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Posted: 11/28/2015 1:21:52 PM EDT
I'm still a newb in the suppressor world, and my first can (Omega!) should be approved any day now. Not that I'm counting, but I'm at 120 days into my form 4.
I'm thinking about buying a dedicated can for my precision bolt gun, and I want to know 1) what attributes make a good can for precision rifles and 2) what suggestions do you have for current offerings? Other details: -- My current precision rifle is in .308, and I wouldn't see me going larger in diameter than .30 cal. I live in Ohio, and I just don't have the chance to use something bigger here. -- I will probably stick with 5/8 x 24 threads. That would be common with my AR10, and I'd rather not complicate things. -- Weight and length are not factors here. This gun be at the range only. What are your thoughts? |
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Posted: 11/28/2015 1:28:00 PM EDT
[#1]
repeatability is what you want in a precision can. TBAC used to (or still does depending on who you ask) owns the precision rifle suppressor market.
Plenty of people on here seen to have had great experiences with other cans - qd and direct thread. I understand the desire for another can, trust me, but a direct thread option on the omega should suffice. Good luck and post pics when you're done - host too! |
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Posted: 11/28/2015 1:45:34 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
repeatability is what you want in a precision can. TBAC used to (or still does depending on who you ask) owns the precision rifle suppressor market. Plenty of people on here seen to have had great experiences with other cans - qd and direct thread. I understand the desire for another can, trust me, but a direct thread option on the omega should suffice. Good luck and post pics when you're done - host too! I'll definitely use the Omega on the bolt gun when I get it. I'm sure that I'll get tired of switching between the direct thread and the ASR mounts on it, so that's the reason for the dedicated can. Is direct thread a "must be" for precision cans? |
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Posted: 11/28/2015 1:55:13 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'll definitely use the Omega on the bolt gun when I get it. I'm sure that I'll get tired of switching between the direct thread and the ASR mounts on it, so that's the reason for the dedicated can. Is direct thread a "must be" for precision cans? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
repeatability is what you want in a precision can. TBAC used to (or still does depending on who you ask) owns the precision rifle suppressor market. Plenty of people on here seen to have had great experiences with other cans - qd and direct thread. I understand the desire for another can, trust me, but a direct thread option on the omega should suffice. Good luck and post pics when you're done - host too! I'll definitely use the Omega on the bolt gun when I get it. I'm sure that I'll get tired of switching between the direct thread and the ASR mounts on it, so that's the reason for the dedicated can. Is direct thread a "must be" for precision cans? Not at all. I think using a direct thread can for precision rifles sucks, because that almost definitely means you're taking the can on and off your enormous bolt action rifle for transport and storage. It's annoying. Also, the can will loosen, impacting precision. A QD can with an awesome mount like the Sandman L or the Recce 7 means it's much easier to take the can on and off frequently, plus the can should stay completely tight on the mount. The direct thread only for bolt actions is a myth now that there's QD cans with really good mounts. |
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Posted: 11/28/2015 2:13:47 PM EDT
[#4]
QD or direct thread both work well and each has advantages and disadvantages. Direct thread is lighter but slower to take on or off , QD adds weight with quick on / off being its strong suit.
I have both / use both and accuracy has been the same on my rifles so its a personal choice. |
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Posted: 11/28/2015 2:28:04 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
I'm still a newb in the suppressor world, and my first can (Omega!) should be approved any day now. Not that I'm counting, but I'm at 120 days into my form 4.
I'm thinking about buying a dedicated can for my precision bolt gun, and I want to know 1) what attributes make a good can for precision rifles and 2) what suggestions do you have for current offerings? Other details: -- My current precision rifle is in .308, and I wouldn't see me going larger in diameter than .30 cal. I live in Ohio, and I just don't have the chance to use something bigger here. -- I will probably stick with 5/8 x 24 threads. That would be common with my AR10, and I'd rather not complicate things. -- Weight and length are not factors here. This gun be at the range only. What are your thoughts? Weight is absolutely a factor. BBL deflection has a great influence on accuracy. I would pass on a thread-on. As mentioned that is a solution for a decade ago problem. There are many quality QD cans. there is also no reason to believe the newer cans from Rugged, Dead Air will not perform well. I have been using a Titan-QD for some time now. If I were looking for something today I would probably look at DA or Rugged. |
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Posted: 11/28/2015 2:31:42 PM EDT
[#6]
I went through the same thing recently. Originally I wanted a dedicated precision can so I was looking at a Harvester. Then I decided I wanted something that's more for dual use with my precision rifle and my SBR. I was really looking hard at the Omega, but my dealer steered me toward the Sandman-S. It's a little heavier than the Omega, but when I held them in each hand it was a very small difference. You could tell the Sandman was heavier, but it wasn't enough that you would notice if you didn't hold both at the same time.
I ended up going with the Sandman because it's quite a bit more robust and should hold up better to SBR use. The Omega is full auto rated down to 10.5" so it probably would have been just fine too, but the full Stellite baffle stack on the Sandman is quite a bit stronger. Plus, according to my dealer and what I've read in a lot of other places, the mount system on the Sandman will lock up absolutely in the same place every time, so POI shift on a precision rifle should be repeatable. If you want to spend some money and get the best dedicated precision can, though, everyone recommends Thunderbeast. I've shot a rifle with an Ultra 7 and it was very impressive. Surprisingly quiet for such a short suppressor, and so light that you didn't even notice it on the end of the rifle. |
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Posted: 11/28/2015 2:45:28 PM EDT
[#7]
Tbac is the Cadillac for that game. I have a harvester I run on one gun. I'll be running a saker on my 223AI I run a saker 308 on my 308 AR. There are all sorts of things to consider. My harvester has no poi shift on my heavy barrel which is very handy. Just buy what you want and get good data.
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Posted: 11/28/2015 3:13:39 PM EDT
[#8]
I use a specwar 7.62 on a 24" Bartlein m24 barreled 6.5 Creedmoor and it's awesome. Very repeatable and shows no increase in groupings with the can on vs off.
If I wasn't using it just on a bipod on a bench or prone I would likely go with the TBAC ultra series for a bolt gun due to light weight. But being mine is range use only no competitions I am fine with length and weight of specwar. |
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Posted: 11/29/2015 3:46:43 PM EDT
[#9]
I really have not considered Dead Air suppressors before this thread. Now, I'm looking at the Dead Air Sandman TI. It looks like a great can, and it's intended for precision rifle use. Can anyone weigh in on the Sandman Ti?
So, I have a separate question. How do you secure a direct thread can? Do you just make it as tight as you can by hand? Do you put anything on the threads to keep it in place? I wouldn't want to use Rocksett because you have to remove the can in order to get the rifle back in the case. Any thoughts? Thanks gang N |
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Posted: 11/29/2015 3:48:32 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I really have not considered Dead Air suppressors before this thread. Now, I'm looking at the Dead Air Sandman TI. It looks like a great can, and it's intended for precision rifle use. Can anyone weigh in on the Sandman Ti? So, I have a separate question. How do you secure a direct thread can? Do you just make it as tight as you can by hand? Do you put anything on the threads to keep it in place? I wouldn't want to use Rocksett because you have to remove the can in order to get the rifle back in the case. Any thoughts? Thanks gang N I don't have any dead air cans, but wouldn't hesitate to purchase due to the history of who is behind the company. I've never had an issue with a thread on can coming off a bolt gun. Hand tight has always been fine. There are now more quality options than there ever has been before. |
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Posted: 11/29/2015 3:50:12 PM EDT
[#11]
A lot say to snap your wrist when you tighten a direct thread on. I was told the same by Ray at TBAC at a demo of their stuff. Some have also been known to use Teflon tape.
No experience with DeadAir. |
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Posted: 11/29/2015 4:50:18 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I really have not considered Dead Air suppressors before this thread. Now, I'm looking at the Dead Air Sandman TI. It looks like a great can, and it's intended for precision rifle use. Can anyone weigh in on the Sandman Ti? So, I have a separate question. How do you secure a direct thread can? Do you just make it as tight as you can by hand? Do you put anything on the threads to keep it in place? I wouldn't want to use Rocksett because you have to remove the can in order to get the rifle back in the case. Any thoughts? Thanks gang N That's precisely the problem: there isn't a great way to keep them secure. The threads on the suppressor and the threads on the barrel matter immensely. Some people have good luck, some have to constantly re-tighten their suppressor. With the Sandman L, the Ti has no appeal for me. |
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Posted: 11/29/2015 4:57:39 PM EDT
[#13]
Why not use a QD ASR mount on the precision rifle. I have the omega and have used both direct thread and ASR on my Desert Tech SRS A1 and haven't noticed any difference in accuracy. And it's nice having the muzzle break when I can't use the Omega.
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Posted: 11/29/2015 5:12:19 PM EDT
[#14]
TwangNBang has a good video on the Sandman L showing how it increased his precision rifles accuracy. Check it out!
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Posted: 11/30/2015 12:45:07 AM EDT
[#15]
I believe Dead Air plans on offering direct thread adapters for their QD cans in the future so that would be an option. I was told the Ti was their best option for a precision rifle though.
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Posted: 11/30/2015 1:01:30 AM EDT
[#16]
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6.
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Posted: 11/30/2015 8:45:32 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6. Same here out to 600 yards. That being said, the market is full of better options now so I can't say I would purchase an SDN-6 with precision intent. Lots of other good options out there. Solid and repeatable mount is the key. |
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Posted: 11/30/2015 9:13:59 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Same here out to 600 yards. That being said, the market is full of better options now so I can't say I would purchase an SDN-6 with precision intent. Lots of other good options out there. Solid and repeatable mount is the key. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6. Same here out to 600 yards. That being said, the market is full of better options now so I can't say I would purchase an SDN-6 with precision intent. Lots of other good options out there. Solid and repeatable mount is the key. Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). |
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Posted: 11/30/2015 11:45:40 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6. Same here out to 600 yards. That being said, the market is full of better options now so I can't say I would purchase an SDN-6 with precision intent. Lots of other good options out there. Solid and repeatable mount is the key. Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). Yes its possible but unlikely. You are altering the harmonics of the barrel by putting a can on it. OP, I've been shooting a Silencerco Harvestor for over a year. Its obviously a direct thread on and has never come loose on a rough day of shooting for matches. In fact I'm waiting for my Omega to be approved that and that will be used for my match can at that point. A lot of the top PRS shooters shoot with cans, and quite a few of those are Omega's or Harvestors at this point. |
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Posted: 11/30/2015 4:04:33 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6. Same here out to 600 yards. That being said, the market is full of better options now so I can't say I would purchase an SDN-6 with precision intent. Lots of other good options out there. Solid and repeatable mount is the key. Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). I have seen it. It probably was more the mount then the can itself. M4-2000 on a 51T mount. My varmint AR will do 3/4 MOA groups normally. With the M4-2000 and the 51T mount, it opened up to about 1 1/4" groups. I retired the M4-2000 to my combat AR, and got a TBAC 223P-2 for the varmint AR. Groups stayed at 3/4 MOA with the TBAC. |
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Posted: 11/30/2015 4:08:01 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6. Nope. Mine work fine too and I have never had a problem with 51T mount. |
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Posted: 11/30/2015 4:56:42 PM EDT
[#22]
I have the yhm 7.62 brake mount open my groups up a little bit.
I sold that can. |
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Posted: 11/30/2015 6:28:12 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6. Same here out to 600 yards. That being said, the market is full of better options now so I can't say I would purchase an SDN-6 with precision intent. Lots of other good options out there. Solid and repeatable mount is the key. Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). Some people reported groups opening up possibly due to the rotational play present in many 51t mount/can combos. While I had some play on a couple mounts early on (some barely still present), carbon from shooting mostly took care of that. I haven't noticed any accuracy degradation with or without the rotational play. There are other mounting systems that don't have as much potential for this issue now, so for a precision application one of those would probably be a better choice. |
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Posted: 11/30/2015 8:31:53 PM EDT
[#24]
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Posted: 12/1/2015 12:38:04 AM EDT
[#25]
Shit guess I'll joint in with the pics now
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Posted: 12/1/2015 1:47:29 PM EDT
[#26]
I don't have any pics but I shoot an AAC 762DN-6. It's a quick detach on the T51 mount. I have the 'wobble' that the mount is known for and it doesn't hurt my accuracy.
I still shoot sub MOA with it at 200 yards and regularly connect at 1k yards with steel targets. |
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Posted: 12/1/2015 1:56:32 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I use my SDN-6 on my custom built 308. It's been very repeatable and extremely accurate out to 750yds. Gues im one of the lucky ones with the SDN-6. Same here out to 600 yards. That being said, the market is full of better options now so I can't say I would purchase an SDN-6 with precision intent. Lots of other good options out there. Solid and repeatable mount is the key. Maybe I am missing something, but I have never seen groups get worse because of a can. Shift, certainly, but so long as the threading is square and you aren't getting baffle strikes, does the can impact actual accuracy at all? I have never seen evidence to suggest it did (unless something was wrong). +1 |
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Posted: 12/1/2015 6:51:46 PM EDT
[#28]
Here were mine with my 51T 762SD.
This was from the MOA all day thread. I had just reinstalled the stock, a new trigger, and was at a nonstandard distance and making adjustments every group so forgive the wandering zero, but if it affected my accuracy I cannot tell. Also I think there is six in one group and four in another, but I was chasing sunlight to get that shot for those pictures... enough excuses, though!
Please note I'm not saying cans CANNOT have an effect on accuracy- others have stated they had some that did. But it sounds like so long as everything is proper and correct, there shouldn't be any issues. I personally don't shoot well enough to see a difference with/without the can. There could be one, but its probably very small if there is one. This mount is pretty tight, at least compared to how some people describe it. It can just slightly move over, maybe 30% of the way to another click if I had to guess. The ones on my AR are pretty close to rock solid, though. |
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Posted: 12/1/2015 6:57:41 PM EDT
[#29]
As far as repeatability, the Larue can looks pretty good. Some should be hitting dealers any minute so we hopefully will get some sound reports from them.
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Posted: 12/2/2015 8:37:12 AM EDT
[#30]
Was also looking at cans for precision work, so maybe this was covered, but has anyone here had experience with Ron Allen's AE cans?
In particular, the AEM3, AEM4, or AEM5? This would be for my AR, 18" SPR. Thanks. |
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Posted: 12/2/2015 11:26:19 AM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Was also looking at cans for precision work, so maybe this was covered, but has anyone here had experience with Ron Allen's AE cans? In particular, the AEM3, AEM4, or AEM5? This would be for my AR, 18" SPR. Thanks. The AEM5 is the correct suppressor for your SPR if you are going for an mk12 copy. Ron Allen made the OpsInc suppressors used on the original mk12. |
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Posted: 12/2/2015 11:58:21 AM EDT
[#32]
GRIFFIN SPORTSMAN TAPER MOUNT SILENCER, 12 ounces, 300WM Rated, 8.6"x1.7" 131db on a 6.5cm bolt gun at the ear. My SAC custom gun with fluted AMU bartlein has less than 1/4" POI shift.
What makes it better? 795 including the brake. This is the best precision rifle can i've shot and is my favorite on precision guns. Picture of an FBI sniper qual I did. Elevated heart rate from running, then shooting in the prone, repeat every group. Relaxed without elevated heart rate this can/gun will do 1/4" CTC groups with factory 140gr Hornaday loads. 
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Posted: 12/2/2015 6:12:00 PM EDT
[#33]
Silencerco Harvester and Griffin Armament Sportsman DT are sub 12oz suppressors that are great for bolt guns or semi autos with lower rates of fire.
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Posted: 12/2/2015 6:47:34 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The AEM5 is the correct suppressor for your SPR if you are going for an mk12 copy. Ron Allen made the OpsInc suppressors used on the original mk12. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Was also looking at cans for precision work, so maybe this was covered, but has anyone here had experience with Ron Allen's AE cans? In particular, the AEM3, AEM4, or AEM5? This would be for my AR, 18" SPR. Thanks. The AEM5 is the correct suppressor for your SPR if you are going for an mk12 copy. Ron Allen made the OpsInc suppressors used on the original mk12. Okay, thanks. Actually I was looking hard at the AEM3 and AEM4 cans for having lighter weight and a shorter OAL, but still having decent suppression capability. |
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Posted: 12/2/2015 8:57:55 PM EDT
[#35]
I had a brand new Troy 308 rifle on the range today that I threaded here to 5/8x24 for a minimalist brake in titanium. It came with 3/4x24 threads with no shoulder like a KAC rifle, only without a companion suppressor mount. It also had a rifle extension mounted in a M4 ramped upper, so we had to add the ramps the old fashioned way. We swapped buffers to Griffin SOB, springs and extensions to AR10 car, and added a third gas port hole to the BCG's.
That rifle had the ADM 2 stage trigger installed. The Scope was a new Mark 6 3-18 with the CMR-W reticle (basically a 1/2MOA dot to aim with) and I was running a new can with roots in the Recce 7 series on that rifle. One round to adjust from 25 to be on paper at 100, and the first 3 round group with 175 Federal GMM was .465MOA. The first two rounds went into the same hole and then I got nervous about maintaining and broke a stock weld and took a couple breath cycles and basically probably screwed myself out of what could have been a 1/4MOA 308 gas gun group. Shot 2 more rounds getting zeroed and put the 300m pin on a 310 yard steel plate and hit it first round (obviously not a big deal but that's the extent of the CMR-W test for the day). Impressive given the rifle is ~$1200MSRP. While we were there we were also shooting a new 1873 Winchester 14.5" SBR with Optimus three lug config mounted and it was grouping 1/3" at 25 yards with the Marbles tang sight and Lyman globe front. That was cool because the lever gun wasn't expected to be accurate. That's maybe 1.5MOA ? Not bad for a 38 special. |
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Posted: 12/2/2015 10:14:01 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not at all. I think using a direct thread can for precision rifles sucks, because that almost definitely means you're taking the can on and off your enormous bolt action rifle for transport and storage. It's annoying. Also, the can will loosen, impacting precision. A QD can with an awesome mount like the Sandman L or the Recce 7 means it's much easier to take the can on and off frequently, plus the can should stay completely tight on the mount. The direct thread only for bolt actions is a myth now that there's QD cans with really good mounts. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
repeatability is what you want in a precision can. TBAC used to (or still does depending on who you ask) owns the precision rifle suppressor market. Plenty of people on here seen to have had great experiences with other cans - qd and direct thread. I understand the desire for another can, trust me, but a direct thread option on the omega should suffice. Good luck and post pics when you're done - host too! I'll definitely use the Omega on the bolt gun when I get it. I'm sure that I'll get tired of switching between the direct thread and the ASR mounts on it, so that's the reason for the dedicated can. Is direct thread a "must be" for precision cans? Not at all. I think using a direct thread can for precision rifles sucks, because that almost definitely means you're taking the can on and off your enormous bolt action rifle for transport and storage. It's annoying. Also, the can will loosen, impacting precision. A QD can with an awesome mount like the Sandman L or the Recce 7 means it's much easier to take the can on and off frequently, plus the can should stay completely tight on the mount. The direct thread only for bolt actions is a myth now that there's QD cans with really good mounts. All this bears repeating. I never bought into the direct thread being the best for precision. Pick a can with a good mount-to-can lock up and repeatability will be there. That way you will still and a muzzle device on the end of the barrel when you decide to shoot unsuppressed. That said, my choice was the omega and brake mount for my precision guns. Zero shift |
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