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Posted: 12/22/2001 11:33:48 AM EDT
My wife just took a new "fun" job as a waitress with some of her girlfriends and needs a new CCW pistol. She normally carries a Glock 26 in her purse, but that won't fly as a waitress. Her dress will be blue jeans, a button down shirt that is tucked in & with a belt, and the normal waitress apron with note pad/money pockets. Anyway, she wants something that will not buldge at all (she's 5'6" & 125#) but is still a safe weapon (no darrangers) I have been thinking about the Kel-Tec P32 as its the proper size and weight, but I can't find a holster that she can wear with it that covers the trigger, and while the belt clip is nice and would work, it doesn't cover the trigger (we both carry 1 in pipe) She wants to carry it inside the jeans. Any ideas?
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 11:36:04 AM EDT
S&W J-frame .357 w/ .38s.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 11:46:30 AM EDT
Some people hate em, some people love em.

Walther PPK/S.

Real thin.

Link Posted: 12/22/2001 11:56:06 AM EDT
The Walther is a good suggestion. I used to have a Colt Govt. Model .380 stainless that would probably work well, I think it is out of production but is now called a Mustang?

What part of AK are you in? I am in Anchorage and would go out of my way to support a restaurant that allowed the waitresses to carry concealed. I don't have my permit yet but there is nothing better than knowing those around me do.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 12:08:44 PM EDT
Thanks for the ideas so far guys.
Shadowblade, she is working at the Outback and yes, we are in Anchorage. Far as we're concerned, unless it specifically states in her employment handbook (which it does not) she can't carry, then she will. Hell, even if it did, she'd rather carry and use it to possibly save her life one day and get fired for packing...its a small price to pay for living

Link Posted: 12/22/2001 12:13:46 PM EDT
Galco's Deep Undercover Holster w/ J-Hook. Fits my Glock 27 and the shirt is still tucked into pants. Barely noticeable.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 12:25:48 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 12:49:43 PM EDT
I have a P32 and love it. Small and surprisingly accurate. I load it with Winchester Silver Tips. I carry mine in a wallet holster but I dont know if a smaller sized woman can get away with that as easy. There are those pager holsters that hold a fake or real pager and have a holster attached inside the pants. www.pagerpal.com Dont have any experience with them but they look neat especially for a light thin P32.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 12:55:29 PM EDT
The Keltec P32 is the way to go for deep concealment.

Jack Fusilier makes a Pocket Holster for the P32.

Website www.gunsmith.fuselier.com/HOLSTERS.HTML



and
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 1:02:36 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 3:22:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Green_Furniture:
Either the PPK(nonS) or P32 are ideal for concealed "1 in the pipe" carry. I carry my P32 with the belt clip and it is very hard to "bump" the trigger with the clip, inside the pants. The trigger pull on it is quite long too.



My small carry pistol is a Walther PP. I like it.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 3:28:54 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Norm_G:
S&W J-frame .357 w/ .38s.



J-frame, 5-shot, in just .38 Super pretty good also.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 3:34:08 PM EDT
I love the smell of a Kel-Tec in the morning. Mine sleeps on my night stand next to me EVERY night. Best $209 dollars i ever spent.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 3:38:43 PM EDT
A North American Arms .22 is about the smallest thing I can think of. There are all sorts of pocket, ankle, and Thunderware type holsters for it. Or if you want some more wallop, a Colt Pocket Nine would be great if you can find one.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 5:08:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2001 6:07:58 AM EDT by cybersniper]
Waiting to see about what David said.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 5:39:45 PM EDT
OK recommend one for me....

Price is no concern,
but it has to have some old world charm, desirability and have potential to increase in value it it hasnt done so already.

Any thoughts on a seakemp or maybe a nazi proofed ppk with those sexy brown grips?
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 6:19:34 PM EDT
Take a look at the Khar MK9.
Lets just hope she never has to use whatever she decides to carry.
Merry Christmas.
ARH
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 6:22:26 PM EDT
How about a Makarov? accurate, reliable, DA/SA semi auto, 9mm Mak no slouch either, better than .32 or .380,was designed for concealed use from ground up, Commies used them for about 40 yrs, still use them, Check out www.makarov.com lots of info if you're interested
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 6:29:59 PM EDT
Cybersniper,
Have you fired your P32 while it's still in the wallet. I'm just wondering how it works, cuz it looks a little dangerous?
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 8:57:54 PM EDT
IMHOhe Springfield Armory, Para-Ord, Kimber, etc. It is "just me" (and there are many who would differ and I would not really argue against their points...this is just a personal opinion of mine) but unless a person spends a lot and I do mean A LOT of time with an auto, they are way better off with a high quality revolver. And if bad turns to worst and the weapon has to be used for what it is being carried for, both the .357 and the .38 loaded with Cor-Bon will give the life saving results you must have.
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 8:59:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ARH:
Take a look at the Khar MK9.
ARH



I paid big bucks for a new Kahr Arms Mk9 Elite (high polished stainless). As I had to special order the gun from back east, I never got a chance to inspect it before the purchase. Upon closer inspection at home, I discovered excessive grinding under the nylon grips, to the point that the grips would bend inwards when squeezed tightly. Also I found pock, or air bubbles in various parts of the reciever. Having paid so much for such a little pistol ($800 plus) I decide to file a complaint with Kahr. Although I managed to have them replace my receiver after some prolonged bickering, the complaint process was long and the customer service agents were rude. The machinist I got to talk to was the worst of them all however. The biggest kicker was that the "new" replacement receiver was noticably thicker on the right side than the left. In the end, I decided to cut my losses and trade the POS in for something else at the gun shop. In all, the Kahrs look nice, but the workmanship on my particular gun was horrible. FYI, Kahr is presently owned by the "Moonies" a religious cult. Take that info for what its worth.---
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 9:26:17 PM EDT
Does it have to be CCW? How about a Glock 21 in a tactical type holster?
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 11:31:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ARChuck:
Does it have to be CCW? How about a Glock 21 in a tactical type holster?



Hmmmm. Take a look at the original post. She is a waitress. That'd look real good. A very cute gal taking your order with a G21 tactical strapped to her leg
Link Posted: 12/22/2001 11:58:52 PM EDT
Cybersniper I am assuming you did not know but you do now. That pistol in combination with a shoot through wallet is a NFA regulated weapon which needs to be registered with the ATF as an AOW Any Other Weapon. Penalty for possesion of an unregistered NFA weapon is upto 10yrs in prison and up to $250,000 fine or both.

You can register that firearm on ATF form 1 which will require you to put makers marks and city/state on the firearm and pay a $200 making tax for the AOW
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 5:52:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2001 8:26:32 AM EDT by cybersniper]
David_Hineline,
Your kidding right? If not, do you know the US law code number/section so I can look it up?

Never mind, I just found the 1997 ATF letter/opinion on it. I still have the old Tex Shoemaker and Galco catalogs that have these types of holsters listed. But I see they dont list them anymore. Thanks for the info.


Link Posted: 12/23/2001 6:33:05 AM EDT
Check out the Beretta Tomcat in .32, it's amazingly accurate and there's a new version coming out w/tritium sights front & back. I've carried a Tomcat for years in a DeSantis "Trickster" hip pocket holster when I couldn't carry my Glock 26.
HTH...
Tomac
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 8:57:26 AM EDT
MG, I have carried a Seecamp 32 for around 2 years now. The price is a little steeep and they are somewhat hard to find but EASY to carry as I've been sitting on it in a "wallet" type holster since the day I bought it. I've put about 300 rounds through it with only one smokestack-type jam due to a deformed round, The noise and blast alone would be enough to scare the bejesus out any potential badguy if you missed him with the round! No sights, no conventional safety, but small and very concealeable. Btw, My wife and I love Alaska and try to get up to Anchorage once a year. Beautiful country and quite a change from Fl!
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 9:10:43 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MGNiko:

Hmmmm. Take a look at the original post. She is a waitress. That'd look real good. A very cute gal taking your order with a G21 tactical strapped to her leg



That's what I was thinking. Just think of the tip potential. :)
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 5:58:58 PM EDT
North American Arms makes a .32 and now a .380 as well. There are metal guns, and while they weigh a little more than the plastic guns, they are designed to stand up under more firing than the plastic stuff. With either caliber, I'd say a LOT of practice is in order.

I can also recommend the Colt Pocket 9, and the Colt Mustang PocketLite, and by proxy, the Colt Pony.

The Pocket 9 is a DAO aluminum framed 9mm, size is same as the PPK .380. These are no longer being made, and the price on them is skyhigh. I know where a new one is for $750. Mine needs new springs after about 500 rounds, and parts are awfully hard to come by.

The Mustang and Pony were the last .380s Colt produced. The Mustang is SA, the Pony is DAO. The PocketLite variation is aluminum framed, and is highly recommended. Sights are not QUITE vestigial, but are minuscule. These are accurate and reliable, but a bit hard to find, and like all things Colt quit making, are getting expensive.

Go by www.colt380.com for info on small guns, pictures, mods, etc. They really seemed to like the NAA .380. They do custom work, and make upgrade parts for the little guns.

I own a Pocket 9, but no longer carry it. Too pricy, and beginning to have reliability problems with stovepipe ejections. The Mustang PocketLite is my last resort pocket pistol, and still sees service. (I did replace the plastic recoil spring guide with the SMA metal guide.)

When I need more power in a small package, I carry the Model 60 LadySmith. Great grips, nice action, and I can choose .38s or .357s. I really like the Winchester USA (white box) 110 grain .357 in these little guns, and they are a definite step up from .38 Special.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 6:18:37 PM EDT
I have the Kel-Tec P-32 for every day carry. It fits very nicely in the Uncle Mikes Sidekick No.1 which covers the trigger guard and makes the little gun almost invisible in the back pocket of a pair of bluejeans. Yous really can't beat the Kel-Tec. Size and weight make it perfect for CCW when you are unable/unwiling to carry a larger weapon.
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 6:21:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/23/2001 6:24:28 PM EDT by LWilde]
DUDES, what's the matter with you people?
All of you guys who suggested autos are out to lunch! Given all the details he gave about his wife he's going to want the best wheel gun ever made, a s&w J frame. Don't get me wrong, I own two Glocks, a 1911, and several other autos. A matter of fact I don't even own a revolver, so I'm not some kind of a wheelgunner but given her job description, the fact that she'll put the gun in her purse and not clean it and the fact that she is a woman would warrent a very good revolver. Don't take that the wrong way the fact remains that many woman have trouble with autos for various reasons. A S&W J frame with 38 special +P's is the ONLY choice, remember her life may depend on it someday.

ALWAYS REMEMBER, "THAT WHICH IS COVER FOR 5.56, IS MERELY CONCEALMENT FOR 7.62!"

(Ok...a bit of explanation is in order. All above true...but written by honorable son. He is getting his own account now. For the record, I disagree with the slur against 5.56mm too!)
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 7:51:49 PM EDT
A revolver is the weapon of choice in regular concealed carry, but it sounds as if he is looking for something that will NOT create a "bulge" on his small wife.

He even mentioned the Keltec P32.
I think the Keltec P32; while NOT being the BEST gun to have in an armed confrontation: it is certainly the most Concealable handgun money can buy.

It is very thin and very light. It uses a LOCKED breach instead of BLOWBACK which the NAA Guardian uses.

Such a dimunitive pistol would be unnoticible in a pocket of a persons levi's; especially when the person is using a wallet type holster to prevent "printing".
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 8:20:14 PM EDT

Originally Posted By 50cali:
FYI, Kahr is presently owned by the "Moonies" a religious cult. Take that info for what its worth.---



I'm sorry that you had such a bad experience with your Kahr, but that statement is just not true. They are not owned by the Moonies. The son of Rev. Moon is the owner. He is a businessman here in the USA that values the 2nd amendment as much as the rest of us. While he is a member of the church, he is not involved with running the church. It would be like saying that Bushmaster is owned by the Baptists because the owner of Bushmaster is a Baptist.

BTW, I have no idea what religon, if any, the owner of Bushmaster is affiliated with. It was just an example.

USPC40
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 9:49:03 PM EDT
Thanks much guys! After much fondeling of guns, she decided on the P32. The jeans she wears are super tight ass and there's absolutly no room for a wheel gun. Hell, there's hardly room for the P32, but she looks awful cute with those panty lines showing... Anyway, about the "she's a woman and would warrant a very good revolver" statement, Yes she is a woman, and if she liked revolvers, she'd carry a very good one While I'm sure she would rather sling her Vector over her shoulder and go to work, some silly laws prevent that
Link Posted: 12/23/2001 10:16:34 PM EDT
The ATF's standard for "shoot-thru" holsters is, IIRC, if the holster has a hole for the trigger to be usable the combination needs to be registered as an AOW. If there is no hole allowing trigger manipulation, its ok.

Kharn
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 9:06:40 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MGNiko:
Thanks much guys! After much fondeling of guns, she decided on the P32. The jeans she wears are super tight ass and there's absolutly no room for a wheel gun. Hell, there's hardly room for the P32, but she looks awful cute with those panty lines showing...



I think some pictures need to be posted so we can see if she does a good job concealing the pistol. :)
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 10:19:35 AM EDT
www.naaminis.com/magnum.html

If you can't conceal this, you better give up.

Life Size pic.
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 11:26:20 AM EDT
I carry a NAA Guardian 380 in my front pants pocket. It is considerably heavier than the P32, but packs more punch. You might consider the lighter weight NAA Guardian 32. The KelTec P32 I had was not very reliable. Some are, some are not. YMMV. Watch-Six
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 11:38:30 AM EDT
WARNING! I've heard that the Outback is anti-gun, at least on the corporate level. You might want to look quietly/carefully into this before possibly opening up a can of worms. You can choose not to ask and avoid an unpleasant answer (A viable option), but I'd recommend treading lightly. Granted, you're in AK, but you still never know what the reaction might be if corporate somehow gets involved.

Just my $.02
Link Posted: 12/24/2001 12:30:54 PM EDT
Saw a recent article in handgunner. J&G sales has a FEG PA63, Walther look alike, that is suppose to be a pretty nice gun 9X18 Makarov,aluminum frame, 8 round magazine and $90. Might be worth considering.
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