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Posted: 11/22/2001 4:03:13 PM EDT
Howdy,
While I wuz out deer hunting I wuz thinking what new guns the manufacters should build.
1.A double rifle in 45/70. I think Stoger or EEA should be able to do this for >$400
2.Lever action in 454 Casull. You could probally do this will a regular 94 or 336 action.
3.Semi-auto 45/70. Ruger with thier vast knowlage of investment casting should be able to do this.
4. Cheap AK action in 308 that uses M-14 mags
5. Savage 99 with change out barrels in 243, 308 7/08 ect. That'd be real cool especially if they had a case for everything
That's what I think. Anyone else have any ideas??????
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 4:14:57 PM EDT
battle rifle, 20-30 round capacity mag, in 300 WSM. FAL or M14 type or even AK would be cool. Hey! An AR15 in 300 WSM!
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 5:27:13 PM EDT
An accurate Mini-14 for the same price they charge now.

Savage rifles chambered in 17 Remington, 22 Hornet, 221 Fireball and 222 Remington.


Link Posted: 11/22/2001 5:56:36 PM EDT
I believe pedersoli makes a double in 45/70, beautiful gun, but I think it's $1200-$1500
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 5:57:21 PM EDT
Baretta makes some fine doubles as well ($$$$$)
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 6:56:12 PM EDT
1)A while back there was a .45-70 double rifle. I think it was around $500 or so. The market is pretty limited, and most of that market is willing to pay the $1000+ that double rifles go for.

2)I saw a .454 Casull Winchester 94 at a gunshow. It was originally a .45Colt Trapper that was rechambered.

3)I'd buy one. I think a .45-70 on an AK action(like the Saiga shotguns) would be the ticket.

4)I'd prefer FAL mags, as they are a whole lot cheaper. Of course it's already been done in the guise of the .308 Galil, that will take modified M-14 mags, but that isn't exatcly "cheap".

5)The Savage 99 was a cool lever-gun. Another nice set-up could be that semi-auto .308, from #4 above, with quick change barrels in .308, .243, 7/08, etc.

Link Posted: 11/22/2001 7:37:02 PM EDT
The Ruger Redneck, available in multiple calibers. When done shooting, you could access hollow buttstock which would contain 24 compressed emergency beer tablets (add water) and the side of the buttstock would have an embedded, small, solar-powered TV screen/liquid crystal display permanently tuned to "The Man Show". No remote is required, at least in the tactical configuration.
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 7:40:58 PM EDT
a .223 short formed from .223 brass and using .224(5.56mm)cal bullets. it would make an awsome semi auto pistol round. Hmm, better yet base it on a 38 super case necked down to .22 cal and to 38 super OAL. then you could use 38 super mags. Its only a matter of time before someone gets smart enough to thing of this.
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 7:51:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FrankSquid:
a .223 short formed from .223 brass and using .224(5.56mm)cal bullets. it would make an awsome semi auto pistol round. Hmm, better yet base it on a 38 super case necked down to .22 cal and to 38 super OAL. then you could use 38 super mags. Its only a matter of time before someone gets smart enough to thing of this.


Wouldnt the .224 BOZ fit that bill, 40 cal down to .223.
GG
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 9:17:23 PM EDT
An H&K SL8-1 that can accept AR mags.
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 10:25:09 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 10:33:10 PM EDT
EAA has IZH 43 side by side shotgun that accepts 45-70 inserts. $215 for gun---$100 for inserts (wholesale)...
Link Posted: 11/22/2001 10:41:17 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 5:09:06 AM EDT
.224 BOZ!!!? I have wood. 2000 fps from a hand gun. I would say that its a drop in barrel for a Glock 20? I NEED a glock 20. I NEED .224 BOZ. Finally an alternative to the FN 5.7, thanks guys. BTW, is that your glock Troy?
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 5:24:21 AM EDT
A high tech, reasonable cost, simply designed semi and bolt configuration...mostly in pistol calibers carbine and rifle versions.....the technology is already in existence....just the forethought and marketing necessary to make it feasable......the ruger minis have already done experiments in that direction.....with cnc and modern alloy ability...this would seem very possible to me......imagine a lightwieght, anodized carbine in 10mm...or 357..or whatever....maybe adaptable to some modern rifle calibers also.....
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 7:20:59 AM EDT
a decent reproduction of the winchester 1887 lever action shotgun
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 7:54:45 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Ross:
1)A while back there was a .45-70 double rifle. I think it was around $500 or so. The market is pretty limited, and most of that market is willing to pay the $1000+ that double rifles go for.




Most of your doubles would go for 8-10x that. If you pick up a double gun journal you will see that a low end double starts around 10k. Before I die I will own one though, dont know what I will do with it but I will own one.

Ropes
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 7:57:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/23/2001 7:50:50 AM EDT by MC_Man]
How about this?



www.fazed.net/humor/videos/?source=glockauto.mpg

And while you're there, check out some of the other videos.
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 8:01:59 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Admiral_Crunch:
An H&K SL8-1 that can accept AR mags.




exists, but it will cost ya. and you have to send your gun to todd of special weapons. its part of a "make the SL8 look cool" conversion. it acually would help, but its like 800 $
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 8:15:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By FrankSquid:
.224 BOZ!!!? I have wood. 2000 fps from a hand gun. I would say that its a drop in barrel for a Glock 20? I NEED a glock 20. I NEED .224 BOZ. Finally an alternative to the FN 5.7, thanks guys. BTW, is that your glock Troy?



The questions are:

1: Can we (U.S. Citizens) buy it?
2: From whom?
3: Where does one get a barrel for it? I see mentions of 1911 and also Glock 20's as base platforms, but haven't seen anything in my searches.

God Bless Texas
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 8:30:14 AM EDT
if you have the case dimentions for a cartridge just about any barrel manufacture can cut a barrel for you in any oddball way you like.
the same is true for reloading dies.

the tricky part would be calculating load data for it.

the case dimentions i have but i dont even know where to begin to calculate a load for it
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 9:03:57 AM EDT
I'd love to see a Glock longslide with the 3.5 lbs trigger in 10mm. A Glock 20L
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 9:16:16 AM EDT

Originally Posted By po89mm:
if you have the case dimentions for a cartridge just about any barrel manufacture can cut a barrel for you in any oddball way you like.
the same is true for reloading dies.

the tricky part would be calculating load data for it.

the case dimentions i have but i dont even know where to begin to calculate a load for it



Would a cartridge like the .224 BOZ use pistol or rifle powder? This would be something that I would really be interested in loading for. With a little patience it shouldn't be too hard to work up a functioning load by just starting with really low charges. Anyone know of anybody currently making barrels for them?

What about mags? Would normal .40 S&W mags work or would there be feeding problems?

Michael
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 9:29:59 AM EDT
Hmm, after doing a little internet reasearch, it looks like the .224 maybe a LE restricted round.
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 9:59:08 AM EDT
I had heard that the .224 BOZ was to be restricted to LE/Military only, but are there any federal laws pertaining to reloading your own armor piercing ammo or constructing a pistol to use it in for your own personal use?

Anybody out there know anything?

Michael
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 10:01:30 AM EDT

Hmm, after doing a little internet research, it looks like the .224 maybe a LE restricted round.

exactly, but no law says you cant make a wildcat duplicating the 224 boz and call it whatever you like.
thats why ya gotta roll yer' own

pony i imagine it could go either way. it all depends on the powder burn rate

What about mags? Would normal .40 S&W mags work or would there be feeding problems?

i yould have to say they prob use standard 40 S&W mags since the case is a necked down 40 cal anyway.

as for feeding problems i think that all depends on how the barrel ramp is cut.



Link Posted: 11/23/2001 10:27:54 AM EDT
Ok, after searching the BATF website for about 30min I finally found the information I was looking for. Per the definitions the .224 BOZ doesn't seem to fit into the armor piercing ammo category because it uses a .22 caliber projectile and the bullet used would not necessarily have to be a FMJ, though at 2800 fps I'm sure it would probably defeat a lot of the soft body armor out there anyways. Below is the information I found straight from the BATF website. The pertinent info is contained in section (ii).



Under Title 18, UNITED STATES CODE, CHAPTER 44 as amended by Public Law 103-322
The Violent Crime and Law Enforcement Act of 1994 (enacted September 13, 1994) 18 U.S.C. CHAPTER 44 § 921(a)(17)(B) the term 'armor piercing ammunition' means --

(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; or

(ii) a full jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the projectile.

(C) The term 'armor piercing ammunition' does not include shotgun shot required by Federal or State environmental or game regulations for hunting purposes, a frangible projectile designed for target shooting, a projectile which the Secretary finds is primarily intended to be used for sporting purposes, or any other projectile or projectile core which the Secretary finds is intended to be used for industrial purposes, including a charge used in an oil and gas well perforating device.

Link Posted: 11/23/2001 11:20:41 AM EDT
they need to make a mini 14 take ar mags. a 14 w/20's would look sweet and the mini 30 should take ak mags. that for me would be better than an AR15 a cheap,light,reliable handy rifle that I would not mind bangin round with unlike a 800$ AR
and they should make a M1A that takes FAL mags that would be it
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 11:25:57 AM EDT
I think there should be fully automatic guns, "in every Brand and Configuration", available to US tax payer's,(with a criminal background check of course)without a hassle and special class 3 licence's. Also, all the cops should have at least a H&K MP5 in the squad car.
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 11:28:51 AM EDT
I would love to se a Benneli side by side Super90!! 5 rounds in each tube. Selectable for one or both barrels. That would be awesome!!!

Link Posted: 11/23/2001 11:30:51 AM EDT

Originally Posted By HighlandMac:
I would love to se a Benneli side by side Super90!! 5 rounds in each tube. Selectable for one or both barrels. That would be awesome!!!




Hell I may buy a lefthanded Super90 and see what can be done!!

Link Posted: 11/23/2001 11:46:26 AM EDT
A model seven version of the Rem600 with laminated stock in a 6.5 Rem Mag.

Maybe one day they will bring it out in a classic. IIRC, I think, but I am not positive, the 2002 classic is going to be a 221 fireball
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 12:34:25 PM EDT
HK should come out with a civilian G-11.

Someone should come out with a caseless rifle

There needs to be more bullpups on the market
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 2:43:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bob243:
A model seven version of the Rem600 with laminated stock in a 6.5 Rem Mag.

Maybe one day they will bring it out in a classic. IIRC, I think, but I am not positive, the 2002 classic is going to be a 221 fireball



How about a Model 7 in 6.5x55 Swede, then maybe we could get some factory ammo at a decent price, brass would become plentiful, etc. etc.

Factory Mini-14 H-Bar that accepts AR mags.
Then maybe I wouldn't hate Mini's so much.

Sig Sauer to build a .45 acp derringer, or a TRULY subcompact 9mm ala Kel Tec size.


Link Posted: 11/23/2001 2:52:28 PM EDT
why doesnt ruger make a mini 14 take AR mags
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 2:59:56 PM EDT
A reasonable (less than $300) semi-auto in 5.56 or 7.62x39 in a box magazine simular to SKS. Or even conversions to SKS's to 5.56 for $150. Mini 14's that shoot accutatly. Small .454 Casull and .44 mag semi auto brush guns. Nice little 7.62 and 5.56 bolt actions for under $300. .17 cal magnum rimfire. I could go on and on.
Link Posted: 11/23/2001 7:49:34 PM EDT
357, 44 mag, 45 auto, & 9mm tube guns like a Marlin 22 (don't know the model #) with about a 10 rd capacity that could be topped off like a lever action. Maybe do this ideal in a pump gun config too. When I say topped off like a lever action I mean you don't have to take the tube out of the action that has the magizine spring in it. Just slide a fresh rnd in from the side of the gun. Priced under $400 please.
Link Posted: 11/24/2001 12:22:21 PM EDT
Maybe a .308 AUG?..............
Link Posted: 11/24/2001 12:56:37 PM EDT
fixed mag AR pistol that used stripper clips. then it could maintain some normality( I.E. not a swiss cheese looking thing like the new OLY)
Link Posted: 11/24/2001 2:27:20 PM EDT
One one that doesn´t run out of ammo..
Link Posted: 11/24/2001 2:32:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Tuukka:
One one that doesn´t run out of ammo..

DEEP SPACE NINE.........
Link Posted: 11/24/2001 4:13:36 PM EDT
A 98 Mauser with no thumb cut, having a rotary magazine, integral scope mounts, side-swing safety, and just long enough for the .22/250, .250 Savage, and .300 Savage cartridges with bullets seated out a tiny bit longer than usual. Make mine a .250.

A .44 Magnum lever action carbine based on a scaled down/beefed up M1887 Winchester shotgun action.

A Sako 75 SINGLE SHOT in 6.5-'06 Ackley Improved.

A sub 10 ounce 5 shot .32 Magnum double action stainless/titanium revolver of S&W type.

A flintlock that was properly designed to spark without beating the heck out of the flint.
Link Posted: 11/24/2001 4:16:53 PM EDT
I wish someone would make the Bren-Ten again.
Link Posted: 11/24/2001 4:45:45 PM EDT
How about a handgun that shoots a BB size projectile at around 15,000-20,000 fps. Using electromagnetic propulsion rather the a conventional propellent. Hay, you said any gun!


Vulcan94
Link Posted: 11/25/2001 3:47:30 PM EDT
How 'bout a Mauser action 458 SOCOM??? Does anyone have dies and reamers???
Link Posted: 11/25/2001 3:58:22 PM EDT
Millitary Scientist's are allready working on a "SMART" Bullet, that hone's in on a laser painter. One percise shot with armor peircing bullet's to a tank's ammo dump and KABLOOEE!
Link Posted: 11/26/2001 7:11:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By motoguzzi:
Maybe a .308 AUG?..............



Yes. Someone should make the G2A-type bullpup (based upon the M1A). Although there is an imported 30-cal Bullpup, the G2A would have several advantages (cost, available mags). Tested by Navy Seals as a Bullpup sniper rifle, the G2A would be ideal for taking on field trips requiring 1 MOA accuracy.
Link Posted: 11/26/2001 5:50:32 PM EDT
a 454 cassull 1911 with a extened slide and barrel so i can pretend to be alucard from hellsing
Link Posted: 11/26/2001 7:22:58 PM EDT
I need a beefed up M6 Scout chambered in .223 Rem over a smoothbore .45 LC barrel for shot cartridges. Give it a skimpy, skeletal forend to keep my hands off the barrel.

I'm easy.
Link Posted: 11/26/2001 8:30:35 PM EDT
Silenced 22lr machine pistols with at least three weaver rails and minimalist folding stocks. Suppose that would also need to come with new improved gov't regulations. Sigh.

50/70 lever action carbines. C'mon, the round is ideal for big bore lever actions. Same or better game effect as 45/70, but shorter so as to allow more rounds on tap in a tube magazine. Brass might be a tad expensive...

This last one is a biggie. Pocket BB pistol type things (think Browing Baby size) - but firing inexpensive hand-reloadable casings with no powder, just small pistol primer or similar and BB/other standard size projectile or shot size. Bleed off some of the primer blast from the barrel if you like to ensure gas assisted semiauto blowback (or whatever) operation and reliably low muzzle velocity. The goal here is to slide the guns into the grey area of things that are not considered firearms even in Canada (muzzle energy under 5.7 joules) while allowing realistic sounds, semiauto operation and yielding enough power to penetrate paper or maybe roll a tin can across the room. The parlor guns of the 21st century - and regulations be d*mned. Heck, make a deluxe full auto version too if you like - if it's not a firearm, it's not mandatory to comply with firearm regulations. Show me that gun and I'm lining up with cash.
Link Posted: 11/26/2001 8:48:11 PM EDT
a US made AUG that does'nt cost over $800. and is able to take AR mags.

has anyone shot Auguila IQ ammo? they make a 117grn .45 that pushes at over 1450fps. just imagine how fast the 9mm would shoot.

i second the AK that uses Fal mags in .308

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