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Posted: 5/15/2017 7:59:16 AM EDT
I noticed in some other picture threads guys running right eye on -14's.  What are the pros and cons.  Unless you are left-handed, isn't it better to run left eye?

Here's my thinking.  With the device over the non-dominate eye, I still have pretty good night vision out of my dominate eye which helps with navigation.  Also, it seems to help blend or meld the two images into one, because the dominate eye is working harder, so to speak.  And finally you have better sight of your weapon as you manipulate it and perhaps better clearance for a chin weld on the stock.

That being said, are there other times and places for running right or dominate eye with these things?  I have read about guys using a modified stock weld to look through their RDS with helmet-mounted devices, but that sounds like pretty specialized cases?  Of course if it's weapon-mounted you're shooting dominate eye.  And if you are using it as a hand-held monocular, and scanning with it like a day optic, then yeah OK you're also using dominate eye.  But if it's helmet-mounted?
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 8:14:59 AM EDT
[#1]
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 8:56:43 AM EDT
[#2]
Gotcha.  I think the eye-fatigue thing on a long patrol is a valid point.  Most of my training has been short duration so I will have to push that out some.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 11:07:51 AM EDT
[#3]
Augee made some good points in this thread: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_6_18/476217_New-to-NV--School-Me.html&page=1

I absolutely don't want to be one of the guys that is distracted by a million gizmos and that is constantly deciding between a million techniques but I am a firm believer that anyone using an MNVD for martial use should be comfortable using the MNVD over either eye for many reasons. There is probably an existing thread where this is better placed for compilation value purposes. If not then we can start running it here.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 12:31:59 PM EDT
[#4]
OP, the word you're looking for is "dominant," not dominate.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 2:40:18 PM EDT
[#5]
Wow, that is an amazing thread, don't know how I missed it.

I like the concept of the higher riser mount.  Not only for NV but just GP use.  I don't have trouble adjusting my stock weld, as I worked from iron sights, to RDS, to IR laser.  This merely puts a new one in between std RDS height and using an IR illum/pointer.  I have found that as long as I'm on the other fundamentals, such as firm off-hand pressure into the shoulder pocket, and looking straight through the sights, and good trigger press, I'm OK with different stock weld positions on my cheek or chin.  

As this relates to NV, this opens up a whole new world for me.  Glad I asked this question because with peer-to-peer engagements, staying passive might be a very good idea.  But being weapons-mounted severely restricts your options.  So being able to finally get behind the RDS with a helmet-mounted system is huge.  Thanks to all, especially SOT and Augee (again) for the info.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 3:01:07 PM EDT
[#6]
I was either lucky or just bound and determine to use the stuff because I have had zero issues with integrating an augmented eye with a normal night vision one.  As long as I keep the gain half-way close to the non-aided eye, they blend together nicely.  The only headaches I had initially were from the helmet weight and grip around my head.  After a few uses, and an added counter-weight I've been fine.  Maybe it helps if you have been practicing day-time shooting with both eyes open?  I have been forcing my eyes to blend optic and normal view together for years so the -14 was nothing too new to accept.  

Has anyone thought about some kind of lightly padded cradle for the NVMD to rest against to use this technique?  I realize this would cover up the rear iron sight, so an extra step would be involved to use BUIS, but...?  Would this give you a more stable position to center the -14 to the RDS reticle?  

Or would it be worth it to remove the BUIS, since you have RDS, IR pointer/illum, and IR RDS.  These three options give you a red dot with an unaided eye, a laser pointer/illum with NV, and a red dot (well green) with NV.  Some guys would even have a viz red/green laser pointer (and illum).  At this point do you even need BUIS?
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 4:07:04 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I was either lucky or just bound and determine to use the stuff because I have had zero issues with integrating an augmented eye with a normal night vision one.  As long as I keep the gain half-way close to the non-aided eye, they blend together nicely.  The only headaches I had initially were from the helmet weight and grip around my head.  After a few uses, and an added counter-weight I've been fine.  Maybe it helps if you have been practicing day-time shooting with both eyes open?  I have been forcing my eyes to blend optic and normal view together for years so the -14 was nothing too new to accept.  

Has anyone thought about some kind of lightly padded cradle for the NVMD to rest against to use this technique?  I realize this would cover up the rear iron sight, so an extra step would be involved to use BUIS, but...?  Would this give you a more stable position to center the -14 to the RDS reticle?  

Or would it be worth it to remove the BUIS, since you have RDS, IR pointer/illum, and IR RDS.  These three options give you a red dot with an unaided eye, a laser pointer/illum with NV, and a red dot (well green) with NV.  Some guys would even have a viz red/green laser pointer (and illum).  At this point do you even need BUIS?
View Quote
I am a natural adapter with NV. I have watched a few people have serious struggles. Part of the problem may be physiological but I use a lot of different optical equipment and I think part of it has to do with the fact that I have already adapted to other equipment.

I considered some kind of an index for the MNVD but decided against it. When you are on the clock you don't want to have to get aligned on a cradle. If you missed perfect alignment then you might be out of the cradle and unable to get a sight picture at all. I use a Harris S25C bipod when I need solid shots at distance. The extra length lets me shoot from sitting position and work over rubble or vegetation. A solid body index helps a lot. Give the passive method a whirl if you have a spacer available. Just from talking to you I think you will adapt well to it.

I have a carbine optimized for night use that is still daylight capable:

1) OTAL
2) EOTech
3) Troy Offset Iron Sights

I need to cam the pistol grip outboard a little for iron sight usage. I have shot night matches (no NV allowed) and the coordinators are pretty good at setting the stages. I had a stage once where I was bobbling back and forth between white light / no light plus an EOTech and I could not get my illumination and sight picture together very well with either combination due to visible light splashback from a barrier. I tagged one target first shot and then pop, pop, pop, pop... it probably took me at least 5 to 7 shots to get the second target right next to it. If it had been a live target then it would have been free and clear. Offset irons with white light probably would have done well. Co-witnessed irons viewing through the EOTech would have had much of the same issues because it was the lens that was causing the problem. BUIS are still worth the extra weight for me for the small amount of situations where they are the only solution. I want to be capable 24 hours - not just 23. Do a 24 hour training session and you will see your sighting systems behave differently during different lighting conditions. You can even do this dry fire if you are honest with yourself and you are willing to admit when you do not have a solid sight picture. Rapidly changing from one lighting condition to another, white light On/Off and going from open spaces to confined spaces in short order all play havoc with perception and, therefor, sight picture. Adding NV to the mix helps a lot but also makes the equation more complicated. Task overload is always right around the corner.

The short story? Keep your irons.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 5:20:01 PM EDT
[#8]
Nice.  Sometimes I get tunnel vision based on my perceived mission requirements.  My assumption is low/no light; NV and IR laser, multiple targets without NV capability.  But yeah like the old prepper joke, you get ready for a nuclear strike and a little bug does you in.  I need to re-evaluate my engagement scenarios and the lighting therein.

You are probably right on the cradle; the damn thing is so oddly shaped it would be hard to get any kind of mate; probably be best to get the cheek/chin weld dialed in and strive to look straight through the optic(s).

Ditto on irons.  Despite 3-4 different aiming systems, it may come down to BUIS's.

Good thread.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 6:47:10 PM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Nice.  Sometimes I get tunnel vision based on my perceived mission requirements.  My assumption is low/no light; NV and IR laser, multiple targets without NV capability.  But yeah like the old prepper joke, you get ready for a nuclear strike and a little bug does you in.  I need to re-evaluate my engagement scenarios and the lighting therein.

You are probably right on the cradle; the damn thing is so oddly shaped it would be hard to get any kind of mate; probably be best to get the cheek/chin weld dialed in and strive to look straight through the optic(s).

Ditto on irons.  Despite 3-4 different aiming systems, it may come down to BUIS's.

Good thread.
View Quote
I like a little extra height on the riser so I can overshoot the alignment a little without smacking the MNVD. If the MNVD hits the carbine then I find it slows me versus just getting a little overshoot and then correcting. 3/4" for the absolute co-witness sights and 5/8" for the lower third sights seems to do the job.

The VLTOR CASV and the ARMS SIR shine for this because they already have a small rise. There are a lot of good 1/2" risers available. 3/4" are a little work to find.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 10:16:59 PM EDT
[#10]
I am definitely gonna try a riser on my NV carbine.  And maybe on my back-up.

So Ok there are good reasons to run dominant (that OK Texas?) eye NV.

Learned me something new.
Link Posted: 5/15/2017 10:40:24 PM EDT
[#11]
If the laser is already zeroed then wedge the riser in place and view the reticle through the PVS-14 with a background at your zero distance. Flash the laser to see where your reticle is in relationship to the laser. Adjust the reticle to match the laser. You now have a rough zero. Live fire to verify.

Going back to non-riser use is the same process except that you remove the riser.
Link Posted: 5/16/2017 6:46:24 AM EDT
[#12]
Roger that.  Kinda zeroing in reverse.
Link Posted: 5/17/2017 6:39:44 AM EDT
[#13]
Not all my guns have an IR laser, but almost all my guns have a T-1 mounted on them.  I keep my -14 on the dominant eye for this reason.
Link Posted: 5/18/2017 7:45:01 AM EDT
[#14]
Well, yeah if you have a riser under each one of them.  The J-arm (or dual dovetail adapter) will easily adjust to either eye, so it shouldn't be an issue, switching from one gun, or mode, to the next.  I think practicing with both eyes makes sense.  

I've learned a lot about this stuff recently.  Being able to fight both active and passive with NV, as well as with visual light or laser, and BUIS.  Being able to seamlessly switch from one mode to the next.  Much to consider!
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