I've read good reviews, and I think it'd be a fun blaster to SBR. Anybody know of a good source? Also, that huge B&T suppressor is supposed to be good too because it limits backpressure, are they for sale anywhere? Google is being stingy.
Thanks in advance!

Gunbroker.com

I have a first gen TP9 SBR and it is a hoot. I wanted one of the Rotex cans the first time around but I came up craps finding one for sale in the US. I've seen the new ones on Gunbroker (the TP9's not the Rotex suppressors) and I imagine that is the go-to for the short term. It will probably be after summer before they start hitting the market with any real volume. Robert RTG got his parts shipment in so he has the stock kits, spares and other odds and ends for them.

My TP9 has the threaded muzzle so I've been debating getting one of the Thompson Machine cans for it, but honestly I prefer it short and loud. I have a multimount on my MP5K clone / 9mm AR and that satisfies my suppressed PCC urge. The Teep is mostly just for shenanigans.

That was really helpful.

I always find it incredible that people don't know about the second most visited firearms related website on the internet, and that you can buy pretty much any gun imaginable there.

Thanks guys.
Hey, another random question. How does one mount a suppressor to the gun with that really weird big thread on the TP9?
I have seen that Thompson Machine makes their SG2 which supposedly has enough volume to work well with the TP9. How would one mount it?

Very carefully.

But in all seriousness the way the TP9 works is that its barrel rides independently inside a larger outer housing, which is what is threaded / lugged. The barrel itself is cammed, moves rearward and rotates when it unlocks under recoil. The muzzle that you see sticking out from the end is a large bell housing, and this is what the suppressor attaches to. Thompson Machine makes and adapter for their subgun can that fits the first gen threaded muzzle.

B&T discovered that their Rotex suppressor had a habit of becoming seized to the early style threaded housing (and from what I hear the TM can has the same problem), so they redesigned it to be a three lug. Every TP9 now comes with this three lug housing... which means your only option for suppression is the Rotex can with the proprietary three lug adapter built in.

Someone else made an adapter that necked the first gen threaded muzzle down to a 1/2x28 thread, but from what I hear those adapters don't work so well with standard pistol cans and put way too much pressure on the TP9's guts. As you are already aware these things need large volume subgun cans.

And this thread is useless without pics...

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=491565294

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=491307703

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=489757413

I fired a class 3 one with the Rotex can a dealer friend had back in 10 or 11. It was a fun little subgun, however, the Rotex can wasn't very quiet for its size and even with subsonic rounds my ears still rang a little after a mag or two.

That being said I think the baffle design is also a product of limiting back pressure just as much as the size of the can was.

All things considered I think the TP9 is about as close to an MP7 as I will ever get so I have been eyeing them since they were first imported I never bit the bullet so to speak simply due to price. If they come down some this go around I will probably sell an ar or 3 and pick one up.

The trigger mechanism is the one part of this thing that I would call an achilles heel... mainly because it is such a weird thing. It is obviously a subgun "pull to select" sliding trigger reworked to be a semi auto trigger, so it has a long, weak, mushy, straight pull. If you open it up you will see that the trigger spring is nothing but a simple double loop puller that looks like something you'd see in a child's toy rather than a firearm. But the real oddity with it is that while it is a sliding trigger, it employs a hinged glock style trigger safety... so when shooting it you have this odd sensation of a hinged safety into a straight sliding pull.



It used to be the only way to get the stock was to get it from DS Arms, and they wanted a copy of your F1 before they would ship. Wolverine Supply in Canada had / has them and they used to ship to the US, but now that Robert RTG has them on hand they should be more common.

All the stock is is a plastic "L" with a spring latch and two screws. I kind of wish B&T would make one of their MP5 stocks with an adapter to fit it. Sure it would be huge and wouldn't fold for shit, but the little stock the TP9 has is like most subgun wire stocks... it works best for conserving space than it does for shooter comfort.

They do make a full size stock for it... Have to get it from Europe though...

Yeah but it is more or less a clone of the original Steyr SPP stock, which are no better than the stick stocks IMO. There is a guy I know who has an original SPP with the fixed stock and we've shot my TP9 and it side by side... there is no real difference in comfort, just a bit less flex.

What would be nice is the sloping, radiused top the B&T MP5 stocks have. Something nice to put your face against that isn't a plastic rod or square.

Nice TP9. I like your foregrip setup.

What you say about suppressor choice is imperative when selecting a can: VOLUME. That incident mentioned was a guy on SilencerTalk that over pressurized the rotating barrel action to the point it damaged the firearm. He had an adapter made for the TP9 for a 9mm pistol can. The problem first manifested itself in feeding problems due to the bolt cycling faster than the magazine could feed. Then he saw the damage to the cam track on the barrel. The little can made a piston of the barrel and hammered it against the pin.

This instance shows how the unique action of the gun necessitates a suppressor with a large blast chamber and overall volume.  The reflex cans coming out of Finland reflect this kind is construction. Sucks the U.S. Rotex costs so much but you bought a TP9. Most owners of the TP9 in other countries can easily buy suppressor so the propriety can isn't such a big deal to them. Can you imagine getting a can tossed in by your LGS in Finland to sweeten the deal?

I've drawn up an adapter for AR tubes that bolts to the rear boss in Master Cam. After drawing it up I'm worried any lateral force on a mounted stock (my intention was a brace before their reclassification) would break the frame.

After trying to put a AR stock on the TP9 I realized it was a waste of time.
The platform is a niche product that commands a premium.

BUT, it fills the niche for me. It's really supposed to replace a pistol. The Swiss are doing just that. Trying to make a TP9 handle like a MP5 isn't going to happen, IMHO.  

I wouldn't think an AR stock would be a good fit for the TP9... I'd imagine it would sit too high, kind of like those AR stock adapters people made for the Mac subguns. I mean, it is hard enough to use the shitty (plastic) iron sights these guns have with the factory stock, I can only imagine how useless they'd be with a higher positioned AR tube on the gun.

And to clarify I don't have any real functional issue with the B&T side folding stock, my gripe is with it when you shoot more than a few mags at a time in one go. Like nearly every wire stock or collapsible stock on the market it works for what it does, but it quickly gets uncomfortable over time as it doesn't have a nice smooth radiused area to put your face against. Its just makes for a difference between a weapon and a range toy.

That the exact conclusion I came to: it's a tiny subgun don't mess with what works. I was going to have to add BUIS to get a sight picture with the adapter I drew up.

The only beef I have with the factory folder is the axis pin has TINY metric threads that mate to polymer threads on the stock boss. I took my time making sure I didn't cross thread or strip the frame. But, that's not much of a complaint. There was one guy who stripped his frame on the firearmblog....and blamed B+T! lol

Good to see another fan on the platform.

Haven't been able to find one at a good price so I just got one of the new UZI pistols and will SBR that instead.  Talked with IWI USA and they said the stocks will be available from their USA based web store in a month or two.  Barrels are easy to remove (knurled nut) to thread for a suppressor.  Now I just have to get another piston with the proper threads for my suppressor.

I think it is a good alternative to the TP9.

Good pick on the Uzi. It's at the price the TP9 used to be and you can get parts relatively cheap. The guys at UziTalk are great. RobertRTG is where it's at for a lot of Uzi parts.

How does the plastic lower feel?

Pics!!!!

I wish they would make the Uzi Pro with that Tavor-esque grip guard... or at least offer a way to get it. The regular Uzi Pro with stock doesn't appeal to me much.

Yeah without the Glock magazine capability I'd rather they go with the Tavor style or just offer the old stamped.  


That's me as a collector.



I would be poorer if they had done the latter.

Shit, I already own a fullsize Uzi and a pile of magazines two cats deep. If they made a "classic" Uzi pistol I'd be on that soooooooo fast.

B&T makes a dedicated suppressor that mounts to the TP9 muzzle/lug. They are making these suppressors in the US to be offered on the civilian commercial market. I've fired the semiauto TP9 and select-fire MP9 with and without the factory suppressor. The suppressor is pretty large, but it is surprisingly light. Much lighter than my SWR qd3k. Wait for the factory B&T USA tp9/mp9 suppressor, it will be worth it.

They really need to offer a factory Micro UZI SBR. I would be on that in a heartbeat.

I've been lusting for a TP-9 for a while now too!  I want to know if they're just trickling in slowly, or I'm being too impatient for the big container to arrive so they'll be available everywhere.

There is no way in hell they are importing them in that quantity.  No way.  

CZ has their low-budget Scorpion that will sell at least 5x1 for the B+T pistols.

And the nay-sayers will say both are useless because we all know a Glock 17 with a 33 round magazine does EVERYTHING better than a TP9

Dude actually said that to me AFTER shooting MY ammo (+P) through MY TP9.

Oh god, if I had a nickel for every time someone shot one of my SBR subgun clones and said the same thing I'd have... well... a pocket full of nickels. Most folks who have shot some of my stuff are not the kind of folks who would be buying that type of firearm anyway. It is pretty hard to convince someone out of their preconceived notions when it comes to firearms. Everyone is an expert and we all have our favorites.

I myself am just glad that more manufacturers are willing to take the gamble on releasing subgun clone pistols that are so SBR friendly. I've gone positively pokemon with them... gotta buy 'em all! I think the majority of my stamps are now for subgun clone SBRs. Then again I grew up in the heyday of the wonder 9 subguns of the late 70s into the 80s, so as a kid it was always my dream to own an Uzi, MP5's, MACs, etc. and now I do (for the most part).

As for the availability I don't expect to see them in anything close to the numbers the Scorpion is in. I imagine they will be fairly uncommon and your best bet will be Gunbroker or having your dealer direct order one from one of the distributors I've heard B&T is supposed to be using. My dealer is still trying to run down one of the APC9's for me and so far he is coming up bupkis. By all accounts some of them are in the US and available for sale, but hell if I know where they are. Time will tell though... I mean, it took a good six months for those Sig 553 pistols to trickle in before they were pretty common on Gunbroker. And then like all rare and expensive birds their market shit the bed and many people slashed the prices to liquidate them.

If there is anything I hate about niche firearm shopping it is that. You want to get something but you don't want to jump on too soon lest you overpay... and you don't want to wait too long lest they sell out and you miss them. Its a tricky tightrope to walk.

Learned this the hard way with the Sterling 9mms.

I ended up getting mine from the B&T dealer in WY... it's a hoot to shoot! Definitely will be awesome with a stamp.

I already have one but I'm curious..

Is this a good price for a DSA import? I'm thinking about picking it up for spares.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=495577436

I have not shopped for one in a little while but the buy it now price of 1300 for a used gen 1 with only one mag seems rather steep to me. When I've seen used DSA TP9's on Gunbroker in the past they almost always sold for between 1000 and 1100 or so, and most of them had multiple mags and other accessories like the brass catcher or the side rail upper.

For a while about 6 months ago there was a guy with a gen 2 with no box and only one mag priced at like 1300 or so and it just sat and sat and sat, he kept relisting it every week. I guess someone finally bit or he just gave up.

You'll save some money if you can grab a used TP9 with some magazines. They're $65 now. A pair of Steyr SPP pistols sold for $1099 on gunbroker recently, for what it's worth. There was only a 15 round magazine for the pair but also a scope mount. Some people don't know what they have. The super rare factor Steyr fixed stocks are floating around at ~$400. It's a solid platform IMHO.

How durable are they? How durable are the magazines?  I haven't ever taken my SBR out to really stretch it's legs yet but it's one of my favorite guns and I'd be sick if something happened to it and I couldn't just repair it.

I've been shooting mine for years now with zero failures. While they are complicated, they also appear to be pretty robust. My only concern with the mags is accidentally dropping a fully loaded one onto concrete. Something tells me that would be a death drop if it hit on one of the edges with enough force.

From what I have seen Robert RTG carries everything that seems like a wear part (firing pins, springs, etc.) and I have those as backups. And with B&T back on the scene domestically I'd imagine any serious failure that resulted in some sort of catastrophic breakage might be able to be handled through B&T USA? Has anyone seen any contact info for them yet?

I haven't had any function issues with mine either.  Ate Wolf and Tula all day.  Made the fudds mutter pretty heavy that day!!! (Gang-banger gun with commie ammo!!!)  Funny as hell

I haven't heard anything from B+T USA.  I spoke with the owner (can't remember his name) of Armati USA several months ago about importing the B+T pistols and he say B+T wasn't happy with how DS Arms handled the brand in the USA and that B+T wanted more companies selling their product.  Apparently the owners of B+T and DS Arms were/are acquaintances and that's how Karl Brugger decided to distribute in the US.  When I spoke with the guy from Armati USA,  he said they were waiting on the ATF for approval at that point for the pistols and that APC series rifles would have to be modified  single shots (no gas port drilled) to get imported then reworked here due to 922r bullshit.

I don't know at this point what the relationship is between B+T USA and Armati USA.  The gunbroker ad says the pistols are being imported by B+T USA.  Aftermath Gun Club seems to be the best source of reliable info for the company from what I've read.  



Hopefully they start production here for 922r compliance

lol and they serve ice-cream in hell

Even with the polymer lower the UZI Pro feels very solid because the upper is all steel.  The mags are steel and now come in 20, 25, & 32 rounders.  Prices for the mags are good at $17, $19, & $22 respectively.  I put a Hand Stop and rail cover on mine and with my support hand exerting forward pressure on the stop the Pro is pretty stable.  I just sent my Form1 to BATFE to SBR it.  IWI USA tells me factory folding stocks will be available in two to four months.