Shocked? Where do you get that I am shocked?

As for your statements about Germanium, like many of the other statements in this thread, I just don't know what was smoked before they were made.

When 97% of the world's Germanium is produced outside of the United States (by China and Russia), I'm not sure how 100% of Germanium is controlled by the DoD. Unless you mean the scraggly little bit produced in the US.

Time for me to unsubscribe from this thread. Enjoy your echo chamber.

-Stooxie

Sounds good, over and out!

Will await your informative future comments on the Boson line of VOx microbolometers over the coming 10 year product life span.

More to the point- Vic was staunchly in the "mounting a PVS-14 on a .308 is a BAD idea" camp from the moment I posted the question asking if the linked item was somehow "special".

After a great deal of ego and bombast later (but ZERO supporting technical data) on the part of the selling vendor it came down to the technical gurus (including Vic) on one side and the giant ego on the other.

I figured you would not have a clue of what I was talking about, ie, that there is a finite limited amount of germanium available for use in civilian markets for end purposes such as civilian thermal lenses for sportsmen, which is why it remains the most expensive part of any thermal device.

Germanium is widely used for infrared lens design, especially in the 7-15 micrometer Mid-IR wavelength spectrum.  Excellent correction of wavelength aberrations is due to germanium’s high refractive index (4.0) and  the aspheric surfaces achievable when using the diamond turning process.

Although VOx microbolometer focal plane arrays are now getting down to the 12 micron size, that is the lower limit of thermoresistor size reduction since that just so happens that is also the mid-IR wavelength band that is being sampled by the thermoresistor, which also means that reductions in weight, size of lenses, focal length, etc. is also not going to shrink any further.

Due primarily to market constraints of strategically restricted elemental germanium, prices of thermal devices available to consumers will not be going much lower and production will not be going much higher, even with the use of other substandard germanium substitutes being designed to help alleviate this problem .

The only way around this dilemma is the use of cooled microbolometers and that technology will not be getting into consumers hands anytime soon for the price of a song and a dance.

https://pr-infrared.com/wp-content/themes/PR-Infrared/pdf/Security_App_Cooled_vs_uncooled_s.pdf



BTW, FYI, the Boson cores will all have F/1.0 germanium lenses for maximum sensitivity, it doesn't get any better than that!

whoa whoa whoa!!! I thought you kept insisting this thread is about Q14-C TWS!!! Over and over, in fact. It seems like the thread only goes back to being "about" that when you don't like what someone says as a way to redirect from their points without having to address them. You've spent plenty of time in this thread participating in the discussion about Q14B's, FLIR's marketing strategies, your background, your feelings about everyone here, and now germanium...

I'd say that if the majority of the 9 pages of a thread do not reference a Q14C TWS, and the OP has been highly participatory in "off-topic" discussions within, the thread itself is decidedly NOT "about" the Q14-C TWS, despite what the original post intended. 

Glad you brought this up because as the old adage goes -> ignorance truly is bliss!

The real reason I am excited about the new FLIR Boson cores is do to the fact that uncooled microbolometers and lenses have reached a pinnacle in their design due to certain constraints in specific materials and construction and will be rather static for the next decade.

So what is so exciting about the new FLIR Boson core to those interested in Thermography?

Simple, it is the embedded Movidius Myriad 2 12-core image processor, which allows expandable infrared video processing architecture to take advantage of advanced image processing and video analytics while keeping power consumption low.  Cars, weapons sights, handheld imagers, security cameras will now have the ability to process video onboard, and allow Boson to do things previous core designs were incable of.

Specifically the video analytics image processing capabilities will be designed for AI applications to improve Positive Identification at greater ranges, stadimetric range determinations, trajectories, true radiometric determinations, and a host of other AI applications such as those now being used used by Goggle, Facebook, large metropolitan security cameras, etc. etc. for video algorithium analytics which previously were unavailable in thermal image processing.

Intel recently bought out Movidius for these very same application reasons.

The Movidius core image processor is not accessible through the FLIR Boson GUI and the FLIR Boson SDK is not able to reach it either, thereby keeping the AI algorithiums proprietary and off limits to outsiders.

This is where the foreseeable future of high end thermal imagers is going, all developed through software applications through video imaging microprocessors, and at the current time, Boson uncooled VOx thermal imagers are the only thermal imagers available to consumers outside of scientific research, industrial applications, and military use.

So, like I mentioned previously in this thread that went over the heads of the majority of non-technically orientated Arfcom members, what you are getting is something you have little to no idea about and which is the basis for unreal future upgrade applications.

And guess what?

The Boson C-Series TWS includes all this as do other FLIR products with the Boson cores!

So when conspiracy theorists spend the majority of their Arfcom time dreaming and fantasing about what exactly it is I do with my FLIR gear on my property, now they will have even more to hypothesize about!

Seriously man?

I knew you'd have a really technical thermal question to ask!

Skypup has a sense of humor I truly appreciate, because brains send panties into bunches in today's society

Let's hear from the triggered again.  You're on a roll Sky pup. I hope I don't get a tummy ache from too much pop corn.

Well, when you ask yourself:

"Why would a big mean ugly wicked multinational corporation like FLIR spend the $$$millions$$$ in R&D to produce such an awesome microbolometer kit with an integrated video analytics microprocessor for a bunch of dumbass redneck hog and coyote slayers on Arfcom like me?"

The answer once again is simple, they didn't.

They produced the the Boson cores for military specifications promulgated by DARPRA and CERDED NVESD to help our military service men and women on the battlefield become valkyries in the coming decade.

Commercial end-use consumers like us are just very lucky to be able to enjoy the trickle down effects.

Sooooo do we have price estimates yet?

or release dates, finalized specifications, etc? At this point, there is no knowing what the Q14 or any of the other mysterious Boson devices (without released specs) are going to have - it is all just conjecture and is subject to change without notice, at any time, despite what FLIR may be directly communicating to the customers or what may be discussed within this thread or the other thread due to communication issues within FLIR.

You sound worried that the very mysterious Boson cores are all just conjecture?

One thing is for certain, there will be a great many changes coming.

Hopefully one of those great changes are the inclusion of a reticle on the Q14B. :-)

Deleted

Another in a series of seriously informative technical thermal posts. Your reallly on a roll now.

Thanks for sharing your very intimate ingratituous stream of consciousness thoughts with us here today, we look forward to your knowledgeable technical contributions to these Thermal/NV forums in the future.

SkyPup, sent you an I.M.

Sorry, I have no sales, marketing, pricing, etc. information, you will have to pick that up from an authorized FLIR distributor/vendor when their NDA is superseded.

even anything in the ballpark of an msrp or street price

While I appreciate a lot of your information, the above is 100% false. You are absolutely a marketing outlet for FLIR.

I do love hearing all the conspiracy theories, keep 'em coming, each one brings up new fantasies that lead to the next one and so on and so forth.

Well, this thread is basically a pillow fight at this point....

...and I just used the $ I had earmarked for the q14b on a katadyn expedition....so, I will tune back in a few months from now.

Thanks to the contributors..

Since we don't have many if any hard specs from FLIR, someone who is nice but isn't forthcoming about his relationship with the company, squabbling, and everything except tech going on I'm wondering why this thread isn't locked?

Again, just as someone passing by I wonder if I could make a thread about a product and be coy about my standing with the company, offer little tech info, and have it stay unlocked?  

I dunno. Is FLIR a partner here?  If so I'm guessing that's the answer. $. Absolutely nothing wrong with that. If I owned a place I'd probably do something similar. I'd just come out and say it though. It looks odd when

wait... so is this a BOSON core background thread now?? I can't keep track. 

you seem to just like to "hear yourself talk" as it were... since you just keep writing technical dissertation-esque answers to questions literally no one asked, and giggling to yourself at how clever your "sick burns" are. lol. 

I started following some of these threads as a thermal noob, who wants to get into some gear ( wife says after we get the master shower redone). I like reading the technical info and applications of these different products skypup supplies. But, the condensending? attitude mixed with it isn't great. I personally am really interested in how the boson core stacks up to other products, and also what products are coming out with it in them. I would love to read a about the differences between the Q14B, the clip on, and scope versions. What applications work best for each?? Will 60hz refresh be worth it over the 30hz? 320 over 640? Etc etc. I'm sure there are a lot of others like myself who come here looking for info like this.


Side note, in my reading I have determined that the way companies name thermals, sucks. It's damned confusing.

Edit: come to think of it, I would love a thermal for noobs thread.

I agree.

Learning about the gear is great, but skypup you really come across as someone who looks down on folks that are not on your level.

Anyway, thanks for those here who have provided info on the bosun products. Hopefully flir finds a good market for them and consumers find themselves happy. I won't speculate further until post release.

That's cool, I never aim to please, just to kill.

It would be nice if everyone was the same and thought alike in some sort of socialist way though, the world would be such a pretty boring place.

His level?

I think he meant your level.

Man, I can't help but get excited about all the people going to cancel their FLIR boson system orders. I should be getting closer and closer to the front of the line

It isn't a theory. It's accurate information. You use, enjoy, and prefer their devices. Furthermore, you stump for them at every turn online. I didn't say they paid or reimbursed you in any way, I simply pointed out that you're a marketing outlet for FLIR.

I use and prefer Giessele triggers and charging handles. They've been flawless and their customer service (I called to CX an order) is extraordinary. I stand up for them because of the quality of their product and how well they've treated me. My praise of that company, both online and IRL, is a marketing outlet for Giessele.

It's an undeniable truth.

I used to like reading this thread for information and informed speculation on a proposed product that I was interested in. Now the thread is dominated by a bunch of immature internet personal attacking  "juveniles" who
are jealous of other people's financial capability and have no adult supervision since school let out for the summer.

I'm sure my point will be proven shortly by subsequent posters who have previously displayed their compositional wit.

Ok, I can live with that!

I only purchase stuff I use and abuse for long periods of time, and if it cannot take the use and abuse I certainly will not be using it.

I tried out the new Timminy Elite trigger but got weak strikes on handloaded 2/10 NATO military primers, so I got rid of that and got two more Giesseles, for a total of 12 Giessele triggers and 8 charging handles now. I even got a couple of their charging springs and H2 buffers for my SBR builds.

I went out of my way at Shot Show to visit their booth and talk to them in person, good people.

Why, because they work simply awesome for me and improved my accuracy and therefore result in increased kills on the vermin on my property and nothing else works better for me.

Amen to that, Brother.

Only problem is some of the other Boson kit I want to get will not be out untill next year.

Feels like the wait for the five BATFE Form 1s SBR builds....

If you're pointing your inanity at me...

This is not even a tech thread anymore