Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
User Panel

Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 3
Posted: 5/10/2017 4:07:13 PM EDT
Below we are going to look at the four main guns I carry. Yet I do NOT carry them equally. One of them gets carried 90% of the time, while the others are carried far more sporadically. There are a number of factors that go into my decision of which gun to carry. Weight is definitely a major factor, as is magazine capacity (firepower), recoil, ability to make quick accurate follow up shots, reliability, and overall size. Those criteria are about the gun itself, but external factors, like the clothes we wear also help determine, or even dictate, our concealed carry choices.

(NOTE: You may notice when reading my list of selection criteria above, I don’t mention caliber. Personally, I do not put as much emphasis on caliber as others may. First, I think shot placement is more important than caliber. I’m also making the assumption that most people who are reading this article are going to carry a handgun chambered in one of the major service calibers, especially given the incredible range of concealed carry choices out there in these calibers. Today every major manufacturer makes a single-stack 9mm pistol that is not much bigger or heavier than a Beretta Bobcat in 22lr. If you carry a 22lr or a 32acp pistol, you probably do so for a specific reason and realize the limitation of those calibers for defense.)

WEIGHT
Let’s face it, the heavier a gun is, the more effort it takes to carry it. In my experience as a non-LEO concealed carrier, my heavy guns just don’t carried very often. For me heavy is anything over 36 ounces. It is just not practical or comfortable for me to carry a heavy gun over extended periods of time…so I don’t. For me then, weight is a huge factor. If it is over 36 ounces, it is not going to get carried.

MAGAZINE CAPACITY
In my mind, you can never have too many bullets on hand, but you can have too few. I am personally not comfortable carrying a gun with less than a 15 round magazine capacity. If you encounter a situation that involves more than one attacker, you are going to need those rounds. Though sometimes my dress or the weather dictates I carry a smaller gun with a magazine that holds 7 or 8 rounds. While not ideal, it is better than not carrying.

RECOIL
I’m not going to carry a gun that I can’t control or shoot well. I have to be able to control the recoil and be able to make quick follow-up shots with the gun I carry. Simply, I have to be able to shoot the gun well. If I can’t shoot the gun well, which means control the recoil and make quick accurate follow up shots with it, I don't carry it.

I find that calibers larger than 9mm do not suit me for concealed carry. For me .40 cal and .45acp have noticeably more felt recoil than smaller caliber options. Which means it takes me longer to recover and make accurate follow up shots. So I don’t carry guns chambered in those calibers. Do I shoot them at the range? Sure. But if you pull up my shirt you won’t ever see one on my belt in the 4 o’clock position.

SIZE
Generally I don’t like small handguns. The sub-compact class of handguns is my least favorite. Guns of this size-class tend to have more muzzle-flip than their compact and full-size brethren; which means it takes longer to make quick and accurate follow up shots.

Smaller guns also tend to be more susceptible to user error such as limp-wristing which can affect reliability. I also just hate to have my pinky of my shooting hang dangling in the air when firing a gun.

Generally for me, the bigger the gun, the better I shoot it. As a result I always try to carry the largest gun I can without violating my WEIGHT rule of keeping the gun below 36 ounces. Unfortunately larger guns are usually more difficult to conceal. However, I have come to find some fairly big guns can be carried IWB with the right type of clothes and be completely undetectable. The right gear and dress can hide a full-sized pistol just as well as a sub-compact pistol.

SO WHAT DO I CARRY?
Using the selection criteria above, there are four guns in my collection that I find myself carrying. There are no doubt many choices out there that could easily replace any of my four. A number of them are sitting in my safe. These are simply the four I find myself carrying most often, because I find they fit the criteria I have laid out above and I shoot them very well.

Before I tell you which one I carry most, I will just show them to you with their weights. After all, weight is a major factor in this carry equation; four to six ounces actually makes a noticeable difference, so every ounce counts.

GLOCK 19 WITH RED DOT (9mm 15+1 Capacity, 31.0 ounces)



FN FIVE SEVEN WITH FACTORY FIXED NIGHT SIGHTS (5.7x28 20+1 Capacity, 27.9 ounces)



S&W SHIELD (9mm 7+1 Capacity, 24 ounces)



CZ P-07 SUPPRESSOR READY (9mm 15+1 Capacity, 36.2 ounces)



(NOTE: For safety purposes all guns were weighed WITHOUT a round in the chamber. But the magazines are fully loaded.)

So we have one full-sized gun here (FN Five seven), two compacts (Glock 19 & CZ P-7), and one sub-compact single-stack (S&W Shield). In terms of weight there is one pretty serious anomaly here. The only full sized gun here, the FN Five seven with a loaded 20 round magazine weighs less than 28 ounces! Not only is the gun light, but a fully loaded 20 round Five-seveN magazine weighs just 7.5 ounces. That is half the weight of a fully loaded Glock 19 magazine. Stocked with 15 rounds of bonded hollowpoints, the Glock 19 magazine weighs over 15 ounces.

The full-sized Five seven is the 2nd lightest gun here behind the diminutive Shield which weighs in at 24 ounces loaded. But the Shield only carries 8 rounds fully loaded with one in the pipe. I don’t use the factory extended 8 round mags because it defeats the purpose of this little gun. With the extension on, it is as tall as the Glock 19. Given my lack of love for little guns, I’m frankly glad the Shield weighs 24 ounces and not less. It is just not pleasant to shoot or train with a lighter gun chambered in 9mm. Recoil and muzzle-flip is harsher, and fast accurate flow-up shots are harder to accomplish.

At 31 ounces, the Glock 19 with a Trijicon RMR attached is the third heaviest, and finally the CZ P-07 Suppressor Ready weighs in at 36.2 ounces. Though the CZ is just over my weight limit of 36 ounces, I shoot this gun so well so fast that it must be on the list. My P-07 may be the most natural pointing pistol I have ever shot. I can put 10 rapidly fired rounds into a 2” group at will with the CZ. I love shooting this gun, especially suppressed. It is hard to not shoot this gun well.

You may notice from the pictures that 3 of my 4 carry guns have threaded barrels on them. Even my little Shield. I love shooting suppressed. Though it is highly unlikely I would ever need to, I like to have the option to suppress my carry guns. When I order my holsters I make sure to select the option to have the front end opened to accommodate the longer barrel. I find it makes no difference if the gun I am carrying has a threaded barrel or not. If I carry my Glock 19 with and without a threaded barrel, I simply don’t feel or notice a difference. My body is never at an angle where the tip of the barrel would push into my butt cheek.

So which gun do I carry most? Drum roll please…I carry the FN Five seveN 90% of the time. Even more surprising, I live in South Florida and I wear shorts and a loose t-shirt every day. Believe it or not, the Five seven completely disappears under a loose shirt. I carry IWB at 4 o’clock and the huge Five SeveN, which basically weighs the same as the little Shield, is simply not detectable. My buddies who know I am carrying and know what I am carrying are always amazed that they can never spot it. Even when I bend down! Normally the bigger the gun and the more ammo it holds, the heavier it is. With the Five seven this logic simply does not apply.

I am indecent shape, tall and athletically built so some days I like to wear a tight t-shirt. On those days I carry the little Shield IWB. Any of the other guns I carry would show for sure in this situation. So I have no choice. If I want to look good, I have to carry a little gun.

There are few situations or modes of dress where I can carry my compacts like my Glock 19 and CZ P-07, but not carry my Five seven. I may have a few shirts where the Five seven just prints a little too much and the Glock or CZ are just right. But those situations are rare, so I don’t often carry the compacts.

Though I must say I LOVE shooting my handguns with an RMR! I simply shoot faster with an RMR. I really like the idea of an RMR on a carry gun, especially for dark situations.

I know there are a lot of 5.7x28 naysayers out there who would scoff (to put it politely) at my primary carry choice. I find those folks simply have not done the research and know little about the caliber. First, the Five seven is one of the most inherently accurate pistols I have ever owned. Some of you may know that 5.7x28 has 40% less recoil than 9mm; which means accurate follow up shots are a breeze and it is easier to get multiple well-placed shots on a target. My Five seven also launches an Elite Ammo 32gr copper projectile at 2400 fps and will penetrate a Level IIIA vest and continue into a block of ballistic gel 19” tumbling and yawing all over the place. I have no doubt it is as effective than any of the other major service calibers out there. Think of 5.7x28 as a small rifle round being fired from your pistol.


ELITE AMMO T6B 32 GR




Anyone of these four guns would be a great choice for a concealed carry gun. For me personally, I want to carry the biggest gun I can comfortably and effectively conceal with the most amount of firepower. Given the shocking light weight of the full-size Five seven and surprise ease of concealment, it is my primary choice.
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 4:16:46 PM EDT
[#1]
Not really on topic but how do you like the G19 with red dot? Ive been seriously considering getting one lately. Have you / do you cc it?
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 5:02:50 PM EDT
[#2]
First, interesting thoughts and inclusion of a red dot for CC is interesting and if you can do it comfortably, cool. I know someone will take issue with potential failure of the electronics, but you're unlikely to need sights or the red dot to be on target in the situation where you need your CCW.

Second, I am laughing at this quoted part and I'm hoping this was a joke thrown in for good measure. You're joking about needing to do this for safety, right? This is like one of those Easter egg jokes in the movies, right?

Quoted:

(NOTE: For safety purposes all guns were weighed WITHOUT a round in the chamber. But the magazines are fully loaded.)
View Quote
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 5:09:01 PM EDT
[#3]
The po7 only carries 15 with that extended mag?

Have you ever shot a deer or coyote or a hog with the 5.7?
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 5:11:49 PM EDT
[#4]
The 5.7 is a neat round and I enjoyed shooting a friend's, but I shoot way too much to consider it. My shooting costs in ammo alone would almost double.
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 8:18:28 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Not really on topic but how do you like the G19 with red dot? Ive been seriously considering getting one lately. Have you / do you cc it?
View Quote
As I said above I do carry the G19 with the RMR and I absolutely love shooting it. I shoot pistols with red dot sights noticeably quicker than pistols with iron sights with similar accuracy. There is no difference for me concealing a G19 with an RMR or without. I have a holster designed to accommodate the G19 with an RMR.
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 8:21:27 PM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
First, interesting thoughts and inclusion of a red dot for CC is interesting and if you can do it comfortably, cool. I know someone will take issue with potential failure of the electronics, but you're unlikely to need sights or the red dot to be on target in the situation where you need your CCW.

Second, I am laughing at this quoted part and I'm hoping this was a joke thrown in for good measure. You're joking about needing to do this for safety, right? This is like one of those Easter egg jokes in the movies, right?
View Quote
All my pistols with RMRs have tall night sights. If the electronic fail, the irons are right there where the dot would be. I have had my RMR shoot loose on the range and I carried on with the irons. Loctite fixed that problem.

You are correct about the unloaded chambers, but it is a long story.
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 8:25:08 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The po7 only carries 15 with that extended mag?

Have you ever shot a deer or coyote or a hog with the 5.7?
View Quote
No the extended mag carries 17. I carry it with the 15 round mag. I didn't have the 15 round mage with me when I took the pic, so I removed two rounds when I weighed it.

I personallyhave not shot any animals with 5.7. But I have seen the results, and they are pretty brutal. Google it and you will find some stuff for sure.
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 8:37:32 PM EDT
[#8]
the five seven is a really fun gun. i played with one a decade ago before it was easier to get different types of rounds.

OP what kind of holster are you using?
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 9:08:51 PM EDT
[#9]
That's a clusterfuck of different guns.  

How do manage to stay proficient with all that?  I'm busy enough staying on top of a Glock 34 and 43.
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 9:54:54 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
No the extended mag carries 17. I carry it with the 15 round mag. I didn't have the 15 round mage with me when I took the pic, so I removed two rounds when I weighed it.

I personallyhave not shot any animals with 5.7. But I have seen the results, and they are pretty brutal. Google it and you will find some stuff for sure.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
The po7 only carries 15 with that extended mag?

Have you ever shot a deer or coyote or a hog with the 5.7?
No the extended mag carries 17. I carry it with the 15 round mag. I didn't have the 15 round mage with me when I took the pic, so I removed two rounds when I weighed it.

I personallyhave not shot any animals with 5.7. But I have seen the results, and they are pretty brutal. Google it and you will find some stuff for sure.
I've seen cherry picked pics. Not that impressed
Link Posted: 5/10/2017 9:55:48 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
That's a clusterfuck of different guns.  

How do manage to stay proficient with all that?  I'm busy enough staying on top of a Glock 34 and 43.
View Quote
I'm ok going from a g19-1911-beretta
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 9:01:43 AM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
the five seven is a really fun gun. i played with one a decade ago before it was easier to get different types of rounds.

OP what kind of holster are you using?
View Quote
I mainly use a Tucker Gun Leather "Cover Up Plus". In fact that is my gun and holster on the page. I sent them a pic.

Tucker Gun Leather - Cover Up Plus

There are many great Kydex options out there as well. I really like the T.Rex Kydex IWB Nomad for the Five seveN too:

T.Rex Nomad IWB
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 9:18:08 AM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
That's a clusterfuck of different guns.  

How do manage to stay proficient with all that?  I'm busy enough staying on top of a Glock 34 and 43.
View Quote
I train once a week. I shoot between 300 to 500 rounds a week. Three of my carry guns are single action (2 striker fired, and the Five Seven actually has a hammer inside and is cocked so it is single-action). One is DA/SA. I am NOT a fan of DA/SA, but I have added it to my training because I like the P-07 so much. Again I carry the Five seveN 90% of the time, so I train with that most heavily. Every range visit includes at least 2 of my carry guns. Always the Five seveN. I have 3 Five sevenS and one is a dedicated range gun. Here is a long-term review of that gun here on AR15.com in the FN Forum:

FN Five Seven Pistol - Long Term Use Range Gun - Updated Here

I feel that I have trained enough with these 4 guns that I would be comfortable if I had to use any of them in a defensive situation. Over the last 5 years I must have put at least 20,000 rounds through the 5 Five SeveNs I have owned (sold 2, have 3 now). Over the last 20 years there has been at least one 9mm Glock in my collection. Currently I have 2 9mm Glocks, but at least a dozen have come and gone from my collection over the years. I would have to guess in the last 20 years I have fired somewhere near 100,000 rounds through Glock 9mm pistols (5000 rounds per year x 20 years = 100,000). So I am pretty comfortable with my carry guns and feel I am proficient with all of them.
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 9:24:28 AM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I've seen cherry picked pics. Not that impressed
View Quote
FN 5.7x28 Pistol Kills
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 12:01:47 PM EDT
[#15]
Good thing five seven holds 21 rounds.... (insert joke here)

With that out of the way, that's some mean looking bullets, I assume jacketed steel with the obvious failure point to fracture on impact/tumble?

ETA: I'm positive it would go threw some barriers like sheet metal better than any "normal" hand gun caliber.  How's it handle stuff like automotive glass? Wood etc? Seems like such a light bullet which fragments into at least two pieces would stop quickly in a lot of stuff something like 9x19 would keep going in.
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 12:16:10 PM EDT
[#16]
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 12:56:14 PM EDT
[#17]
Very cool looking rounds
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 2:39:06 PM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I'm ok going from a g19-1911-beretta
View Quote
It's funny how strong opinions some of the teachers have and how they vary so widely.  I just read an article in SWAT that Pat Rogers wrote in 2010 and it was all about carry guns.  He specifically said to avoid DA/SA guns like the plague.  His reasoning was they require "two different grips".  One for double action shooting and one for single action.  Yet he wasn't opposed to revolvers in the same manner.  I do think he definitely showed a preference to autos of "single action" flavor.  Which he also lumped striker fired guns into that category of single action.  Which I don't completely disagree with.  

Anyways....  I'm not sure what my point was other than that just about every style gun is going to have it's proponents and antagonists.  There are not a lot of Pro DA/SA trainers out there but Ernest has to count for something.  Plus I don't think you really need 2 different grips with the M9.  But whatever.....

I get what you're saying samuse, but in the end all the different styles aren't THAT much different.  IMHO.   I do like to simplify for me too though.  I'm not sure I'm smart enough to have a lot of different things going on.   Lately I've been trying to focus on guns with no external safeties and all that.  Just to keep things simple.   Problem is my HiPower is my most accurate gun at the moment......
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 2:48:41 PM EDT
[#19]
Glock 19 or Shield are good carry choices. Go with one of those. 
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 3:27:58 PM EDT
[#20]
I'm comfortable going from a Glock to an M9 to a 1911 as well.

But comfortable and proficient are often not the same thing.  

I notice my shooting degrades pretty rapidly when I shoot standardized drills against myself with pistols other than what I regularly train on.
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 4:27:09 PM EDT
[#21]
I just looked up that ammo, $56 for 25 rounds! Shit better preform like a fucking death ray.
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 4:39:27 PM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Good thing five seven holds 21 rounds.... (insert joke here)

With that out of the way, that's some mean looking bullets, I assume jacketed steel with the obvious failure point to fracture on impact/tumble?

ETA: I'm positive it would go threw some barriers like sheet metal better than any "normal" hand gun caliber.  How's it handle stuff like automotive glass? Wood etc? Seems like such a light bullet which fragments into at least two pieces would stop quickly in a lot of stuff something like 9x19 would keep going in.
View Quote
Lots of videos on YouTube of many 5.7 rounds going through lots of barriers. Search and enjoy. The boutique rounds perform so much better than the Factory rounds. They are loaded way down because of the armor piercing debacle a bunch of years back with the 5.7. It was over the now banned SS190 FN Factory round. The Elite Ammo round I carry out-performs SS190.
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 6:01:49 PM EDT
[#23]
All pistols suck. 

Why carry a bulky expensive odd ball caliber boutique gun when you can get the same results with a 9mm striker gun. 

Youre fascinated with 5.7 so I knew the answer when I clicked. 
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 6:26:21 PM EDT
[#24]
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 6:45:11 PM EDT
[#25]
If the situation in my area deteriorated I would change what I carry.  Until then I will carry my CW9 in my front pocket with two spare mags in the offhand pocket.
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 7:28:09 PM EDT
[#26]
The Five Seven seems to have one big glowing positive... 21 round capacity.
velocity isn't a bad second. Best I recall most rifle bullets need at least 1800fps to expand, on paper the five seven is excellent, but with a light weight bullet...It's a coin toss as to wither it's going to be effective or not on different barriers, some it will be much more so, some less so than say a 9x19. I don't recall at what velocity temporary expansion cavity becomes an effective wounding mechanism.. anyone on the top of their head?
Link Posted: 5/11/2017 7:56:55 PM EDT
[#27]
I know K9DPD in this thread. His department used Five Sevens. I don't know if they still do. 

http://www.lightfighter.net/topic/anyone-ever-shoot-the-fn-5-7-pistol-any-opinions?reply=2843236911446417#4131082102
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 8:36:21 AM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
All pistols suck. 

Why carry a bulky expensive odd ball caliber boutique gun when you can get the same results with a 9mm striker gun. 

Youre fascinated with 5.7 so I knew the answer when I clicked. 
View Quote
You make a good point. As far as pistols go, I generally feel sufficiently armed with a 9mm 15 round striker gun. However, there are a few reasons I go with the Five seveN over a 9mm:

- 40% less recoil than 9mm allows me to get back on target faster for more accurate follow-up shots. In the end, that is the goal of self-defense with a pistol...get as many rounds on target as quickly as possible.
- Rifle like performance...A 5.7x28 bullet traveling at 2400 fps will penetrate barriers that 9mm can't, including Level IIIA armor.
- 21 rounds on tap. You simply can't effectively conceal a 9mm pistol with 21 rounds.
- a spare loaded 20 round magazine is half the weight of a loaded 15 round 9mm magazine
- The full sized 57 weighs less than a 15 round Compact 9mm pistol.
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 8:41:17 AM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I know K9DPD in this thread. His department used Five Sevens. I don't know if they still do. 

http://www.lightfighter.net/topic/anyone-ever-shoot-the-fn-5-7-pistol-any-opinions?reply=2843236911446417#4131082102
View Quote
No offense but that post is from 2006! A great deal of development has been done with 5.7x28 ammo in the last decade plus. There is also a ton more recent research out there since 2006, including actual shootings like Ft. Hood. I hate this example, because it disgusts me, but the shooter used the weakest of the 5.7x28 loadings (SS197) available, and the damage caused was far worse than what a 9mm would have done. If you google it there is a fair amount of analysis of the wounds caused in that case. Even the victims that survived had Shattered bones like hips and arm bones, and were unable to carry on.
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 9:01:10 AM EDT
[#30]
The question then becomes why is it not more widely used? Why is the military not using it? What do folks that shoot people in the face have to say about it?
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 10:17:50 AM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The question then becomes why is it not more widely used? Why is the military not using it? What do folks that shoot people in the face have to say about it?
View Quote
It is the sidearm of the The Belgian Military and several hundred smaller agencies throughout the world. It is in the arsenal of the US Secret Service along with the P90. Here is an older list of agencies deploying the Five seveN Pistol:

Agencies employing the FN Five Seven

It suspect it is not more widely used simply because of cost. It is almost three times the cost of a standard hi-cap 9mm service pistol.

I read a great excerpt by a US Serviceman in Iraq of a shooting with a Five seveN pistol by a Belgian Officer. I just spent 15 mins trying to find the link. When I find it I will post it. Basically the Belgian officer fired one round of FN SS198 at a target at 50 yards. The pathology showed the bullet entered his chest and came to rest in his buttock. It did some serious damage along its path. One shot at 50 yards the guy dropped instantly and that was the end of the story.
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 10:29:15 AM EDT
[#32]
Good read as I have/carry 3 out of 4 of those as well! I've been carrying the P-07 almost exclusively just because I shoot it so well although it is a chunky little b
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 10:39:56 AM EDT
[#33]
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 1:40:34 PM EDT
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The question then becomes why is it not more widely used? Why is the military not using it? What do folks that shoot people in the face have to say about it?
View Quote
Oh c'mon Brad, you know as well as anyone that what the military uses isn't always going to be the best thing ever.  There are a lot of other factors to consider in that setting.  

I've got no dog in the hunt.  But there's no way you can convince me 9mm is superior to any other round out there.  I'm a proponent of the 9mm.  I've mostly shot 9mm. It's mostly been in my defense guns since I've kept a gun around for defense. But that doesn't mean there aren't choices that may work better.  Especially at some things (OR do some things better I guess is what I mean).  Everything has it's upsides and downsides.  Some more than others.
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 2:06:35 PM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Oh c'mon Brad, you know as well as anyone that what the military uses isn't always going to be the best thing ever.  There are a lot of other factors to consider in that setting.  

I've got no dog in the hunt.  But there's no way you can convince me 9mm is superior to any other round out there.  I'm a proponent of the 9mm.  I've mostly shot 9mm. It's mostly been in my defense guns since I've kept a gun around for defense. But that doesn't mean there aren't choices that may work better.  Especially at some things (OR do some things better I guess is what I mean).  Everything has it's upsides and downsides.  Some more than others.
View Quote
When I say military I typically mean Spec Ops as conventional branches don't select weapons based on terminal performance. I would think SOCOM would be using the Five Seven in some capacity. 
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 3:09:57 PM EDT
[#36]
Gotcha.  But then you see guys like Stukas87 (I think it was him) post the MP7 in use and we hear that round is not so great (maybe it's good at some thngs???)......  Who  knows why they do what they do...  LOL.  But I get your point.  Could be a money thing.  Because even spec ops probably have some limit as to what they get.  Or maybe not.

Does FN produce that pistol in the USA?
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 4:00:55 PM EDT
[#37]
At $.32 a round for practice ammo, I'm just not seeing the draw. 45 ACP is even considerably cheaper than that.
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 5:28:46 PM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Gotcha.  But then you see guys like Stukas87 (I think it was him) post the MP7 in use and we hear that round is not so great (maybe it's good at some thngs???)......  Who  knows why they do what they do...  LOL.  But I get your point.  Could be a money thing.  Because even spec ops probably have some limit as to what they get.  Or maybe not.

Does FN produce that pistol in the USA?
View Quote
Made 100% in Belgium and imported.
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 5:30:07 PM EDT
[#39]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
At $.32 a round for practice ammo, I'm just not seeing the draw. 45 ACP is even considerably cheaper than that.
View Quote
Tell me about it. It does hurt my ammo budget.
Link Posted: 5/12/2017 5:54:34 PM EDT
[#40]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Tell me about it. It does hurt my ammo budget.
View Quote
I'm about to pick up 2 more cases of 9mm for $189 a piece.
Link Posted: 5/13/2017 8:15:42 AM EDT
[#41]
Carry whatever works for you !!!! But just a thought-  How much training do you think you'll be doing with it due to cost of ammo ?
Link Posted: 5/13/2017 8:38:37 AM EDT
[#42]
OP, interesting and well written post. Congratulations on your logic and choice.
Link Posted: 5/13/2017 2:55:34 PM EDT
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'm about to pick up 2 more cases of 9mm for $189 a piece.
View Quote
I just did the same. I also treated myself to 1000 rounds AE 124gr Suppressor Ammo. I found it on sale for $12 a box. Couldn't pass it up.

On the other had it costs me $179.99 delivered for 500 rounds of SS197. It hurts, but worth it to me to. I have a lot more 9mm pistols than 5.7 pistols and burn through 9mm much faster than 5.7x28. I would say if you averaged it out over the year I shoot 50 rounds of SS197 a week and 200 rounds of 9mm a week. Lots of 22lr too. I have some really nice 22lr suppressed pistols and rifles. The pistols I built up from volquartsen frames and parts and tac-sol uppers, mini red dots etc. Lots of fun and super accurate with the right ammo.
Link Posted: 5/13/2017 3:00:22 PM EDT
[#44]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Carry whatever works for you !!!! But just a thought-  How much training do you think you'll be doing with it due to cost of ammo ?
View Quote
I just posted above. I shoot once a week and I shoot my Five seveN at least 50 rounds a week. I shoot an average of 200 rounds of 9mm a week. Lots of 22lr too.

I have been shooting this way for years. I have thousands of rounds through my Five Seven pistols. I have owned 5 of them, currently I own 3. I have a long term review going on one of my Five seveN pistols here. I only have 2300 rounds through this one, but I add 50 rounds a week at least:

FN Five Seven Pistol - Long Term Use Range Gun - Updated Here

So to answer your question, "Yes", not only have I thought about it, I've been living it for many years.
Link Posted: 5/13/2017 3:01:02 PM EDT
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
OP, interesting and well written post. Congratulations on your logic and choice.
View Quote
Nice, thanks!
Link Posted: 5/13/2017 3:03:19 PM EDT
[#46]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I just did the same. I also treated myself to 1000 rounds AE 124gr Suppressor Ammo. I found it on sale for $12 a box. Couldn't pass it up.

On the other had it costs me $179.99 delivered for 500 rounds of SS197. It hurts, but worth it to me to. I have a lot more 9mm pistols than 5.7 pistols and burn through 9mm much faster than 5.7x28. I would say if you averaged it out over the year I shoot 50 rounds of SS197 a week and 200 rounds of 9mm a week. Lots of 22lr too. I have some really nice 22lr suppressed pistols and rifles. The pistols I built up from volquartsen frames and parts and tac-sol uppers, mini red dots etc. Lots of fun and super accurate with the right ammo.
View Quote
I, too, shoot 200 rounds of 9mm a week. I rotate a couple of Glock 17s every 1000 rounds. I've also been shooting my 1911s more with the price of 45 ACP being down.
Link Posted: 5/14/2017 11:45:08 AM EDT
[#47]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Most "experts" agree that 2000-2100 fps is where hydrostatic tissue damage occurs.
View Quote
I thought velocity is only part of the equation. Doesn't mass/weight weigh heavily into the equation as well?
Link Posted: 5/14/2017 12:16:03 PM EDT
[#48]
Link Posted: 5/14/2017 5:22:13 PM EDT
[#49]
Liberty Civil Defense 9mm and Body Armor
Link Posted: 5/14/2017 5:46:30 PM EDT
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Made 100% in Belgium and imported.
View Quote
I wonder if that's got anything to do with spec ops not using it.......
Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 3
Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top