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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:14:48 PM EDT
Word around the internet tubes is that SilencerCo laid off ~100 employees. Sounds like people, in anticipation of the HPA, haven't been purchasing.
Curious if distributors stocking up on Black Rifles and mags with the thought that FHRC was going to get elected has any cause in this. 
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:20:36 PM EDT
[#1]
Sad,
I can tell you my purchases have stopped. Not because of HPA, but because I can't stand the wait. I have lots of suppressors and would like a few more. But a year wait?! Fuck that. I have had form 4s go though in 30 days before, and one that took 13 months. I just can't do it. I will just make do with what I have. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:21:10 PM EDT
[#2]
A shooting buddy worked for them and he got replaced by a temp about 18 months ago so I would guess that they have been seeing a slowdown for a while.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:23:13 PM EDT
[#3]
I suspect this trend will continue across the entire firearms industry over the next few years. My local shops are ridiculously slow right now.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:23:46 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sad, I can tell you my purchases have stopped. Not because of HPA, but because I can't stand the wait. I have lots of suppressors and would like a few more. But a year wait?! Fuck that. I have had form 4s go though in 30 days before, and one that took 13 months. I just can't do it. I will just make do with what I have. I know. It always sucks when people get laid off. I am curious if this is a more preemptive move because they know the year is going to be slow, and just cutting costs as much as possible so they get by. Hopefully the slowdown won't actually take anyone down, especially with some of the newer companies coming out. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:25:47 PM EDT
[#5]
That sucks but I can understand why people are buying less. The wait is horrible and with the HPA looming everyone is hoping to skip the wait.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:28:11 PM EDT
[#6]
Seems like its been such a constant upward trend with the whole firearms industry in anticipation of the worst outcome.
Now that people are all semi tapped out from storing up for so long it seems natural for some of these companies to trend down |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:30:29 PM EDT
[#7]
Deadair, Rugged and Sig have taken a chunk out if their market share.
The only cans I own are Silencerco, but when I think centerfire can I'm thinking of those other guys. Their Saker ASR should be a good seller. I hope them the best. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:32:45 PM EDT
[#8]
Wow that sucks. I to have stopped all purchases but not because of HPA. F that 41F shit and the suppressor prices just keep going up. So good luck.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:40:19 PM EDT
[#9]
I would've never imagined they even had 100 employees. Must take a lot of people to run that marketing machine.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:41:55 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would've never imagined they even had 100 employees. Must take a lot of people to run that marketing machine. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:42:04 PM EDT
[#11]
There was an artificial uptick in sales last year before July... like a complete run on everything NFA. I'm sure sales were through the roof and supply couldn't keep up with demand for a lot of these companies. But they had to know that the day after 41F it would completely stop, at least from almost everyone using a trust.
Gone are the days of filling out the form at the dealer and sending it off with a copy of your trust. Not only are the new processes onerous for multiple trustees, but the sheer complication of what is required is a turn off for a lot of people who got into the game once they found out how simple it was with a trust. Forms? Fingerprints? Photos? CLEO notifications? Huh? Never mind... On the bright side, I think it would be logical to assume that we will see an extremely sharp decrease in wait times once they finally get through all of the 41F lead up. The times will keep getting longer the closer they get to July-submitted forms, and then once they get through those, they will be like... now what? lol. That will be many months from now, of course. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:43:24 PM EDT
[#12]
Also silencerco hired Jason Schauble as their CFO... and lay offs seem to follow him wherever he goes.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:46:18 PM EDT
[#13]
I have stopped buy guns in general, except older cool stuff. Maybe I will buy something new this weekend.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:49:19 PM EDT
[#14]
Not just mfg's, LGS are closing in a fast pace too.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:49:22 PM EDT
[#15]
That's too bad.
I would love to buy more cans, but I'm holding off for a while. not because of the hpa, but to let my pocket heal from the 41f spree I went through. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:51:38 PM EDT
[#16]
IMO I'd consider Silencerco as one of the top silencer companies... it's a shame they have to do this. They grew too fast and didn't anticipate the major decline of sales after 41f. Idiots. Hopefully they'll always stand behind their lifetime warranty.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:54:13 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
IMO I'd consider Silencerco as one of the top silencer companies... it's a shame they have to do this. They grew too fast and didn't anticipate the major decline of sales after 41f. Idiots. Hopefully they'll always stand behind their lifetime warranty. By volume they are definitely number one. The large layoff is more than likely the combination of factors and the lack of a need to produce Pre-41F volumes of 10K+ cans a month. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:54:53 PM EDT
[#18]
I submitted my first post 41F form 4 last week and with a trust I sent in more paperwork than I used to for individual. That sucks! I bought a bunch of stuff in the years leading up to 41F and slipped in a couple last minute purchases as well but I'm done for now. Going to have to really want it to deal with all the new paperwork. it sure sounds like I'm not alone in being "done" for the time being.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:57:31 PM EDT
[#19]
Wonder how much they spent on R&D for the Maxim and exepected sales.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:58:28 PM EDT
[#20]
One of the small gun shows here in NC was really slow last weekend according to vendors.
I hate that for them. I'm hoping the lack of fear will bring a different market and see innovation and new opportunities for all. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 10:59:20 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Also silencerco hired Jason Schauble as their CFO... and lay offs seem to follow him wherever he goes. I had never heard of him, but man that dude's Wikipedia page is rough... |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:00:16 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
There was an artificial uptick in sales last year before July... like a complete run on everything NFA. I'm sure sales were through the roof and supply couldn't keep up with demand for a lot of these companies. But they had to know that the day after 41F it would completely stop, at least from almost everyone using a trust. Gone are the days of filling out the form at the dealer and sending it off with a copy of your trust. Not only are the new processes onerous for multiple trustees, but the sheer complication of what is required is a turn off for a lot of people who got into the game once they found out how simple it was with a trust. Forms? Fingerprints? Photos? CLEO notifications? Huh? Never mind... On the bright side, I think it would be logical to assume that we will see an extremely sharp decrease in wait times once they finally get through all of the 41F lead up. The times will keep getting longer the closer they get to July-submitted forms, and then once they get through those, they will be like... now what? lol. That will be many months from now, of course. Yep. This is what happened to me. I have my family members on my trust, and I'm not going to march my wife, kids, and parents to get fingerprinted so I can get something else. Now it's easier for me to do an individual purchase, but then you don't get the benefits of the trust. So it sucks. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:03:06 PM EDT
[#23]
How many folks here said they bought 5-10+ suppressors right before 41f?
I definitely stopped buying anything after that. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:03:14 PM EDT
[#24]
I'm done at least for now. Picked up a Rugged Obsidian in January that was bought in February. Almost a year wait. Not doing the whole fingerprint, passport photo deal. If the HPA passes so be it. Maybe then I'll consider some other suppressors. I'm at six right now, haven't shot some of them yet. No sense in hoarding suppresses.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:08:36 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sad, I can tell you my purchases have stopped. Not because of HPA, but because I can't stand the wait. I have lots of suppressors and would like a few more. But a year wait?! Fuck that. I have had form 4s go though in 30 days before, and one that took 13 months. I just can't do it. I will just make do with what I have. Im in the same boat as you. I want a 45, another 30cal, and 12g can but just don't want to wait. 
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:10:23 PM EDT
[#26]
When they broke ties with SilencerShop my SiCo sales/transfers went to nearly zero. Their chosen distributors were difficult to do business with. They were by far my most popular brand up to that point. Really hate to hear the news, hope they can turn it around as they are constantly innovating.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:11:08 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not just mfg's, LGS are closing in a fast pace too. That's unfortunate. I hate seeing fellow neighbors lose their jobs. But as a business owner, you need to do what you need to do. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:14:20 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can tell you my purchases have stopped. Not because of HPA, but because I can't stand the wait. Same here. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:16:03 PM EDT
[#29]
With 41F and the anticipation of a Clinton election victory production was running wide open. Now with the legislation and a Trump victory (thank god) there is an enormous supply of firearms based products that were made in preparation of a post Clinton panic. It's great for us as consumers as sales and prices are very good. Unfortunately a lot of shops will close up. 100 layoffs is a serious downsizing. I would love to see a chart showing sales.
I have not made any NFA purchases after 41F and don't plan to for the foreseeable future. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:16:46 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When they broke ties with SilencerShop my SiCo sales/transfers went to nearly zero. Their chosen distributors were difficult to do business with. They were by far my most popular brand up to that point. Really hate to hear the news, hope they can turn it around as they are constantly innovating. That breakup sucked, I was buying Sico cans through SS. My last was a recce 5 and I'm very happy with it. But having almost all of mine from sico has been nice as everything is compatible (3x sakers). Plus pistol and .22 cans are basically the same just bigger scale. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:17:46 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When they broke ties with SilencerShop my SiCo sales/transfers went to nearly zero. Their chosen distributors were difficult to do business with. They were by far my most popular brand up to that point. Really hate to hear the news, hope they can turn it around as they are constantly innovating. Really? Lipseys was always great for us, and Accusport and RSR weren't too bad either. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:18:02 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
By volume they are definitely number one. The large layoff is more than likely the combination of factors and the lack of a need to produce Pre-41F volumes of 10K+ cans a month. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
IMO I'd consider Silencerco as one of the top silencer companies... it's a shame they have to do this. They grew too fast and didn't anticipate the major decline of sales after 41f. Idiots. Hopefully they'll always stand behind their lifetime warranty. By volume they are definitely number one. The large layoff is more than likely the combination of factors and the lack of a need to produce Pre-41F volumes of 10K+ cans a month. Them mentioning HPA in their weekly emails and heavy promotion of how they think it would psd in the 1st 100 days didn't help either. As we've all seen, the new administration has way bigger shit than HPA to deal with right now. They tied the noose. And every company seems to be feeling it. I'm all for HPA. But there are other ways of pushing legislation. I guarantee if all the manufacturers part of ASA could rewind 9 months the strategy would have been different. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:24:20 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Really? Lipseys was always great for us, and Accusport and RSR weren't too bad either. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
When they broke ties with SilencerShop my SiCo sales/transfers went to nearly zero. Their chosen distributors were difficult to do business with. They were by far my most popular brand up to that point. Really hate to hear the news, hope they can turn it around as they are constantly innovating. Really? Lipseys was always great for us, and Accusport and RSR weren't too bad either. Ive been dealing with Allen Arms for SiCo and had good results. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:24:29 PM EDT
[#34]
Someone pass this on to Don Jr and see if he can get his dad to fasttrack the HPA. Multiply this across the industry and we could be looking at more jobs than Carrier.
If the HPA passed today I'd buy another SiCo RFN. But as it stands right now, a year+ wait? No thanks :( |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:27:00 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Them mentioning HPA in their weekly emails and heavy promotion of how they think it would psd in the 1st 100 days didn't help either. As we've all seen, the new administration has way bigger shit than HPA to deal with right now. They tied the noose. And every company seems to be feeling it. I'm all for HPA. But there are other ways of pushing legislation. I guarantee if all the manufacturers part of ASA could rewind 9 months the strategy would have been different. They certainly could have approached it from different way, but there would have been a post 41F slump either way. More so than anything the media is what ran with it. People can complain about them pushing it, but at the end of the day, if it passes everyone will benefit. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:27:33 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ive been dealing with Allen Arms for SiCo and had good results. Was never setup with them, but heard good things. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:34:54 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would've never imagined they even had 100 employees. Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would've never imagined they even had 100 employees. I'm naive to manufacturing as a whole but I figured 20 people. Someone on phones, someone swapping Trifecta mounts for ASRs  , someone hitting "go" on CNC machines, and someone boxing up orders. Maybe one token guy smoking a cigar with a fedora.
Quoted:
Deadair, Rugged and Sig have taken a chunk out if their market share. The only cans I own are Silencerco, but when I think centerfire can I'm thinking of those other guys. Their Saker ASR should be a good seller. I hope them the best. It doesn't help that SiCO 'created' Dead air and Rugged Quoted:
How many folks here said they bought 5-10+ suppressors right before 41f? I definitely stopped buying anything after that. 5-10 F1/f4
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:42:42 PM EDT
[#38]
To be honest, I'm one of those who are waiting for the HPA to pass (or not pass) before I pull the trigger on a couple cans (or 3-4 if HPA passes). The paperwork aspect and the wait have just put it on the back burner for me.
It sucks that they had to lay some guys off. Hopefully the HPA passes soon and they'll be rehired. I'd suspect business to be quite busy for a while if one could just buy over the counter. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:43:30 PM EDT
[#39]
Something like this happening was a subject of conversation 6 months ago...
https://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=20&t=465983 I keep putting cans in my shopping cart, but I'm not pulling the trigger. I've had way to much money tied up in pending form 1's & form 4's this year, and I'm not going through the fingerprint/photo hassle. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:51:56 PM EDT
[#40]
Predicted their slide years ago. Probably the easiest short you could make.
Remington, AAC, Tracking Point, Silencerco. There is a common denominator in the downfalls of all these companies. It is on the tip of my tongue... |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:53:40 PM EDT
[#41]
I put my money into NV goggles and sights.
Didn't know who/whom was going to win the WH. BUTT!!! if it was going to be that bitch and I survived the first night's firefight... Well hell, I was going to pick up all the kewl shit off the ground before weapons cleaning and breakfast.
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:56:55 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
When they broke ties with SilencerShop my SiCo sales/transfers went to nearly zero. Their chosen distributors were difficult to do business with. They were by far my most popular brand up to that point. Really hate to hear the news, hope they can turn it around as they are constantly innovating. It also didn't help that SilencerShop set up a pretty easy system for post 41F submissions. I've done two post 41F submissions and after having my prints and photo taken, the process is just as painless as it was before 41F. Sad that SilencerCo and SilencerShop couldn't come to terms that were equitable to both companies. |
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Posted: 2/1/2017 11:57:50 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm naive to manufacturing as a whole but I figured 20 people. Someone on phones, someone swapping Trifecta mounts for ASRs , someone hitting "go" on CNC machines, and someone boxing up orders. Maybe one token guy smoking a cigar with a fedora.
It doesn't help that SiCO 'created' Dead air and Rugged 5-10 F1/f4
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Posted: 2/2/2017 12:00:17 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sad, I can tell you my purchases have stopped. Not because of HPA, but because I can't stand the wait. I have lots of suppressors and would like a few more. But a year wait?! Fuck that. I have had form 4s go though in 30 days before, and one that took 13 months. I just can't do it. I will just make do with what I have. This. I have even decided to wait on form 1s for my SBRs and suppressors. The HPA has minimal impact on what my major interests are. I want it to pass, but I'm not filing forms right now just because I have other priorities righ now... ...except for the form 1 for my sig mpx. |
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Posted: 2/2/2017 12:01:57 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Predicted their slide years ago. Probably the easiest short you could make. Remington, AAC, Tracking Point, Silencerco. There is a common denominator in the downfalls of all these companies. It is on the tip of my tongue... .... and SWR in Texas ... (if you considered them a separate entity) |
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Posted: 2/2/2017 12:01:58 AM EDT
[#46]
I bought two cans before 41f. My first two since Iowa only legalized them in April 2016. Neither was a SilencerCo. If the HPA passes or looks like its about to pass I was going to buy a Salvo 12. I will still probable buy one after the hump of 41f forms is processed.
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Posted: 2/2/2017 12:03:31 AM EDT
[#47]
Aw fuck sico isn't doing well? I have a couple cans in jail I was going to ask them to freebie swap to ASR from trifecta due to the changes in new lineup. Would feel like a dick even asking now.
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Posted: 2/2/2017 12:03:46 AM EDT
[#48]
Wasn't HPA that stopped my suppressor purchases... it was the stupid 41F requirement for all the people in my trust.
I actually finally received word that my KAC M110 can that I've waited about a damn year for KAC to deliver on is ready... I literally forgot about that can so I guess I'm going to have to decide between individual or doing the new trust crap. |
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Posted: 2/2/2017 12:04:46 AM EDT
[#49]
Wow! Glad that I sent in my crappy trifecta mount and exchanged it for an ASR mount when I did. Just received it today.
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Posted: 2/2/2017 12:04:59 AM EDT
[#50]
Yeah I can see them losing hundred if not thousands of sales due to the difference of opinion they had with sliencershop... I have bought from both with no complaints so far.
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