Interesting video, would love to have seen them test the Gov issue SAPI as well.

but...but....I was told 55gr 5.56 at 3k FPS would penetrate steel at that range.....

Yet again proving that steel is a fine budget choice for those wanting some type of armor...

But the question now is whether the steel plates are actually better.  In that test I would rather have been wearing the steel plate.  I'm mixed I guess.  I do have a set of ceramic plates on order.  It does make me second guess myself.

Neither is the best. There are trade-offs with either.

It will, in the case of plates that were improperly heat treated, which is where the scuttlebutt you're referencing started with.

ETA: I love that the AR500 plate they have isn't cut symmetrically on the top corners.

i just bought those midwest plates and i like them. i havent shot at them but i would think any ceramic plate would fail with 2 shots in the same spot. if you get shot in the top of a AR500 plate that frag is going into your neck for sure.

/facepalm

Too much derp to even know where to start.

This is what I got out of it. Yes, they mentioned "non-scientific" test but it was skewed towards steel as the shooter sells them. Also shooting the ceramic in exactly the same spot...changes are way low on that.

Of course you have worked extensively in the armor testing business (of which you have never provided evidence), so you should have no problem letting us all know why the test was full of "derp". Dude shot the steel plate and ceramic plate and saw failure of the ceramic. Let me guess...you think it was retarded because the plates were at an angle, they shot the mid-west plate close to the same spot, and we don't know the ammo used.

supposed to make shooting easier, I've been shouldering my rifle on the side of the strap so I don't think it makes a big dif

I got to make a video shooting my various steel plates, targets, not armor.  I mag dumped 30rnds of xm193 from 20' into a 12" steel plate with no penetration.  The steel came from my father's friend who owns a metal shop.  These pieces were stamped out.  I have no idea what the grade is.  I also have some ar500 targets from The Target Man, so I can shoot both side by side.

I also had an old piece of 1/2" thick mild steel that 193 penetrated at 100 yards.  So its all dependent on the grade of steel.

It's good to see real world variables (angles, shot placement, etc.) as you won't be in a lab if getting shot.  It's also nice to get off of paper specs and see real world performance.

oooops. missed the switch.
Too bad they didn't test it with 55gr. 5.56.
They shot it with 9mm.

Why the hell would you test a rifle plate with a hand gun?

um, did you watch the video?

oops missed the switch.
And he did say 55gr. right at the end.
HUH.

Quote for kindle

says vid is private

Another Ar500 test vid. Pretty well done.

Shows that spalling will always be an issue with AR500 plates after multiple rounds, but it will still prevent lethal holes from being put in you.

I've posted these before and the butthurt flowed deep, so this is the first ceramic vs steel thread I've opened in a long time.

I shot this plate with steel core 5.56, lead core 5.56, lead core .30-06 and 9mm.    The rifle rounds from about 30ft, the pistol about half that.





There are slight dents under the .30-06 and steel core, but not enough to show in the picture.  I also have some AR500 targets that I made of 1/4" AR500 and they have about 2,000 rounds on them without any holes.

I also have some 450 Hardox steel and some AR400 that do not handle being shot nearly as well, but no pics, sorry.

 

I just ordered some AR500 armor plates. Last forever, mitigate spalling within the first few impacted rounds, and even after the despalling coating is gone they will still prevent a lot more rounds from putting holes in your body.

It has a lot more going for it than the ceramics that cost 3-5 times as much, that have a shelf life and will only defeat a few rounds.

The choice is clear.

Ceramic has its advantages too.  If I wore plates for a living I would use ceramic, in my situation it makes sense (to me) to buy the AR500 and train in it, and save for some truly good ceramic.  I will keep the ceramic in the closet and continue to train in the steel.

Plan A: take multiple rounds to the plate and never get hit anywhere else.

Good plan.

(And ceramics themselves don't have a shelf life. Kevlar does, and some of the wraps that go around the plates do, but ceramics will outlast essentially anything if not damaged)

AR500 is fine if that's what you want. They are low cost, and will stop most common threats. Good. Buy them if you want them, that's the whole free market thing at work.

But don't pretend like it's a better choice than ceramics.

I would not trust a ceramic after one hit I have seen first hand the results. Also, I just can't bring myself to spend hundreds of dollars on something that may expire and degrade over time when I know I can get somthing that will last forever. To each his own.

I'm not pretending. It is a better choice for me.

Ceramic and steel both have their place. If I were gearing up for military or police applications where Uncle Sugar is footing the bill and resupplying me with new plates if I crack one or take a hit, I would probably go with Level 4 ceramic. I'd like to have the ability to stop a single round of .30 cal AP, which I would consider a common threat overseas. There are lots of Dragunovs and even Mosin-Nagants out there still that can really ruin your day with the right round. OTOH, if I were mainly concerned with a civilian SHTF type situation here within the US, the AR500 steel plates make a lot of sense. The .30 cal AP rounds are pretty uncommon over here. The AR500 plates like those discussed in this thread will stop M193 and M855 just fine. They will also stop the non-AP .30 cal rifle rounds quite well. They can withstand multiple impacts from these rounds. They can be dropped, thrown around, and abused for a lifetime and still remain functional. They can be left in hot trunks and not degrade due to the heat like the super lightweight poly plates. And they're cheap. While cost shouldn't be the sole deciding factor when choosing equipment designed to save your life, for people who have to buy their own gear out of pocket, cost certainly is a consideration. AR500 steel gives you a similar degree of protection against the common threat rounds found in the US, it provides better multi-hit capability, it is more durable overall and compared to ceramic plates, they are very inexpensive. The tradeoff of course is that they are a bit heavier. And without some type of coating or kevlar panels covering the strike face, there is the danger of spalling even on initial hits.

Truthfully, if you can afford it, the best bet if you're a civilian is to do what Currahee has done. Get both! Train with the steel plates and keep your ceramics protected so they'll be fresh if and when you need them. And if you manage to drop and crack one of them somewhere down the road (or even worse, take a round in one of them), you will always have the steel to fall back on. Again, as civilians, you don't have a military supply system furnishing you with new gear when what you have breaks. If something ever happens in this country that is bad enough to necessitate the use of this type of gear, replacements will likely be hard to come by. So what you have when things kick off may be all you'll ever have. So having some quality steel plates is a good idea due to the long term durability and multiple hit capability. Besides, who knows how much longer body armor will be available to civilians in this country? Should a ban ever be placed on the sale of Level III/IV type armor, I sure would like to have some steel plates in my inventory that I know will last me for a lifetime and can be passed on to my kids someday.

The video is still marked private. Can someone please tell me at what distance they shot the XM193 at? Was it standard Walmart Federal or some foreign no name crap?

It was not specified. All he said is that it was 55 grn.

I watched the video before it was marked private. He said .223 55 grain. Nothing was mentioned about XM193.

That's exactly what I needed to hear

I am always leery of claims that 1/4" AR500 plate has stopped Federal XM193 at close range. For the majority of folks purchasing plates for a SHTF scenario, the engagement distance of less than 5 yards in your typical American residence should be of high consideration. Also of high consideration should be the proliferation of surplus XM193 online and at Walmart. I would assume if your job requires more than just occasional  ballistic-plate, rifle-threat protection, you would invest more than a few hundred dollars and get something worthy of the typical threats you would face. I also see the same cost arguments come up time and again regarding steel vs ceramic. If the $100 to $150 it takes to graduate from steel plates to a Level IV ceramic has you stressed, perhaps you should re-evaluate your need for them at all.

Weight usually won't be a consideration for SHTF use but the threat of XM193 should definitely be considered. Thanks to Obama and the sensationalism of several mass shootings, I would guess more AR-15's have been bought by civilians in the last 5 years than probably all the other years since it was invented.