In my bag I've got a glock 19 with spare 33rd mag.  A rifle just isn't an option at this point.  In the future maybe.

But if going up against one/several I wont have my Banshee.  Still I'd like to have something to give me at least some protection.  

Maybe one of those US Palm single plate setups with a ceramic plate?  AR500plate?

Thanks

-Emt1581

Are you planing to go after an active shooter as a none LEO?
I do not recommend that if that is what you are asking.
With that being said I suggest ceramic always.

Unass the area should be your goal.

That being said, I don't see how a plate carrier fits in to the equation.

Defense not offense.  

Any carrier suggestions or just wear the bag in front of the chest?

-Emt1581

+1

Get the f**k out of an active shooter situation ASAP. Its not your job to stop a crazy person with a gun. There are people with much better gear and training than you who will handle it. Plus by putting yourself into that situation you are putting yourself at GREAT risk of being shot by police. When police show up to a active shooter situation they are going to take down anyone with a gun that isnt wearing a police uniform. If you do find yourself in the middle of one, chances are it will be unexpected and you wont have armor. Keep your head down and your pistol concealed unless absolutely needed. If you have a obvious chance to stop the shooter do so but dont go out of your way to lay down your life.

Is there a specific reason why you think you will find yourself in an active shooter situation? I see your name has "EMT" in it, i know some medical crew get called to shootings but usually they only allow them on seen once the situation is under control, ie you wont be working on a victim while being shot at or anything.

With that being said ceramic is always preferable over AR500.

You CC a Glock 19 with a 33 rd mag?

Please dont take thing the wrong way but i think you need to reevaluate your gear and firearms needs and what you actually need for the real world are. As a concealed carry firearms instructor I get a lot of students who show up in my classes who want to get their concealed carry permit because they think it will make them a police officer. I have to remind these people they have no rights to arrest anyone committing a crime. Concealed carry is to be used as a absolute last resort for defense of ones LIFE...not property, not ego, not to be a hero, stop a crime or just in general be cool. The only time you draw that pistol is if you absolutely think the person that has confronted you is going to end your life and your only way to stop them is to end theirs first. Honestly as a civilian if you have to draw your concealed carry firearm you screwed up! you have used poor judgment and put yourself in a bad situation. You walked down the dark alley, stopped for gas at 3am in a bad neighborhood, went for a jog by yourself late at night, weren't aware of your surroundings, etc...

Well I own a Tyr Tactical PICO, there is no way you would stuff something like that into a bag though.
Unless you can rig something up to where you will be able to wear your bag like a plate carrier and have proper placement I do not recommend that either.
If you want to wear armor get a concealable soft vest.

SPARE mag is the stick.  I'm a vol. EMT...15years now.  However my office on a college campus is where an active shooter would be far more likely to happen.

Can't say Ive ever heard an instructor say all ccwers who need to use their piece has made a mistake in some way.  Definitely a unique perspective given the job.   Kinda like saying she was asking for it while administering a rape kit.

-Emt1581

What are Pennsylvania's CC laws? Meaning in Michigan you don't qualify to carry on a college campus...I am the assistant director of security for the college for creative studies in Detroit MI. If I heard you were carrying I would immediately call the police and have you arrested even if you were faculty. Myself and the director are the only ones permitted to carry on campus and we had to have special expedition to do so. I was a marsoc operator for 8 years and a Detroit police officer for 4 years. If you need to carry at work, yourself and security are doing an awful job...CCS has never had an active shooter in over 100 years in the city with the worst crime problem in the country...

It really depends how you're going to store it while not in use.

Only you know your own personal situation well enough to be able to point out places where you might be able to hide said equipment when not in use.

You will be lucky to actually have access to said equipment if the need arises (with my luck, the incident would take place while I'm outside the office in the shitter or something, meanwhile, the armor is safe and sound in the office and I'm cut off from it).

Being fast enough to actually put the damn thing on in time will be another story.

Totally legal here.  And concealed means concealed.  Never heard of a school shooting in a high crime area.  

Any actual thoughts on armor or just looking to drop in and spread the good word of hypocrisy?

-Emt1581

They used to make an apron of sorts a while back.  Soft armor but just flip it over your head and your good.  The US. Palm looked similar.  But this is why it couldnt be a standard carrier.  No way of getting that on in a second or two if needed.

Thanks

-Emt1581

Several different companies have an Active Shooter Kit with a minimalist-type plate carrier out on the market now.  The company I work for has one with a basic plate carrier with 3 rows of PALS webbing on the front carrier and a slick back.  It comes with a little carry bag so it can be thrown wherever you need for storage.  I thought it was a pretty cool idea.



CHRIS

That is perhaps the most ridiculous and dumbest statement I've ever read on the internet.

Maybe my statement came off a little strong. Obviously there will be situations you have zero control over and you will be forced to defend yourself, it's not your fault, things just happen. But at the same time you should be making your best effort to avoid dangerous situations that put you at risk. It's all part of situational awareness and understanding that a ccw gives you the means to defense yourself but it doesn't come with a LEO badgw, the right to enforce law or make arrests.

If you think ppl have the right and/or the responsibility to put themselves in harms way and play the role of a police officer that's your opinion. But in my classes I teach the opposite.

Well done judging your security success rate on NOT having an active shooter

Yes this is what I was thinking of.  Any links?

Thanks

--Emt1581

Ahh, another "I'm the only one professional enough" operator.

If LE see's you with body armor and a 33 round mag in a Glock during an active shooter incident, you will get shot.

This isn't ours, but the carrier is similar and we include a carry bag.


http://highcomsecurity.com/products/active-shooters-response-kit?variant=575109557


If you Google Active Shooter Kit you'll see several types available.





CHRIS




 
 

Let's just go ahead and call bullshit on this one.

/

This... Police aren't real big on gaining Positive ID of their targets.

LOL..

ETA- Your timeline don't add up if you went to DPD after your 8 years as a MARSOC "operator"....

As far as carrying a handgun for self defense,  if I need one, I believe a
a rifle is better, so I bought a glock pattern .40 sub2000. I have bought
a glock model 22 to pair with it.  Primarily intend to carry it on trips with my
family or friends when we are not carrying our gear for a match or class.
Both carry discreetly in a maxpedition spatha and I want to buy a soft
armor panel for frontal cover.  

If the leo's show up quick enough I'll un-ass. Otherwise I'll do what I have to do
to protect my family and anyone else in my immediate area.

I believe active shooter situations are going to become
more common.  Be prepared.

That's my plan.  Always fluid.

John

Oh ok..a slick carrier.  Forgot about those.  Good idea.

When I looked at active shooter setups in the past, the vast majority were based on a rifle platform so I came up wither my own.  Everything fits nicely into a maxpedition versa.  

It'd be heavy but an AR500 plate in a slick carrier would give me some coverage without worrying about fractures from dropping the bag onfloor the floor ever day.

Thanks

-Emt1581

Chris,
You & I met at the Arfcom shoot
in Cullowee a few years ago.

How are you involved with HighCom?

Are you still in Ruf'ton?

Thanks!

John

We sure did... and I am still in the megopolis of Ruf'ton.

I'm not involved with HighCom.  They are a competitor of ours in that market. They just had something similar to what our company makes and I didn't want to come across as a shill by showing ours.  We've done business with them in the past and they seem like a solid company.



CHRIS



 

Who do you work for?

John

If you aren't wearing a immediately recognizable uniform, I would be shocked if you didn't get fired upon.  David

How about backpack armor?
Backpack armor

Or if you have the money, that armored bag by Erathr3.

Expensive

I would go with a name brand slick carrier with the lightest ceramcs I could afford, no condor crap.  Ceramics aren't as fragile as you think and you can add a strip of foam to the bottom if you feel the need for extra protection.  I feed hard armor is a neccesity with the few cases where an active shooter has been armed with a long gun, but soft would be easier to carry everyday.  Go see and try on some armor, that way you have an idea how bulky it is gong to be.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

+1

and the highlighted part is some real, next level, belt-fed derp

So security at fort hood was awful? What about security at the Washington Navy Yard? That kind of thinking is dangerous and just 1 step away from "only people who should have guns/high cap magazines are law enforcement and the military."

REDACTED

Midnight facilities maintenance cleaned up this post before any students arrived to use the area.

I am a Rapid Deployment Instructor.  Our local medics are all issued soft armor carriers that are similar in appearance to local LE with MEDIC patches prominently displayed.  They are also trained to only deploy with LE cover teams.....and only after the shooting stops.

Like others have said, and I realize that it is not a popular reality on Arfcom, but in an active shooter response you are more likely to get shot than challenged if you are running around with a weapon and you don't look like one of the good guys.  We teach our detectives and narcs that they need to suit up and partner up with a uniform asap to prevent blue on blue.

There is also the very real possibility that you will be identified as a second suspect by other people if you are moving around.  In that case you will be engaged if the officers see a weapon in your hand.

You will  be much better off to bunker in a room to protect as many as you can than you are to go hunting.  You can still protect others without making yourself a target.  By the time room clearing/secondary searches begin the shooting has stopped and things are slowing down back to normal.  

As to armor stay with ceramics or level IIIA soft armor.  Either way a slick carrier with medic patches or some other way to ID yourself as an EMT is a good idea.  Its a good idea if your job ever involves responding to any type of GSW.  Someone's already been shot......

Stay Safe,
Rob

You and your director went on an expedition to find your ability to carry on campus?  Amazeballs.

I'm impressed that you've squeezed 12 years of mil/leo work experience into a 26 year life span.  That's quite the expedition.

Fuck yes!  RAIDERS!!!

And thank you for your police service in Detroit; it's probably worse than any place you went with MSOR

Oh shit! Someone better call the facilities staff, it's about to get messy up in here. Before long, it won't be a safe environment for art students.

United States Marine Corps Forces Special Operations Command (MARSOC): February 24, 2006 - present

MARSOC has been around 9 years and 3 months.

8 years MARSOC, 4 years Detroit PD and current job?

I thought "Operators" had to be good at math and reading clocks & calendars and shit.


OP, TAG usually has some good deals in their "Sale" section.
Here's a "Havoc" slick carrier for $70
TAG

Like I said earlier, the goal is to survive.  If I get a shot, great.  But I just want to be able to protect myself and if possible take care of the wounded.  See in my Versa there's a G19 but there's also an IFAK complete with hemostatic agents, chest seal, decomp needle, shears, etc.  Nice thing about the versa is that it doubles as a holster so it just looks like I have a bag slung over my shoulder/hip.  Kinda blends in on campus.  

As for identifying myself as a good guy...a few options and given that no one's going to see it unless the worst of the worst happens... it's not like I'm going to be prancing around in it.  I could paint EMS or EMT on the carrier, pin my badge or some station/EMT patches to it, wear my reflective vest (again with or without badge, etc.  Problem is, in this area, a black or really any plate carrier is going to stick out like a sore thumb to cops.  Then on the other hand the fluorescent yellow reflective vest is going to attract a shooter like a moth to a flame.  

-Emt1581

The Blackhawk! low viz at Opticsplanet is only $44 shipped.  Given I'll only wear it once....

I do have ceramic plates at home in my banshee but I was thinking about just buying steel and tossing it in my desk drawer.  It's just one hell of a gamble that the shooters will use non-armor piercing rounds.  I could always do steel now and then upgrade with another set of ESAPI's as funds allow.  I'm shocked how expensive those bastards got!! I got my set for just over $200 a few years ago and they came with free steel side plates!!

Thanks though!

-Emt1581

I've carried an AR500 plate in a backpack for about a month before I ditched it. If bullets start flying, most people are probably better off dropping the backpack so they can run faster.

I can run faster without 30 pounds on my back.

One AR500 plate weighs 30lbs??  

I don't think my entire carrier with SAPI's, mags/etc. attached weighs that much.  

-Emt1581

I don't remember the exact number, but they are about 9 pounds for the plate. Everything else in my work backpack is about another 20 pounds.

When it comes to running away, dropping the backpack speeds things up significantly.

NorCal is never above you and never below you but always ready to ban you.

Ok, so you have an active shooter situation. Say it's at work. Or the mall, it really doesn't matter.

You break contact, (heroically shooting 5 or 6 assailants with your EDC, most likely a Glock, probably with some sweet Trijicon or laser sight or both. doesn;t matter). And then you make it to a safe place where you start helping the wounded and getting LE on scene because nobody has trained to use a phone to call 911. .... Sheep..... Who knows, maybe you even got laid. Again, you have made it to safety with those you could reasonably band with on the way out. Is it realistic that it is time for you to go don a vest... of any sort, out of your car, and then re-engage in the fight... alone?



No it isn't. Active shooter situations, unless you're in an organized tactical unit, do not warrant breaking contact and donning body armor. No. Not at all. Just find a place to take cover. Most likely, the cops would end up testing your vest for you.

While I generally agree with you, the average person doesn't have access to support for ceramic. Regular x-ray inspection by someone who KNOWS what they are doing isn't cheap. For most people (and myself), the newer 3+ AR500 stuff with coating is a deal. more affordable, and more durable. Can't leave the UHMWPE plates in the trunk in most of the US or it degrades. Who wants $1000.00 milkjugs?

I do keep armor in the trunk of my personal vehicle. 3+ plates with IIIa Kevlar behind it. Maybe not the "coolest", but functional and reliable. Work armor is ceramic, but not my dime for that.