User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:01:20 AM EDT
 I want to run a can on my FAL Para with 11" bbl (DSA OSW before they called it that). Its select fire so I shoot it in full auto most of the time. There are cans that will handle the full auto .308, but I'm worried about the short barrel. Being a FAL I can dial the gas down but I'll need enough to cycle. And is the bullet coming out too unstable for the bores of the common cans? I'm already going to deal with the weird 9/16x24 LH threading, but is that all I need to worry about? I've got coming a TB 30P1, 762-SDN6, Quicksand, and a Saker 7.62. The SDN6 and Saker are rated for full auto. Any problems running those on the short barrel? I've never even tried to suppress my longer barreled (semi-auto) FAL's. Who is doing that and what are you using (including mount)? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:07:29 AM EDT
[#1]
RIP Can
I would go with a Saker 762. Strongest .308 can on the Market, I believe. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:08:03 AM EDT
[#2]
Delete.. Damn forum software.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:08:03 AM EDT
[#3]
Delete
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:10:47 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: RIP Can I would go with a Saker 762. Strongest .308 can on the Market, I believe. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:17:26 AM EDT
[#5]
Idk the answer to your question (sorry) but god damn that thing is sweeeeeeeet
 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 3:44:02 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Idk the answer to your question (sorry) but god damn that thing is sweeeeeeeet Think of how sexy it would look with a suppressor on the end! Granted, I run the gun spartan sleek rather than bury it in rails, scope mounts, optics, lights, lasers so it looks a little plain but its nice and light. I do want to swap out the grip for a SAW grip though, original pinches a bit. And its LOUD. Its what I shoot to make people move a bench or two away from me. I need to suppress it if I want to be civil at the range with it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 7:41:26 AM EDT
[#7]
I'd just contact SiCo to see if the Saker is rated for that short of a barrel.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 7:59:52 AM EDT
[#8]
It says on the AAC website that centerfire rifle silencers are warrantied for barrels as short as 10", or 7.5" in the case of the SDN-6 and 300 AAC blackout. I'm not sure where an 11" full auto FAL falls into that statement
.
Either way, may as well use an SDN-6 and order a second so it gets approved about the time the first one wears out. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 8:59:37 AM EDT
[#9]
Maybe something rated for .338? would be a chunk, but it gives you a higher pressure rating and a little more freebore that might help if you had stability issues.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 10:05:25 AM EDT
[#10]
is the barrel 1:11 or faster? one full rotation in the bbl is usually the metric for sufficient suppression stability
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 10:38:56 AM EDT
[#11]
What kind of effective range do you get with the barrel that short?
TXL |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 10:53:07 AM EDT
[#12]
Barrel threading might be an issue as well, that is most likely to be either 9/16-24LH or 1/2-28RH. Neither are a standard thread for 308, without involving an adapter of some kind?
Our GMT-300WM Silencer is the strongest 30cal can we've ever tested, but is only rated to 12" in 308/7.62. Hope this helps? Joey |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 11:32:24 AM EDT
[#13]
With an 11" barrel it doesn't matter if the can is rated for it or not. You're gonna kill the blast baffle in <5k rounds. Probably sooner in F/A.
You'll eventually get tired of paying $200 tax stamps on your replacement cans. It's kind of a self correcting problem. Ballistics suffer too. If you want something that short suppressed go with a blackout. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 2:35:38 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Think of how sexy it would look with a suppressor on the end! Granted, I run the gun spartan sleek rather than bury it in rails, scope mounts, optics, lights, lasers so it looks a little plain but its nice and light. I do want to swap out the grip for a SAW grip though, original pinches a bit. And its LOUD. Its what I shoot to make people move a bench or two away from me. I need to suppress it if I want to be civil at the range with it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Idk the answer to your question (sorry) but god damn that thing is sweeeeeeeet Think of how sexy it would look with a suppressor on the end! Granted, I run the gun spartan sleek rather than bury it in rails, scope mounts, optics, lights, lasers so it looks a little plain but its nice and light. I do want to swap out the grip for a SAW grip though, original pinches a bit. And its LOUD. Its what I shoot to make people move a bench or two away from me. I need to suppress it if I want to be civil at the range with it. Thats how it should be! |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/29/2014 11:23:25 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
With an 11" barrel it doesn't matter if the can is rated for it or not. You're gonna kill the blast baffle in <5k rounds. Probably sooner in F/A. You'll eventually get tired of paying $200 tax stamps on your replacement cans. It's kind of a self correcting problem. Ballistics suffer too. If you want something that short suppressed go with a blackout. *i don't know dick about FALs* Any way to get a new barrel and thread it to a common pattern and get a brake to absorb the brunt of the blast? Also, the OP and I are definitely in different tax brackets 
ETA: Sexy as hell btw Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/31/2014 4:13:22 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: is the barrel 1:11 or faster? one full rotation in the bbl is usually the metric for sufficient suppression stability Good question, I have no idea. I need to find out. Sorry, can't figure out how to post multiple quotes, lookes okay when I write it but it doesn't post correctly. Quoted: What kind of effective range do you get with the barrel that short? _____________________________________________________________ Not long but I never really cared. I have no problem shooting 300 yards with it (the length of my local shooting range) but that and longer I would be using a more appropriate rifle. This rifle is short, violent, and loud. I just use it for close up fun. It says on the AAC website that centerfire rifle silencers are warrantied for barrels as short as 10", or 7.5" in the case of the SDN-6 and 300 AAC blackout. I'm not sure where an 11" full auto FAL falls into that statement . Either way, may as well use an SDN-6 and order a second so it gets approved about the time the first one wears out. _____________________________________________________________I think it may come down to twist rate as MaxTheRabbit mentioned, and possibly going to a .338 can also mentioned. The SDN-6 has the Inconel but I am counting on the Saker's Stellite core to make the can last even longer under such abuse. Perhaps I can erode my blast baffle and just have it replaced (and probably the QD brake mount) Quoted: _____________________________________________________________Barrel threading might be an issue as well, that is most likely to be either 9/16-24LH or 1/2-28RH. Neither are a standard thread for 308, without involving an adapter of some kind? Correct. It appears DSA's OSW upper is now threaded 1/2x28 but I have an early version with the dreaded FAL 9/16-24LH. I know some manufacturers make the mounts, but I might have to go with an adaptor and I'm really not liking those. Quoted: ______________________________________________________________With an 11" barrel it doesn't matter if the can is rated for it or not. You're gonna kill the blast baffle in <5k rounds. Probably sooner in F/A. You'll eventually get tired of paying $200 tax stamps on your replacement cans. It's kind of a self correcting problem. Ballistics suffer too. If you want something that short suppressed go with a blackout. 5000 rounds in full auto will probably be the end of my barrel due to throat erosion anyways. I wouldn't always shoot it suppressed, or full auto in suppressed - sometimes I like to make a lot of noise. Eventually I would blow up a can if I continued to hammer down, and the rifle gets hot so it's not continuous mag dumps. Don't care about ballistics because that's not what I am trying to wring out of the beast, that's what my other rifles are for. I mostly shoot things like steel, stuffed animals, bowling balls, tin cans, etc - whatever I can find to destroy. Don't get me started on Tax stamps. I have 17 cans on order (replacing all my really old cans) and I'm not going to like the $3400 bill on the stamps. Maybe I'll order a second can for when the first dies and make it $3600. Quoted:*i don't know dick about FALs* ______________________________________________________________________Any way to get a new barrel and thread it to a common pattern and get a brake to absorb the brunt of the blast? Also, the OP and I are definitely in different tax brackets ETA: Sexy as hell btw Well the current OSW front ends are 1/2x28, and I could get the 13" barrel instead of the 11". But I would hate to have to change half the gun just to put on a can. This may be one rifle I just can't/shouldn't suppress. No, I'm not rich, I was a C3 back when prices were far more reasonable. This was a big plunge but my cans are all like pre-2000 vintage except for one rimfire can. I started out in 1994 and back then, my M16 was $2200, M11/9 was only $400. The FAL was $3600 and at the time I couldn't believe I was going to pay that much for a machine gun. In 1994, M2HB's were only $3500. In Shotgun news, someone was selling a 105mm Howitzer (with 28 reloadable shells), and Mike Dillon was selling of his old dual electric mount with a mini gun on one side, and a 20mm chain gun on the other. I'll give you one more teaser pic concerning suppressors  The FAL and the factory MP5SD above are dealer samples. Ask me how I saved $200 on my FAL by buying a dealer sample instead of the three other transferables DSA had, and how much I have beat my head against the wall over it ever since.  The can you see on my M16 is my M4-96D, which is completely seized to that barrel due to abuse. I'm going to send it to Gemtech and see if they can 1) separate the can from my upper and 2) upgrade the can to a G5. I don't use my original HK SD suppressor either, it's not serviceable and wears out somewhere after 10,000 rounds so now I use a KAC Navy can as recommended. Ugly heavy steel can but works great.At any rate, I'll call up Silencer Co and AAC and ask about shortest barrel length allowed, and before I do that I need to find out what my twist rate is. I imagine it's the same as a standard FAL but with the weird upper, who knows. And I fully realize the can would take phenomenal abuse and not last anywhere as long. Let's see how that Stellite stands up. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/31/2014 9:34:48 AM EDT
[#17]
more please
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/11/2014 4:46:19 AM EDT
[#18]
Sorry, didn't mean to revive this thread but I ran across another old picture and couldn't resist.
 Ditched the girl friend, kept the belt fed. She ended up costing me three times as much as the gun did. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/11/2014 12:32:58 PM EDT
[#19]
http://www.gem-tech.com/store/pc/GMT-300WM-40p980.htm
almost |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/11/2014 1:15:32 PM EDT
[#20]
The problem is the immense pressure in an 11" barrel with .308.
Honestly, based on the way the Saker and the SDN-6 are made (circumferential fusion welding) I think there's a great chance of ballooning both of those cans out if you start mag dumping on your SBR .308 on full auto. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/11/2014 9:44:42 PM EDT
[#21]
Most of the top tier cans will handle it no problem in S/A .
Full auto is where the pressure gets to them. Pressure is not fully vented and you pump another shot into it and hello fatty can. I've bulged a couple them on a 10.5" .308 in F/A. Learned my lesson. BTW, SBR .308's in F/A is a hell of a lot more fun with no can anyways. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/11/2014 10:56:28 PM EDT
[#22]
TBAC is a no go. Zak told me 16" minimum for a 30BA with a .308.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/11/2014 11:56:59 PM EDT
[#23]
I know this is heresy but I've come to the realization that some things just shouldn't or can't be suppressed. This and my Flintlock to start.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2014 10:56:24 AM EDT
[#24]
So you aren't going to suppress the FAL? If you do decide you want to suppress it, I'd make darn sure those DSA threads are concentric. Also, it might be a good idea if you've run it hard to have the bore checked. After he had a slight baffle strike, my brother sent his DSA and his can to the manufacturer, YHM. They said the threading he had done by a third party was OK but that the bore was worn so badly that it was no longer round but oval in cross section. We ended up rebarreling the gun with a medium contour tube shortened and threaded by YHM.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2014 12:25:20 PM EDT
[#25]
On a scale of 1 to kicking Hitler out of art school how bad of an idea would it be to roll your own suppressor? You could make a stubby and view it as semi-disposable. If 5k on FA would call for a barrel replacement you could file a form 1 at 3k and hopefully have a stamp in time to rebuild/replace the suppressor.
Also you talked a bit about post sample mgs, so wouldn't that mean you have a SOT? And can't SOTs make replacement parts for suppressors whereas regular folks can't? Just thinking out loud. Might be cheaper in the long run building your own vs buying a commercial can. I'm thinking of doing something similar for my 7.5 ar. I just want to take enough bark away to shoot it without having to double up on ear goggles. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2014 12:52:39 PM EDT
[#26]
What about the MG-SD? One of the flash hiders offered for it fits the MK46, which has the same thread pitch as the FAL.
http://www.advanced-armament.com/MG-SD_p_445.html |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2014 2:54:37 PM EDT
[#27]
I love my SF SOCOM on my SCAR17CQC. Not quite as short, but still 13". Never had an issue and looking down the tube I see no noticeable erosion on it. It has about 500 rds of full auto through it. You can definitely see its gotten hot though. They list an FAL mount on their site.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/12/2014 9:36:14 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Also you talked a bit about post sample mgs, so wouldn't that mean you have a SOT? No, but I used to be (C3) and retained the samples as a sole proprietor when I got out of the business. Quoted: What about the MG-SD? One of the flash hiders offered for it fits the MK46, which has the same thread pitch as the FAL. http://www.advanced-armament.com/MG-SD_p_445.html ETA: I just fired off a letter to AAC and asked about minimum bbl length. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2014 2:45:28 AM EDT
[#29]
If you do go AAC, they have 9/16x24 LH flash hiders in stock: http://www.advanced-armament.com/BLACKOUT-51T-Flash-Hider_p_447.html
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2014 11:11:16 PM EDT
[#30]
Correct me if I am wrong but I don't think you can legally possess post sample mgs unless you have a current SOT.
Otherwise EVERYONE would simply rent an office space, pay the fee for a year to be an 07, make 10 M16s and then not renew the license. I am pretty sure an individual cannot own a post sample gun. ??? In terms of the original question (which I'm not sure why you are posting if you already ordered 17 cans), Just get an SDN6 and burn it up. then in 5 years get a newer 308 can. I've been running the SDN6 on 300blk, 556, and shorty .308 rifles no problem (i limit F/A to bursts though, I personally wouldn't do long dumps with a shorty suppressed 308). The SDN6 works well but they definitely take a beating. honestly you'll spend more money in ammo and beer over the next couple years anyway, its not that expensive (realistically) to just buy a new can every now and then. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/13/2014 11:38:38 PM EDT
[#31]
You can keep pre May dealer samples when you give up your SOT
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2014 12:36:25 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
On a scale of 1 to kicking Hitler out of art school how bad of an idea would it be to roll your own suppressor? You could make a stubby and view it as semi-disposable. If 5k on FA would call for a barrel replacement you could file a form 1 at 3k and hopefully have a stamp in time to rebuild/replace the suppressor. Also you talked a bit about post sample mgs, so wouldn't that mean you have a SOT? And can't SOTs make replacement parts for suppressors whereas regular folks can't? Just thinking out loud. Might be cheaper in the long run building your own vs buying a commercial can. I'm thinking of doing something similar for my 7.5 ar. I just want to take enough bark away to shoot it without having to double up on ear goggles. I like the "F1 your own" idea. .338 bore, 7" long, 1.75" diameter Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2014 2:21:12 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You can keep pre May dealer samples when you give up your SOT And ONLY if you are/were a SOLE PROPRIETOR. There was only one owner/employee - ME. I also got to retain anything on a Form 3 without paying the tax. If you VIOLATE the rule by using the license for "collection purposes", you get to go to prison for tax evasion. You have to show you are in the business and sell. I was a C3 for 7 years (FFL for 10) and got to keep my remaining inventory as I had no post 86 weapons - those I would have had to give up. What I have are PRE-May 1986 dealer samples. So if you become a C7 and build new machine guns, you DON'T get to keep them if you leave the biz. Post 86 guns and Pre-May 1986 dealer samples are not the same thing. Even dealer samples are limited - some mfg's would only transfer one of each model because they are used as SALES SAMPLES, not to be sold and transferred to non-SOT's. Also, in order for a C3 to get a POST 86 gun, you need it to be requested for a demo on the letterhead from an LE/GOV/MIL. You can't just order them like other NFA. However most dealers I knew had police buddies or friendly PD's that would gladly request those guns for a demonstration since they knew they were going to get to shoot them for free during the demo. When I first started as a C3 I did transfer my first MAC 10 and suppressor to myself on a F4, even though I was a dealer, because I wanted it for myself so to avoid looking like I was just trying to get out of paying the tax, I paid. I retained what inventory I had remaining that I had in stock when I let my FFL and SOT lapse when I closed shop. That all really sucked. Basically no one was signing off on F4's in Alaska at the time, even though told to. I could only sell to dealers. Trusts were not in vogue at the time. I gave up and the very next year they started signing off on F4's.  But because of rule changes with BATFE and shipping policies of FedEx and UPS, it just wasn't worth it to me to get back in the business.Sorry Active, but you are right in that if it were that easy and you could retain post 86 guns, ex dealers would be running around with them and tons of people would suddenly become C7's. You didn't think it was that easy, did you? If only that were the case... |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2014 2:30:30 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I like the "F1 your own" idea. .338 bore, 7" long, 1.75" diameter Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile This might be the most practical. A cheap low tech big ass can seriously over bored. Make a few of them so when I have blasted one to degradation and hell, time to throw on the next can. But I am not a suppressor builder, had a partner who was, but I don't have all his stock and equipment to build a serious can that will put up with the abuse the MG-SD and Stellite cored cans will, let alone Inconel. Won't be the most quiet in any case but I am primarily looking to just tame the beast. There are, however, plenty of reputable MFG's that can build me whatever I want. SRT was good about that, tell them what you want and they will build it for you. Maybe I should have them build me my .50 muzzle loader can. I actually ran across someone at my local range today that said he in fact HAS a can that was built for a muzzle loader. Color me interested. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/14/2014 9:54:27 AM EDT
[#35]
Ahhhh ok sorry, I thought you were talking about post samples. my bad. Yeah i guess the pre-may stuff would be fine, thats pretty awesome! good work! I honestly think a SDN6 or Sureifre 308 can would be fine on that shorty FAL. I am not home right now but I can take some pictures of the inside of my cans from pitting and wear, honestly its not the end of the world, i feel like by the time you actually use a can until it is not usable, you will want to buy a newer nicer model anyway. Maybe look at YHM too, i have all sorts of cans but the yhm phantom that i have is a tank. i have actually been trying to ruin it just for fun and it just keeps trucking. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2014 12:21:48 AM EDT
[#36]
Well, AAC was a bust. The MG-SD is only rated down to a 12" bbl, and it's only threaded "7812"-24. I'm not entirely sure what 7812 is but the barrel would have to be rethreaded.
Anyone else go down to 11"?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2014 9:24:01 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, AAC was a bust. The MG-SD is only rated down to a 12" bbl, and it's only threaded "7812"-24. I'm not entirely sure what 7812 is but the barrel would have to be rethreaded. Anyone else go down to 11"? I bet it would work fine. The 762-SDN-6 is rated down to 12", so the larger diameter of the MG-SD shouldn't be a problem. The .7812-24 is the thread for the M240B, but they also have a flash hider threaded 9/16-24LH available for that can (PN 101897). |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/16/2014 11:32:27 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I bet it would work fine. The 762-SDN-6 is rated down to 12", so the larger diameter of the MG-SD shouldn't be a problem. The .7812-24 is the thread for the M240B, but they also have a flash hider threaded 9/16-24LH available for that can (PN 101897). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Well, AAC was a bust. The MG-SD is only rated down to a 12" bbl, and it's only threaded "7812"-24. I'm not entirely sure what 7812 is but the barrel would have to be rethreaded. Anyone else go down to 11"? I bet it would work fine. The 762-SDN-6 is rated down to 12", so the larger diameter of the MG-SD shouldn't be a problem. The .7812-24 is the thread for the M240B, but they also have a flash hider threaded 9/16-24LH available for that can (PN 101897). The 9/16-24 LH FH is designed for 5.56 use. It would need to be bored out to the proper .30 cal hole. |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/17/2014 3:25:14 AM EDT
[#39]
Mike, <o:p></o:p> After additional conversations with our engineer staff, the MG-SD would be suitable for your application. Additionally MG-SD mounts are available in 9/16-24LH but the aperture is cut for 5.56. Your mounting options are as follows: -Have your barrel cut with the .7812-24 (common thread pitch on 240B) -purchase the 9/16-24LH mount and have a machine shop open up the aperture to 7.62. Sorry, but we do not offer custom work at our facility. Best of luck with your project, if you need any additional information let me know. <o:p></o:p> Sincerely, <o:p></o:p> Nick Hughes | Customer Service <o:p></o:p> |
|
|
|
Posted: 9/22/2014 12:45:06 AM EDT
[#40]
while we are talking .30 cal, what about the SDN-6 on a 7.5" mini Draco barrel in 7.62x39?
I wasn't planning to use a can on it, but the factory hider flew off and sheared the threads. Was going to have it rethreaded in 1/2x28 and use the .30 cal hider offered by AAC. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
