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Posted: 8/23/2016 6:03:06 PM EDT
[#1]
What kind of warranty does L3 have?
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Posted: 8/23/2016 6:18:11 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What kind of warranty does L3 have? We offer a 5 years on our L3 tubes either Mil Spec Omni 8 filmed or filmless WPT. OP, please feel free to call or PM me. Be happy to assist with the information overload, I understand.  We have many happy customers with all our TNV-14 line and be happy to explain the differences as well.
Vic |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 6:31:15 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We offer a 5 years on our L3 tubes either Mil Spec Omni 8 filmed or filmless WPT. OP, please feel free to call or PM me. Be happy to assist with the information overload, I understand. We have many happy customers with all our TNV-14 line and be happy to explain the differences as well. Vic Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: What kind of warranty does L3 have? We offer a 5 years on our L3 tubes either Mil Spec Omni 8 filmed or filmless WPT. OP, please feel free to call or PM me. Be happy to assist with the information overload, I understand. We have many happy customers with all our TNV-14 line and be happy to explain the differences as well. Vic |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 9:30:04 PM EDT
[#4]
tag because I will probably drop the coin this week on a PVS-14,
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Posted: 8/23/2016 10:21:05 PM EDT
[#5]
Call Vic. I was in the same situation and he was very helpful! Can't wait for my WP goodness to get here.
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Posted: 8/23/2016 10:29:44 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Call Vic. I was in the same situation and he was very helpful! Can't wait for my WP goodness to get here. Hell I'm not even sure what all my questions are yet. |
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Posted: 8/23/2016 10:38:43 PM EDT
[#7]
Not sure on the price difference between green and blue, but when pressed, I have not read or heard anyone say that WP is in any way superior. You will probably be the only kid on your block with it, if that is important to you. I'd rather spend the extra money on more or higher res green tubes. Whether you go single or multiple, GOOD Filmless, otoh as long as you know the weapon mounting limitations, will probably get you more legit "oohs and aahs" as compared to state of the art thin filmed tubes, than will similarly spec'd tubes in a different color.
I have two TNVC '14s- one I bought new, the other I bought used after calling TNVC to see if they had anything in stock to beat it (they didn't). They have been exceedingly helpful with both and if I ever bought another ,I2 device they would be my first and hopefully last stop. ETA- guys that would know are saying below that the currently available WP tubes kick the shit out of currently available green tubes- based on overall higher specs. So it seems the "best" you can get is also WP... |
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Posted: 8/24/2016 3:32:06 AM EDT
[#8]
There is still not enough users giving their perspective on Intens that they own to say as someone who have not peeked through one what you lose and what you win. The basics are they are lower in noise and scintillation, good and expensive. Also can take a 500G shock compared to under 100G for Gen3 tubes IIRC.
From Carpe Nocturnums Youtube astronomy videos you can see how it compares against a L3 Filmless and that should represent a pretty dark scenario. Keep in mind the phosphor difference in his videos, the darker edges and stark color gradients are from the camera caused by the dark green, or that's my guess. |
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Posted: 8/24/2016 4:39:24 AM EDT
[#9]
I have several L-3 WP tubes. I really prefer them to green. It's way more pleasing to my eye. My tubes happen to be pretty good spec as wel. (2400+ FOM on some)
I was using a 14 the other night and I couldn't help but notice that moonlight color and WP color seem to be pretty similar so running a single tube seems just a little more effortless for me. If I could only have one I'd buy the best I could get and that seems to be L-3s lately. |
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Posted: 8/24/2016 6:20:00 AM EDT
[#10]
If money is no object don't look at any one builder, look at the tube specs and warranty.
Any monkey can build these things in 30 minutes, its not rocket science. |
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Posted: 8/24/2016 9:33:48 AM EDT
[#11]
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. Many of them are running 72 Line Pair center resolution, 2500+ Photo-cathode sensitivity and I would say 90% of them are getting 31+ SNR.
Right now the ITT WP tubes are not filmless, unless they have changed them in the last 3 or 4 weeks, they are still a thin filmed WP tube that mimics the specs of their green tubes, which are not bad tubes by any means. I can not comment on the Photonis tubes as we do not sell them, nor have i gotten a hold or looked through them. If you want the best, with one of the best all around Warranty's and NO BS customer Service on call then TNVC is here for you. Feel free to call me at 909-796-7000 ext 303 and I'll talk to you so long about WP tubes you'll get bored. I'd say the WP L3 tubes exibit specs 10-15% higher on average than the Green Phosphor tubes. The WP tubes are vastly superior in capability to green Phosphor tubes, I prefer them when I hog hunt and shoot classes, I would have loved these things in Iraq back when I was in the military |
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Posted: 8/24/2016 11:12:24 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. Many of them are running 72 Line Pair center resolution, 2500+ Photo-cathode sensitivity and I would say 90% of them are getting 31+ SNR. Right now the ITT WP tubes are not filmless, unless they have changed them in the last 3 or 4 weeks, they are still a thin filmed WP tube that mimics the specs of their green tubes, which are not bad tubes by any means. I can not comment on the Photonis tubes as we do not sell them, nor have i gotten a hold or looked through them. If you want the best, with one of the best all around Warranty's and NO BS customer Service on call then TNVC is here for you. Feel free to call me at 909-796-7000 ext 303 and I'll talk to you so long about WP tubes you'll get bored. I'd say the WP L3 tubes exibit specs 10-15% higher on average than the Green Phosphor tubes. The WP tubes are vastly superior in capability to green Phosphor tubes, I prefer them when I hog hunt and shoot classes, I would have loved these things in Iraq back when I was in the military I hate you guys. Ive been wanting a WP tube because the specs have been so high on them lately. 
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Posted: 8/24/2016 11:26:26 AM EDT
[#13]
I've been running a WP PInnacle PVS-14 the last couple of months. My take performance wise it seems similar to all the green pinnacles tubes I've owned in the same spec area. I do kind of prefer the WP myself by a narrow margin as it seems easier on my eye/eyes strain wise after extend use. I ordered a WP L3 PVS-14 from TNVC also so I will have both the Pinnacle and L3 Filmless WP tubes in PVS-14's. My TNVC L3 WP should ship next couple of weeks if my delivery estimate stays current I hope it has great specs also!.
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Posted: 8/25/2016 4:21:02 AM EDT
[#14]
Vic or Sam can the mod3 be ordered in white phosphor? I think that's the setup I'd like to purchase eventually from you guys if it's an option. I'd go with the sentinals but I like the option of passing off one of them if needed.
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Posted: 8/25/2016 8:25:53 AM EDT
[#15]
PM sent
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Posted: 8/25/2016 11:36:45 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
PM sent i would like the same info on those wp mod 3's. I bought a pvs14 wp from tnvc. I like it |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 3:06:20 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'd say the WP L3 tubes exibit specs 10-15% higher on average than the Green Phosphor tubes. L-3 can build green tubes to the same performance spec as the white ones. Certain customers really like white. Others prefer green. Given a choice, I personally would pick one of the high performance L-3 Green unfilmed units. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:57:57 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 11:16:37 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
PM sent Did this PM answer the question about WP Mod3's? If so, i'd love the same info, please. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 11:26:27 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Now that I am looking at your offerings again, are all your White Phosphor PVS-14 your builds or do you also sell L3 or ITT built ones as well? Not a preference on my part just trying to be aware of options. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 11:40:17 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. https://tnvc.com/shop/pvs-14-night-enforcer-gen3-pinnacle-night-vision-monocular/ |
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Posted: 8/27/2016 1:19:01 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They sell direct from "original manufacturer units" (for lack of a better term).... here is an example though it is thin film and green phosphor. Not White filmless. https://tnvc.com/shop/pvs-14-night-enforcer-gen3-pinnacle-night-vision-monocular/ Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. https://tnvc.com/shop/pvs-14-night-enforcer-gen3-pinnacle-night-vision-monocular/ Interesting. Obviously missed that one. I stand corrected on those then. |
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Posted: 8/27/2016 4:24:11 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Did this PM answer the question about WP Mod3's? If so, i'd love the same info, please. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
PM sent Did this PM answer the question about WP Mod3's? If so, i'd love the same info, please. This was the response: Normally no, but if you contact us and speak with us directly at tnvc, we can probably custom build you some WP Mod'3. Be advised the wait times kinda suck as these things are popular and we can only get a certain number of tubes per month from L3. |
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Posted: 8/27/2016 12:02:17 PM EDT
[#24]
So you all know, we are working on getting MOD 3's filmless WPT's for an option as a standard build choice. We've just been waiting for tube allotments from L3. The availabity is tough at times becuase of demand.
Sam said to PM him because we don't know exact dates etc. and nowadays we refrain from publicy guessing.
Once these go on our web site with pricing, I will personally announce it here and elsewhere. Thank you. Vic |
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Posted: 8/27/2016 12:12:10 PM EDT
[#25]
Does the white tube stop you from seeing purple, brown, and orange tinted colors after removing the NOD for extended periods?
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Posted: 8/27/2016 12:33:42 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. We sell one "factory" unit and that is the Night Enforcer that was formally ITT, then Excelis, and now Harris who acquired them. We also manufacturer three PVS-14's under our roof and that is the TNV-14 in 3 flavors of tubes. ITT (Omni 7), L3 Omni 8 in green filmed and White Phosphor Filmless. We also have NO restrictions on selling these units to every US citizen. These units are not restricted to LEO. A looong time ago when the Pinnacle Autogated units were first going out in the wild, ITT did have an early restriction these could only be sold to LEO's. They also said at that time, even though EACH of the units came with data sheets, we could not send them with the units.  We had a few drawers worth after a few years.
Hope this helps a bit. Vic |
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Posted: 8/27/2016 1:27:51 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Does the white tube stop you from seeing purple, brown, and orange tinted colors after removing the NOD for extended periods? Hmmm, interesting (I have not experienced that) but I know I've read and heard from others who have reported this. I am no eye doctor but I know Skypup here in his past life was a genetic scientist with eyeball stuff.   Maybe he can shed more light on this phenomena.
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Posted: 8/27/2016 1:55:57 PM EDT
[#28]
Depending on your age, with older being progressively worse, the rhodopsins in your cone photoreceptors will take longer to regenerate after looking at white light. Your inherent night vision will also take longer to readjust as your rods get bleached out.
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Posted: 8/27/2016 3:11:45 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Depending on your age, with older being progressively worse, the rhodopsins in your cone photoreceptors will take longer to regenerate after looking at white light. Your inherent night vision will also take longer to readjust as your rods get bleached out. I also find it easier when wearing a single monocular over duals when my other eye is already dark adapted, it takes a lot less time for the other eye to adjust for darkness vs. wearing a pair of duals. I think there was an Army study on this awhile back as well. I think CJ7Hawk posted something on this topic. |
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Posted: 8/27/2016 3:26:18 PM EDT
[#30]
Current prices for the Photonis Intens tubes are higher than L3 filmless (green and white phosphor). Unless you have a specific application which requires the increased spectral response of the Intens tubes, your best bet will be L3 filmless. From what I've seen, the specs on the filmless white phosphor tubes have been roughly the same as the green.
Here are the minimum specs for L3's standard tube offerings: 
To give you an idea of the typical performance, here are the specs from the last batch of tubes we received: Color PC EBI SNR Res Halo FOM BLEMS White 2163 0.1 32.2 64 0.8 2060.8 White 2040 0.4 30.1 64 0.8 1926.4 White 2164 0.3 31.5 64 0.8 2016 White 2163 0.5 31.7 64 0.8 2028.8 White 2158 0.5 31.7 64 0.8 2028.8 White 2003 0.3 28.9 64 0.7 1849.6 White 2167 0.3 31.1 64 0.7 1990.4 White 2167 0.7 31 64 0.7 1984 White 2160 0.3 31.2 64 0.8 1996.8 White 2160 0.3 29.8 64 0.8 1907.2 6x6 in Zone 2 White 2161 0.5 31 64 0.8 1984 Green 2513 0.8 34.3 72 0.8 2469.6 Green 2482 0.6 33.9 64 0.8 2169.6 6x2 in Zone 2 |
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Posted: 8/27/2016 3:33:48 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've been running a WP PInnacle PVS-14 the last couple of months. My take performance wise it seems similar to all the green pinnacles tubes I've owned in the same spec area. I do kind of prefer the WP myself by a narrow margin as it seems easier on my eye/eyes strain wise after extend use. I ordered a WP L3 PVS-14 from TNVC also so I will have both the Pinnacle and L3 Filmless WP tubes in PVS-14's. My TNVC L3 WP should ship next couple of weeks if my delivery estimate stays current I hope it has great specs also!. Thank you. Many of our Mil counterparts also say the same thing about the WPT's. For me I'm old fashioned and still like green.... The specs will be damn good! 
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Posted: 8/27/2016 3:34:24 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Now that I am looking at your offerings again, are all your White Phosphor PVS-14 your builds or do you also sell L3 or ITT built ones as well? Not a preference on my part just trying to be aware of options. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. Yes, see my above post.
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Posted: 8/28/2016 9:57:23 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We sell one "factory" unit and that is the Night Enforcer that was formally ITT, then Excelis, and now Harris who acquired them. We also manufacturer three PVS-14's under our roof and that is the TNV-14 in 3 flavors of tubes. ITT (Omni 7), L3 Omni 8 in green filmed and White Phosphor Filmless. We also have NO restrictions on selling these units to every US citizen. These units are not restricted to LEO. A looong time ago when the Pinnacle Autogated units were first going out in the wild, ITT did have an early restriction these could only be sold to LEO's. They also said at that time, even though EACH of the units came with data sheets, we could not send them with the units. We had a few drawers worth after a few years.
Hope this helps a bit. Vic Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. We sell one "factory" unit and that is the Night Enforcer that was formally ITT, then Excelis, and now Harris who acquired them. We also manufacturer three PVS-14's under our roof and that is the TNV-14 in 3 flavors of tubes. ITT (Omni 7), L3 Omni 8 in green filmed and White Phosphor Filmless. We also have NO restrictions on selling these units to every US citizen. These units are not restricted to LEO. A looong time ago when the Pinnacle Autogated units were first going out in the wild, ITT did have an early restriction these could only be sold to LEO's. They also said at that time, even though EACH of the units came with data sheets, we could not send them with the units. We had a few drawers worth after a few years.
Hope this helps a bit. Vic It does for me at least. I thought you didn't sell any direct production PVS-14s from the manufacturer. Corrected there. Kinda like certain laser devices when ordered are sent from the factory, and you guys don't even touch the product. Now I also need to make the decision on green or WP.... |
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Posted: 8/28/2016 11:26:29 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It does for me at least. I thought you didn't sell any direct production PVS-14s from the manufacturer. Corrected there. Kinda like certain laser devices when ordered are sent from the factory, and you guys don't even touch the product. Now I also need to make the decision on green or WP.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The L3 WP tubes we are currently getting direct from L3 are the highest spec tubes I've ever seen. From reading their information on their site, and here, all sales to public involving the PVS-14 are their builds, with either ITT or L3 tubes assembled in them. Only "milspec" are directly from ITT or L3 if that makes sense. Military/Leo are eligible for those units, not general public. We sell one "factory" unit and that is the Night Enforcer that was formally ITT, then Excelis, and now Harris who acquired them. We also manufacturer three PVS-14's under our roof and that is the TNV-14 in 3 flavors of tubes. ITT (Omni 7), L3 Omni 8 in green filmed and White Phosphor Filmless. We also have NO restrictions on selling these units to every US citizen. These units are not restricted to LEO. A looong time ago when the Pinnacle Autogated units were first going out in the wild, ITT did have an early restriction these could only be sold to LEO's. They also said at that time, even though EACH of the units came with data sheets, we could not send them with the units. We had a few drawers worth after a few years.
Hope this helps a bit. Vic It does for me at least. I thought you didn't sell any direct production PVS-14s from the manufacturer. Corrected there. Kinda like certain laser devices when ordered are sent from the factory, and you guys don't even touch the product. Now I also need to make the decision on green or WP.... Actually while they are "factory" units, everything (including all lasers) come to us first. We open each and every piece to insure everything is working and more importantly power on the factory 14's to insure tube is up to our standards. Yes we have rejected plenty over the years. Thank you.
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Posted: 8/28/2016 1:38:10 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So you all know, we are working on getting MOD 3's filmless WPT's for an option as a standard build choice. We've just been waiting for tube allotments from L3. The availabity is tough at times becuase of demand. Sam said to PM him because we don't know exact dates etc. and nowadays we refrain from publicy guessing.
Once these go on our web site with pricing, I will personally announce it here and elsewhere. Thank you. Vic Alrighty, Clasky got the new L3 Omi 8 WPT Filmess option for the MOD-3's up on the web site! These are now a standard build option with this unit. Just type in AB NightVision in our search bar on our web site. |
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Posted: 9/4/2016 9:38:27 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not sure on the price difference between green and blue, but when pressed, I have not read or heard anyone say that WP is in any way superior. You will probably be the only kid on your block with it, if that is important to you. I think it boils down to personal preference given the examples I've used, and whether you like the WP tubes enough over green to spring for them. If you actually end up using them a lot, the cost difference isn't really that big of a deal. I can't imagine anyone getting the WP and regretting it, especially if TNVC says their specs are outstanding. |
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Posted: 9/4/2016 10:01:41 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hmmm, interesting (I have not experienced that) but I know I've read and heard from others who have reported this. I am no eye doctor but I know Skypup here in his past life was a genetic scientist with eyeball stuff. Maybe he can shed more light on this phenomena.
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Does the white tube stop you from seeing purple, brown, and orange tinted colors after removing the NOD for extended periods? Hmmm, interesting (I have not experienced that) but I know I've read and heard from others who have reported this. I am no eye doctor but I know Skypup here in his past life was a genetic scientist with eyeball stuff. Maybe he can shed more light on this phenomena.
Everyone that I have seen with this issue generally ran their gain very high/bright. I prefer my unit just bright enough to see and not any more much easier on the eyes. |
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Posted: 9/5/2016 6:29:33 AM EDT
[#38]
With (at least ITT made) MX10160 tubes this is a problem and I am susceptible to it - I see purple every time I've been under these tubes for an hour or more, unless the environment is really dark and max gain limits the brightness noticeably.
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Posted: 9/5/2016 3:03:46 PM EDT
[#39]
I often wear my PVS-14 or dual goggle's for several hours straight hiking/driving around. I have also found a super bright tube gain setting adds to more eye strain in the long run.
I've had 20 + years of experience running "green" tubes and only recently started running WP. For me personally, I believe the WP is easier on my eyes and the more I use WP the more I realize the difference. Performance wise such as contrast and tube sharpness, I think overall tube specs matter more than green or white. |
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