The topic of shooting a shell in a shotgun without the barrel was brought up in a discussion on a local FB group of mine. Assuming the bolt holds the shell properly and it can/does fire, would removing the barrel all together constitute making an SBS? Yes, I understand the physics behind this and that it will be anticlimactic and messy, but we are still curious to the legality.

In a more general sense, do NFA barrel laws apply when you remove the barrel all together?

Here is a picture of the intended set-up (not my pic, gun, or idea):

Good point. I asked the owner, and he said that it came with a stock installed from the factory, so it indeed is a "real" shotgun.

I've seen plenty of shotguns sold with pistol grip only (example.  https://www.classicfirearms.com/mossberg-persuader-8-shot-12g-pistol-grip ), so I don't think it's simply the stock. As long as the barrel length is 18", overall length 26". I dont know...if the overall length is 26"+ you might be able to get away with a short/no barrel

Definition of a shotgun includes a smooth bore barrel.

There is no barrel to fit the definition of it it so it's technically just a receiver.

Don't have my virtual measuring tape handy, but IF that fires -and is intended to fire like that- and the OAL is less than 26", then it's an NFA firearm. Could be an SBS under "weapon made from a shotgun" definition if there has ever been a stock and smoothbore barrel attached to that receiver, would have to know the history of that gun.

You're thinking of the classical definition of a shotgun, which is any weapon that fires a shotgun shell.  The legal definition of a shotgun requires that it be designed to be fired from the shoulder.  So, no stock, not a shotgun under federal law.

My guess is that it did at one point meet the Title I definition of "shotgun" and it's probably less than 26" in OAL in that configuration, which would make it a "short barrel shotgun" under Title II, the National Firearms Act.

It came with a stock installed, and obviously a barrel from the factory (probably a long hunting barrel, hence the gold trigger).

If the OAL is over 26 as it sits, would that just make it a "firearm" or "other" or something generic and non-NFA like that? Wouldn't the fact that it came with a full stock from the factory mean it's an SBS, even if the OAL is over 26?

That's where my question lies--can it still be an SBS or any NFA item for that matter if it doesn't have a barrel BUT it can still technically fire a shell?

"Short barrel shotgun" has two definitions under the NFA: Barrel length less than 18" or OAL less than 26". NFA also adds "weapon made from a shotgun", causing essentially anything created downstream from a shotgun to be a "shotgun" as well. Here it would not need a barrel or a stock because it already had these features in an earlier configuration, thus defining it permanently a "shotgun". Because -and I'm guessing- it's less than 26" in OAL, it would be an SBS.

All of this is predicated on the intention to actually and willfully fire it like this. Taking your 26" barreled hunting shotgun and removing the barrel does not automatically create an SBS since there is no intention or willfull execution necessarily to fire it in that state. Willfully firing it without the barrel triggers "redesign".

If it's actually, say, 26.5" in OAL, it's not "concealable" and does not meet any definition under the NFA. Without a barrel, there's nothing to measure as being less than 18". In that configuration at 26" or more in OAL, the gun would transfer as "Other".

As shown in your picture, about the only thing that will happen when you "fire" it is that the shell will rupture and spit the pellets all over the place (at very low velocity).

No barrel-no gun. It is just parts.  A ballpeen hammer, and a pair of pliers aren't an sbs either, though both examples would do the same thing, rupture and spill pellets everywhere.

This guy doesn't know jack shit about the most elementary federal gun laws.

Priceless Ignorance there.


How can you be on a gun forum for 13 years and not know what a gun is?

He'd have a point if it came from the factory like that.  Since it didn't...

No, he would not.
It is a firearm as pictured. A stripped receiver is a firearm. It doesn't matter if it came from the factory or if Bubba disassembled it into little bitty parts. Barrel or no barrel.........it's a firearm.

True, I misread his post and thought he was sayng it wouldn't be a shotgun without the barrel.

Probably shoulda elaborated a bit more on that. Obviously it's a gun, the receiver is the "firearm", I know that, but removing the barrel does not make it an SBS, it's a shotgun, with missing parts....my hammer reference was to show the effect of the round being "fired" as the same. If I'm removing one 16" barrel to install another 16+" barrel, I'm not in possession of an illegal SBR while the barrel is off. Despite the fact I could place a round on the bolt face and probably get the firing pin to set it off.