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Posted: 2/2/2015 12:41:13 PM EDT
[#1]
I don't see values going down, as a whole. Just look at the 10/22. I bought one, with a 4x32 scope, for $150 in 2003. Same gun now, without a scope, is generally $200-$250. And some people pay more for the ones with metal trigger groups.
It's not something that's going to give you compound interest, but waiting long enough could net a decent profit down the road. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 12:56:10 PM EDT
[#2]
IMHO guns are not a great investment strategy. Most guns are purchased out of discretionary funds, and as such do not command a huge profit margin. As long as brand-new versions of the gun are available, what you have will always just be a used item. Maybe won't depreciate as fast as a used car, but unlikely to appreciate much in real terms above the rate of inflation. If you are lucky and buy something that is subsequently discontinued/unavailable (whether by the manufacturer or by government action), then it might increase significantly (a good example being transferable machine guns). Given recent history, you would get a better ROI from stockpiled ammo and reloading components.
If I were rolling the dice on investment guns, I'd buy Colt AR15s and 1911s... the way Colt is running their business into the ground, the Colt name could be a thing of the past in our lifetime. Also, pick up CMP guns (Garand, M1 carbine etc.) and lay them away for when the supply dries up. Investment IS a great reason to give the wife though 
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Posted: 2/2/2015 1:04:58 PM EDT
[#3]
My gun safe, now gun safes, have always been part of my investment portfolio. When I've had financial turmoil, I've always been able to see my guns for more than I paid for them.
But I'm not so sure about today's modular rifles (AR-15s) being good investments, for a few reasons: 1. Technology changing fast - Look at those old heavy quad rail setups, older optics, front sights, etc. The AR-15 of just a couple years ago is less desirable that the AR-15 of today, at least for most buyers. 2. Too many AR-15s - I have a couple dozen... many that I know are on the same boat. 3. Brand/Make irrelevant - You're buying a stripped lower, and God knows what the rest of it is? So, you are proving components, vs the entire rifle. And given rule #1 (above), the value of those components declines as newer/sexier ones come along. 4. Freanken-ARs... In addition to the couple dozen ARs I have, I also have a dozen or so stripped lowers. heck, you can buy two stripped lowers for $100, so why not? 10yrs from now, even if ARs are made illegal, I'll still be able to buy plenty of components (barrels, hand guards, triggers, etc.). I'll therefore be reasonably cheap for me to buy a bunch of components using 2024 technology, and strap them to one of my existing $50 lowers, than to build/buy a new rifle.... All I'm saying is, if you're heavily invested in ARs (as I am), their proliferation and modularity may impact the price negatively. Having said that, I expect my: Sig Sauer pistols, Glocks, Smiths, Weatherby's, etc. will all hold or appreciate. YMMV. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 1:31:45 PM EDT
[#4]
I've bought only one pistol with the intent of future value, a Cold Diamondback 4" in .22lr.... paid $350 for it... took it to local gun shows for about 4 years... no takers... finally sold it for $375... today they are listed on GunBroker for $1600 up... if you buy with disposable income, and can hold it.. I think most metal framed pistols from reputable manufacturers... SW, Colt, Ruger will at least maintain their value...probably not so much with the polymer framed pistols
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Posted: 2/2/2015 2:00:32 PM EDT
[#5]
About 1999 Al Gore was edging ahead in the poles and I was looking at a Colt 6724. They had been $1000 and now crept closer to $1100. They gun shop guy tried twisting my arm with "That gun will only make you money".
Last I looked 6724s are back to around $1K. The $1100 invested in about anything else 15 years ago would have compounded exponentially. I guess that's why he was gun salesman and not a Financial Advisor. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 2:00:58 PM EDT
[#6]
I have never purchased a firearm as an investment, only for actual usage to fulfill a need or requirement. If they go up in value while I own them then great, but it's not something I care about.
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Posted: 2/2/2015 2:12:53 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
About 1999 Al Gore was edging ahead in the poles and I was looking at a Colt 6724. They had been $1000 and now crept closer to $1100. They gun shop guy tried twisting my arm with "That gun will only make you money". Last I looked 6724s are back to around $1K. The $1100 invested in about anything else 15 years ago would have compounded exponentially. I guess that's why he was gun salesman and not a Financial Advisor. Ebb and flow. You could have sold that 6724 for a healthy profit after O was elected or after Newtown. Just because it's low right now doesn't mean the price can't double overnight. *note* In no way, shape or form I am not hoping for another panic. Overall, there are much better places to spend your money if making money is your end goal. That said, firearms are generally a very low risk investment. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 2:16:40 PM EDT
[#8]
I think of my guns as functional art that I can enjoy. I don't worry too much about making money from them.
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Posted: 2/2/2015 2:18:17 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
About 1999 Al Gore was edging ahead in the poles and I was looking at a Colt 6724. They had been $1000 and now crept closer to $1100. They gun shop guy tried twisting my arm with "That gun will only make you money". Last I looked 6724s are back to around $1K. The $1100 invested in about anything else 15 years ago would have compounded exponentially. I guess that's why he was gun salesman and not a Financial Advisor. I appreciate that you were willing to tell us this story, because it illustrates a side we don't usually hear mentioned. I've bought plenty of guns I've lost money on. I did the math, and semi-autos generally suck as investments - think 2.5% real return per year, and that's if it's something sexy like a Galil or HK. A random 870 isn't going to be worthwhile at all. Even with machineguns, you would have done WAY better buying the NASDAQ-100 back in 1986. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 3:08:08 PM EDT
[#10]
The vast majority of firearms sold just become used guns. Very very few can be considered investments. I've made serious money on two, maybe three guns over the years and it was not due to any clairvoyance on my part. Just dumb luck and hitting the politics right. . On the rest I was doing good to break even. Most I lost money on.
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Posted: 2/2/2015 4:09:32 PM EDT
[#11]
To me, my firearm collection is my hedge against very high inflation. They fit into my finance strategy as a non-dollar denominated asset that will have a fairly static real value. They won't get wiped out by stock market drops or bank scares or hyper inflation.
I'll use my 401k and other traditional investment vehicles for getting worthwhile returns. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 4:26:08 PM EDT
[#12]
I usually don't lose money when it comes to trading & selling firearm.
But, recently I lost money on almost all firearms that I either traded or sold. Market is pretty saturated right now especially AR market. I never buy guns as investment but don't like to loose money either. If you truly wanted to make some money on gun, then I would highly suggested you to jump on NFA bandwagon. Here's some example: NIB MP5 sear gun - paid $16K at 4 yrs ago now it's worth $30K+ NIB RLL - paid $6k about 4 yrs ago now it's worth $16-18K Steel DIAS - paid $22K about 3 yrs ago now worth *PRICELESS* NIB M11 - paid $1K 10yrs ago now about $6K YMMV |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 7:17:26 PM EDT
[#13]
Some antique firearms will only increase in value due to supply and demand. Surplus Enfield and Mauser rifles were abundant 20 years ago, and in that time their value has at least tripled. I seen Russian SKS rifles that used to sell for $125 selling for $500.
Political climate affects values, too. Before the demand for firearms in general dropped last year, I'd see used common, easy to find used .22 rifles such as the Ruger 10/22 and Marlin model 60 selling for as much as a new model. It wasn't just markup by the dealers. A friend purchased a 10/22 take down model, and financed it by selling his older 10/22 at for a new price. |
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Posted: 2/2/2015 7:33:15 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My gun safe, now gun safes, have always been part of my investment portfolio. When I've had financial turmoil, I've always been able to see my guns for more than I paid for them. But I'm not so sure about today's modular rifles (AR-15s) being good investments, for a few reasons: 1. Technology changing fast - Look at those old heavy quad rail setups, older optics, front sights, etc. The AR-15 of just a couple years ago is less desirable that the AR-15 of today, at least for most buyers. 2. Too many AR-15s - I have a couple dozen... many that I know are on the same boat. 3. Brand/Make irrelevant - You're buying a stripped lower, and God knows what the rest of it is? So, you are proving components, vs the entire rifle. And given rule #1 (above), the value of those components declines as newer/sexier ones come along. 4. Freanken-ARs... In addition to the couple dozen ARs I have, I also have a dozen or so stripped lowers. heck, you can buy two stripped lowers for $100, so why not? 10yrs from now, even if ARs are made illegal, I'll still be able to buy plenty of components (barrels, hand guards, triggers, etc.). I'll therefore be reasonably cheap for me to buy a bunch of components using 2024 technology, and strap them to one of my existing $50 lowers, than to build/buy a new rifle.... All I'm saying is, if you're heavily invested in ARs (as I am), their proliferation and modularity may impact the price negatively. Having said that, I expect my: Sig Sauer pistols, Glocks, Smiths, Weatherby's, etc. will all hold or appreciate. YMMV. The sentence in red reminds me of when I used to shop for old guitars. You could look at the aftermarket parts such as pickups, and get a good idea of when the owner modified it. In some cases it would decrease the value because the sound they produced is somewhat dated or common, otherwise it brought value because the buyer appreciates the vintage value. I can see how undesirable customization can lower prices. There seems to be a trend wih Mini-14's where you can get more money for a used Mini-14 if you sold it with it's factory stock versus an aftermarket stock. |
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Posted: 2/3/2015 11:09:32 AM EDT
[#15]
If you purchased Flemming HK auto-sears when they where $250 each (I know of a guy who purchased 20 at that price) then that would have been a GREAT investment!
However, in general and strictly from an investor's standpoint they don't do anywhere near as well as more traditional long term investment strategies. They are also subject to industry and regulatory changes that are often beyond prediction and can effect value greatly and quickly. There is also greater risk from fire,flood, theft, etc. and if you are actively using them (shooting, carrying) they are becoming much less valuable than pristine specimens. ETA- Are firearms investments? YES and if you take care of them and hold on to them long enough, you will likely be able to sell them for at least a little more than you paid. Are firearms a good investment for retirement income? NO, there are better strategies for investing now in order to support yourself later. |
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Posted: 2/3/2015 12:38:54 PM EDT
[#16]
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Posted: 2/3/2015 8:29:34 PM EDT
[#17]
If you want to look at firearms as a investment, first save your money. When the next crash hits and many are selling their guns, buy low. When the next upswing comes and everyone starts buying again, sell high.
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Posted: 2/3/2015 10:49:04 PM EDT
[#18]
investment yes, but its not a $$ return im expecting.
Im investing in my ability to shoot stuff
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Posted: 2/3/2015 11:06:25 PM EDT
[#19]
I have 401k, mutual fund, company stock, real estate for investing. Firearms are my hobby. I will say guns hold their value pretty well compared to most other hobbies. But don't really compare to real investments.
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Posted: 2/4/2015 3:31:03 PM EDT
[#20]
I look at them as an easily liquidized asset with the potential to gain value. Market conditions impact that a lot. I dumped a ton after Newtown, bought a condo, and now have more than before.
Some I buy because I know they are a screaming deal. |
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Posted: 2/4/2015 3:39:40 PM EDT
[#21]
It all depends on the gun. Your Glock is not an investment. An all matching C39? Potentially, yes.
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Posted: 2/4/2015 8:36:12 PM EDT
[#22]
Firearms are collectibles. Collectibles/antiques should be less than 5% of your overall investment strategy for most people. Unless you make it a business.
They tend to significantly under perform the market/traditional investments. |
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Posted: 2/5/2015 7:19:05 AM EDT
[#23]
It seems to me guns are really cheap right now, I was looking at a flyer from a local shop just this week and the prices were cheap, surprisingly cheap.
Smith&Wesson M&P 9MM and 40 cal NIB for $449 Springfield XD same cals as above $349(might be because the new model 2 cam out??) Delton ARs $529 and other entry level guns for only a little more. Another shop has Police trade Glock 22s for $279 I mean I am not complaining its better than the alternative but I wouldn't think buying to sell on down the road would be very profitable especially if nothing silly happens. |
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Posted: 2/5/2015 10:35:22 AM EDT
[#24]
Bad investment. One new law passes banning sales or transfers and your investment drops to zero.
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Posted: 2/7/2015 9:49:11 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
IMHO guns are not a great investment strategy. Most guns are purchased out of discretionary funds, and as such do not command a huge profit margin. As long as brand-new versions of the gun are available, what you have will always just be a used item. The above is correct. For investments the best choices are full-auto or US Military firearms (in good/original condition). |
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Posted: 2/7/2015 10:47:27 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The above is correct. For investments the best choices are full-auto or US Military firearms (in good/original condition). Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
IMHO guns are not a great investment strategy. Most guns are purchased out of discretionary funds, and as such do not command a huge profit margin. As long as brand-new versions of the gun are available, what you have will always just be a used item. The above is correct. For investments the best choices are full-auto or US Military firearms (in good/original condition). You're part of the problem. Index funds are investments |
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Posted: 2/8/2015 10:36:37 AM EDT
[#27]
A full-auto gun MAY be a good investment if you can resist shooting it. The ammo you dump thru it will easily burn any profit most will make reselling theirs.
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Posted: 2/9/2015 2:39:09 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You're part of the problem. Index funds are investments Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
IMHO guns are not a great investment strategy. Most guns are purchased out of discretionary funds, and as such do not command a huge profit margin. As long as brand-new versions of the gun are available, what you have will always just be a used item. The above is correct. For investments the best choices are full-auto or US Military firearms (in good/original condition). You're part of the problem. Index funds are investments Love index funds because of their low operating costs. Full Auto firearms have done quite well however. |
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Posted: 2/10/2015 4:33:51 AM EDT
[#29]
Not that it is a great investment. I wouldn't even call it that. But pre-Sand Hook I would buy receivers. As other have noted, every buy in Krakafornia is a panic buy. I have been buying lowers, and Nodak receivers, AK parts kits etc since 06/07. After January 2013 I did very well. These scares happen ever few years, and it is nice to be ahead of the curve. Going forward I am going to be sure to get some BCG's, and LPK's. You won't get rich, and I wouldn't rely solely on it, but you do get ahead.
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Posted: 2/10/2015 12:26:39 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Love index funds because of their low operating costs. Full Auto firearms have done quite well however. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
IMHO guns are not a great investment strategy. Most guns are purchased out of discretionary funds, and as such do not command a huge profit margin. As long as brand-new versions of the gun are available, what you have will always just be a used item. The above is correct. For investments the best choices are full-auto or US Military firearms (in good/original condition). You're part of the problem. Index funds are investments Love index funds because of their low operating costs. Full Auto firearms have done quite well however. You're missing the point. They've done great becasue of an artificial cap on supply. You're hedging against your 2A rights. I don't suppose you're donating to Nolo's lawsuit 
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Posted: 2/25/2015 2:34:14 PM EDT
[#31]
AR's are a terrible investment because the market is saturated and new technology makes AR's from even 3-4 years ago obsolete.
AK's and surplus military rifles will be a pretty good investment. 5 years ago I got a Russian Capture Mauser98 for 250 bucks and they had crates of them in stock. Now you can only find them on gunbroker and they sell for 500-600 bucks consistently. I remember when an SKS cost less than 200 and now you will pay at least 450 for an SKS that isn't a complete sewer pipe of a gun. Even Mosin-Nagants used to be had for 80 bucks for a good hex receiver 5 years ago, now it's rare to see them below 180 or so. So if you want an "investment" that you can take out to the range and have fun with, get you an old bolt action military rifle or an M-1 Garand. |
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Posted: 2/25/2015 7:03:25 PM EDT
[#32]
Firearms are a good investment if you pick and choose and have the funds. The market as we know is flooded for gun collectors, take a look at the amount of people that do not even own a firearm. There is a lot faster way to make money on your investment in a real world scenario as long as the real world scenario is good with 18 trillion worth of debt. It will be hard for a market crash to snatch those firearms from your portfolio. I know a person that has several FNC carbines unfired that were bought in the 80's for several hundred dollars each, along with series 70 colt pistols at a really cheap price for todays market. What are they worth now for collectors. Just have to have vision. What would an unfired Belgium 20 ga with a 200 dollar investment be worth today in the box.
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Posted: 2/26/2015 1:57:16 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
AR's are a terrible investment because the market is saturated and new technology makes AR's from even 3-4 years ago obsolete. AK's and surplus military rifles will be a pretty good investment. 5 years ago I got a Russian Capture Mauser98 for 250 bucks and they had crates of them in stock. Now you can only find them on gunbroker and they sell for 500-600 bucks consistently. I remember when an SKS cost less than 200 and now you will pay at least 450 for an SKS that isn't a complete sewer pipe of a gun. Even Mosin-Nagants used to be had for 80 bucks for a good hex receiver 5 years ago, now it's rare to see them below 180 or so. So if you want an "investment" that you can take out to the range and have fun with, get you an old bolt action military rifle or an M-1 Garand. So what is this new tech that makes my 6920 obsolete? |
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Posted: 2/26/2015 2:52:45 PM EDT
[#34]
My Colt M16A1 has been a great investment! 100% return in 9 years.
I think guns are a good investment and when I run into unexpected bills; I have a safe full of options. |
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Posted: 2/26/2015 4:05:28 PM EDT
[#35]
My goal is when I'm old to set up a table at gun shows and sell 90% of my collection. As long as it keeps up with inflation I'll be happy.
I always thought it would be fun to find some young guy who was just drooling over something and sell it for what I have in it. It would make their day. |
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Posted: 2/26/2015 5:01:27 PM EDT
[#36]
Guns are a hobby for most of us, and any gains are either by getting a great price or by luck/artificial limitations of supply/rarity/panics, like the MG owners who have already spoken.
Taxes might also take a bite out of your "profit". I have spent a lot on this hobby, but by luck the value of my MGs has outweighed the ammo and accessory purchases by far. My ammo hoarding and reloading has paid off in reducing the costs of opertaion, but has not eliminated them. You can delude yourself into thinking it's an investment, but c'mon! Add up what you've spent in guns and ammo, and the value now, and figure the return on investment, and it won't be good... but it was fun! |
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Posted: 2/26/2015 5:37:17 PM EDT
[#37]
If you trade firearms into ffl dealers, you're going to lose, but if you have desirable models, and use the internet, to sell off what you may have to, or don't want anymore, I believe you will do ok.
But, you'll only do all right, if you purchased at reasonable prices, and took care of your stuff. If you go into any Cabela's, Gander Mt., Dick's, Bass Pro, or whatever, almost anything you buy in those stores, will be sold by you, at a garage sale ten years down the line, at an 80%+ loss. So, basically, most stuff in those stores, will be almost worthless in the future. Firearms, and ammo, are the exceptions. They will retain far more of their value than just about anything else sold in those stores. If you get lucky, and there is panic buying, or if you buy firearms, or ammo, that are discontinued, and in high demand, you can actually make money on your purchases, if you decide to sell. You are going to lose a ton of money buying most new vehicles, especially if you keep them 10+ years, but with guns and ammo, you will lose less, percentage wise; a lot less. Can you make more money on investments? Of course you can, but that's not the point, here. It's a hobby, and if you can hold your own in it economically, with little financial loss, what's not to like? Of course, with the ammo you shoot, you are going to lose all of your investment there, unless you keep the brass, and get some money back. |
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Posted: 2/27/2015 1:36:53 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So what is this new tech that makes my 6920 obsolete? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
AR's are a terrible investment because the market is saturated and new technology makes AR's from even 3-4 years ago obsolete. AK's and surplus military rifles will be a pretty good investment. 5 years ago I got a Russian Capture Mauser98 for 250 bucks and they had crates of them in stock. Now you can only find them on gunbroker and they sell for 500-600 bucks consistently. I remember when an SKS cost less than 200 and now you will pay at least 450 for an SKS that isn't a complete sewer pipe of a gun. Even Mosin-Nagants used to be had for 80 bucks for a good hex receiver 5 years ago, now it's rare to see them below 180 or so. So if you want an "investment" that you can take out to the range and have fun with, get you an old bolt action military rifle or an M-1 Garand. So what is this new tech that makes my 6920 obsolete? The 6940. Sure the 6920 is not obsolete and many people would prefer it to the 6940. Yes it is a perfectly good gun and I'm sure you could get 6-700 bucks out of it if you were to sell it but it's probably not gaining value anytime soon. |
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