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Posted: 1/3/2003 12:50:14 AM EST
Ammo FAQ: www.ammo-oracle.com
(Old) Mag FAQ: magfaq.tripod.com

Barrel? Go CHROME or go home.
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Posted: 1/3/2003 1:22:04 AM EST
Very Helpfull
AR15 $900
Case of .223 $130
Pissin off a liberal... Priceless
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Posted: 1/4/2003 8:59:39 PM EST
Troy, nice chart.
I wonder why Colt doesn't make a DCM/CMP rifle?
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Posted: 1/4/2003 9:31:02 PM EST
Troy your chart is GREAT! A very nice tool for buyers.

Just as a note, DPMS has 1:8 twist as an option (or standard) on everything but their Race Gun that comes with 1:8 only. DPMS also has a variety of lightweight 16" and 20" barrels.
We are living in a golden age. The past was pretty awful; the future will be far worse. Enjoy!
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Posted: 1/4/2003 10:18:39 PM EST
Once again Troy--You are the man!
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Posted: 1/4/2003 10:27:34 PM EST
Nice work!
The world's a cold place; better pack your own heat.
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Posted: 1/4/2003 10:42:31 PM EST
gee hesse really sucks.

chrome line barrels? No
stainless barrels ava?unknown
barrel source? unknown
hard coat anodized recievers?No
cast or forged?Cast
M4 barrel ava? No
other lightweight barrels?No
Preban rifles?No
%of total market for 2000?1%

and the big finisher....

warranty length? NONE!!!!


How in the hell do they even stay in business?

Assault is an Action, Not an object.
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Posted: 1/5/2003 2:57:35 AM EST
Excellent reference!

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Posted: 1/5/2003 4:07:41 AM EST

Originally Posted By WolfAR15:

How in the hell do they even stay in business?




Same way any "budget" manufacturer stays in business - by catering to customers whose main concern is initial purchase price.


Nice tool, Troy!!!
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Posted: 1/5/2003 8:02:41 AM EST
Now that's the reason I joined this site. People like Troy doing research like that and posting it for the rest of us.

Great Job!!!
Have you seen the Honda Valkyrie Rune?
I want one in Illusion Blue!!!

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Posted: 1/5/2003 8:30:15 AM EST
Nice chart, but please note that ArmaLite does offer 1:8 twist also.

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Posted: 1/5/2003 12:37:09 PM EST
But Troy, what exactly does this chart mean to all those who say Colt is BY FAR the best AR on the market?

I'm worried for them. They've dedicated themselves to a cause without merit. We might need an ARFCOM 12 step program to "deprogram" the propaganda they've suffered from for so long.

"Class, we all know Colt makes a very nice AR, so lets start with that premise, mmmmm k? Now remain calm.....I have some shocking news for you. They have nothing on Bushmaster. The two companies produce rifles of about identical quality." "Martha....could you run and get us some tissues please.....make it a LOT of tissues. Thanks" "Hey, you in the back, put that razor down! And you up front, what do you think you're doing with all those pills? Don't make me come over there.....and think of your Colt AR, what will happen to it when you're gone? Come on people, keep it together."
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Posted: 1/5/2003 1:37:07 PM EST
ROTFLMFAO!!
" no tack (driver), no bull (barrel)" -damn "Feinstein state"
the <font color=red>red</font id=red> X in
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Posted: 1/5/2003 1:44:43 PM EST
Colt, schmolt!
<img src=/images/smilies/smiley_tomcat.gif border=0 align=middle>

I don't trust anyone in the government.
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Posted: 1/5/2003 5:18:51 PM EST
Thanks, Troy!
"Send lawyers, guns, and money"
The late, great Warren Zevon
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Posted: 1/5/2003 6:44:49 PM EST
Finally

Job well done

Can't beleive I never thought to do this.
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Posted: 1/8/2003 2:13:11 AM EST
Troy, in the thread that you linked to, budam posted that he contacted Oly Arms and they verified that their recievers are hard coat anodized.

Just when you thought that you were done...
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Posted: 1/9/2003 6:00:43 AM EST
Under "Armalite/Prebah Rifles" remember that the AR-180 IS such a rifle.
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Posted: 1/11/2003 12:19:38 AM EST
Troy:
Nice work!!!!
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees" - Emilio Zapata <img src=/images/smilies/smiley_bandit.gif border=0 align=mi
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Posted: 1/11/2003 12:39:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By NYPatriot:
Troy, in the thread that you linked to, budam posted that he contacted Oly Arms and they verified that their recievers are hard coat anodized.



Thanks for keeping an eye out!

Yes, Olympic receivers are hard coat anodized.
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Posted: 1/13/2003 12:22:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/13/2003 12:25:13 PM EST by QuanticoArms]
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Posted: 1/17/2003 3:46:39 PM EST
I have an Oly "Maxhard" lower on one of mine.

I beleive they still offer this.

My motto ? "Shoot first, questions later. You get alot less questions that way."
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Posted: 1/20/2003 4:44:42 PM EST
Colt and bushmaster both identical.
Your ass hurts M4. Last I cheked you cant seperate the two halves with out a screwdriver, the trapdoor in the stock is made of the cheepest plastic(BM is more beefy with a metal latch) and what about that plastic buffer(once again metal used on the BM).
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Posted: 1/20/2003 5:25:15 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/20/2003 5:27:04 PM EST by M4]

Originally Posted By BALOO:
Colt and bushmaster both identical.
Your ass hurts M4. Last I cheked you cant seperate the two halves with out a screwdriver, the trapdoor in the stock is made of the cheepest plastic(BM is more beefy with a metal latch) and what about that plastic buffer(once again metal used on the BM).



Hey BALOO, keep strokin' the barrel of your Colt, it just might cum for you one of these days...you friggin' nit wit.

"The two companies produce rifles of about identical quality."

I own pre-ban AR's from both Bushy & Colt and the differences in NO WAY justify the rediculous price differences. Thanks for the input, a real slice of genius.

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Posted: 1/20/2003 7:51:27 PM EST
Hey ass munch in that case all companies produce ABOUT identical quality.
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Posted: 1/20/2003 8:59:12 PM EST

Originally Posted By BALOO:
Hey ass munch in that case all companies produce ABOUT identical quality.



A) No they don't. ***See chart above.***

B) Slap a little Vagisil on that sore twat of yours, the swelling will go down, I'm sure.

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Posted: 1/21/2003 4:29:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By garandman:
I have an Oly "Maxhard" lower on one of mine.

I beleive they still offer this.



Yes they do. I have more of them coming in right now.
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Posted: 1/21/2003 4:31:17 AM EST
For DPMS, you need to add note 6 to the twist rates. DPMS offers various...
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Posted: 2/4/2003 8:38:20 AM EST
Have you ever done/considered doing a chart of which brand/grain/caliber (.223 vs 5.56mm) from best to worse should be put through the various brands of rifles?

I would love to see somethinglike that, or if anyone can recommend an idiot's version of what I am talking about,let me know.

Duhhhh...

Matt
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Posted: 2/6/2003 5:53:39 AM EST
Troy,

You list some as .223 and some as 5.56 and some as .223/5.56.

What is the difference?

Thanks,
Eaker
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Posted: 2/7/2003 6:01:07 AM EST
I believe .223/5.56 is a Wylde Chamber, right guys?

Quote from the FAQ:
"Some AR manufacturers use an in-between chamber spec, such as the Wylde chamber. Many mis-mark their barrels too, which further complicates things. You can generally tell what sort of chamber you are dealing with by the markings on the weapon, but always check with the manufacturer to be sure."

This is from an FAQ about RRA Wylde Chmaber:
http://talk.shooters.com/room_3/Oct172002.cfm



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Posted: 2/20/2003 1:57:29 AM EST
Hey Troy,

Sent you email about Oly being anodized twice via email. Is it not working? Let me know if you need anything else in updating table.
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Posted: 2/23/2003 9:32:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/23/2003 9:34:43 AM EST by stator]
Bushmaster buys barrel blanks and turns, chambers them. I believe Jarrod stated this several years ago here. I would expect only Colt makes the barrel from raw stock. Even then, they probably contract for the blank too.
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Posted: 3/21/2003 5:15:39 PM EST
Troy, great post.
And... I see a lot of Colt envy here. Why bash some one else unless you're insecure about your own weapon(s).
And btw, I own Colt, Bushy, E.A., and DPMS, so it ain't just Colt loyalty. They all make great weapons. Except hesse.
Now I want/need an Armalite.
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Posted: 5/14/2003 5:01:46 PM EST
Just a quick note that DPMS also makes a left-handed model of the AR-15. Nice Chart
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Posted: 6/14/2003 1:22:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 6/14/2003 1:26:07 AM EST by Belial]

Originally Posted By QuanticoArms:
Because (choose one)
A. They can't build accurate rifles?
B. They don't understand the market?
C. They're always bankrupt, so can't produce another model?
D: ???? ---> Come up with your own


Originally Posted By ECS:
I wonder why Colt doesn't make a DCM/CMP rifle?




Now that is funny!!!!!!!!!!
Its only funny until someone gets hurt...Then its hilarious...
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Posted: 6/26/2003 1:08:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 6/29/2003 3:54:20 PM EST by jtb33]
-
www.ArizonaShooting.com
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Posted: 6/29/2003 11:53:45 AM EST

Originally Posted By ECS:
Troy, nice chart.
I wonder why Colt doesn't make a DCM/CMP rifle?



They do...Colt service rifle
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Posted: 7/1/2003 8:57:34 AM EST
Isn't Vagasil what Dianne Feinstein (who has a CCW Permit) uses to lube her handgun? What a woman of the people.

It's not that they put themselves above the law (as they do) but the arrogance of putting themselves above the people is the source of the outrage.

They'll tell you their job is to govern the people if you ask the question correctly, bedcause that's what they believe. They're devoid of the concept that their job is to govern the United States Government, on behalf of the American People of the States they represent.

How did we let them turn that into collecting revenues from all the States to redistribute them to the People of their own State's, for the purpose of exploiting that tool in securing their election to, or perptuating their overstay (see Robert Bird, Strom Thurmond, etc.) in their respecting legislative bodies?

Now stop fighting and FOCUS. Or we're going to be using that chart for toiltet paper.
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Posted: 7/27/2003 9:59:11 AM EST
I'll just keep buying bushmasters, thank you very much. But a good resource nonetheless.

Buy Bushmaster!
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Posted: 8/9/2003 11:48:09 AM EST

Originally Posted By texashark:
Troy, great post.
And... I see a lot of Colt envy here. Why bash some one else unless you're insecure about your own weapon(s).
And btw, I own Colt, Bushy, E.A., and DPMS, so it ain't just Colt loyalty. They all make great weapons. Except hesse.
Now I want/need an Armalite.




How about downright colt hatred? ps in case you didn't notice, they don't give a rats ass about what you want in a gun. I hope they just go away.

lessee- messed up the takedown pins. (isn't that enought?) use plastic buffers now. did that wacky "block" in the trigger well so all us evil gun owners can't use a legal dias.

ohh, before i forget, how bout the rip-off price? I think colt considers regular consumers just like the government- don't know what we want, are willing to pay twice what it is worth and what other companies make them for, etc etc.


don't ever accuse me of colt envy- they don't have anything i want!

what site?
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Posted: 12/18/2003 7:23:21 PM EST
Howdie - As a newcomer, where might one learn about the various terminology used in Troy's chart above and what the pros/cons are to the variations? Any websites, books, etc...?
Thanks.
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Posted: 12/19/2003 1:11:27 AM EST
Ammo FAQ: www.ammo-oracle.com
(Old) Mag FAQ: magfaq.tripod.com

Barrel? Go CHROME or go home.
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Posted: 1/20/2004 1:09:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/20/2004 1:10:22 AM EST by POF-USA]
Troy,

Nice list. Very informative for someone that is looking to buy a weapon. Do you know the selling prices for each company?

Frank
POF-USA

(Weighs 45% Less and Cost 42% less)
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Posted: 3/4/2004 8:52:22 PM EST
I need some input on AR`s. When I pick one up I will probably buy surplus ammo at the local shows. Which rate of twist is best for most milspec ammo? I see mainly DPMS and Rock River at the Dallas shows, how do they stack up side by side? It will be used mainly for casual shooting, I want something between the 22RF`s & 30-06`s I currently have. All advise appreciated, thanks. DAVE
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Posted: 3/4/2004 9:05:44 PM EST
Ammo FAQ: www.ammo-oracle.com
(Old) Mag FAQ: magfaq.tripod.com

Barrel? Go CHROME or go home.
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Posted: 3/15/2004 11:52:37 PM EST
Between DPMS and RRA, I'd have to suggest Rock River. Great quality gun, plus they just secured a DEA contract (not that that's saying much), their prices ain't too bad either. I'm still a Bushmaster man though... -Op
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Posted: 5/13/2004 5:48:35 PM EST
Nice List.
Thanks for the work
Chameleon Weaponry - brass
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  • May 2003
  • USA SD, USA
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Posted: 5/19/2004 3:24:29 PM EST
The chart isn't showing up for me right now.

Did the photoserver upgrade "unlink" it? Or is it just me?

www.chameleonweaponry.com

The person who complains the most, and is the most critical of others has the most to hide.
Token Colt freak
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  • USA NH, USA
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Posted: 5/22/2004 2:17:16 AM EST
A clarification on Colt's warranty:



www.colt.com/CMCI/lifetime_agreement.asp
My wife wants me to buy her a Bushmaster Lady <img src=/images/smilies/icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle> What's next, stigmata?
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  • USA VA, USA
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Posted: 6/4/2004 6:43:27 AM EST
Ha! Hesse Arms doesn't even have a website!

How hard is it these days to get web hosting? They must be in some kind of trouble, or run by a bunch of fat rednecks that smell like cigarette smoke and have a filthy workplace.

You know what I'm talking about.
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