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Posted: 6/30/2015 1:25:57 PM EDT
[#1]
The most secure two-way radio you can reasonably purchase would be a DMR radio such as Motorola Trbo, which is digital and allows encryption.
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Posted: 6/30/2015 1:37:02 PM EDT
[#2]
Its not powerful enough to get me in trouble with the encryption is it? I have some though that its some how not ok with the Gov for me to use a radio and encrypt the signal over a set range. Could of swore i read that not long ago.
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Posted: 6/30/2015 1:50:44 PM EDT
[#3]
Short answer is on certain licensed frequencies encryption is legal to have. It is not ok for HAM radio bands and use encryption. Also equipment is very expensive and key loaders are often hard to find and expensive too. There are open source encryption protocols you can legally use however. Anything is possible with enough $.
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Posted: 6/30/2015 3:54:05 PM EDT
[#4]
DMR is completely legal to use but you need usually need a license, depending on what you are doing. There are a few unlicensed channels available such as MURS, but I'm not sure if encryption is legal on MURS (a quick google search reveals that there is some debate about it).
A lot of commercial radios (including low end models) have "scramble" options which is a pretty basic type of encryption that should probably suit your needs, but wont be as secure as Moto Trbo. Do you have a budget in mind for this? Are you willing to get a license? |
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Posted: 6/30/2015 4:43:47 PM EDT
[#5]
I've never tried it, but could you program a simplex channel with a tone? In the transmit and receive, set a TPL code. Just a thought, never tried it.
Not exactly "encryption" but if it worked, it would keep most of your chatter out of the ears of those not really looking for you. |
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Posted: 6/30/2015 5:10:48 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've never tried it, but could you program a simplex channel with a tone? In the transmit and receive, set a TPL code. Just a thought, never tried it. Not exactly "encryption" but if it worked, it would keep most of your chatter out of the ears of those not really looking for you. That wouldn't give you any encryption at all, anyone with a scanner would hear you, and anyone with a radio that has a monitor function would hear you. TPL codes are just to help filter out unwanted chatter from co-channel users. |
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Posted: 6/30/2015 5:51:16 PM EDT
[#7]
Some of the chinese radios are dPMR, not compatible with Motorola DMR, but they are significantly less expensive. I do not know how secure they are, just that they exist.
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Posted: 6/30/2015 9:30:06 PM EDT
[#8]
I basically need something for paintball/air soft, ass holes are channel surfing n shit.
Its serious business. 
But being as it could come in handy for SHTF, but as well as needing to be cheap enough to play weekend warrior with. i have no idea on price point... i mean i'm playing in 2K of LBT gear... so it has to cost less than all the money. |
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Posted: 6/30/2015 11:06:38 PM EDT
[#9]
just use an OPSKED/code for everything. It's same-same only more low tech.
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Posted: 7/1/2015 8:01:47 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
just use an OPSKED/code for everything. It's same-same only more low tech. But its not as cool. |
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Posted: 7/1/2015 8:57:13 PM EDT
[#11]
Baofeng BF-888s is what you seek.
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Posted: 7/1/2015 11:57:38 PM EDT
[#12]
IIRC, somewhere I remember reading about using Motorola SecureNet and any of the encryption types, as long as you were a licensed HAM and made a broadcast announcement that you were going to transmit in secure mode, including the type (AES, DES, OFB, etc) and announced your keycode. Thats as far as I can remember about the legal-ese of it all.
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Posted: 7/2/2015 12:09:31 AM EDT
[#13]
Used racal/thales P25 radio has encryption available from the software, no keyloader needed.
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Posted: 7/2/2015 12:49:48 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
IIRC, somewhere I remember reading about using Motorola SecureNet and any of the encryption types, as long as you were a licensed HAM and made a broadcast announcement that you were going to transmit in secure mode, including the type (AES, DES, OFB, etc) and announced your keycode. Thats as far as I can remember about the legal-ese of it all. I don't remember anything on any test or in any regulations that I ever studied that said you could use encryption or codes for anything other than satellite and model aircraft control. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 10:49:49 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I basically need something for paintball/air soft, ass holes are channel surfing n shit. Its serious business.
But being as it could come in handy for SHTF, but as well as needing to be cheap enough to play weekend warrior with. i have no idea on price point... i mean i'm playing in 2K of LBT gear... so it has to cost less than all the money. As a long-time paintballer, I'd say if you can use a HAM radio that's simply not transmitting on one of the FRS/GMRS frequency then 99% of the snooping will stop. Of course that's a "security by obscurity" approach rather than real security. The 14 year old M98 weilding punks won't be able to hear you, but if the FBI / CIA / NSA / TLA wants to listen, they'll be able to listen. That assumes everyone else you're team can also use the same frequency. Lots of the events I've been to had assigned channels all in the FRS/GMRS range for teams/squads because that's what everyone can use. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:07:58 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Used racal/thales P25 radio has encryption available from the software, no keyloader needed. Yes but good luck finding good batteries. |
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Posted: 7/2/2015 11:24:35 PM EDT
[#17]
Ebay old i355 nextel radios, encrypted, short range.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 5:29:42 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ebay old i355 nextel radios, encrypted, short range. This is your best and cheapest bet. These are SMR band radios, and function as FHSS (Frequency Hopping Spread Spectrum) 900 Mhz digital radios. While technically not encrypted, the FHSS digital nature of the transmission means that in order to decode it, you need a computer, SDR software, DSD+ software, and some dedicated radio/computer knowledge and skills. Not for the average paintballer. If you aren't keen on the i355's because they are discontinued, the Motorola DTR radios function almost identically, (although they are not compatible) and are still being produced. The DTR's are ISM band 900Mhz radios. Good luck RB |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:14:05 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you aren't keen on the i355's because they are discontinued, the Motorola DTR radios function almost identically, (although they are not compatible) and are still being produced. The DTR's are ISM band 900Mhz radios. Good luck RB I was about to recommend the DTR's. They are digital in the 900MHz band. This gives you at least a layer of obscurity where someone would have to be looking at the 900MHz band to hear you. Not a lot of people use them because they are so limiting, another benefit if you look at it that way. Being digital may offer a small layer of protection as well, not sure how scanners pick them up, but a cheap HAM (Baofeng) would not pick them up. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:28:59 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
IIRC, somewhere I remember reading about using Motorola SecureNet and any of the encryption types, as long as you were a licensed HAM and made a broadcast announcement that you were going to transmit in secure mode, including the type (AES, DES, OFB, etc) and announced your keycode. Thats as far as I can remember about the legal-ese of it all. nope OP - no encryption on the ham bands - if you get a business licence you're OK for encryption on the frequency you're assigned. What are you using now - what is most popular for the rest of the people playing to use? I'm assuming FRS/GMRS - if so, get some MURS radios and rock on, they won't be able to listen in because they're a completely different band. If you want even more secure you can step up and get tech licenses, go to 220 / 900mhz / 1.2Ghz and there won't be many on there though ham isn't really setup for playing paintball or airsoft, you may get some guy who doesn't like what you're doing even if you're being legal about everything. There are some license-free 900Mhz radios that are pretty secure as well. None of these are "encrypted" so if you're trying to stay away from anyone more important than the kids at the game you may have problems. *edit* - all of these options are probably a bit more expensive than just picking up blister pack radios - and will require some more work... just FYI. Also, good commercial radios are built much tougher than their commercial counterparts. That part may be appealing. |
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:54:24 AM EDT
[#21]
ost.
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Posted: 7/3/2015 10:57:17 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
ost. I have your answers 
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Posted: 7/3/2015 11:02:08 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have your answers Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
ost. I have your answers I love you. |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 11:24:05 AM EDT
[#24]
The i355 intrigues me...it looks like a much better option than standard $40 FRS radio sets off the shelf and can also take extended atennas and even use an FME antenna adaptor and etc for use with a plate carrier.
What's the downside to using an i355? |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 8:16:57 PM EDT
[#25]
eBay
XTS 3000 for $100-200 or XTS 5000 for $300-500 Make sure they have encryption on the flash code eBay for DES-XL or AES module to put in them $30-100 depending on which radio and crypto Motorola KVL 3000 to do DES for $400 ish or KVL3000+ for AES $1500 You now have secure radios |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 10:06:14 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ebay old i355 nextel radios, encrypted, short range. This. |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 10:12:42 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Ebay old i355 nextel radios, encrypted, short range. This. Short range yes - encrypted, no.... but better than a blister pack radio by far |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 11:27:31 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Short range yes - encrypted, no.... but better than a blister pack radio by far Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ebay old i355 nextel radios, encrypted, short range. This. Short range yes - encrypted, no.... but better than a blister pack radio by far Not encrypted, but 900mhz digital, frequency-hopping spread-spectrum is tough for an amateur to decode/intercept ETA: beats the hell out of the old frequency-inversion scrambling. |
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Posted: 7/4/2015 11:29:50 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not encrypted, but 900mhz digital, frequency-hopping spread-spectrum is tough for an amateur to decode/intercept ETA: beats the hell out of the old frequency-inversion scrambling. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ebay old i355 nextel radios, encrypted, short range. This. Short range yes - encrypted, no.... but better than a blister pack radio by far Not encrypted, but 900mhz digital, frequency-hopping spread-spectrum is tough for an amateur to decode/intercept ETA: beats the hell out of the old frequency-inversion scrambling. oh way better than most I agree - tough, not all that much if you know what you're doing... most. don't
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Posted: 7/5/2015 12:27:33 AM EDT
[#30]
i355 if youre on a budget, DTR 550 if youre not.
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Posted: 7/5/2015 8:30:13 AM EDT
[#31]
This was a picture I took of me charging up another group of XTS that I bought off ebay I have 10 now, with a shit ton of batteries some impress some not. We use them when we 4 wheel, hunt, camp, whatever. The thing on the left is a key loader - don't be a dummy and run encryption on the HAM bands, in fact don't get yourself in hot water just buy a license from the FCC if you're going to use encryption.
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Posted: 7/5/2015 8:41:49 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This was a picture I took of me charging up another group of XTS that I bought off ebay I have 10 now, with a shit ton of batteries some impress some not. We use them when we 4 wheel, hunt, camp, whatever. The thing on the left is a key loader - don't be a dummy and run encryption on the HAM bands, in fact don't get yourself in hot water just buy a license from the FCC if you're going to use encryption. http://i.imgur.com/Bd3kYHE.jpg very nice collection you have there 
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Posted: 7/5/2015 8:45:58 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
very nice collection you have there Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
This was a picture I took of me charging up another group of XTS that I bought off ebay I have 10 now, with a shit ton of batteries some impress some not. We use them when we 4 wheel, hunt, camp, whatever. The thing on the left is a key loader - don't be a dummy and run encryption on the HAM bands, in fact don't get yourself in hot water just buy a license from the FCC if you're going to use encryption. http://i.imgur.com/Bd3kYHE.jpg very nice collection you have there Yeah. That wasn't cheap. |
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Posted: 7/5/2015 9:34:00 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This was a picture I took of me charging up another group of XTS that I bought off ebay I have 10 now, with a shit ton of batteries some impress some not. We use them when we 4 wheel, hunt, camp, whatever. The thing on the left is a key loader - don't be a dummy and run encryption on the HAM bands, in fact don't get yourself in hot water just buy a license from the FCC if you're going to use encryption. http://i.imgur.com/Bd3kYHE.jpg Ballpark investment? |
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Posted: 7/5/2015 10:07:02 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ballpark investment? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
This was a picture I took of me charging up another group of XTS that I bought off ebay I have 10 now, with a shit ton of batteries some impress some not. We use them when we 4 wheel, hunt, camp, whatever. The thing on the left is a key loader - don't be a dummy and run encryption on the HAM bands, in fact don't get yourself in hot water just buy a license from the FCC if you're going to use encryption. http://i.imgur.com/Bd3kYHE.jpg Ballpark investment? Roughly $1500 in radios (10 total) $120 in antennas $200 in crypto modules for the radios that didn't come installed with them $600 in batteries $600 for the KVL with an extra battery and the cable to load the keys $120 for an old panasonic toughbook to run the software on $30 for the programming cable $20 bucks for a tool to open the radios to install hardware / service them So a little over 3k in that stuff |
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Posted: 7/5/2015 10:08:39 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Roughly $1500 in radios (10 total) $120 in antennas $200 in crypto modules for the radios that didn't come installed with them $600 in batteries $600 for the KVL with an extra battery and the cable to load the keys $120 for an old panasonic toughbook to run the software on $30 for the programming cable $20 bucks for a tool to open the radios to install hardware / service them So a little over 3k in that stuff Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
This was a picture I took of me charging up another group of XTS that I bought off ebay I have 10 now, with a shit ton of batteries some impress some not. We use them when we 4 wheel, hunt, camp, whatever. The thing on the left is a key loader - don't be a dummy and run encryption on the HAM bands, in fact don't get yourself in hot water just buy a license from the FCC if you're going to use encryption. http://i.imgur.com/Bd3kYHE.jpg Ballpark investment? Roughly $1500 in radios (10 total) $120 in antennas $200 in crypto modules for the radios that didn't come installed with them $600 in batteries $600 for the KVL with an extra battery and the cable to load the keys $120 for an old panasonic toughbook to run the software on $30 for the programming cable $20 bucks for a tool to open the radios to install hardware / service them So a little over 3k in that stuff So you can run actual crypto as long as you license it? |
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Posted: 7/5/2015 10:29:31 AM EDT
[#37]
Yes if you buy a license you can run it at the location you are authorized to run it at, I only run DES-XL didn't feel like paying a premium for AES-256
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Posted: 7/5/2015 1:19:14 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I basically need something for paintball/air soft, ass holes are channel surfing n shit. Its serious business.
But being as it could come in handy for SHTF, but as well as needing to be cheap enough to play weekend warrior with. i have no idea on price point... i mean i'm playing in 2K of LBT gear... so it has to cost less than all the money. For $300 per HT you can get a Yaesu FT1DR with the "new" C4FM encoding. It's not in terribly widespread usage yet. Of course this entails your entire team getting their ham licenses. You could also go with a D*Star HT from Icom. DMR has some digital encoding as well. |
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Posted: 7/5/2015 1:32:38 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Roughly $1500 in radios (10 total) $120 in antennas $200 in crypto modules for the radios that didn't come installed with them $600 in batteries $600 for the KVL with an extra battery and the cable to load the keys $120 for an old panasonic toughbook to run the software on $30 for the programming cable $20 bucks for a tool to open the radios to install hardware / service them So a little over 3k in that stuff Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
This was a picture I took of me charging up another group of XTS that I bought off ebay I have 10 now, with a shit ton of batteries some impress some not. We use them when we 4 wheel, hunt, camp, whatever. The thing on the left is a key loader - don't be a dummy and run encryption on the HAM bands, in fact don't get yourself in hot water just buy a license from the FCC if you're going to use encryption. http://i.imgur.com/Bd3kYHE.jpg Ballpark investment? Roughly $1500 in radios (10 total) $120 in antennas $200 in crypto modules for the radios that didn't come installed with them $600 in batteries $600 for the KVL with an extra battery and the cable to load the keys $120 for an old panasonic toughbook to run the software on $30 for the programming cable $20 bucks for a tool to open the radios to install hardware / service them So a little over 3k in that stuff How much did mighty Mo charge you for the programming software? |
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Posted: 7/6/2015 6:49:34 PM EDT
[#40]
Try the Bowman/Marconi/Selex PRC 343 or H4855 radio. It has around an 500m range. They are encrypted between units. Low powered WIFI. Has a low probability of detection. These are used by the British and I think the Marines too. More info can be found here: http://www.prc68.com/I/Bowman.shtml
They can be found on Ebay from any where to $100 to $500. Try searching Marconi/Selex H4855 or Bowman PRC 343 http://www.ebay.com/itm/MARCONI-SELENIA-Communications-H4855-Radio-Used-/201381683236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ee348a024 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Marconi-Selenia-Selex-Prc-343-bowman-H4855-Prr-radio-reduced-price-/221814360830?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item33a52a8afe Also on ebay you can buy a 5 pin lemo to NATO pin and run Comtacs or Sordins with the radio without any modification (I have the same set up). http://www.ebay.com/itm/LEMO-to-Nexus-U-92-connector-H4855-radio-Bowman-PRR-PRC-radio-TEA-TCI-MBITR-152-/181094393076?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a2a1124f4 Try contacting "danspartan" on ebay. He hooked me up. http://www.ebay.com/usr/danspartan?_trksid=p2047675.l2559 |
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Posted: 7/7/2015 7:35:46 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Try the Bowman/Marconi/Selex PRC 343 or H4855 radio. It has around an 500m range. They are encrypted between units. Low powered WIFI. Has a low probability of detection. These are used by the British and I think the Marines too. More info can be found here: http://www.prc68.com/I/Bowman.shtml They can be found on Ebay from any where to $100 to $500. Try searching Marconi/Selex H4855 or Bowman PRC 343 http://www.ebay.com/itm/MARCONI-SELENIA-Communications-H4855-Radio-Used-/201381683236?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ee348a024 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Marconi-Selenia-Selex-Prc-343-bowman-H4855-Prr-radio-reduced-price-/221814360830?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item33a52a8afe Also on ebay you can buy a 5 pin lemo to NATO pin and run Comtacs or Sordins with the radio without any modification (I have the same set up). http://www.ebay.com/itm/LEMO-to-Nexus-U-92-connector-H4855-radio-Bowman-PRR-PRC-radio-TEA-TCI-MBITR-152-/181094393076?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a2a1124f4 Try contacting "danspartan" on ebay. He hooked me up. http://www.ebay.com/usr/danspartan?_trksid=p2047675.l2559 good point - I've used them quite a bit and never thought to look for them... they work decently well |
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