I been building my PC & Belt for awhile now and was planning on running 7 AK mags (I'm running an AK47) & 5 glock mags. Is this enough for SHTF or should I be carrying more mags?

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JK, but that should be good. A small Go-Bag with some more munitions couldn't hurt though    

Mission drives the gear, if you foresee needing that many mags, then play ball but it seems a little excessive. Put them all on and do some burpees than run a few miles. Personally I keep 3-4 rifle mags and 1-2 pistol mags on my PC. I feel it's more than enough to get me the fuck away from danger. Best of luck!

Do you intend to be stationary or mobile with such an ammo load out, plus other equipment- admin, med, water?

I'd take a few pistol mags off your belt and vest.  Put a few more AK mags in a pack that you would carry instead.  I can't see myself going through 5 pistol mags

Well I running 3 Rifle on my PC & 3 on my belt (1 in the ak), As for the pistol I'm running all the mags on the belt, The PC has an armorbak for water & A HSGI Bleeder for Med supplies. I would post a pic but I'm too lazy

Also the way I have it setup I can be mobile without to much weight.

Are all of these mags on the belt on your support side? If so, this sounds like it would be pretty imbalanced.
What all do you have crammed into that bleeder also? I wouldnt think it would be possible to fit all the contents of an IFAK into one but I could be wrong.
Do you have dump pouch for all these when you expel them?

Still need to get the dump pouch for the belt, as for the belt, 2 double decker tacos & 1 pistol taco on the left with 1 double decker taco on the right, behind the glock. As for the IFAK I still need to work on it. The bleeder is really a "quick and easy" kit while I been working on the real IFAK. But my question was regarding if I have enough mags, not about IFAKs

This.

Back in the day when there were FOBs, COPs, etc. all over the place (Afghanistan) we carried very light loads.  Our plan, if we had to, was to beat feet and find help at the nearest friendly location.

Now that there's no where to run to we aren't as concerned with mobility as much as our ability to stand and fight until help comes to us.  We are carrying very heavy loads with extra ammo and water stuck everywhere we can.

If things go south, someone will be making their last stand; our intent is for it to be them.

Then, the best advice was given with the second post... Make the gear fit the mission, not the mission fit the gear.

I wasn't bashing your choices or how many bandaids you had in the bleeder, just asking questions... I know it helps me when I read about other peoples' thought process on something and how it may or may not work.

I'd drop the double decker pistol taco on the right side and put 1 more AK pouch on the PC for your primary.

Alright thanks everyone for your input, And I'll keep that in mind ^

Might add 1 or 2 more AK mags, and drop 1 or 2 pistol mags. Like everyone else I'm still trying to figure out what's best for me and what I can/can't do with my gear setups.

A good and often overlooked consideration:  rifle ammo is much more valuable than pistol ammo, yet we tend to carry an inordinate amount of pistol ammo.

One day I realized that I could put a 30 round M4 mag in the same space as 2 pistol mags.  In a SHTF scenario, your pistol is probably a weapon of last resort, so why carry a whole lot of ammo for it at the expense of ammo for your primary.  I now don't carry any spare pistol mags; just the one in the gun.

That said, I have a "training" plate carrier set up with extra pistol mags just so I can practice (shooting) w/o stopping for more ammo.

You need enough ammo to break contact or defend your home from a few,  if your planning on a firefight you need friends with ammo.  4-5 total rifle mags is probably plenty for that,  I'm not saying 7 is too many though.   3 spare mags for a pistol is probably enough, I would have more rifle ammo over more pistol ammo.  A Leatherman fits great in most pistol mag pouches, you might plan on that over an extra pistol mag.


 

Edit:

I prefer to have 3-4 rifle mags on my belt, but this is a bad idea unless you have supenders. Cheap supenders,  like surplus or home made with webbing,  is better than none if you can't afford good ones.

haha yeah I have a leatherman wave already

Im guilty of that
My shtf warbelt is also my HD belt, and my range belt. Which means i have 3 pistol mags and 1 rifle mag. My splitfront mav is biased the other way, 4 (could double that) and 2. Lets face it I train more than I go through shtf scenario and this loadout is good for me.

Overseas, if I was carrying my M4, I had 7 mags on my body and 2 for the M9. Couple more in my bag plus a few cans in the truck full of 5.56.

It seems like a bad idea to carry much more than that. You're going to want to carry food and water as well as tons of other gear. If you have 150 pounds of stuff on your body, you're going to be a slow, tired target. If I was in a SHTF situation, I'd be avoiding trouble not looking for it. If you need more than 7 magazines, you might want to rethink your plan. As others have said, it also depends on the situation. Are you trying to make it across the country? Do you have a vehicle? Are there others in the group that can help you carry the gear? That's my take on the matter anyway.

What's your definition of SHTF?

Are you planning for a highly unlikely Zombie Apocolypse or an airborne invasion by Soviet hordes onto your high school football field? Or, do you live in an area which might see rioting and looting due to racial tension or a long-sought, hard-won victory by a local sports team? Or, are you thinking more like a natural disaster and a few days to a week of power loss and abnormal strain on the emergency management system? Or, are you worried about a man-made event, such as the blackouts of several years ago?

The first step in identifying how much of something you may need is identifying those events which could occur where you could be called upon to use that gear. Then, you need to identify which of those events is actually plausible, as opposed to far-fetched fantasy, followed by deciding which events are actually likely, and then decide which events are actually MOST likely.

Considering that it's completely implausible to believe that Zombies are going to rise up against us, and highly unlikely that the Soviets (or, more correctly for the times, the Russians) are going to drop on your town, I'd argue that it's pretty safe to rule those out as events for which you need to actually prepare. And, given that you live in the densely populated northeastern U.S., it's unlikely that any event, man-made or otherwise, is going to be of such catastrophic proportions that it's going to become incumbent upon you and a handful of your friends to begin sending out roving patrols on movement-to-contact or ambush type missions.

Eliminating those types of events/fantasies from the list leaves you with just a few plausible events. First, you might lose power for a few days or a week because of a harsh storm (particularly as we move into the winter months). Second, depending upon where you actually live, the demographics, and the social/racial climates, you could have to defend home and hearth against some rioters/looters. Third, if you live in a more remote locale, you might have to defend hearth and home against someone such as a wanted fugitive or the average ne'er-do-wells. In none of those events are you and a band of neighbors likely to be sending out armed, roving patrols. You're most likely to stick close to home-after all, it's hard to defend your house from looters or escaped convicts if you and John from next door are 20 miles away, doing your impression of a SEAL team setting up a linear ambush.

For those plausible events, the ones with even the most remote likelihood of happening, it's pretty safe to assume that 1-2 pistol mags and 2-4 rifle mags, in addition to the ones in your guns, is likely to be more than sufficient, especially since you're HIGHLY unlikely to be put into a situation so dire that reloading those magazines or replenishing them from a stockpile somewhere in your house would be impossible.

You're in Pennsylvania, not Afghanistan. The chances of you being pinned down on some remote mountainside, unable to get to the rest of your ammo, is highly unlikely. Of course, this changes if you're someone expected to rush head-first into an active shooter situation, such as a cop. But, failing that, you'd be better off just putting a minimal amount of mags on a belt, chest rig, or plate carrier, and stockpiling a few inexpensive USGI surplus bandoleers filled with loaded mags close to them, or put them in an ammo can or possibly an assault pack, so that you can replenish your belt/chest rig/PC as needed, if needed.

Thanks for your wise words, Where I live I do believe the only "real" SHTF events would be Marshall law, Looters, & Nature Disasters. I already have a 50. cal ammo can full of AK mags loaded with GT , So giving what you said I can understand where your coming from. Like I said before I like hearing other's opinions on the matter

Wouldn't that prohibit me from doing multiple, sick ass transitions?

On my belt I run 2 pistol mags and 1 rifle mag, on my PC i run 3 rifle mags. Through 100's of hours of classes I've never needed more than this,so in a SHTF situation I doubt I'll need more than what I'm already used to.
My gear is set up so I can move and move fast, so I have a minimalist set up. If shit was to get real I would just throw on a back pack with all my extra needs.
I challenge you to take some carbine courses with that load out, I doubt after one class you'd keep it.

I used to think that I needed as much gear as I could carry, until I started taking classes. Taking classes let's you know what works for you, after every class I've taken I've always came away with a gear evaluation and switched some things around.

My current duty set up is 3 mags for my primary sidearm which is lacking and 6 for my rifle. I really want 10 for both, I know a lot of guys adding PMAG extensions and running 60 rounders.

serious?
Quick reference: a 5.56NATO bullet itself weighs about 4g. A 7.62x39 weighs about 7.5g (Just about twice as much).
This doesn't account for weight difference between a stamped steel magazine vs an aluminum mag, which is a bit.
That's gonna weigh a fucking ton!


I'd say 5 AK mags will more than suffice (if you're looking for a sustained gunfight, but most likely 3 in your rack would be fine), and 3 pistol mags.

Stationary hell no.  Belt I have set up is  3 mags and 2 glock 21 mags.  120 rounds of 5.56 if you are down to the last 30 rounds you should be evacing because you are probably out gunned anyway.  In a total SHTF I would think you would want to avoid any negative contact and save your supplies ....my thinking anyway

3 rifle mags on the kit...one in the gun. Two pistol mags on the kit, one in the gun. Holster, ifak, dump pouch, hydration bladder, trauma shears, a knife, gps, and a secondary light source (one on the rifle). That's about all you'd what on personal gear. Toss a fat .50 ammo can in the truck with spare mags for both, batteries, maybe a handheld icom radio...  And a case of water/spare fuel in cans/ recovery gear. You're set.

How would I take these classes? I was thinking about taking classes but I have no idea where to look for them?

Depending on your location in Pa, You may be close to one. F.I.R.E. is in the Pittsburgh area I think. This is the outfit I was going to take next year and really start getting into training with. South in Va is a place called Max Velocity that runs a lot of training that is geared towards building you up to Small unit tactics and exercises.
Check in the training forum. Lots of advice and guidance.

my $.02:
I think a lot of us have different ideas of what's going to happen in a SHTF situation, or whatever you may be planning for. Also, there's a lot of different experiences levels here: military, police, civillian (with and without training). And that drives gear setup.
I'm a low-speed civilian gear queer and i've evolved from wanting to have 7+ primary mags and 4+ secondary mags to wanting 1 or 2 secondary mags and 1-4 primary mags.  I've also chosen my gear to make it scalable.

This means that if mobility and concealment are a concern I can run with just belt mounted stuff and keep the mag count low.  Or, if I need a little bit more gear I can don a chest rig. If i need armor I can don a plate carrier. If i need both my chest rig and my plate carrier can integrate. These can both be worn with or without the belt.  No need for a pistol? Don't put it on the belt and there won't be any excess pouches no the chest rig or plate carrier.

Ammo is great, but there are other concerns too. What else will you be carrying? In a SHTF situation if i'm out and exposed it's either because i'm moving from shelter to shelter, or i'm gathering necessary supplies.  Will i be wearing a backpack? How much weight is there? Do I really see myself getting in a 150+ round fire fight because I want some campbells chunky soup?
I'm not going overseas to wage war. In all likelihood, I want to remain unnoticed and more or less concealed.  More mags are hard to conceal.  I'd recommend 3-4 primary mags with one of those being on the belt as a speed reload. Then for the handgun 1-2 mags.  Any more than that for handgun mags and you're just carrying around unnecessary weight.

Your in PA, I've heard good things about Rockwell. I'm not to familiar with the east side of the country, I would suggest asking around your home town forum.

Excluding GPS (which will be added later), this is how I roll. Hydration bladder and a Nalgene are in the assault pack, and I might have a small water bottle in a cargo pocket.

Unless you are sasquatch size, carrying 7 AK magazines on your body is going to be painful.

My job required me to carry an AK in Afghanistan, so I can attest to this with first-hand experience. I carried at a maximum of 4 on a chest rig, and kept three in a magazine shingle wedged in between the driver seat and center console of my Toyota Surf.

I think an AK mag weighs 3lbs vs 1lbs for an AR mag

Learn to scale your gear.

I've seen people who literally tried to get as many mags as possible on their chest rig or PC. Try to run a few blocks in that and let me know how it works out.

Have your 'go-to' setup that is somewhat scale-able, and then compliment it with a small ruck, etc.

For a chest rig, I have a 8 column x 4 row panel on your standard H harness, its custom made but has the footprint of the Haley rig. I have 4 Tyr 'happy mags' with 2 of them stacked all the way on my weak side as the first acts as a speed reload. The other 2 are next to each other. I have 1 pistol reload and 1 multitool, both in a pistol mag pouch; if I NEED 2 pistol mags, I can do it, but never do.

I also have a StuffIt pouch infront of the last mag pouch. This can stay empty as it is by default, but if needed can hold 2-3 additional mags, or a GPS, radio, whatever you want. The there's a tear away IFAK still on the front but all the way towards the right (still ample clearance for my sidearm on my belt) and that's my chest rig.

If I feel the need that I need more ammo or additional gear with me, I take the same rig I practice with and know how its setup and add a small ruck with whatever I need. Nothing changes.

50% more than you think you're going to need has always been my rule of thumb. Question is - how many are you going to need?

Personally, I've got three setups - 2rifle/2pistol, 6rifle/2pistol, 10rifle/4pistol.

Carry three spare rifle mags maximum, maybe keep a few spares in a backpack/assault pack.

I've trained with Rockwell Tactical. Owner is an SF guy. Excellent class, excellent instruction. Not a weekend fantasy camp course.

If you get into a gunfight without any friends around you're not going to make it to 7 mags.

This post should be tacked.

1 fully loaded ak mag (30 rounds) weighs between 1.3 - 1.7lb per mag (depends on mag type)

also thanks for all the info and opinions guys I think I'll just run 4 AK mags on my PC & 1 on my belt for a quick reload, So that's 6 total AK mags (5 on PC/Belt, 1 in weapon). Also I'm scaling my pistol back to just 2 spare mags as well, I stepped back and started to count my weight for my PC/belt and I was shocked at how heavy it was . I am pretty strong but running this setup for hours would kill me over time. I need to slim down my weight quite a bit. I might even lose 1 AK mag on my PC and run 2-3 mags on my Tri-zip bag.

Also quick question, In my tri zip should I run extra ammo or only stick to loaded mags?

Loaded mags if you got them.

Loaded mags. I also enjoy using a 20rder on my belt in both AK and AR as my oh shit mag as it interferes less with armor.

Now you're gettin' it.

You may be better served by skipping the mag on the belt and just putting it in the pack (if needed). Loaded magazines are preferable to loose ammo.

I'm not saying you haven't already, and I don't know your background, but I think a good place to start would be seeing how much *you* can carry and still be effective with.

7 AK mags is a crap ton of weight plus your water, gear etc. What's your body weight? How many miles can you ruck without stopping?

Much like the gentleman that asked what your definition of SHTF is, I think it's important to know what your own capabilities are and be honest with yourself before finding an arbitrary number to put to a crystal ball scenario.

Put on all your shit, a loaded pack with water and 30 pounds of rocks and go ruck 20 miles. See how you do.

Determine what the best balance of load out is for what you really need to accomplish in 99% of emergency situations. Martial Law (which is insanely unlikely) is the last place you want to be waking around in full kit. You're going to get arrested, all your shit confiscated, or worse, shot.

Edit: I think you'll find that as a civilian in an emergency scenario, your best bet is looking like everyone else, and have a CCW (that you can quickly ditch if necessary) to get yourself home to your family. Then when you're home you can put on your Red Dawn kit in the comfort of your living room.

Your priority is staying alive to fill your responsibility to protecting your family, your property, and your neighbors, in that order. There's no reason to run to the hills, unless circumstances dictate you leave town. In which case, you don't need 7 AK mags, you need a hotel reservation out if town until shit cools off.

BTW, I've got about 7 M4 and 4 AK mags that have shit the bed over the years (dents mostly). I put lead wheel weights in them wrapped and top them off with cleaning rag T shirt bits for rucking and training and such.

Dont know why I was thinking 3lbs. 1lbs 13oz according to  mykitchen scale.

When I use my Ak Ill use a 4mag chest rig over my slick plate carrier with one on my belt

Nutnfancy video. Can YOU Run a Mile in Full Tactical Gear?!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76XVhOPkKhc

I would but 2 things, 1 my full kit isn't finished yet and 2. unless I go in the mountains there's no place to go for a walk in full gear (without making people scared ). But I might go for a walk someday in the mountains.

No one can get it done for you, except you.

Best of luck

Lol, why would you run a mile in full tactical gear.

This, by God, this.

PT

Well yeah, when someone is forcing you to.

When you have the option not to, I mean.