I have an old Interceptor vest (from bulletproofme.com) that I was thinking about upgrading or replacing and I'm torn on what to do.  It has a 3 color desert shell which does not really "work" for Michigan and in addition to that the front opening kills a lot of MOLLE real estate; the only replacement carriers I have been able to find are the conversion carriers sold by Beez, they appear to be exactly what I need but for the price I could almost just buy new armor, hence my delema.  It's made worse by the fact that the only one of the 3 they offer that appears to support (external?) side plates, or anything at all to the side for that matter, appears to require a seoerate cumberbund insert which drives the price even higher, plus their is the other pieces I will need (throat protector, groin protector, etc.) by the time all is said and done I estimate it will cost $400-$500 and I'll still be using my old interceptor inserts (and a new cumberbund).  Might it make more sense to just buy a new vest for the same amount of money or less?  (What size cumberbund would I need anyway, and would the carrier be the same "size" (I.E. Small, medium, large, XL, etc.) as my interceptors?)

The idea I had was to buy a used/refurbished police concealable vest for about $200 give or take and then just wear an external plate carrier (about $60-$150) over that, plus that way I would have the option of just wearing the concealable vest if I wanted.  But how good would the result be?  I'm all for saving money, but I don't want to compromise my protection too much either.  So, which direction would you recommend?  Also, how can I tell if an old vest contains Zylon?

Is there any particular reason that you need side plates, yoke, or dick flap? Because if not, I'd leave that shit out of consideration. I'm probably going against the grain here, but all that shit is heavy, bulky, limits movement, and increases the amount of weight you're forced to carry. If it's not dictated by work that you have to have that stuff, don't bother with it, plus you get the added benefit of saving some coin.

I wore a Mayflower Lo-pro armor carrier for years with a chest rig swift clipped to the front of it. Carried my SAPI plates just fine and fit PACA armor quite well. If you absolutely want all the extra coverage I'd go that route. Plus you have the ability to drop or change out placards depending on the mission. Lots of guys are now offering carriers like that, TAG comes to mind for a great price.

Or your other option of a concealable vest with a PC over it. That is were I'm lost. If I'm building a grab and go rig, I want to be able to do just that. Not fuck around with one vest, then throw another one over the top of it. If you already wear concealable armor everyday, then back to the PC setup as you only really need to haul plates and ammo at that point. Thousands of options for PC's and concealable armor out there.

Really, you need to identify exactly what you are wearing armor for, and weight the pros and cons of each option. Body armor is a compromise at it's core; you want max protection, you're giving up mobility. Want more mobility, you give up protection. Though if you're wearing an old ass IBA, basically anything is as upgrade at this point.

If I'm going to bother wearing plates I'm going to wear all of them, sides included, the bad guys might not all be directly in front of me or directly behind me.  As for the neck and groin etc.  my take is that if I'm wearing the tactical vest then things have completely gone to shit and I want maximum coverage, but those parts are also detachable so I don't necessarily have to wear them if it turns out not to be warranted, however if I am replacing the main carrier I will have to replace the carriers for those too.

As for the concealable vest thing, I was considering that for two reasons, one to save money, and two, flexibility; 90% of the time I doubt I would need the rifle plates or magazine pouches, etc. so the concealable vest would just make more sense, but if I DO need all the extra stuff all I would have to do is put the plate carrier on over it, vs. keeping around a seperate dedicated vest, at least that is my thought.

Your right though, about anything would be an improvement over the IBA, it's not bad, but it isn't really good either and the front opening is driving me nuts.

Shit, I wear armor for a living and I want it as light as possible. None of the accessories are worn, ever. Just because the threat is a possibility, doesn't mean that I need to wrap myself in bubble wrap before I go outside. Not to mention the fact the the little pieces, yoke, dick flap, etc, aren't bulletproof, they are pointless since you aren't running around Afghanistan.

I'd just go with a PC setup. Seriously, no need to look like the michelin man. Front and back plates only have kept many a man alive through some rough shit.

It's better than nothing, but I still want side protection, I have no idea from which direction the bullets will come and I will not have a squad backing me up.

Hurley really hit the nail on the head IMHO. Wearing full armor is a mobility kill in my book, it also hampers getting behind your gun and driving it for effect to defend yourself. The heat that is retained by a full vest system in a hot humid environment can quickly lead to heat injuries. In addition to how many folks have back injuries from wearing oversize armor options.

Armor up and then shoot a few strings with a shot timer. Then shoot the same strings W/O armor and see the differences in how fast and accurate you are. Repeat but add in a few drills with 10-25 yard dashes to your first shooting position, or between shooting positions. Heck even normal tasks like driving, ease in and out of a vehicle and any other day to day tasks that you may need to preform while wearing armor for that matter. If someone in your area has a PC and they are willing to let you give it a try with your plates add that into the mix for even a better comparison data.

My go to after 21 years of wearing armor, is a simple PC with the VS-PBZ plates, backers with soft side armor only. My whole armor system weighs only 12.9 LBS, has minimal effect on my times (0.5-1 sec on a 25 yard sprint from the prone) when shooting any drill and zero effect on my accuracy. Yes my set up is on the extreme high end of what is commonly available, but I now have the freedom to choose how I'm equipped. Even if I were running steel plates I would still run the the same PC that I currently run for range of motion reasons.

Yea, pretty much all of this. If you really want soft armor for increased coverage (nothing wrong with that depending on your role), you'd be better served by BALCS cut, or the Velocity / Mayflower concealment cut. And please, no DAPs or dick flaps. They make baby Jesus cry. The only thing I'll say is, side plates aren't *too* bad if they are the 6"x6" variety.

There's some good advice here. I would seriously re-consider wearing all that additional crap. the dick flap and the yoke and all that other stuff is only protective against shrapnel also... it's not gonna protect you from a bullet strike. That stuff did not pass the cost/benefits test in Afghanistan when I was over there... we ditched it. In any domestic SHFT scenario I can imagine, maneuverability and speed is my priority with my plate carrier. It is important enough to where I had to get over the mental block I had when I considered only carrying 3 mags on my chest vs the amount of ammo I used to carry there. I did add 2 mags to my belt, but that's still 1 less than a standard load out.

It's easy to get caught up in that mindset - but where do you draw the line?

I would recommend ditching the interceptor, it is old technology and you will enjoy a much comfortable, lighter and likely cheaper modern day carrier.

As for choosing between a plate carrier and armor carrier thats tough. PCs are all the rage lately as they are lightweight, allow mobility and keep you cool, all very important when you are someone who spends 12 hours a day, 7 days a week in your armor in a hot desert or doing mountain patrols in some third world country. Its also popular among police officers as they are already wearing soft armor and can keep a PC in the trunk of their cruiser to toss on for active shooter situations. But all of this comes at a price, and thats protection. Only the vital organs are protected and only from a direct front or rear strike.

Now an armor carrier has its uses as well. They are more desirable for people who are in a fixed position, say in a vehicle on patrol like a hummer or APC. Every SWAT teams ive seen wears armor carriers, they are heavy, hot and difficult to move it but they usually ride in a vehicle to the scene, jump out, run to the door and make entry, at which point there is no cover, little concealment and no way to take advantage of "mobility" when you are stuck in a hall way with a dozen other officers.

I think you need to ask yourself what your needs are for this armor. While its nice to look to the military, police or other professionals who utilize armor on a daily basis you must also realize that the dangers they face may be very different than yours and picking a certain vest just because the Navy Seals use it prob isnt the best idea, their job requires them to be light enough to swim, jump out of planes or spend days or even weeks on their own in rough territory, things a civilian would/should not be doing with armor.

With that being said I have a armor carrier for home defense. Considering 97% of the firearms used in shootings are pistols I want as much IIIA soft body armor as possible and a BALCS panels covers pretty much your whole torso. I also have front, back and side plates. Is it heavy? yes, but the most likely use would be defending my family in and around my home, so long hikes are unlikely and if necessary I can always remove plates, soft armor etc...but i would rather have to much armor than not enough when the bullets start flying. I dont mess with any of the groin, shoulder or neck armor as I want to be able to just toss my armor carrier on in a matter of seconds, as chances are if i ever need it there will be not warning, aside from maybe some glass breaking or the dog barking.

Pretty much my thought process.  My scenario is mostly defensive (pretty much home defense+), mobility isn't a major concern, but one of the reasons I was considering a "scalable" set up was for just in case that WASN'T the scenario, what do you think of the idea of a concealable vest with a seperate plate (and magazine) carrier to throw over that?  The best of both worlds, or unnecessarily clumsy?

You're barking up the wrong tree if your plan is to put on the armor when "things have completely gone to shit and I want maximum coverage."  Not that it's wholly you're fault, a lot of risk averse organizations have adopted the "turtle up" mentality.

You put on the armor when you are actively seeking out trouble/putting yourself in dangerous situations, and you match the armor to the likely threat.  If you're kicking in doors overseas, you want rifle protection in front.  If you're facing more explosive threats, you might want to add more soft armor coverage.  If you're a cop primarily facing pistol caliber threats, you might go with a soft armor only vest.  

In the phantasmagorical scenario that "things have completely gone to shit," you're best bet would most likely be to move fast, move often, and avoid running gunfights; not to swaddle yourself in cheap surplus body armor and waddle around like a person wearing a hundred pound Sumo suit.  

Every extra piece of equipment represents a trade-off, usually with long-term fatigue and mobility.  Ask yourself honestly, which of these things is going to increase your survivability and equip yourself accordingly.  

~Augee

It's would work, this is what a lot of patrol officers do. In fact you can find some pretty cheap used police body armor. The cons to this setup are that it provides less coverage than BALCS soft armor and it requires you to put on two pieces of gear and for home defense their may not be enough time to put on any armor let alone strap up two different sets of armor. I try to plan for the most likely scenario which IMO is some form of home robbery, these happen every day in cities across our country, in my neighborhood there are several break ins a year. How many times in my life times has SHTF? Zero. Could it ever? Yes. But going mad max and gunning people down on the streets like its the end of civilization as we know it is more of a pipe dream up there with zombies.

Mobility is always a major concern, especially when looking at defending inside a structure.   That yoke on the interceptor isnt something you can just yank off once you end up on the ground and realize you can barely get your head up level with your weapon.




This.  Really relevant considering it doesnt sound like you ever wear armor at all, so you're going to clumsy and overly fatigued.

All that bolt on side armor not mated to plates is made to stop frag from explosions, not really bullets.

I went through this very thought process a year or two ago OP and after much research and a few classes I determined a few things about myself. I personally do not need rifle protection and moving to the threat normally ends badly for myself. The most probable threat I may face as a civilian would be home invasion with pistols or knives. So I purchased iiia vests from galls and set about getting a plan together for my family.

It is my opinion that as a civilian having a rehearsed solo or family plan in place in case something like a home invasion did happen would be worth more than body armor I may or may not have the chance or time to put on. Unless you have small children I would retreat to predetermined back room during a home invasion and not go hunting the bad guy or guys. Pick a safe room with a solid door put a second cell phone in it on a charger, a second pistol with a light on it, and your armor and medical gear. You should already have a phone and handgun on you but if not you have backups in place in the safe room. You will also want to be able to operate both the phone and pistol one handed. Know the difference between cover and concealment. If the stars align it would look something like the following for myself.

Determine the noise I heard is someone indeed breaking into my home.
Once a threat is identified and my path has not been blocked my family and myself would retreat to the predetermined safe room.
once in the safe room I would lock the door and call the police while we put on iiia vests and everyone gets behind the backstop.

Its not glamorous, its not high speed, but it gives you the home court advantage and gathers all your loved ones in a defensible position.

Again this is all my opinion, I have never fired a shot in anger or been shot at.

If you are a reader I highly recommend picking up a copy of Pat McNamara's book "Sentinel".

Get some light plates like some good level 3s or some AT armor.

As for a Pc get a Ferro Concepts slickster, Velocity Systems Light Weight plate carrier, Mayflower APC which is essentially the same as the Velocity Systems, Crye JPC 1.0 or 2.0 or a Blue Force Plateminus.  These are all light and built well.

I have some ar500s I'm looking to upgrade to something lighter in a Mayflower APC.  I use it only for times when I need it for a training class, to work out in, and in the most unlikely SHTF scenario where I am only wearing it in my house.  So maybe keep the groin and neck protectors for SHTF home defense where you aren't having to walk around and the second you have to do any walking, I would ditch the extra protection.  I assume if you are taking fire in a SHTF scenario you don't want a firefight, you want to get out as soon as possible, so being as light as possible counts IMHO.

Kind of how I was looking at it, if it can support the groin, ass, throat, deltoid, and shoulder protectors I want them in case I think I need them, but it doesn't mean I will wear them all the time, they are detachable.  Trouble is, and why I'm thinking of a concept change, is that if I simply upgrade the carrier I must also upgrade that stuff too which raises the cost much higher.  Better, perhaps, to just start over, assuming it can be done reasonably in budget.

Start over. And don't mess with that extra stuff - it's just dead weight for your (and most) purposes. To my knowledge, none of it has an NIJ certification. As others have pointed out, if you are mounted, in a high IED threat environment, sure, it may make some sense. But for most people, a private citizen in particular, it's really going to do you more harm than good. A soft vest with the option to add plates and a chest rig (Velocity Systems LPAC / LPAAC) may be a good thing to look at. If you really want to balance coverage with mobility, you might want to look into MBAV cut soft armor with plates.

You can trim down the Interceptor-cut 3A Soft Armor into appropriately-sized 3A backers for your plates, then go with whatever design plate carrier you dig, you may even have enough 3A left over for 5x8-10 soft armor inserts if your chosen plate carrier design utilizes an envelope-style nylon/webbing molle cummerbund.    

Cummerbund size depends on mfg and which size or style plate carrier you buy.    Most come with one cummerbund per PC size, others like Mayflower RC have 4 cummerbund sizes which overlap plate size.  So you could buy a PC for Medium ESAPI Plates, but because of body type, you may need the medium or the large cummerbund.


Carrier-wise, you can spray paint your DCU Interceptor carrier, or use your 2pc style front armor inserts in an IOTV carrier in UCP or Multicam. The strip down the IOTV to essential components as needed, skip the arm guards, collar, nut flap and back flap unless you are running a roadblock.

I was under the impression that interceptor panels would not fit IOTV carriers, is that not the case?

It wont be a good fit, but the IBA panels are much smaller than the IOTV panels, so I dont see why it couldnt be made to work.  the IOTV is a lot bigger than the IBA.