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USA
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Posted: 5/29/2007 10:02:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: tony_k]
Updated link - July 4, 2014
NFA Handbook –––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– Updated links - January 6, 2010 downloadable .pdf version is here: NFA Handbook HTML version NFA Handbook –––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– April 22, 2009: An updated version of the NFA Handbook was put on the web by ATF today. A list of the sections which were revised is here: NFA Handbook revisions The html and downloadable .pdf version is here: NFA Handbook –––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– May 29, 2007 National Firearms Act Handbook ATF’s National Firearms Act (NFA) Branch and the National Firearms Act Trade and Collectors Association (NFATCA) are pleased to announce the publication of the National Firearms Act Handbook. This handbook was developed in partnership by the NFA Branch and the NFATCA with the goal of providing timely and current information and procedures to the industry, the public, and government agencies, including ATF. The handbook may be found on the ATF website (www.atf.gov). http://www.atf.gov/firearms/nfa/nfa_handbook/index.htm Download the National Firearms Act Handbook updated June 2007 Mirrored, if the link above doesnt work 10 megs updated May 2007 |
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USA
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Posted: 5/29/2007 11:16:56 AM EDT
[#1]
interesting paragraph on page 164
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Posted: 5/29/2007 11:28:25 AM EDT
[#2]
Yep, back in 1981 when Colt was pretty much the only one making semi-auto guns, the SP1 was the standard. Now, not even Colt makes their semi-auto guns SP1 compatible.
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Posted: 5/29/2007 6:57:06 PM EDT
[#3]
Anyone know what that's all about??? |
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Posted: 5/29/2007 6:58:38 PM EDT
[#4]
Write a letter.
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Posted: 5/29/2007 7:02:16 PM EDT
[#5]
seems like someone already did
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Posted: 5/29/2007 7:03:38 PM EDT
[#6]
Might get a copy for next time the cops say I can only carry my NFA item directly to and from the range.
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Posted: 5/31/2007 7:58:42 PM EDT
[#7]
Previously, AAC was told they could destroy an old can and replace with a new one with same number. Gemtech was told they could not. I imagine at some point the two opposing opinions must be reconciled... |
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Posted: 5/31/2007 8:14:23 PM EDT
[#8]
Da link no worky! |
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LA, USA
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Posted: 5/31/2007 9:49:37 PM EDT
[#9]
The link sometimes work. I went to the atf site and did a search and found it that way. But when ever I try to save it it looks like it starts to load then freezes up. I may try late tonight or very early in the morning.
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Posted: 5/31/2007 9:53:27 PM EDT
[#10]
..
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LA, USA
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Posted: 5/31/2007 11:11:38 PM EDT
[#11]
http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/nfa/0507nfa_handbook.pdf
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TX, USA
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Posted: 6/2/2007 1:45:37 PM EDT
[#12]
Good for NFA! Good post!
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VA, USA
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Posted: 6/3/2007 12:50:21 PM EDT
[#13]
If anyone manages to actually download the handbook, can you please rehost it somewhere else?
ATF website has been unreliable for me for the last 24 hours... |
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Posted: 6/3/2007 1:08:15 PM EDT
[#14]
tag
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Posted: 6/3/2007 1:12:02 PM EDT
[#15]
I have tried and tried for the past two days! |
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Posted: 6/3/2007 1:15:11 PM EDT
[#16]
Imagine that, the link does not work again!!!
It is like they do not want us to know the rules!!!
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USA
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Posted: 6/4/2007 10:09:04 AM EDT
[#17]
I have it mirrored. None of the links on the ATF site work now
 www.anjanet.com/nfa/0507nfa_handbook.pdf |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 6/6/2007 9:33:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AcenJay]
[#18]
Does this mean that we can no longer use full-auto capable M16 bolt carriers on our semi-auto AR-15 rifles?!? EDIT: After reading through that 18 page thread on the subject, I am convinced that the ATF is just pussyfooting around the subject and not giving a clear answer. They are trying to discourage people from using M16 carriers, but don't say for sure that it is illegal. |
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Posted: 6/23/2007 7:59:31 PM EDT
[#19]
They discourage it, but as long as it doesn't make your gun become a machine gun, then it is legal. (M16 carriers do not make AR15's become machine guns). |
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Posted: 6/24/2007 11:54:35 AM EDT
[#20]
Thank you so very much!!!!!!!! 
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 7/4/2007 3:32:11 PM EDT
[#21]
Well there's a document that's a waste of time and tax dollars to make. It's a re-hash of the same, ambiguous bullshit.
I love the diagrams of the de-mil specs for importing rifle parts, such as the FAL and the G3. They show the destruction 2/3rds of the usable parts with their torch cuts. Problem is, nobody is going to cut the guns like that, because it destroys the product, and many (most?) of the usable parts. Oh, they do mention that there may be other approved methods. Since these are the methods importers will actually use, why don't they include them? (i.e., removing the reciever entirely, disassembling the weapon and cutting and removing a section of receiver, etc.). They also reinforce myths and legends about what is legal, while permitting major manufacturers to comply with what appears to be a completely different standard. If nothing else, they are reinforcing the current confusion. What a waste. Our only hope is, through 'incrementalism', the document can be changed and edited over time for better clarification (or the explanation of actual ATF practice). Argh. |
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OR, USA
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Posted: 7/10/2007 1:49:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: BurntPocketHole]
[#22]
I just printed the handbook out at work, all 207 pages of it. I kinda had to sneak it, I work for a bank and theres only one copy machine in my area. made a nice binder too with tabs, thank you corporate you F'ers!
It will make a nice addition next to the Machine Gun Dealers Bible. ...come to think of it I should copy a couple of those off at work too.  |
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OR, USA
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Posted: 8/22/2007 12:38:45 PM EDT
[#23]
The way I read it was, ANY part which is used in a machinegun, when placed in your weapon MAKES it a machinegun. It specifically said, that possessing an autosear, even if it's in a shoebox in your closet, constitutes a machinegun by definition. Basically any part used to make a machinegun IS a machinegun. Confusing stuff.....
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Posted: 8/22/2007 12:59:05 PM EDT
[#24]
EXCEPT for the court ruling that said, if it don't fire more than once with a single pull of the trigger, it AIN'T a machine gun. And fortunately for us, shoestrings aren't machine guns either. TXL |
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USA
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Posted: 8/23/2007 7:44:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: rkba-net]
[#25]
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Posted: 9/17/2007 12:15:10 PM EDT
[#26]
Anytime the ATF uses words like "recommend", "suggest" etc, the sentance in which those words are used are not law. PERIOD.
They "recommend" not to use M16 parts in an AR15. That does not say it is illegal to do so. This shit never dies. Guys continue to read into the regulation not read the regulation. It is nice to know they got AR15s to fire with auto with just 5 M16 FCG parts installed. It is always good advice to stay away from M16 parts but it is not law they can't be used. If it does not fire more than one bullet per pull of the trigger, regardless of which parts are installed, it's not a machine gun and therefore legal to own. Constructive intent is a whole nuther subject. Intent is very hard to prove in court unless you do something stupid like, go on the internet and bash the ATF continuously, call for the death of elected officials, call for the overthrow of the government, refuse to pay taxes, write hate letters to the government, and own books on how to convert guns to full auto, and have a drawer full of conversion parts. I too dislike the vague answers from the ATF but I also see it for what it is, an honest attempt by the ATF to keep gunowners from mistakenly or accidentally violating the regulations by mixing full auto and semi auto parts in the same gun. Sound advise but not law. The ambiguous wording is used because there are literally thousands of possible combinations of guns and parts that may or may not be legal and they can not cover them all. That is why they want guys to ask the tech branch about a particular set up. |
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Posted: 9/20/2007 7:48:27 AM EDT
[#27]
Someone should tell Colt since they put M16 FA carriers in all there rifles now. 
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IN, USA
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Posted: 10/16/2007 5:52:26 PM EDT
[#28]
Can you elaborate on the ruling and if thats the case then installing any m16 trigger part is legal as long as it does make the gun shoot Full Auto. |
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Posted: 10/16/2007 7:03:45 PM EDT
[#29]
Check here |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 10/17/2007 12:17:29 AM EDT
[#30]
Yeah I have read that train wreck. I was hoping to find some legal case that settles it one way or another. I have a M16 carrier in my Colt 6933 from the factory.
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Posted: 10/17/2007 1:52:03 PM EDT
[#31]
Hey Tex,
I would love to have a copy of the Court ruling stating what is a Machine gun or not. Know where I can find it? |
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Posted: 10/17/2007 2:14:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: globe512]
[#32]
Well this is a disturbing bit of text:
The weapons will "operate as a machine gun merely...by removal of the disconnector." This is the problem with the M16, RRA, Stag, LMT, or any other bolt carrier that it has a shrouded firing pin. It was clearly described by Dano in the 19 page legal thread. If the firing pin is shrouded (or the hammer is not notched), removal of the disconnector by the ATF will almost certainly allow the weapon to fire automatically, or at least double or triple. The combination of the cut-away SP1 style carrier and a notched hammer is designed to prevent hammer-follow automatic fire. If ATF considers their removal of a disconnector to be fair game in demonstrating possession of a machine gun, anyone who has a shrouded firing pin bolt carrier is at risk of prosecution, whether technically legal or not. ETA: Despite the fact that both written and case law clearly states that any weapon that only fires one shot with a single trigger pull is NOT a MG, I'm just commenting that it is disturbing that ATF continues to insinuate in this 2007 publication that a disconnector-less standard production shrouded carrier AR may be an MG. |
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Posted: 10/17/2007 4:01:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: tony_k]
[#33]
United States Code, Title 26, Section 5845:
(b) Machinegun The term “machinegun” means any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger. BATFE believes that removing the disconnector falls within the definition of "readily restored," which is why no matter how many letters Mr. Chen at Colt may wave around, I would not use an M16 carrier in a semi AR. FWIW, BATFE has no prosecutorial responsibilities. Instead, the prosecutor -- whether state or federal -- gives Tech Branch your AR to "test" and then calls them in as the government's expert witnesses, and they will testify about how easily they made your AR fire more than one shot with a single pull of the trigger. It is difficult to argue that a standard government testing procedure is flawed. It's not impossible, but the opposing technical experts don't come cheap, and fighting this will double your legal fees. OTOH, any decent attorney could argue that the modifications to a semi bolt neccessary for FA use go well beyond "readily restored." Your Mileage May Vary. I'm too old to be dating Bubba. 
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IN, USA
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Posted: 10/18/2007 12:16:43 AM EDT
[#34]
OK ,, I gotta ask then why does Colt send out new rifles with M16 carriers?? I mean I know that my 6933 has one and a 6971 I had did as well. |
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Posted: 10/30/2007 12:23:14 PM EDT
[#35]
I wrote the ATF and told them I had an M16 carrier in my AR15 upper and noone came to my door or called me. Heck, they never even responded to my letter requesting clarification that my set up which could not fire full auto but whose upper was used on a registered full auto lower to fire full auto was in fact legal. This was before the letter that said if it would not fire full auto it was not legal came to light. If they wont come after you when you send them a letter telling them you have it I dont think there is anything to worry about.
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 11/24/2007 2:27:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Outlaws]
[#36]
delete
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Posted: 11/24/2007 6:04:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: tony_k]
[#37]
Simple: Colt uses M16 carriers because they get them cheaper from their supplier than semi carriers, because their military contracts allow them to buy FA carriers in larger quantities than semis. BTW, when Colt's Mr. Chen wrote asking BATFE if it was legal to use FA carriers in Title 1 firearms, BATFE's response letter was carefully worded to avoid answering the question. Instead, Tech Branch quoted the same law I quote above, and let Colt draw their own conclusions. Colt still sends out "civilian-market" ARs with the semi carriers. Most (though not all) of the semi models that they ship with M16 carriers are from their law enforcement product line. I suppose that if there is ever any question about the legality of M16 carriers, they will fall back on that point ("Well, we thought they were all going to LE agencies. That's who our distributors were supposed to sell them to.") One final note: There is no shortage of companies which received BATFE approval of a firearm or acceessory, allowed them to go into production and sell thousands to the public, and then BATFE changed their mind and decided the gun/product was not legal after all. This has been BATFE SOP for decades; the Akins Accelerator is the latest such fiasco that cost law-abiding gun owners thousands of $$$. Requiring Colt to "recall" all the M16 carriers would be small fry in comparison. 
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FL, USA
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Posted: 3/15/2008 10:38:48 PM EDT
[#38]
Thank yoy very much! I have now downloaded the NFA booklet. /s/ Muskethead.
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CO, USA
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Posted: 3/19/2008 3:35:42 PM EDT
[#39]
Awesome!
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AZ, USA
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Posted: 4/20/2008 1:55:56 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Gretel]
[#40]
Some how I don't believe any of that, I bought an AK kit and a CETME kit neither of which I have put together, and both included F/A parts. The bolt and carrier, disconnector and selector, from a F/A AK fits inside a semi-AK but it doesn't make it fire more than one time with the press of the trigger. You'd have to have the know how to do it and enjoy bubba's special company for the next 10 years. Awhile back I bought a DPMS parts kit for a lower AR-9 and it included a Burst Hammer, which didn't work half of the time in semi-auto, it worked really good for bump firing, the rest of the time it walked my pins out or wouldn't re-cock. I didn't realize what the hammer was until I ordered a specific 9mm hammer to replace it. I kept the hammer just to remind what 1000rds of 9mm will to a hammer not made for a pistol caliber upper. Possessing a DIAS thats not registered prior to the ACT is a violation, if you own an AR of any kind. You can have all the unregistered auto-sears you want if don't own an AR15 or just don't like guns. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 5/13/2008 3:38:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Copperjacket]
[#41]
Nevermind, forgot this thread was a sticky.
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WA, USA
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Posted: 1/22/2009 9:56:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: diverdown]
[#42]
What Copperjacket said...
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Posted: 4/22/2009 4:12:08 PM EDT
[#43]
An updated version of the NFA Handbook was put on the web by ATF today.
The links in the first post in this thread have been updated. 
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Posted: 4/27/2009 8:42:45 PM EDT
[#44]
I wish they would publish a printed version.
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Posted: 4/27/2009 9:12:11 PM EDT
[#45]
Originally Posted By WI57:
I wish they would publish a printed version. Are you kidding? It's hard enough to get blank fingerprint cards out of them.
But FWIW, ATF is seriously underfunded –– that's why transfers take so long. They don't have the $$$ to print and distribute the manual, and it gets updated every 18 months or so anyway. If they did have the $$$, I'd rather they use the money to hire another examiner or two.
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NC, USA
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Posted: 10/21/2009 2:51:44 PM EDT
[#46]
Originally Posted By AcenJay:
Does this mean that we can no longer use full-auto capable M16 bolt carriers on our semi-auto AR-15 rifles?!? EDIT: After reading through that 18 page thread on the subject, I am convinced that the ATF is just pussyfooting around the subject and not giving a clear answer. They are trying to discourage people from using M16 carriers, but don't say for sure that it is illegal. Based on this section taken from Chapter 2 I would say it is okay to use M16 parts AS LONG AS THE GUN WON'T FIRE FULLY AUTO. "The definition of machinegun also includes a combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person. An example of a firearm meeting this section of the definition is a semiautomatic AR15 rifle possessed with an M16 bolt carrier, hammer, trigger, disconnector and selector. If the semiautomatic AR15 is assembled with the described M16 parts AND the rifle is capable of fully automatic fire, the weapon possessed in conjunction with the M16 parts, whether assembled or not, is a machinegun as defined.17" |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 1/6/2010 7:24:51 PM EDT
[#47]
None of those links were working for me. I found this one via google.
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OR, USA
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Posted: 1/29/2014 3:12:45 AM EDT
[#48]
http://www.atf.gov/content/firearms/firearms-industry/guides/publications-firearms-national-firearms-act-handbook
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Posted: 7/4/2014 11:47:31 PM EDT
[#49]
Link in the first post of this thread has been fixed.
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