 Saber upper was no longer made.  Is there another source that will be producing them soon?

damn!!

Uzitalk.com will soon become your best friend.
Having said that, Lage manufacturing currently has a prototype and a wait list going for a possible production of AR type uppers for the mac RR's.
It is currently pending ATF approval.....kind of a; don't hold your breath, but be kind of excited type of situation.

Ahhh good ole Ernie Wrenn.

The 5.56 Lage upper has been discussed since 2014... Not a fast moving project, But Lage stands the best chance for an ATF approval... If this happens, expect the M series MG's to double overnight


There has been a slight dip in the M market, and I see these guns as a value investment... The OP got a deal, I stole the one I bought. My seller justified it like this, He bought the M-11 in 95' and paid $800 he made 562% on his purchase (I know the upper, mags aren't included)...

Every so often an awesome deal will pop up on an MG.

Like someone will put a nice minty Colt M16 up for sale for $12,000 on gunbroker and it will be purchased literally in 2 or 3 minutes.

I have seen this kind of thing many times.


But I strongly advise buyers not to wait for a super deal.

If you see the gun you want, just buy it even if the price is a little above market.  

If you keep waiting, you might find yourself priced out of the market, because the prices go up around 10% a year on average.

Sometimes they will take a huge jump in just a few months.

Recently WWII M1 and M1A1 Thompsons went up in price from around 18k to 25k in just a few months.

NIB UZIs were around 8k in 2012.  Within a year they were going for $15k


Actually, when the subprime bank scam hit in 2010 and the world economy crashed, MG prices took a big dip across the board.  And then they marched right back up again in the face of a horrible recession.

That shows you that Richie Rich guys are buying these guns now.  A typical wage earner isn't going to push up the prices of a $20,000 collector firearm during a worldwide recession.

Howdy Josh!

Your advice and the poster's above you makes great sense.  This gun was passed on by my boss. I had the cash and went for it.

The dealer was FSC now out in Niederwald.  He built a new shop.  You should check it out if you are ever on the far south side.

I am headed back to Tiger Valley this fall with my other brother for another carbine course.

Hope business is doing well!

I think you did good.. was it unfired?

Somone i know bought an unfire m10/45 for 6k recently.It was also a private sale.
From a dealer you a paying for alittle more safety in the transaction so an addition 500 or 1k might be worth it to some.

It's funny now to look back to just a few years ago and see how people would sweat and dicker endlessly over a few hundred dollars.

Back in 2011, NIB M11/9s would sell at $3200, but they would sit unsold for a month on subguns.com at $3400.

I bought my NIB UZI from a dealer for the big fat dealer price of $8000, I remember thinking that it really should have been more like $7800.  $200 too high!

I know I know. the stories I could tell.

i passed on a $9k GG, a $10 AK reciver.

I did haggel a few NIB m11 for from 2500  to 2300 ea.

I scored my auto conector for $5000 when others were selling for 8,000.

I was the 2nd caller, first guy tried to beat him up on price. Then I offered asking price.

You damn right they will.

Welcome to the family! Be sure to check out the MAC forum at Uzitalk and get stocked up on Lage gear!

Lage's M11/15 prototype was approved by the BATFE Tech Branch yesterday. Que $10k+ M11s.

There's a couple M11/9s on GunBroker with BIN prices of $7.5K - Better grab them!

Seriously, $10k+ M11s in the next three years are wishful thinking.  If I could get $10K+ for the the M11 that I've got pending, I'd cancel the transfer to me and sell it in less than a New York minute.  Three years from now, depending on how the Presidential election looks, all bets are off.

MHO, YMMV, etc.

Yes, very wishful thinking. But given the market and the recent price trends, I don't think it's out of the question in the next five years. If you look at Ruben's pricing from a few years ago, he is just ahead of what becomes the going-rate. Obviously, there is more to MG prices than what one dealer is asking but I think that it's telling. FWIW, he's asking $8k for stock M11s and M10s.

There was chatter on UziTalk that the Lage 556 upper is going to be north of $2k, which is way overpriced IMHO (parts, R&D... I know). But it makes the M11 that much more versatile (which can be overrated), expensive, and appealing (to some, probably shooters more than collectors).

It seems to me that the M11/M10 series, especially given Richard's products, are still undervalued and have an undetermined, high price ceiling.

The MG market is always at an upward trend, but the spikes in price are harder to predict... Here is some of the logic used in the prediction of this (M10/M11) spike

#1) The most desirable MG's are ones that offer versatility - HK Sear / RDIAS - Multi Gun Platforms

#2) Number of Firearms registered - (M10/M11) = Most registries on NFA (32k of 175,977) or 18% of Market


- With the intro of Lage products, the M10/M11 becomes a quasi versatile weapon - This will increase the desirability and drive price up
- The sheer volume of M10/M11s will negatively effect price, they are plentiful, and easy to find - Scarcity is low


Interest is harder to gauge. MAC's have always been, and probably always will be the cheapest entry into the MG world. With more and more people discovering NFA items, the entry level to MG's will continue to rise... 5 years ago MAC's were the cheapest entry and they cost 3K average. Now MAC's are still the cheapest entry at 6K average...

Id bet with the rise in general NFA interest + the Lage products, These guns will be north of 10k in less than 4 years...


At any rate, they are a CANT-LOSE investment... Buy 1, or 2, and enjoy

Agreed ^^. But aren't Spitfires the cheapest of the entry-level MGs?

For the modern shooter (not collectors), I think the M11/M10 (with Lage) is in greater demand and is a more desirable option than the Spitfire, Sten, Reising, and Stemple 76. I could see those four becoming the new entry-level guns.

People were saying that the MG is topped out back when you could buy a NIB Colt m16A1 for $12,000.

Seeing as how the prices went up every single year since then, I'm starting to not believe the "topped out" faction.


If the MG market goes up 10% each year for the next five years, then a gun currently selling for $6500 will be over $10,000.

Going from $6500 to $10,000 is not a big deal, it's only another $3500, which is chicken feed in the NFA world.


Here's some advice for the fence sitters:

You were a fence sitter when MACs were $2500.  You were a fence sitter when they were $3500.  

Etc, etc.

Now they're $6500.  

Just buy the frikkin thing already.

Machine guns already had an artificially high price run up due mostly to the "41 Frenzy" and Hillary Paranoia.  Since Trump's election, with very few exceptions, machine gun prices have been flat at best.

In contrast, since Trump's election my 401K has enjoyed a continuous 10+% annually adjusted increase in value, and I don't have a 12+ month wait to get what I've paid for.

As far as the Lage made M11/15 goes, as it (like its predecessor the AA SABRE) requires drilling a hole in the rear of the registered receiver, thereby decreasing the long term value of the receiver.  A repaired receiver is no longer original - period.  Hymenorrhaphy does not a virgin make.

MHO, YMMV, etc.

Agreed. MACs in their basic form aren't very desirable. And there's a ton of them. With those two factors, they're cheap.

With an upper that makes them worth a damn (Lage), they're more desirable but still plentiful. The market for MACs reflects the Lage upper, not the base gun. With whatever rifle caliber upper available, the price will go up some for that - maybe as much as the jump for the existence of Lage uppers, maybe not. MACs are very plentiful and they're kinda crappy, so they're probably not going to leapfrog guns that have traditionally cost a decent percentage more (like the AC556) just because of the aftermarket. I think it's more likely that the rising cost of MACs will also push up other MGs - a rising tide lifts all boats.

When I got into MGs a Mac was $3-4k, now they are running $6-8k, that was maybe 4 years ago?

I think part of the reason people cant fathom MGs being so expensive is their semi-auto counterparts are comparably so cheap. Why would anyone pay $20k for a MG that should only cost $1k if you are buying a post sample.

People need to get away from the comparison and look at MGs as unique, one of a kind, firearms, not just full auto versions of the same semi-autos that sit on most guns store shelves. A upper middle class family, say a husband and wife with both with professional career might be making $50-100k each, so lets say $75k avg, so $150k household income, after taxes they are taking home $120k a year, so roughly $10k a month cash in their bank account. They could buy a entry level machine gun every month if they wanted too. people in the top few percent of earns can buy a $20k+ MG every months and not even notice it their budget. there are 11 million people in the US with a net worth of $1,000,000 or more, yet only about 170k MG, prob half of which are not even available to the civilian market as they are owned by gov agencies, and what remains sits in strong hands. I personally cant ever fathom selling my MGs for any price, the only way they will go up for sale is if I die and have no heirs to pass them on too. Im sure Im not the only one who feels that way.

I know plenty of people who spends tens of thousands of dollars a year on hobbies and vacations. they own boats and sports cars worth tens of thousands of dollars. they own vacation homes worth hundreds of thousands of dollars. people will pay thousands of dollars for a baseball car, comic book, action figure or rare coin, yet for some reason MG prices boggle peoples minds. My friend was just admiring my MG the other day wishing he could afford one yet I know he just bought a 4K tv worth several grand.

We already know people are buying M240B/Mag58s for $100k+, M60s sell for $50k all the time, I dont see why the prices we see know for entry level MGs cant double within the next decade. The population is growing, every day more people get into firearms, and the internet has spread the knowledge of MGs ownership like wildfire.

IMO over the last 4-5 years ive notice the number of MG listings online seems to have decreased, there used to be a lot more selection and what you do find now seems to get gobbled up days or even hours after being listed. its a sellers market and short of a major recession or change in gun laws I dont foresee that changing.

END RANT

Well, just had the FFL order a Viper can to put on it.  I read the reviews and it looks like that is the best way to go as another poster mentioned.

I have all the mags that came with it (5) and the loader and original strap.

Now to settle for the long wait.

You have only 5 mags? That's almost like having no mags when it comes to FA. Start shopping for some grease gun mags. And ammo, lots of ammo.

I've had good luck with the Keep Shooting GG mags in my M10/45. Good choice if one is looking for new.

I hope it's still around next year when your paperwork is approved.


I'd get all the parts off of it you can. Upper, Lage upper and mags.

Well, I do need more, but my big mag collection is for my ar's at the moment.  At 120 total now.