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Posted: 5/18/2017 1:59:19 AM EDT
[#1]
I can confirm Griffin has a new rimfire can on the way.
How it compares to the others you mentioned, don't know.. will have to wait till it's released. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 6:56:37 AM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
I'm looking at the Rugged Oculus and have heard rumor of a Griffin Armament suppressor with no details other than it's coming. Having been burned by SHOT SHOW Vapor'ware in the past, I'm sort of a "show me" guy today but, I also don't want buyers remorse after waiting ~10 months for a Form 4 approval. What pending Rimfire/22 Hornet/5.7 class suppressors are coming out in the near term to compete with the Oculus in terms of size, weight, or materials assuming cost is reasonable? Why is it better/worse/competitive with the Oculus or SiCo Spectre or ....? TIA, Sid So many good rimfire cans out there, it's hard to go wrong. There will always be new hotness, the only way to win is to buy one at regular intervals. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 7:57:06 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So many good rimfire cans out there, it's hard to go wrong. There will always be new hotness, the only way to win is to buy one at regular intervals. Buy something from a known/reputable manufacturer and you should have no regrets. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 8:08:50 AM EDT
[#4]
Looked at the Q el Camino?
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Posted: 5/18/2017 11:39:00 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
I'm looking at the Rugged Oculus and have heard rumor of a Griffin Armament suppressor with no details other than it's coming. Having been burned by SHOT SHOW Vapor'ware in the past, I'm sort of a "show me" guy today but, I also don't want buyers remorse after waiting ~10 months for a Form 4 approval. What pending Rimfire/22 Hornet/5.7 class suppressors are coming out in the near term to compete with the Oculus in terms of size, weight, or materials assuming cost is reasonable? Why is it better/worse/competitive with the Oculus or SiCo Spectre or ....? TIA, Sid No Vaporware here... In stock ready to go. 
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Posted: 5/18/2017 12:12:56 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryIn stock where? All I have seen is out of stock or 'backordered".
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Posted: 5/18/2017 12:21:58 PM EDT
[#7]
If you can show me a Halycon in-stock I'll buy it right now, but since AAC is the king of vapor wear...I doubt that's gonna happen.
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Posted: 5/18/2017 12:48:45 PM EDT
[#8]
Let us rephrase this...
In stock as we actually are in full production and have inventory - they do exist and are sitting on the shelves at the factory right now. They are PENDING F3's to go to wholesalers/dealers and some should be getting approved any day now. DEPENDING on who your dealer is and where you are located you could see one in real life in a week or so... In the Industry VAPORWARE is a term explaining something that is shown and advertised that actually does not even exist and is in most cases a rapid prototype. "Show at SHOT 2015 sell in 2yrs if we get the bugs worked out by then". Now if we didn't have the whole NFA thing and it was cash and carry they would be in every store right now... |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 12:50:04 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you can show me a Halycon in-stock I'll buy it right now, but since AAC 
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Posted: 5/18/2017 12:51:57 PM EDT
[#10]
Im looking forward to seeing what Griffin Armament has coming out.
I wouldn't buy anything until I seen what they had to offer. But I would look hard at the Oculus and the MaskHD. I own the MaskHD and would buy a second one in a heart beat. I also own a spectreII and its nice on a rifle cant tell it apart from the Mask. But on a pistol the SpectreII sounds loud compared to the Mask. I have heard that the Oculus sounds just as good as the mask. And if the Halcyon is as good as the Element 2 it would be a good one to check out. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 1:44:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So many good rimfire cans out there, it's hard to go wrong. There will always be new hotness, the only way to win is to buy one at regular intervals.
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Posted: 5/18/2017 1:54:30 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
... Buy something from a known/reputable manufacturer and you should have no regrets. With personnel movement to new companies, the 'shackles' have been removed for some 'out of the box' thinking. Dead Air, Rugged and, the new "Q" are a few that come to mind. Then you have government issues that pop up like the wipe issue with DA Ghost suppressors that cast a little doubt on things (in my case, I went from DA to Rugged in my consideration for a 45ACP can). Then you have the personnel layoffs and products being taken out of the marketplace to consider as well like recent developments at SiCo. I'm still really happy I scored an AAC Scarab back at the dawn of the Pilot's heyday. Would I buy it today, probably not but I sure do like it and I'm glad I have it. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 1:58:58 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Looked at the Q el Camino? Like Griffin's product, it is hard to compare a product that isn't released or is in such a small release you can't see one in person. I have for example seen a Mask and Oculus at the same time in the retail marketplace. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 2:04:46 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryAAC's product availability, or lack of, is what caused me to broaden my horizons initially. I was a huge AAC fanboy in the early days but, the marketplace is also a lot more competitive now.
Add some mixed history on older AAC rimfire cans and I'm a bit reluctant to commit until I can demo one myself. It is reassuring to know AAC isn't following SureFire's path to the marketplace with their 22lr suppressor. That SF was one I wanted but, I was so irked at failed delivery promises I moved on. |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 5:41:26 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In stock where? All I have seen is out of stock or 'backordered". |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 6:08:21 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Q is one that seems to be on the verge of public releases but, other than a few demo's I still classify them as vaporware. Will they be widely available for purchase in 2 months? 6 months? A year? |
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Posted: 5/18/2017 7:37:05 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hansohn also lists them in stock. |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 12:00:13 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They have been available for months. I got mine shortly after SHOT show. SilencerShop has them in-stock, they got the first batch. Apparently you are not even trying to look for them. Hahnson also lists them in stock. Form 3's are great if you know exactly what you want and don't need dealer services except to hold your can for ~year. Ask me how I know I don't want an Osprey Micro which is a fine can for most people. That's one I actually personally touched at a dealer. Buying sight unseen is something I don't do today. The Q Erector is the one I'm curious about as the other essentially duplicates a can I already have (similar enough for me but not the same). However, I have never seen the El Camino in person either. So while shipping, essentially the case with SF when I moved on, it may not be vaporware as it is apparently shipping in reasonable numbers but, it isn't out sufficiently for me to see one in person myself much less shoot it or see one shot IN PERSON. |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 11:35:58 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
After having a transfer dealer basically steal my money (bought a Form 3 can and they moved to 'Alaska' never to be seen again) and having recommended Gem-Tech cans ring my ears, I really want to see one in person (not on the web). If I demo a dealers can, they earned my business if I buy that model, PERIOD. Test driving someone else's inventory and then bottom fishing on price is not something I will do and consider it unethical. If I demo a users can and like it, then a form 3 is reasonable IMHO. Form 3's are great if you know exactly what you want and don't need dealer services except to hold your can for ~year. Ask me how I know I don't want an Osprey Micro which is a fine can for most people. That's one I actually personally touched at a dealer. Buying sight unseen is something I don't do today. The Q Erector is the one I'm curious about as the other essentially duplicates a can I already have (similar enough for me but not the same). However, I have never seen the El Camino in person either. So while shipping, essentially the case with SF when I moved on, it may not be vaporware as it is apparently shipping in reasonable numbers but, it isn't out sufficiently for me to see one in person myself much less shoot it or see one shot IN PERSON. Quote HistoryQuoted:
After having a transfer dealer basically steal my money (bought a Form 3 can and they moved to 'Alaska' never to be seen again) and having recommended Gem-Tech cans ring my ears, I really want to see one in person (not on the web). If I demo a dealers can, they earned my business if I buy that model, PERIOD. Test driving someone else's inventory and then bottom fishing on price is not something I will do and consider it unethical. If I demo a users can and like it, then a form 3 is reasonable IMHO. Form 3's are great if you know exactly what you want and don't need dealer services except to hold your can for ~year. Ask me how I know I don't want an Osprey Micro which is a fine can for most people. That's one I actually personally touched at a dealer. Buying sight unseen is something I don't do today. The Q Erector is the one I'm curious about as the other essentially duplicates a can I already have (similar enough for me but not the same). However, I have never seen the El Camino in person either. So while shipping, essentially the case with SF when I moved on, it may not be vaporware as it is apparently shipping in reasonable numbers but, it isn't out sufficiently for me to see one in person myself much less shoot it or see one shot IN PERSON. Quoted:
Q is one that seems to be on the verge of public releases but, other than a few demo's I still classify them as vaporware. Will they be widely available for purchase in 2 months? 6 months? A year? |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 12:32:05 PM EDT
[#20]
Is the Q Erector available?
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Posted: 5/19/2017 2:35:36 PM EDT
[#21]
I was looking at 22 cans for quite a bit, and went with the Oculus. I had looked at the DA Mask (which I still like) and the Hydra.
What made me go with the Oculus is the modularity of it. I had also considered the GA Checkmate QD. Since I have 3 platforms to move around to. |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 3:25:51 PM EDT
[#22]
Oculus for me. Finally made. Me buy a dedicated 22 can
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Posted: 5/19/2017 7:37:44 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well you did not ask about demos, you asked about availability: The El Camino will be a fine for many people but, I should have clarified that I already have a similar suppressor to it and was thinking about the Erector, Oculus, and similar suppressors. The GA teaser about their new rimfire can had me considering waiting for it. Having one can that is short for my bolt action rimfire and the same one being long for a rimfire pistol is nice. All the newer cans I'm considering are easy to clean and caliber rated for the newer rounds my older cans aren't compatible with. I should have also said that my past experiences with newer cans on Form 3's has me a bit gun shy after some bad past experiences with unfulfilled commitments and too many disappointments. Hype also has me cautious about buying something I cannot see or touch and while not an absolute requirement, a personal demo is highly desirable and likely a personal requirement before I commit money to a purchase. |
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Posted: 5/19/2017 11:01:39 PM EDT
[#24]
Oculus is one of the top rimfire models released lately so you guys did well ordering one. Looks great, built like a tank,easy to clean and most important it performs very with recent DB metering to prove it. I ordered the El Camino a while back the lite weight was the selling point to me. People say weight doesn't matter, but after you get a few lite weight rimfire cans most change their mind. A lite weight can is great on rimfire pistols and for guys who build lite weight rimfire rifle setups( me :)
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Posted: 5/19/2017 11:16:58 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We fixed the quote for you Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
If you can show me a Halycon in-stock I'll buy it right now, but since AAC |
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Posted: 5/20/2017 10:21:05 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We fixed the quote for you But atleast Q has the Honey Bager covered for y'all. |
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Posted: 5/20/2017 7:49:47 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oculus is one of the top rimfire models released lately so you guys did well ordering one. Looks great, built like a tank,easy to clean and most important it performs very with recent DB metering to prove it. I ordered the El Camino a while back the lite weight was the selling point to me. People say weight doesn't matter, but after you get a few lite weight rimfire cans most change their mind. A lite weight can is great on rimfire pistols and for guys who build lite weight rimfire rifle setups( me :) I also like the Hydra |
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Posted: 5/20/2017 8:17:59 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oculus is one of the top rimfire models released lately so you guys did well ordering one. Looks great, built like a tank,easy to clean and most important it performs very with recent DB metering to prove it. I ordered the El Camino a while back the lite weight was the selling point to me. People say weight doesn't matter, but after you get a few lite weight rimfire cans most change their mind. A lite weight can is great on rimfire pistols and for guys who build lite weight rimfire rifle setups( me :) |
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Posted: 5/22/2017 2:27:28 PM EDT
[#29]
Don't overthink it.
Buy what's available, in your budget, and that comes from a reputable manufacturer. I really like my Spectre II, but I think I prefer my Ruger Silent-SR over it as the Ruger doesn't leave the back cap on the host like the Spectre II has a tendency to do. |
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Posted: 5/22/2017 2:49:12 PM EDT
[#30]
Although I haven't shot it I think the Q El Camino is the best bet at the moment. I currently own a Liberty Regulator and a Mask with extensive rounds through them so I've developed a pretty good idea of what I value.
1. Ease of takedown can not be stressed enough. The Mask is excellent in this department whereas the Regulator as a monocore can suck to disassemble. 2. Weight. Most rimfire cans are on the light side but lighter is better. The Mask feels dense at 6+oz. The Regulator feels nice for its size. 3. Materials. I do not care for an aluminum can. I want something durable that can be dipped and I don't have to worry about my cleaning solvents. 4. A back cap that stays in place. Liberty cleverly made the back mount LH thread which keeps the mount intact during removal. The mount on the Mask comes loose from the tube a little too easily for my taste. Not really an issue unless you're talking about mounting under a handguard but still annoying nonetheless. So why do I have the El Camino on order? Because it checks all the boxes. Designed with the Element 2 in mind which is widely regarded as a high performing can. The weight is in the ultralight 4 oz range. Made of robust materials that can be dipped. Closed baffles for ease of takedown and no rear cap that can come unscrewed. The Oculus and Halcyon look like great cans but I have no interest in a modular rimfire. Just my 2 cents. |
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Posted: 5/22/2017 2:52:42 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Although I haven't shot it I think the Q El Camino is the best bet at the moment. |
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Posted: 5/22/2017 2:54:06 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It isn't. I have owned one since SHOT Show. |
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Posted: 5/22/2017 3:57:35 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Care to enlighten us on who and why? |
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Posted: 5/22/2017 8:18:03 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well first, "best" is a high bar to clear given what is out there. But some reasons why I do not consider it the "best". It is not the quietest, it is not the easiest to take apart, and the finish on mine started coming off on first dunk. What I do like though is good reduction, can be taken apart, narrow body (fits my holster). |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 10:58:23 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My next rimfire 'needs' to me an integral but after that, what's your recommendation? |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 12:06:53 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There is no one can that does everything the best. What works for you depends on what your needs are. As an example: Easiest to Disassemble: Quietest: Lightest: All Around (IMO): |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 12:30:07 PM EDT
[#37]
Rumor has it that the Bowers USS is the sleeper in this race and is noticeably quieter than the rest.
I'm looking forward to testing that out... |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 12:39:48 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Rumor has it that the Bowers USS is the sleeper in this race and is noticeably quieter than the rest. I'm looking forward to testing that out... It looks like an SWR Spectre made out with a Huntertown Arms Guardian in a dark alley behind a bar... 6.5" is pushing the limits on length in my book. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 12:54:12 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I value your opinion as I know you've tried so many products out there but you can be so cryptic in your replies and seemingly "withholding" information or opinion. I make an opinion on the El Camino (albeit one with no hands on experience though that's often the case in the suppressor game) which you firmly counter yet provide no followup on what you'd prefer instead. I know everything in this business is a compromise and decisions are subjective but maybe you can provide a couple of examples of what you like in a particular category. As an example: Easiest to Disassemble: Prodigy Quietest: Genesis Lightest: Don't know I do not weigh them, but GM-22 at 2.5oz is pretty light (not counting things like pillbox) All Around (IMO): Probably SpectreII Have not used some of the newest cans yet, Oculus, Erector, Halcyon, etc, so they are not considered above. The real answer is there are so many good choices in the rimfire department, it is hard to make a mistake. Trying to quantify one as the "best" is an undoable task. And with new entries coming out each year Oculus, Erector, Halcyon, for example, it would be a constant effort to attempt. I only know of a few 22 rimfire that truly sucked. The first YHM 22 can, the first Sig 22 can were both very loud. These have been discontinued and replaced. The first Prodigy was louder than marketed, AAC replaced the cores for free. What do I use on a regular basis? Prodigy (S&W M&P), Genesis (Glock/AA kit), Spectre (22 F/A), Outback IID (22/45), Mask (Beretta), El Camino (Mosquito), SR-22 (10/22), Mist (96/22). I tend to dedicate them to specific guns (shown) rather than move them around. I had more but sold them during the buying spree last spring and have not replaced them yet (Warlock, Sparrow, Aviator, Ryder, Element). So that is over a dozen cans I have thousands of round experience with that I think are GTG. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 12:58:49 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Rumor has it that the Bowers USS is the sleeper in this race and is noticeably quieter than the rest. I'm looking forward to testing that out... I remember the original Omega 22 was 5 baffles. Then Frank Powell commissioned the Warlock with 6 baffles, then ACC countered with Aviator, now we have a 9 baffle Omega. I remember the short lived DeGroat cans that were like 12-15 inches long. I know he did a 9mm but not sure if he did a 22. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 1:14:18 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am not trying to be vague, but only you know what you are going to use it for. For example, if you are going to shoot 5.7, that limits you to certain cans. If you are going to shoot F/A, that limits you to certain cans. If ease of dis-assembly matters to you, that limits you to certain cans. etc. The real answer is there are so many good choices in the rimfire department, it is hard to make a mistake. Trying to quantify one as the "best" is an undoable task. And with new entries coming out each year Oculus, Erector, Halcyon, for example, it would be a constant effort to attempt. I only know of a few 22 rimfire that truly sucked. The first YHM 22 can, the first Sig 22 can were both very loud. These have been discontinued and replaced. The first Prodigy was louder than marketed, AAC replaced the cores for free. What do I use on a regular basis? Prodigy (S&W M&P), Genesis (Glock/AA kit), Spectre (22 F/A), Outback IID (22/45), Mask (Beretta), El Camino (Mosquito), SR-22 (10/22), Mist (96/22). I tend to dedicate them to specific guns (shown) rather than move them around. I had more but sold them during the buying spree last spring and have not replaced them yet (Warlock, Sparrow, Aviator, Ryder, Element). So that is over a dozen cans I have thousands of round experience with that I think are GTG. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 2:53:37 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
AAC's product availability, or lack of, is what caused me to broaden my horizons initially. I was a huge AAC fanboy in the early days but, the marketplace is also a lot more competitive now. Add some mixed history on older AAC rimfire cans and I'm a bit reluctant to commit until I can demo one myself. It is reassuring to know AAC isn't following SureFire's path to the marketplace with their 22lr suppressor. That SF was one I wanted but, I was so irked at failed delivery promises I moved on. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 3:37:52 PM EDT
[#43]
Interesting thread here. Happy to see so much interest still in the rimfire class. We've been cranking parts out for the new 22 can for the last several weeks. Very excited to launch it but we have a policy to not to discuss anything in development prior to launch. I really wish that we could but all I will say is that nobody in the market ever before has invested this much money and time in developing a 22 can. Its absolutely ridiculous and awesome. That being said im not going to lie to people and say it will be out next week. We are probably looking at another 2 months until launch. So if getting one sooner is important to you there are alot of great options already on the market as has been discussed in this thread from well respected companies.
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Posted: 5/23/2017 3:42:28 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting thread here. Happy to see so much interest still in the rimfire class. We've been cranking parts out for the new 22 can for the last several weeks. Very excited to launch it but we have a policy to not to discuss anything in development prior to launch. I really wish that we could but all I will say is that nobody in the market ever before has invested this much money and time in developing a 22 can. Its absolutely ridiculous and awesome. That being said im not going to lie to people and say it will be out next week. We are probably looking at another 2 months until launch. So if getting one sooner is important to you there are alot of great options already on the market as has been discussed in this thread from well respected companies. |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 4:57:38 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Osbourne Effect. 
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Posted: 5/23/2017 4:58:58 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As in Super Dave? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect |
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Posted: 5/23/2017 10:14:09 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting thread here. Happy to see so much interest still in the rimfire class. We've been cranking parts out for the new 22 can for the last several weeks. Very excited to launch it but we have a policy to not to discuss anything in development prior to launch. I really wish that we could but all I will say is that nobody in the market ever before has invested this much money and time in developing a 22 can. Its absolutely ridiculous and awesome. That being said im not going to lie to people and say it will be out next week. We are probably looking at another 2 months until launch. So if getting one sooner is important to you there are alot of great options already on the market as has been discussed in this thread from well respected companies. 
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Posted: 5/24/2017 12:50:40 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As in cancel the purchase of the Checkmate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect |
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Posted: 5/24/2017 1:04:22 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As in cancel the purchase of the Checkmate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osborne_effect Hopefully it does better than the monocore checkmate. My experiences with it on pistol hosts have been less than stellar - still very noticeable FRP even though it was touted that the design mitigated that. |
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Posted: 5/24/2017 1:34:43 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
6.5" is pushing the limits on length in my book. |
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