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Posted: 9/22/2010 8:34:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MakoDefense]
 I am a few months late posting this, but I wanted a chance to shoot, photograph, and spend some time with this product before I posted about it. The KPOS is a professional grade PDW conversion for common duty and military sidearms. This is a high-end product designed for professional use, not a cheaply built product designed for the consumer market. The construction of the KPOS is entirely aluminum and steel, and the size is kept compact by avoiding the use of polymers, and by using a compact folding stock. Features: The KPOS is a drop-in conversion - it requires no alteration to the pistols. The pistol slides into the KPOS, A locking lever is locked, a locking block slides into place, and a captive pin is pushed into place. The charging handle is inserted into the pre-installed end-plate. Total install time is about 5 to 10 seconds. The KPOS is designed to use a compact optic, but in the case of a failure, the pistol's iron sights may be used. The flash hider may be removed to allow the use of a suppressor.  Purpose: The KPOS is ideal for deep-cover operatives, executive security work, and other situations where a very compact carbine is ideal. The KPOS is also a less expensive alternative to compact weapons such as Uzis and MP5s. A KPOS-equipped pistol is not meant to replace a larger carbine, such as an M4 in its standard role, but to provide an advantage for specific purposes. For civilian use, it turns a pistol into an effective, compact carbine that can be carried or stored in about the same space as a pistol. It is handy in confined spaces, and a lot of fun as well. Safety: Safety is an important consideration, since the pistols that this conversion is designed for do not have manual safeties. When used as pistols, they are either in the shooter's hand or in a holster. When converted to a carbine, safety is an issue if the trigger is exposed. This issue is solved when the KPOS is combined with a specially designed forward grip that is also a safety device. When folded, the grip covers the trigger of the pistol, preventing discharge from something striking the trigger while the weapon is slung.  Advantages: • The KPOS system is more compact than a Micro Uzi, with better ergonomics. • Manipulation of the pistol remains the same - trigger pull, magazine release, reloads, slide catch - all these are the same between pistol and carbine. Training is simplified. • A KPOS-equipped pistol can be carried slung under a jacket, giving carbine effectiveness in a compact package. • A pistol in a KPOS is much easier to shoot accurately than a pistol in the hand. • Accessories may be attached to top side or bottom rails. • Folding stock is compact, deploys quickly, and is patterned after the proven Micro Uzi stock. Advantages over other PDW conversions: Several companies have released copies of the KPOS concept. Some of these products are well-built, while others are not so great. Some were rushed to market while the KPOS was still in testing (photos of the KPOS had been released before the KPOS itself was ready for release). Because extra care was taken to thoroughly test and refine the KPOS design before release, there are several areas in which the KPOS is superior. • The KPOS is designed to be used with both ported and non-ported pistols. Other designs block the ports, containing heat and carbon. • The KPOS is entirely aluminum and steel - much more compact. • The KPOS attaches at the front and rear of the frame for security and repeatable accuracy. Some designs attach only at the front, and the dust covers can flex on polymer frame pistols. • The KPOS has no brass deflector. Ejection is the same as it is when the pistol is shot separately from the KPOS. Nothing interferes with ejection. Other designs deflect the brass, sometimes back down into the action. • The KPOS does not cause the carbon build-up around the end of the slide, frame, and barrel that can be an issue with some other systems. • The KPOS is the most compact system. • The KPOS, with the folding grip, protects the trigger. Other systems are unsafe to carry. • The charging handle endplate can remain on the pistol, whether the pistol is used by itself (with or without the charging handle), or in the KPOS. The charging handle is also available separately from the KPOS and is popular with law enforcement and people who have trouble grasping a slide. • KPOS installation is fast and requires no tools or alteration of the pistol. • The folding stock is much more compact than the fixed or collapsible stocks on other systems. All of the advantage is in the size. If the stock is too bulky, there is not really any advantage over a short M4 or an MP5, etc.  Howard grins after ripping through a magazine of 357 SIG FMJs. Impressions: We offer two PDW (carbine) conversions for pistols. The first is the GLR17 and GLR-440 stock systems. This system is the most compact system available and the best for undercover work. A pistol with this stock installed may be carried under a suit jacket with no more bulk than a pistol by itself. It makes the pistol more stable and effective, but is very light. It is also inexpensive. The second system is the KPOS, which ends up slightly larger than the GLR17/440 system, with a gain in stability and modularity. It is still much smaller than any other PDW conversion, and is smaller than the Micro Uzi. I was recently in Gambell, Alaska, and took some walrus hunters out to get their impressions on the KPOS and the GLR-17. These guys shoot with speed and precision, since they hunt the dangerous animals from small skiffs in among the sea ice, targeting the brain stems of the walrus to ensure a fast, safe kill. We shot a Glock 31 with both the factory 357 SIG barrel and an EFK Fire Dragon 9mm barrel. We all agreed that the GLR-17 was easier to conceal and fast to get into action from concealment. Care has to be taken to keep hands away from the muzzle (thumb needs to be wrapped around the back of the foregrip, not along the side of the weapon, which can place it in the muzzle blast area). I really like this set up for its concealability. The KPOS, however, was much nicer to shoot. The stock is very comfortable and the rubber buttpad keeps the stock in place on the chest. The extra weight stabilizes the weapon nicely, and the flash hider allows me to run my off-hand thumb up along the side of the weapon as I am used to doing. The KPOS conceals nicely under a jacket, and a suit could be tailored or the correct size chosen to conceal it. Getting it into action is a simple as flipping open the stock and foregrip. Controls are obviously familiar.  "Red Eye" loves the KPOS and the M21 reflex sight! Notice the controllability, as the slide is back and trigger still depressed after firing a shot. All of us found that we shot more accurately with the KPOS installed than without, as proven by some tight rapid-fire groups. What did the walrus hunters think? I've been informed that there are some seals that are going to have fatal encounters with KPOS equipped pistols before next summer. They were especially impressed with the M21 reflex sight, since it requires no batteries and has no electronics - a serious advantage for people who hunt dangerous animals from open 16 foot skiffs in the salt water and arctic cold of the open ocean. I will have more photos and video soon, including installation photos. Available models: KPOS17 - Glock 17, 17L, 19, 22, 23, 24, 31, 32, 34, 35 KPOS18 - Glock 18 (full auto) KPOS21 - Glock 20 & 21 KPOS226 - SIG 226 KPOS2022 - SIG Pro 2022 NFA Information: The KPOS itself is not an NFA device. It is simply a stock in the eyes of the ATFE. Before the stock can be mounted on a pistol, the pistol itself must be registered with the ATFE (with a Form 1) as a short-barreled rifle. Once the pistol is registered, the KPOS may be installed. I am not sure whether the ATFE would consider possession of the KPOS and an unregistered pistol to be constructive possession ( I am work on getting a firm answer on this). Since different ATFE field offices tend to enforce things differently, my advice right now would be to store a KPOS with someone who does not have the appropriate pistol until your pistol is registered as an SBR. Once the pistol is registered, it will always be an SBR. The KPOS can be removed and the pistol can still be used as a pistol, but the registered pistol will always be an NFA device, with or without the KPOS (or GLR17/440) installed. An alternative to registering the pistol is to install a 16" barrel, which costs about $200 -$250 retail.  Shooting a Glock 31 with the GLR-17 stock and FGG-S folding grip.    A rapid-fire group at about 25 meters (the four rounds in and just below the orange) and a shredded target. |
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Posted: 9/22/2010 10:04:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MakoDefense]
[#1]
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Posted: 9/24/2010 9:01:09 PM EDT
[#2]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-2z-TlTYeo&feature=player_embedded
We did not make these videos, so while there are some good shots of the KPOS system, not all methods show for assembly and use are correct. I will post videos soon showing correct assembly and methods of use.
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Posted: 9/25/2010 2:44:14 PM EDT
[#3]
Folded size:
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Posted: 9/28/2010 1:22:32 AM EDT
[#4]
Will this work with a Glock that has a "rear sear" installed?
Thanks, Jake |
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Posted: 9/28/2010 12:21:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MakoDefense]
[#5]
Originally Posted By Jmacken37: Will this work with a Glock that has a "rear sear" installed? Thanks, Jake The only issue with the sear is that it occupies the space used by the charging handle. There is a manufacturer that came up with an excellent solution to this problem, but I don't want to reveal any details until he is ready to release it. Otherwise, it would take the fabrication of a charging handle that did not interfere with the sear and a selector switch, so it would take a bit of alteration. ETA: The solution to this is in the works. |
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Posted: 9/28/2010 12:29:21 PM EDT
[#6]
Lipstick
On A Pig |
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Posted: 9/28/2010 11:38:52 PM EDT
[#7]
So which is the pig? The Glock or the SIG . . . ?
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Posted: 9/28/2010 11:49:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Black-Tiger]
[#8]
Not really my cup of tea; but there will be epopel that will like it.
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Posted: 9/29/2010 12:03:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: MakoDefense]
[#9]
Better photos of the FGG-S-KPOS foregrip safety system for pistols.
This foregrip covers the trigger to prevent negligent discharges due to the trigger striking something while hanging from a sling. There are two models - one built specifically for a pistol mounted in the KPOS, and one for mounting on the pistol's rail directly (for Glock, Jericho, or BUL pistols with GLR-17 or GLR-440 stocks installed). The foregrip folds, and a safety shield extends over the trigger guard area of the pistol. It extends by simply pulling it toward the back of the pistol and locks into place. Pressing buttons located on each side of the grip allows the shield to snap forward under spring pressure, or the grip can simply be unfolded to expose the trigger. For safety, both buttons must be pressed simultaneously in order to release the shield. The grip unfolds by simply swinging the grip down and out, and folds with the press of a button. The foregrip can be mounted in any rail slot (in the photos I mounted it in the rearmost slot, while I prefer to mount it forward) and the shield adjusts to the correct length. This foregrip makes the KPOS or the GLR-17/440 systems the only pistol carbine systems (for pistols without safeties) that are safe to carry loaded.  FGG-S-KPOS grip folded and extended to protect the trigger of a KPOS-mounted Glock 31  FGG-S-KPOS Foregrip Safety in extended position with shield retracted |
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WA, USA
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Posted: 10/1/2010 6:49:10 PM EDT
[#10]
Ever gonna come out with a model for the XD?
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Posted: 10/1/2010 6:53:10 PM EDT
[#11]
Originally Posted By chrisb9381: Ever gonna come out with a model for the XD? The XD version will be available soon. I also like the XD. |
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Posted: 10/13/2010 9:36:41 PM EDT
[#12]
More photos and independent reviews here:
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Posted: 10/13/2010 10:44:07 PM EDT
[#13]
that would be interesting for a G20 w/ 6in barrel
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USA
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Posted: 10/14/2010 10:17:24 AM EDT
[#14]
charging handle looks like a teeth breaker!
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Posted: 10/14/2010 1:08:53 PM EDT
[#15]
It would be pretty tough to get your face in a position to get hit by the charging handle. The ergonomics are designed so that your cheek naturally goes to the right position on the stock. I just tried it, and to get the charging handle to hit my teeth, I had to put the side of my cheek all the way forward until it was on the back corner of the KPOS. It is very uncomfortably and not natural at all - you would know your face was in the wrong position. The charging handle is too short to hit the front teeth, so your face has to be far enough forward so that it can hit the teeth on the side of the mouth, so the face has to be a lot farther forward than it would appear before teeth can be hit.
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Posted: 10/14/2010 1:18:46 PM EDT
[#16]
These are popular in Israel because you can get a pistol permit there, but rifles are usually restricted to the military only.
Adding the stock kits to pistols gives you a carbine, but does not affect the pistol permit. |
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GA, USA
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Posted: 10/27/2010 3:26:30 PM EDT
[#17]
Works with a Glock 34 right?
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Posted: 10/27/2010 3:39:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MakoDefense]
[#18]
Yes, it will work with a Glock 34.
Two screws remove the flash hider from the KPOS, allowing the Glock 34 to fit.
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Posted: 10/28/2010 3:53:03 AM EDT
[#19]
This converts the Glock into a SBR type weapon and requires a tax stamp here in the US...correct?
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GA, USA
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Posted: 10/28/2010 4:50:55 PM EDT
[#20]
Yes.
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Posted: 1/26/2011 9:39:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: MakoDefense]
[#21]
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TN, USA
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Posted: 1/26/2011 9:49:15 AM EDT
[#22]
Originally Posted By ikor:
This converts the Glock into a SBR type weapon and requires a tax stamp here in the US...correct? Yes. $200 and Form I |
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Posted: 1/26/2011 10:09:29 AM EDT
[#23]
There is detailed info about this in the first post.
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Posted: 2/19/2011 4:35:00 PM EDT
[#24]
KPOS18 for the Glock 18 is now available.
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Posted: 3/24/2011 1:08:28 AM EDT
[#25]
In answer to the many questions we receive about engraving the frame of a pistol, anywhere that the engraving is visible and can be engraved to the ATFE's requirements works. Many people engrave locations such as the bottom of the grip frame on either side on Glocks, or the bottom of the trigger guard. On Glocks or SIG 2022 (SIG Pro), make sure that you use an engraver who has experience engraving polymer.
Simmons Law Enforcement is a good choice for engraving.
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Posted: 3/24/2011 1:09:42 AM EDT
[#26]
Originally Posted By Jmacken37: Will this work with a Glock that has a "rear sear" installed? Thanks, Jake There is now a version in the works with a charging handle designed to work with the rear auto sear. |
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Posted: 4/2/2011 10:21:59 PM EDT
[#27]
I actually like this the more I look at it. I got my first look at the Ellett Bros show in Columbia SC. It has grown on me since
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Posted: 4/4/2011 10:20:06 PM EDT
[#28]
Anything for the M&P .40?
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Posted: 4/6/2011 4:33:07 AM EDT
[#29]
Originally Posted By lucksthename: I actually like this the more I look at it. I got my first look at the Ellett Bros show in Columbia SC. It has grown on me since If you come to Alaska, I'll let you review it! |
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Posted: 4/6/2011 4:34:22 AM EDT
[#30]
Originally Posted By doubleajaybrock: Anything for the M&P .40? Not yet. We will probably have to see what happens with international use of the M&P before we see it. I can check to see what is planned. |
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Posted: 4/18/2011 10:52:09 PM EDT
[#31]
Originally Posted By lucksthename: I actually like this the more I look at it. I got my first look at the Ellett Bros show in Columbia SC. It has grown on me since I'm going to try to work out a chance for you to review the KPOS. I will be in touch. |
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VA, USA
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Posted: 6/18/2011 5:44:03 AM EDT
[#32]
Anything planned for the Sig 220?
Also, what's with the metal ring hanging from the pin at the 'joint' of the stock? Looks like it could snag on stuff. Can it be removed safely? |
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Posted: 6/18/2011 2:01:44 PM EDT
[#33]
I will check on the 220, it may be close enough to the 226 to work in the same one, but I will have to make sure. The ring is for attaching a sling. It can easily be removed, but most will want to be able to attach a sling. I have never heard of anyone complaining about it catching on anything. It is far more likely that your sling or clothing would catch on something.
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GA, USA
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Posted: 7/25/2011 12:20:00 PM EDT
[#34]
will this work with a glock 20 and a 6inch barrel?
Glad someone finally come out with something for the 10mm!! |
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Posted: 7/25/2011 12:33:54 PM EDT
[#35]
Yes, the 6" barrel will not cause an issue.
This is the version you need: http://www.themakogroup.com/product_p/kpos21.htm
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Posted: 9/3/2011 6:52:06 AM EDT
[#36]
I really like this. Any private reviews yet?
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Posted: 9/3/2011 2:11:12 PM EDT
[#37]
There are several, some better than others. Some reviewers do not really understand the purpose, or have the right background, so some of their comments are not really relevant, others do a better job. We are trying to get it out to more good reviewers. The difficulty is in the NFA restrictions - I can't just send one around to reviewers - it has to go on an SBRd pistol.
Military Arms Channel will be reviewing one in the future, and I plan to have one at David Fortier's range in October. Chuck Pfarrer, former assault element commander in DEVGRU (Seal Team 6), is using KPOS as he travels through Afghanistan and Pakistan researching for his upcoming book about the tracking and killing of Osama bin Ladin. He will also be writing about the KPOS. You can also read about it in the December 2010 issue of SWAT Magazine:  |
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Posted: 9/4/2011 9:49:11 AM EDT
[#38]
Thank you for the gouge. If I keep hearing good things, I will likely SBR a Glock when I get back to the States and place an order.
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GA, USA
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Posted: 9/22/2011 6:39:54 PM EDT
[#39]
I'm seriously moving towards putting this together with a Glock 22, 35 or 17L with a 9mm silencer. It's going to be an expensive endeavor, so I don't want to find myself trapped by my choice of pistol.
I'm pretty sure that when you go 35 or 17L you have to lose the flash hider, but what other pitfalls may I run into with the use of a silencer or long Glock. Mostly concerned with mating this with the 17L, but feel free to elaborate on all three. Thanks in advance. |
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Posted: 9/22/2011 10:10:07 PM EDT
[#40]
You are correct - to use any of the long-slide Glocks, you have to remove the flash hider. It may be that it would be possible to alter the flash hider, but I have not really looked at it to see. You will need to remove it anyway for the suppressor. Unless the suppressor is overly fat, you should have no problems (most are thin enough that you can still use sights on the pistol) The 17L moves the suppressor forward, so it has even better clearance. The top of the KPOS frame is cut back to allow the suppressor to tip up when the barrel unlocks.
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NV, USA
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Posted: 10/12/2011 1:20:52 AM EDT
[#41]
Any word on the XD or XDM versions?
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Posted: 10/13/2011 12:33:07 AM EDT
[#42]
Checking timeline on the XD version - I'll let you know.
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NV, USA
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Posted: 10/16/2011 11:21:36 PM EDT
[#43]
Thanks for checking on this. I am thinking a stock for my 5".45 XD would be very powerful little package.
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Posted: 10/17/2011 3:19:15 AM EDT
[#44]
Send it to Alaska Custom Firearms for a .460 Rowland conversion and it is even more powerful.
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VA, USA
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Posted: 10/17/2011 6:05:05 AM EDT
[#45]
Originally Posted By Jabtsi:
charging handle looks like a teeth breaker! Otherwise looks cool and well though out. G18 would be pretty amazing with it, methinks... |
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Posted: 10/17/2011 1:56:20 PM EDT
[#46]
Originally Posted By GlockSlap: Originally Posted By Jabtsi: charging handle looks like a teeth breaker! Otherwise looks cool and well though out. G18 would be pretty amazing with it, methinks... The charging handle comes nowhere near your face. To be hit by it you would have to put your face uncomfortably forward onto the rear of the unit itself and turn your face toward the right, not looking forward. I locked the slide back and tried to get my face against the charging handle , and there is real no way to do it and still be able to really shoot. You will not get hit by the charging handle. I covered this more in this thread, if you read back. |
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Posted: 10/17/2011 1:58:13 PM EDT
[#47]
Originally Posted By GlockSlap: G18 would be pretty amazing with it, methinks... It's disappointing that there are not a bunch of transferable Glock 18s out there. |
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Posted: 11/1/2011 10:21:07 AM EDT
[#48]
Check this out as well. Nice shooting with a K.P.O.S. with a Glock 17! |
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NV, USA
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Posted: 2/18/2012 6:40:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Stu5250]
[#49]
Anyone have any new info about these coming out for XD/XDMs?
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Posted: 2/24/2012 12:50:35 PM EDT
[#50]
Originally Posted By Stu5250: Anyone have any new info about these coming out for XD/XDMs? We should see these soon, in the new version. |
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