Gents,

Down in Belgium, I am planning to build a custom sport rifle and a friend, who is also a gunsmith, own several dozens of 98K & M1903 actions.


Receiver to receiver, what do you think I shall choose for a sporting rifle (I think of a 20" ou 24"-barrel rifle, purely build for fun in .308).


Thank you !

1903 is based off the 98 action, so functionally both should be good.

I would do 98 just because its more interesting to me. Especially if it is a wartime receiver with markings and such.

I'd use a M98 receiver for reasons:


 

Over there I don't think there's much collector value in 1903s.

US Military firearms, especially WWII-vintage are highly sought by collectors here...even more by non-licenced people who want them "demilitarized"...

 

M1903 go from 1250€ to 1700€ (1400USD to +/-2000USD)

M1 Garand starts at about 1000€

M1 Carbine...from 600€ to 1000€

And M1911A1 are starting at around 800€

I would go with a 98 action.  Surplus Mausers used to be cheap and plentiful in the US.  Back in the 1990's it was common to find surplus Mausers selling for $125 USD.

My .308 Mauser is a Chilean Modelo 1912-61.  It was made by Steyr, originally chambered for 7mm, then converted in the early 1960'a to .308 using a re-chambered, re-profiled 03A3 2 groove barrel.  The front sight sits too low, so the rifle shoots 12" high at 100 yards.  I see Brownells sells a tall front site that can be milled down to proper height.

Regarding going with a 20" or 24" barrel, I prefer a 20" barrel because it is easier to carry in the back of my car.

edited to add:  The prices listed for vintage WWII rifles is very close to the prices in the US.  Large ring Mausers are easier to find than Garands or '03 Springfields.  I guess the US left them all behind in other countries.

Neither do it to a Mosin not a good rifle.

From what he's presented, these are stripped actions, not complete firearms.

My vote's for a Mauser action.

Horse a piece.  But the controlled feed of a Mauser is kind of cool.  I grew up hunting with one and I remember how far the brass would fly depends on how hard you cycle the bolt.  And it's kind of wild how the round snaps up onto the bolt early.  They're usually kind of smooth.  But the trigger on the one I used was kind of mushy.  My 03A3 has a better trigger I think.  Actually, now I gotta remember.  It's been a while since I've shot mine.

Poor WWII rifles.

Krag Jorgensen try one first IM me a thank you later

a Krag bolt feels like it is lubed in anal eze

I've read some yrs and arsenals of the 1903 did not receive proper hardening. No hands on experience with one but Ive shot a sporter 1903 in the original caliber. It was well done. Fajen stock and cold rust blued, slick action and very crisp trigger.

My vote is Mauser action. 2nd is Arisaka

I like the M1903 action for custom build purposes, but it's mostly a matter of aesthetics - they make gorgeous and very elegant sporting rifles.

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As for low number receivers being prone to failure, it's complicated but at this point in time, it's just not a risk.  

Prior to 1929 it was a combination of:

1) higher failure rates prior to the change to a double heat treatment, instituted between serial number 750,00 and 800,000 at Springfield and by serial number 285,506 at Rock Island Arsenal after December 1917;
a) 4.13 failures per 100,000 for Springfield Armory receivers
b) 7.71 failures per 100,000 for Rock Island Armory receivers

2) softer cartridge cases used in 1917-1918 WWI production ammunition; and

3) the coned breech used in the 1903 to improve feeding (but which reduced support for the above mentioned soft headed cases.


The failure rate for the double heat treated receivers was slightly less than 1 per 100,000, for Springfield manufactured receivers, and 0.5 per 100,000 Rock island manufactured receivers. The above rates also include  4 failures caused by shooting 8mm Mauser in a 1903, an inadvisable process that causes chamber pressures well in excess of 75,000 psi proof pressure for the M1903 receivers.


In 1928 an ordinance board recommended the early serial number receivers be removed from service when they came in for maintenance, however the commanding general did not concur and they remained in service until WWII when they were replaced by M1 Garands.

Interestingly by 1929 the improperly hardened 1917-18 production ammo had either bene expended or removed form service, and there were no further receiver failures after 1929.  Given the number of 1903 Springfields in service, with even the very low 1 and .5 per 100,000 failure rates with double heat treated receivers prior to 1929, at least some failures would have been expected after 1929, but none occurred, even with the low number receivers left in service.

That suggests that receiver embrittlement by itself was not sufficient to cause failures in the double heat treated receives - it also required softer cased ammunition.  

It also suggests that any low number receivers that were going to fail, had already failed by 1929.


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Interarms used to import the Zastava made M98 Mauser as the Interarms Mark X and it was also available as a barreled action.  It was very well made and very nicely polished and blued and was frequently used a s the basis of a custom sporting rifle as the bolt handle and safety were already scope compatible.

Remington used the same barreled action for their Remington 798, and Charles Daly used it for their Charles Daly Mauser.

It's still being imported by CAI as the Zastava M70 Mauser (not to be confused with their M70 AK clone).  The metalwork is still superb, although the stocks are nothing to brag about - but for a sumo rifle the stock isn't going to be used anyway.

In many respects this is the best approach to take as you get modern metallurgy, with more reliable strength, and none of the issues that can occur with war time produced high carbon steel and inclusions, as well as an already sporterized bolt and safety.

As between the two the Mauser K98 makes the perfect sporter.  Huge aftermarket parts source for customization.  Barrels, triggers, stocks, scope mount conversions, bolt handles.  They are strong and smooth.