I've just began the sport of shooting [at age 58].  Little over a year ago, started as a practical matter: seems like the world is getting to be a crazier place.  Well, that has lead to me hunting this fall [got my first deer] and now I want to get my sons and grandsons involved.  To that end I'm reading up on buying a .22 rifle for the grandkids to learn/use.  But I also want to make the firearm as versatile as possible.  

I bought a 10/22 because everyone said I should buy a 10/22.  Did so without any research.

Now I want to get a bolt action .22lr for them to begin [not the semi-auto].  I get the whole LOP thing but what I am wondering is why is there so much interest/discussion about suppressors?  Is it just 'fun' to have them or is there a practical reason [either improve accuracy or improved hunting] to use them?

Also, seems to quite a bit of variety in barrel length.  I would have guessed [quality being equal] that the longer the barrel, the more accurate and higher velocity [hence 'better'] than a shorter barrel and one would only opt for a shorter barrel for the convenience of size [carrying and storing].  Am I wrong about that?

Sorry for such fundamental questions but want to make informed decisions.

Thanks in advance,

As to the suppressor, I think there are several good reason to have/use them...

1) As someone who has permanent hearing loss from shooting firearms, hearing protection (especially for the young folks) is a great idea.

2) When teaching beginners, I have found it takes away two the common fears of the new shooter - loud noise & concussion.

3) For a 22 on small game, it does not spook other critters nearby.

4) I also think of it as a courtesy to other folks when I'm not and a gun range - when I'm hunting or target shooting on private property, I do not need to bother others.

5) Yes - they ARE cool to have fun with.

I will soon have 3 suppressors that will cover all of my current needs, and if I had to, I could cut that down to 2.

1) Dedicated 22 - in my case, a Silencerco Sparrow (and this is the one I could also drop if needed - but having a small, light weight dedicated 22 Rimfire can IS nice!)

2) 45 Caliber pistol can. I picked the Silencerco Octane 45HD. I can shoot everything from 22 rimfire up to 45 pistol, and 300 Blackout sub-sonic rifle through it.

3) 30 Cal. Rifle can. I'm going with the Silencerco Specwar, with it I can put it on everything from a 223 to a 300 Rem Ultra Mag.

As you can guess, there are a ton of choices for suppressors - only you can decide what features are important to you.

Hope this helps,
Bob S.

Forgot your question on barrel length.

If you are going to be using iron sights, the longer barrel length will help the shooter be more accurate. The mechanical accuracy of the rifle does not usually change with barrel length, but the human eye can be more precise with the longer distance between front & rear sights.

On a 22 rimfire rifle, you get the most velocity in the 16"-18" length - longer barrel actually shoot a little slower.

Bob S.

With a .22 LR suppressor, you'll likely want to shoot subsonic (generally less than 1000 fps) velocity ammo so that you don't get bullet "crack" noise.

I have one suppressor.  It's on an AR-15, 5.56.  The bullet velocity is supersonic for the ammo I use, but the suppressor keeps the muzzle blast down.

Enjoy whatever you decide to pursue.

I have a Savage FV-SR with the 16" heavy barrel. With the can and CCI Standard Velocity, the rifle can make 1" groups on a calm day at 100.

Post a Would like to shoot a suppressed 22 in the XXX MO area in the MOHTF. That should answer your questions. EXCEPT the ones you'll have afterward about forming a trust, which suppressor to buy, what bbl length for a SBR, etc.

16" to 18" barrel length...I use CCI Sub-Sonic HPs.

I wish I had bought a .22 can years ago. Over the two seasons I've owned mine my squirrel tally has increased by 30%. For a dedicated squirrel hunter this is no small thing.

Thanks for all the help guys.  

I live in MO where I can have a suppressor and have been looking into the steps involved.  One step confuses me:  do I need a stamp for both the suppressor and the barrel upon which it would be attached?  IE if I buy a rifle that is already threaded [say from the manufacturer] do I need a stamp for that then another for the can itself?  

All your advice has been very helpful and much appreciated.

May be helping more members than just me learn the ropes.

 

What part of Mo are you in?
I bought a 22 suppressor to help teach my daughters to shoot.
The two things that are scariest about shooting to new shooters are recoil and noise.
With a bolt action 22 LR that is suppressed, there is almost no recoil and very very little noise.

Now I just need to buy a threaded 22 LR bolt gun...

I can tell you that it does reduce noise significantly in my AR15 using the dedicated 22LR upper.

You will only need one stamp for a suppressor. If you purchase a short barreled integrally suppressed rifle, that will be two stamps,(1 for the short barreled rifle, & 1 for the suppressor).

Hope that helps.

Why a suppressor: I live in a state that does not allow suppressor ownership, but once I leave this state I will certainly be getting one. As said above, it removed the concussion feeling from the shooter. On a .22 there is not really a concussion feeling, so it would only really help to make it quieter. With sub sonic ammo (or standard velocity in the summer ie. 1080 fps) you won't hear hardly anything at all.

Barrel length: As said above, the longer the barrel the longer sight radius you will have. A longer barrel will also make the gun sound a little quieter to the shooter, to a point. A 28 inch barrel 22 certainly feels quieter than a 16 inch barrel.

Now, I know you didn't ask for a recommendation, but......

I would look at the CZ 452/455 series of rifles. They are excellent bolt actions and bring a centerfire quality feel to rimfire guns. I have three of them and could not be more pleased. The 452 trainer would make a great gun to start with as the iron sights are fully adjustable via screws, so no need to have a hammer and punch to make changes. Or, if your grand-kids are younger, the 452 Scout is a pretty darned good youth model and can be put into a larger stock as they grow older. As far as suppressors go, the 16 inch 452 american comes threaded for a suppressor (although it may be hard to find as they are discontinued). Additionally, the 455 series all have user changeable barrels like the 10/22, and CZ sells factory threaded barrels. I know this whole message sounds like an advertisement, but I really am just very happy with the .22's I have gotten from CZ. Even the .223 I got from them is excellent.

My 452 American 24 inch

I live and work west of 270 in St Louis county.  Where are you [you can email/IM me if you want to go private]?  

Which firearm[s] did you choose to help them learn to shoot?

thanks

The best way to describe why to get a suppressor is this.  If you have 2 .22 rifles - one has a suppressor and one does not.  You are almost certainly going to grab the one with the can to take to shoot first.  Convenient, fun, no ear pro (if you are shooting privately).  Nothing necessary - but just little things that add up.





Suppressor adds length that makes a gun a bit more awkward to handle - so you generally go short on barrel length when you suppress - that said, less important with .22's since many are short anyway.





I am no fan of 10/22's  Their only real greatness is they are very popular...  I have a bolt, a pump, and soon a toggle action .22 rifle - all get shot more than my 10/22. 10/22's are fun to blast with, but other rifles are more accurate and at least IMHO more fun to plink with.

---

I help instruct with a 4H program.  I highly recommend the 4H program because (if it is by Dr. Howard's book), it is focused on safety.  That said, it also attempts to teach life skills (practice pays off).  Moreover, it helps the children learn with other children - their piers.  Our program starts with size appropriate bolt action rifles (our club has quite a few rifles - so matching the child with the correct sized rifle is not a problem).  Other clubs start with pellet rifles (which are great tools for teaching - but tend to be very nice target pellet rifles which cost more than most causal 22 rifles (between pcp rifle and sbca tank - hitting 1k is not all that difficult).  With pistols, we do start with pellet pistols for a few weeks (they are lower cost single stroke pneumatic target pistols - about $200 each, and no need for scuba or sbca tanks to charge them).  On our experienced range, we have about 1 instructor to 4 students.  On beginning ranges it is often 1:1 or even 2:1 when necessary.

I'm no 10/22 fan boy.... but wonder why you are not a fan of 10/22/s?

I own a 10/22 but am dedicated to buying a bolt action for my grand-kids w/ a suppressor, to introduce them comfortably.  

I guess, what I'm asking is why... why is the 10/22 so popular is it doesn't 'work' well?  

I'm not here to support or bash semi-auto's... but it sounds like you have a good basis for your observation for your statement and I wonder what it is?

Thanks,

edited for spelling

I never got into simply blasting and rarely plink anymore (did last weekend - 30 rounds).  I enjoy hunting and target shooting.  Take away the blasting aspect, and what's left to love about the 10/22.





Huge amount of aftermarket parts - very customizable.  Great - but when you go down that road, when you finish the main Rugar part you will still be using is the magazine (I do like the flush fit rotary magazine).





I teach kids to shoot.  We use savage rascals as our smallest gun.  I do not know why - but it is probably a combination of convenience (plus we inherited a LOT of our rifles - so I bet that is the real reason).  They work perfectly well and have more rounds through them than is fair to admit - I just don't enjoy sighting them in.  Most of our larger youth shoot Anschultz, with a handful of privately owned Savage FVT's.  If you are shooting targets - try to get a kid to transition from an Anschultz to a 10/22.    The 10/22 is harder to load the magazine, harder to insert the magazine, harder to cock, harder to shoot (trigger pull issues), and harder to remove the magazine (abet they don't remove the mags on the Anschultz that often, as most events are shot with a single shot tray).  





At the firing line, it is so much fun to balance the rifle, then try to press the mag release button and catch the mag - continue to balance the rifle as you load the mag, reinsert the mag, pull back the charging lever - and HOPE that it does not fail to feed.  Yes, at your private range much of that is a non-issue.  You have a table, not a firing line.  You pre-load your magazines.  Then you probably just drop the mag on the table after it is spent.  My step daughter loved that cute pink 10/22, but I asked her to shoot my ugly brown one first.  Afterwards, I got her a savage FVT - which she was much more happy with.





Don't get me wrong - I do think it the 10/22 is a decent gun to have in your collection.  It just has it's place, and I rarely find myself reaching for mine.  If mine had a threaded barrel, I probably would reach for it more.  I am in the process of getting a suppressor ready 22 rifle - and it is going to be a toggle action "10/22".  If my stepson continues to shoot in 4H, I think it could make a decent CMP style non-semi automatic rifle (biathlon action is faster than bolt).



 

Most integrally suppressed rifles only require one stamp by design. That's one of the benefits of going that route. Whether buying 300BLK or 22LR, a majority if them will be at least 16" long by having either the baffles or tube as a permanent part of the barrel.

A separate suppressor and SBR is what will call for $400 worth of stamps.

With my FV-SR and Stainless Sparrow the only thing that I hear is a snap when the trigger is pulled/hammer falls and then a split second later the ting as the Wolf Match sub sonic projectile impacts in the steel bullets trap.

I'll be going with the Ruger American Rimfire Compact TB.
I already have 10/22 mags so it makes the most sense to me.
You and I are in the same area so we should definitely meet up and go shooting some time.
My schedule will probably be the worst hurdle to overcome for getting together, but since I dont own the RAR yet, it's not a giant issue.

IM me when you get some time.

What is the 'TB' part of Ruger American rimfire compact TB?  

I'm getting a RAR as well.  

IM sent.

I have a Savage FV-SR bolt rifle and a Ruger 10/22. Both have fluted heavy barrels but the pull is 2.25# on the 10/22 and 1.5# on the Savage. Both rifles make the same size groups at 50 so for (older guy!) me, accuracy being equal, the 10/22 is my choice. Apart from it being a bit louder due to cycling (which is significantly quieter due to a KIDD bolt buffer), I find it much more enjoyable not having to manually cycle the bolt every time I want to shoot.

My guess would be Threaded Barrel.

Yup.....TB for Threaded Barrel.

Ruger American Rimfire Model 8306

Folks want suppressors for a variety of reasons. Some want them before they're banned. Some want them for the "cool" factor. Some want them to use in an urban environment w/o freaking out the neighbors (pest control). They don't add to accuracy at all, only reducing the noise.

Barrel length has a point of diminishing returns. Once one gets past a certain length, velocity actually suffers rather than improves. For .22LR, it's generally thought beyond a 20" bbl velocity drops due to bbl friction.

For my suppressor host in a bolt action, I went with a CZ 452 American with a 16" bbl. This thing is crazy accurate for such a short bbl, IMO.

My .o2

Everything should be suppressed.  Loud noise is a serious issue to you and property owners around you.  At worst, a suppressor at least cuts the huge blast to something more tolerable, and at best (subsonic ammo) they are flat out fun and will put a serious shit eating grin on your face.

I love Ruger 10/22s. I have a 10/22 tactical, which comes with a threaded barrel with an Apex innovative arms .22 suppressor and a integrally suppressed 10/22 takedown that was made by innovative arms.

BUT my 10/22s aren't stock. They have kid trigger groups, new guide rods with springs, kidd bolts, amoung a few other things. I think think the trigger group is the best upgrade on most firearms. I spend some $ on my ar15 triggers and got geissele trigger ssa-e for all of them. Trigger pull is an easy way to improve accuracy.

My two daughters 8 and 9 years old now have both learned on the 10/22. They have had no problems pulling the bolt back or reloading the mags. I bought a special mag that only holds one round but you could always only allow them to load one round then shot.