Since Garin Lee is not acting as a liaison between Surefire and civilian customers, it seems like things have indeed gone down hill a bit in those relationships. I am sad to see this. However, I have yet to see any better suppressor and muzzle-device combo as compared to Surefire's offerings, so the "buy something better" chant is a bit of a "okay...what, then?" to me.

They make excellent products eg; weapon lights, flashlights, suppressors etc.. From this thread I've come away with one, they will find the most convienant way to not honor their warranty. Two, pretty bad customer service, compared to all the other companies that sell and make silencers. Three, will probably never consider buying any silencer made by Surefire, after their response.

I strongly disagree. Surefire has done a lot of work for me, on my Surefire products, as well as other items, from trouble-shooting to repair, and every single time they have told me that they would only ship to the address on my Form 4's, or on the updated paperwork if I were to move. They requested copies of my Form 4's accompany the items in question. They had me fill out temporary transfer to them, as well. They will only ship to the location where the BATFE has the suppressor/NFA item registered to. This is not new. This is not a dodge. This has been their policy for AT LEAST nearly half a decade since I have owned, used, and been a customer of Surefire and their products.  I have been treated very well by Surefire both as a friend and a customer, and I still have to fill out and provide and make match-up the same paperwork OP was asked to rectify.

That said, I am not someone who lets emotion cloud my purchase preferences. I own equipment from many companies, some of which I dislike as a company or owner, and some of which I love to death and have personal friendships with that transcend a forum. However, I will always buy the best possible tool for the job, if it is possible. I have yet to find a tool for the job that works better for my intended purposes than the Surefire suppressor line.

1) The warcomp is very light (mine comes in well under 3oz), and does an amazing job of dealing with  flash and recoil.
2) The Surefire suppressor has had its durability tested far beyond anything I will use it for.
3) 3rd party testing shows that sound reduction at the shooter's position is on-par with all other major brands when comparing similar product.
4) The locking mechanism is simple, and allows the removal of the suppressor by "shooting it off" in extremis, vs. some other systems which require tools to be used to free a stuck suppressor (shoot them enough, and they all weld to the muzzle device via copper and carbon fouling).
5) The suppressors themselves are as compact and light as any other non-Ti product. Surefire did dabble in Ti, producing a sub-10oz suppressor (Ti Mini 556-212), of which less than half a dozen or so were made, all of which are in hands that will not relinquish them. No further plans exist to make them, last I was told, although their Ti .338 suppressor makes me question if things have changed.

Pretty weird how you just contradicted yourself in the same thread. Earlier you said "Quoted:

Since Garin Lee is not acting as a liaison between Surefire and civilian customers, it seems like things have indeed gone down hill a bit in those relationships. I am sad to see this. "

I did not contradict myself. I feel that things have gone down-hill. Garin Lee ("Kudu22") used to actively and personally handle issues like this in-forum, as well as from his office at Surefire, when members here had things like OP has had crop up. Now, I feel that Surefire is not as directly  represented, and has indeed lost a valuable "pulse" on the civilian customer as evidenced by OP's frustration when he contacted them. Garin Lee used to streamline this process, adequately explaining and providing what I call "over-ride" for the customer. I have had RMA's for items issued to me that were delivered directly to Garin, and when asked about them by the person issuing the RMA, simply stating "This is from Garin Lee's desk. This item needs to see him.", that ended the "but who...on what...how..." discussions with the RMA issuer. OP doesn't have that recourse or that support, because Garin is no-longer with Surefire in his former capacity, and for that reason, yes, I feel that Surefire has become less accessible. Garin Lee was an amazing interface for that company and their civilian customers, and I was sad to see him leave, although happy for him to pursue Life, Liberty, and Happiness in whatever way he felt best, as we all should.

That said, I still maintain that Surefire is not dodging OP by their requirements, as I directly outlined previously. No contradiction exists in my statements.

Unless you're moving out of state with them, they don't NEED a form for any of it. They would LIKE you to, but you're not required.

That's the thing that is annoying me about this experience. I am not knocking Surefire but why require something that has no legal requirements? It just makes my life more frustrating, having to jump through extra hoops just to pay to have my can fixed. I have no qualms with paying either, I get that it isn't Surefires fault for my misfortune, nor do I blame them for wanting compensation for working on it, I just want to get it in and done.

Who knows how long it will take for the ATF to update my address either, as they are backlogged for, more than likely, over a year. I just want my suppressor made whole again...

This comes from an individual with 7 Surefire lights and 2 Surefire cans with 2 additional in NFA prison.

Hey Zerlak I will see what I can get done for you. It is true I am not at SF in the same capacity. I had a chance to get out of CA and I did. I work for SF in a limited role in my spare time because I helped build the suppressor division and it means a lot to me. I will get back to you soon.

Thanks greatly appreciat it, I'll continue the process of getting my 5320.20 submitted, in the meantime.

Thanks again.

Hey Zerlak,

Who ever you spoke to in CS is wrong. We will send the suppressor back to where ever you need it. You are the legal owner. I think you got a new CS person but I have you taken care of. E-mail Kevin at [email protected]. He is going to be your CS guy and will respond to you with the paperwork. Also if it is not a warranty issue I told them to cut you a really good deal on the rebuild. Paul Glass in the suppressor division is waiting for the can to come in and will rush it thru.

Holy crap man, thanks so much. I will be sending him an email in a moment.

This seriously made my month.

Glad I could help. SF will get that 212 can back in order soon brother.

RMA # received very promptly from Surefire.

Will be sending my upper and can to them today.

Good! I was about to be sorely disappointed.

Glad Surefire got this lined out

That. Was awesome.

This makes me happy

Especially as someone who has 9 SF cans in jail right now.

Good luck OP!

Tell me more about this! I only have one SF can in jail

Well, I went a touch overboard in my preps for 41f I suppose. It was a snow ball effect really. As is everything in the black gun world

I had saved for 2 cans and slencer shop was getting OOS on everything, so I picked up a couple Mini 2's The week after, I got a really sweet bonus from work, so I figured why not stop by the LGS and have a look see. Well he was almost out of cans too, but had a great SF selection. I picked up 2 SPS 300 another Mini2 and a Ryder 9. Awesome cause I can shoot them at the range, whenever I want. So about a month later I was totally hooked, and went to another local spot for some engraving services, and what do ya know? A safe full of surefire. So I bought a 556rc2 762rc2 and a 556 monster.

Most of them were late feb early march F4s, so should be coming back soon. Cant wait

What a wave of emotion reading this thread... keep us posted as this continues to play out.

Kudu22 arrives and sorts it out.  He helped me, too with an issue that never should have been.   If Dueck or other big wigs at SF car division read this- you need to take a cue from your part time employee.  Government contracts are not 100% of what you do. Surefire- feel free to contact me for details on the problem I had and how Garrin helped sort it out.

This thread...well Kudo really, makes me want to buy a Surefire.


I'm in the market for a 556 can

Upper and silencer are on their way to Surefire, standard overnight service. Expensive but well worth getting this fixed.

Tag.

I also only have one in jail.

 

But I have 3 in my safe

Congratulations on escaping the politics of California!

Glad it worked out OP,

Garin is the man. He saved my bacon and helped me win a legal battle with a LGS owner/criminal that stole $1,800 dollars in suppressors from me and tried closing up shop.  He went above and beyond getting me supporting evidence for the police, and my CC fraud department.


I have cans from SF, Silencerco, TBAC, and AAC, and would not hesitate to buy another SF can.

Kudos to Kudu!

Talk about going above and beyond.

That being said, customer service and quality are the two main reasons I went with a SOCOM, and purchased a Ryder 22A.

This is why I'm so pleased to have chosen SF SOCOM for my one and only can.

I'm amazed by the people who think that being jerked around, then getting lucky enough to draw the attention of Garin to have their problem resolved (still at significant cost, apparently) is incredible customer service and goes above and beyond. You guys need to deal with SilencerCo, Dead Air, Rugged, and Griffin on customer service issues to see what "above and beyond" really sounds like.

But I'm glad it's going to work out for you, OP. I'm sure it's a huge relief after what you were initially told.

If OP wasn't an ARF member he would be getting the shaft.
Y'all let that sink in.

log out and log back in

Good to know people look out for each other...

Not entirely true. I was planning on calling back again today, and bringing up the "it isn't a legal requirement" bit but if I got the same CS rep again, then yes I could have been fed the wrong information again.

I am entirely better of now though, thanks to Garin stepping in and taking care of everything. His efforts are greatly appreciated too and I feel he truly did go above and beyond, considering he isn't even involved in the department anymore.

Potentially yes, or maybe he needed to push the subject and ask for a supervisor to clarify.
Sometimes knowing people or having connections truly helps

Kudu is the best.

Just in case some others in here are hungry. "worst customer service" bla bla bla.. I think Garin is correct and you probably got a new person. Glad to hear you're on the way to being whole again. Keep us updated.

I tend to more agree with these sentiments.

Though still glad the OP is now ultimately being taken care of.

Garin can't be everywhere, but if you know how to get ahold of him, he fixes things.

That said, Garin? Get Surefire to read this thread. It did a COMPLETE 180* turn once someone competent and who cared about the customer entered the thread. You have a thread that went from "Screw Surefire" to "I want to buy a Surefire!" Surefire needs to model their customer service after your behavior over the years. I understand that suppressors are just a tiny part of what they sell, and that any joe blow can replace M600A tail-cap clickies over the phone, but suppressor customers have detailed and sometimes legal situations that need fully understanding to properly take care of. Surefire needs someone that NFA customers can be directed to, during all CS hours (or at least someone who can call them back 2-3 days out of the week), who can sort things out as efficiently and effectively as you have done for them in the past. I'm not kidding when I say that you personally are the reason I own half of the SF suppressors that I do.

oh stop, you are lke a broken reccord, get over yourself

Why, he's right?  Why do some let emotion rule the day instead of fact. If it weren't for this OP would be screwed most likely. Why should customers have to go the extra mile to get companies to do the simple thing of providing good CS?

I mean, you guys really think lucking onto a guy who use to work at the business in question and him getting them to do the right thing is the business going above and beyond?  How?  Please explain how that makes sense under any circumstance.

now, I'm not out to lynch Surefire, everyone makes a mistake once in a while. Everyone gets an ignorant employee. But like I said, havingvtobgobyo a forum and lucking out and finding an ex employee isn't the business going above and beyond.

Especially since there are places that will fix their cans even if it was the bullet makers fault. That's above and beyond.

Why, he's right?  Why do some let emotion rule the day instead of fact. If it weren't for this OP would be screwed most likely. Why should customers have to go the extra mile to get companies to do the simple thing of providing good CS?

I mean, you guys really think lucking onto a guy who use to work at the business in question and him getting them to do the right thing is the business going above and beyond?  How?  Please explain how that makes sense under any circumstance.

now, I'm not out to lynch Surefire, everyone makes a mistake once in a while. Everyone gets an ignorant employee. But like I said, havingvtobgobyo a forum and lucking out and finding an ex employee isn't the business going above and beyond.

Especially since there are places that will fix their cans even if it was the bullet makers fault. That's above and beyond.

The OP was told wrong information by a new customer service person. Things like that can happen. I did ask for ALL CS agents to be made aware that that is not a policy that the form 4 have the current address. The core rebuilds only apply if it is not a manufactures defect and that is rare if SF does charge. There is a lifetime warranty on the suppressors for the material and workmanship. We get suppressors in from the military with well over 100k rounds through them and get rebuilt under warranty. Same goes for customers.

I can also be reached at [email protected] if there is something I can do.

Ironknife thank you for the membership. That is very much appreciated.

Am I reading this right?

If I somehow do manage to wear out my can it will be covered under warranty?

That would be how it reads to me. Guess it depends on Surefire's definition of "wear out"

Sure that I understand.

Good! Im very happy with my Socom and after this thread I am even happier.

The fact you will still offer a service for the 212 even with its age is nice. Makes me feel a little more comfy with my aging Socom.

Tech changes. Products improve. But knowing the manufacturer will still work with you after a certain product has been eclipsed is awesome.

Great job on taking lead to help the OP. Its something I wont forget when shopping for new cans.

Received delivery confirmation, upper and silencer are now in Surefires hands.

I will keep in touch with them there and let you know Zerlak.