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Posted: 8/14/2014 8:59:37 AM EDT
Karl (Chestnut Mountain Sports) has been building my custom carry and competition Smith and Wesson revolvers since my first carry gun (a 3" Model 65) when I turned 21. That was a long time ago, and he's been building competition revolvers for my father longer than that. He's done other rifle and shotgun jobs for me too and I've always been very happy with his work.

Several years ago I had Karl build me two more carry guns, a 3" 13 and a 2-1/2" 66. I use them both constantly for carry and IDPA, but there are a few details I wanted to change.

First, I like the 2-1/2" barrel length but I hate the fact that you don't have a full length extractor with it. Even if I would overlook that, the 66 has adjustable sights and I prefer fixed. So I decided to spec out my "Perfect" carry revolver and have Karl tackle the project.

First off, it had to be a K-Frame. I find the K to be just the right size, large enough to shoot all day and small enough to easily conceal with a good holster. Next, I wanted a .357 magnum, so I could train with my .38 Special cast bullet reloads and carry my favorite 125gr Hornady Critical Defense .357's. Stainless Steel, fixed sights and a round butt were also necessities.

I dug through my pile of Smith K-Frames and found the perfect donor gun for the project, a 4" police trade-in Model 65-3 that was still mechanically tight. Now for the specs:

-Square to Round Butt conversion and the same smooth Precision Gun Specialties hard nylon "Hideout" grips that Karl put on my first 3" Model 65 he built for my 21st birthday.

-Double Action Only conversion. If you don't know why, take Michael de Bethencourt's snub class and LEARN!!! I decided to retain a small rounded hammer spur so I can thumb back the hammer for the ability to spin the cylinder to check for high primers without having to slightly pull the trigger.

-Chambers chamfered for easier reloads.

-Internal trigger overtravel stop.

-4" barrel shortened to 2-1/2". Obviously, the barrel markings would be partially cut off so Karl slab-sided the barrel and recessed the muzzle. On a factory S&W revolver there are two cylinder locking points. One is at the rear in the middle of the extractor star and the other is at the front of the ejector rod. With a 4" barrel shortened this much the front locking point has to be removed. Karl left a small amount of the front locking point under the barrel after TIG welding the hole to protect the ejector rod from being bent. Karl then added a ball detent on the yoke to act as the second cylinder locking point.

-Every carry revolver I've ever had Karl build for me has the same specs for the trigger. I always tell him to smooth the action without lightening the weight of the pull. I've never found that a light revolver trigger pull is necessary for accurate revolver shooting. As long as the trigger pull is smooth and consistent throughout the pull, the weight is irrelevant.

-Next came the front sight. Karl dovetailed the barrel and made a custom fiber optic sight. You can't buy a fiber optic short enough to work on a Smith revolver with fixed sights. Karl simply machined a front sight, then when he had the sight height regulated, he machined it and installed a red fiber optic rod.

-All that was left was a complete dehorning of all the sharp edges and a bead blasted finish.

I took all of these pictures tonight because starting tomorrow, the holster wear will start. This is a tool, not a safe queen. When I pass it on to my daughter, it's not going to look anything like it does now!

Here it is. It is truly my perfect carry revolver. Even when I tackle my 5-shot .44 Special Ruger GP-100, I don't think this one will ever be dethroned as the King of my carry guns.



















Link Posted: 8/14/2014 10:29:19 AM EDT
[#1]
that is nice.  About how much $$ and how long did it take for the work?

I have at least one donor Smith in my collection I could try that with...
Link Posted: 8/14/2014 10:49:43 AM EDT
[#2]
That's a damn good looking revolver you have there!
Link Posted: 8/14/2014 11:11:06 AM EDT
[#3]
NICE!
Link Posted: 8/14/2014 11:54:21 AM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
that is nice.  About how much $$ and how long did it take for the work?

I have at least one donor Smith in my collection I could try that with...
View Quote


You would have to email Karl directly to see what the project you have in mind would cost and what the timeframe for his work is right now. Unlike almost every other custom gunsmith out there, Karl is a true one-man shop. Unless you wanted some engraving or finish that he doesn't offer in-house, Karl does every aspect of the job himself.

I've owned S&W Performance Center revolvers and autos and Karl's work puts them to shame. He's worth every penny and whatever time it takes for him to do the job. As you can see from the close-up pics, his work is really perfect.
Link Posted: 8/14/2014 12:08:48 PM EDT
[#5]
I don't know much about revolvers, but the close ups show that the work is indeed flawless.

Link Posted: 8/14/2014 12:14:49 PM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I don't know much about revolvers, but the close ups show that the work is indeed flawless.

View Quote


I'm considering having another built similar to this one, but have engraving done by Wayne D'Angelo to turn into a BBQ Gun. This work is beautiful, but I'm going to start shOoting the hell out of it this afternoon. This is the last time it's going to look this good, but it's a tool, not a Safe Queen. All of my other Sokol custom guns are showing their use, not abuse, but that's why I have them built.
Link Posted: 8/14/2014 1:43:38 PM EDT
[#7]
That is a very nice example of custom revolver work.
Link Posted: 8/14/2014 2:05:59 PM EDT
[#8]
You and I have very similar tastes.... Outstanding.

I've had Karl build three revolvers and two 1911s for me.

He's outstanding.... You just inspired me to do another project.  
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 9:05:00 AM EDT
[#9]
I've looked into doing such a thing...but it's a lot easier to buy the gun you want...
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 9:12:13 AM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I've looked into doing such a thing...but it's a lot easier to buy the gun you want...
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I don't think you could buy the gun pictured in the OP.  Even if you could come close it would have a stupid lock on it.  But I don't even think you could get close with or without the lock...
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 12:26:09 PM EDT
[#11]
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 1:07:55 PM EDT
[#12]
To me, just finding a 3" and leaving it be would make more sense, is all.

I'm not a spending a ton of money for a one of a kind gun kinda guy, is all.

Sure they haven't made a 3" K frame for some time now and they're selling for nearly $1000 but the hunt for a reasonable price is half the fun. People that aren't in the trade or don't have their head buried in a computer tend to not know that.

It's a great gun and certainly what the op ordered, but I'm not into it, is all.
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 4:52:18 PM EDT
[#13]
If a stock revolver is good enough for you, great. I want a custom revolver to correct every problem there are with factory guns.

I like 3" K-Frames, too, and shoot all five of mine. One of them, a Model 13, is also a Sokol Custom gun. But I find that a 2-1/2" gun carries and balances well but not having a full length ejector and being stuck with adjustable sights ruins it for me. Not that my 2-1/2" Sokol Model 66 is a bad gun, but this Model 65 is twice the gun a snub 66 ever could be.

I really get the impression that most of you think this kind of project from Karl costs a lot more than it actually does. Karl makes it affordable for most people to carry custom guns.

Maybe I should have Karl add the "Hawgleg44 Package" to his website!
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 7:07:53 PM EDT
[#14]
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 7:11:10 PM EDT
[#15]
the area where the cylinder ring grows over usage..anything special or original finish?  

thanks.
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 9:39:59 PM EDT
[#16]
Never heard of Karl before your thread. It is quite obvious that he is a master craftsman!

Beautiful gun. Thank you very much for sharing!
Link Posted: 8/15/2014 11:20:40 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
the area where the cylinder ring grows over usage..anything special or original finish?  

thanks.
View Quote


No, that's just the original finish. He did polish it up a little, but he simply masked the area off before bead blasting the rest of the revolver.

It's just the small details that add up to set Karl's work apart. He did the same thing to a 2-1/2" 66 he built for me several years ago at the same time he built my parkerized 3" 13.

Here's a pic of the two of them. Unfortunately, I never took any pictures of them before I started using them, like I did this one.

Link Posted: 8/17/2014 2:32:04 PM EDT
[#18]
That is just plain awesome.  What is weight of the trigger pull and what will your carry setup be (belt, holster, spare ammo, etc.)?
Link Posted: 8/17/2014 3:05:35 PM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


No, that's just the original finish. He did polish it up a little, but he simply masked the area off before bead blasting the rest of the revolver.

It's just the small details that add up to set Karl's work apart. He did the same thing to a 2-1/2" 66 he built for me several years ago at the same time he built my parkerized 3" 13.

Here's a pic of the two of them. Unfortunately, I never took any pictures of them before I started using them, like I did this one.

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll204/Hawglegf44/100_2079-2-1.jpg
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
the area where the cylinder ring grows over usage..anything special or original finish?  

thanks.


No, that's just the original finish. He did polish it up a little, but he simply masked the area off before bead blasting the rest of the revolver.

It's just the small details that add up to set Karl's work apart. He did the same thing to a 2-1/2" 66 he built for me several years ago at the same time he built my parkerized 3" 13.

Here's a pic of the two of them. Unfortunately, I never took any pictures of them before I started using them, like I did this one.

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll204/Hawglegf44/100_2079-2-1.jpg



nice
Link Posted: 8/17/2014 11:27:17 PM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
That is just plain awesome.  What is weight of the trigger pull and what will your carry setup be (belt, holster, spare ammo, etc.)?
View Quote


I'm not sure of the trigger pull weight. It's whatever the factory pull has settled in at over the years. But since it was a police trade-in, it was carried a lot but rarely shot. I give Karl the same instructions every time when he builds a revolver for me. Smooth the trigger pull out but don't lighten it at all. I do that for a few reasons:

-First, I've never found a light trigger pull necessary for accurate DA shooting. A smooth pull does help, but a light pull isn't necessary. Learn to shoot a DA revolver and you don't need a light pull.

-Very importantly, I want my guns to be able to shoot ANY ammo that fits in the chambers. I don't want a light trigger that can only reliably shoot ammo with soft primers.

-And last, for the same reason as the DAO conversion, liability. I never carry a handgun with a lightened trigger pull. I know this could be debated endlessly here, but I am on the side where a lightened trigger has been used in court and I want to give the prosecutor as little ammo as possible that he could twist around and use against me. People will say "a good shoot is a good shoot and the gun you use or the modifications won't matter". To that, it's my OPINION that's BS. But it's my OPINION and I don't want to get into a pissing match about it. I'll be cautious and keep a serviceable, non-competition trigger on my carry guns.

Some will say that I've had this gun modified so much it could be a prosecutor's wet dream. I've discussed this at length with Karl, and once with Massad Ayoob, and I'm comfortable that the mods to this revolver, especially with the stock weight trigger pull is lawyer-safe. Not lawyer-proof since nothing is, but Karl says he can easily justify every modification made to the carry guns he's built for me as making them more accurate and safer to carry vs a stock revolver.

And for my carry rig, nothing special. I wear a 5:11 Instructor's Belt and an old Galco belt holster. I'm going to order a holster from Bob Mac. Spare ammo depends on the weather. If it's summer, I'll have 4 Speedstrips on me. If it's the cooler months and I'm wearing a cover garment, I'll also have a few Safariland Comp 2 speedloaders on me, too. My preferred carry load is 125gr JHP Hornady Critical Defense.
Link Posted: 8/18/2014 7:32:27 PM EDT
[#21]
I love the look of those grips. Are they textured at all? I prefer the tackiness and recoil dampening effect of rubber grips, but I might have to give those a shot.
Link Posted: 8/18/2014 8:23:35 PM EDT
[#22]
You can get them textured as an option but I prefer the smooth grips for carry.

Or you can stipple them to your liking. I've seen that done before, too.
Link Posted: 8/19/2014 7:17:30 PM EDT
[#23]
I have to step up for Karl as well here.

He's done a number of revolvers for me as well as autos and is a first class guy to deal with. My M65s in 3" and 4" and my J-frames are ideal carry revolvers and are very similar to Hawgleg44s'...DAO with a dovetailed usable front sight with wide notch rear.

On top of that, it gives me the opportunity to hit the Harpoon and Longtrail Breweries.
Link Posted: 8/20/2014 3:58:22 AM EDT
[#24]
Wonder what kind of work he can do to a S&W 617-6?
I've got a 6" that I've been trying to sell and use the funds to find a pre-lock 6 shot 617 with a 4" barrel, but no luck.
Have thought of having it cut to 3", dovetail front sight, bead blasted, and maybe slab sided.
Link Posted: 8/20/2014 9:29:51 AM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Wonder what kind of work he can do to a S&W 617-6?
I've got a 6" that I've been trying to sell and use the funds to find a pre-lock 6 shot 617 with a 4" barrel, but no luck.
Have thought of having it cut to 3", dovetail front sight, bead blasted, and maybe slab sided.
View Quote


Karl has done .22 work for me before. I had an old Model 17 project that was originally started by Andy Cannon that I got in trade. He built it into a full competition gun for me.

Give him a call!
Link Posted: 8/20/2014 12:00:22 PM EDT
[#26]
very nicely,done.



clown
Link Posted: 8/24/2014 11:02:52 PM EDT
[#27]
Link Posted: 8/25/2014 2:45:00 PM EDT
[#28]
He built this .45 Colt for me with an old Mod 58 and  520 barrel he had on hand.

Link Posted: 8/25/2014 10:18:29 PM EDT
[#29]
Cigardad, that is exactly what I'm looking to have done! PMed you some questions........

Beautiful S&W.
Link Posted: 8/29/2014 3:37:45 PM EDT
[#30]
Karl restored a colt Mk V Lawman for me recently, had to re-time the barrel and refinish, wonderful job.  One of the last few true revolver craftsmen still working imo.
Link Posted: 10/4/2014 9:37:17 AM EDT
[#31]
I might have missed it....but what are those grips??
Link Posted: 10/4/2014 6:41:42 PM EDT
[#32]
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Quoted:
I might have missed it....but what are those grips??
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They are Precision Gun Specialties Hideout Grips. I bought all of my sets from Brownell's but for some reason they stopped stocking the smooth version. My friend ordered a set directly from PGS.

I have a set of them on my 642 and 317 snubs, also. Those are the smooth with the finger grooves and they fit my hand very well.
Link Posted: 10/10/2014 6:07:36 AM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


They are Precision Gun Specialties Hideout Grips. I bought all of my sets from Brownell's but for some reason they stopped stocking the smooth version. My friend ordered a set directly from PGS.

I have a set of them on my 642 and 317 snubs, also. Those are the smooth with the finger grooves and they fit my hand very well.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
I might have missed it....but what are those grips??


They are Precision Gun Specialties Hideout Grips. I bought all of my sets from Brownell's but for some reason they stopped stocking the smooth version. My friend ordered a set directly from PGS.

I have a set of them on my 642 and 317 snubs, also. Those are the smooth with the finger grooves and they fit my hand very well.


has karl worked on your 642 too? if so what work/pics? I dont really NEED anything done on mine, but...
Link Posted: 10/10/2014 7:02:42 AM EDT
[#34]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


has karl worked on your 642 too? if so what work/pics? I dont really NEED anything done on mine, but...
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I might have missed it....but what are those grips??


They are Precision Gun Specialties Hideout Grips. I bought all of my sets from Brownell's but for some reason they stopped stocking the smooth version. My friend ordered a set directly from PGS.

I have a set of them on my 642 and 317 snubs, also. Those are the smooth with the finger grooves and they fit my hand very well.


has karl worked on your 642 too? if so what work/pics? I dont really NEED anything done on mine, but...


No, other than chamfering of the chambers and the grips, my no-lock 642 is stock. I specify "no-lock" because after having a Model 66 lock up while firing I'll NEVER trust my life to a POS Smith with the lock again.

I'll probably end up having Karl smooth the trigger out a little sometime but I just haven't yet.

The sad thing is after having all of this work done on the 65 I've been appointed a to a PD again and I've been carrying my Glock 19 duty weapon instead. The 65 has only been to the range once and it's sat in the safe ever since. It's just not right!
Link Posted: 10/10/2014 3:50:12 PM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


No, other than chamfering of the chambers and the grips, my no-lock 642 is stock. I specify "no-lock" because after having a Model 66 lock up while firing I'll NEVER trust my life to a POS Smith with the lock again.

I'll probably end up having Karl smooth the trigger out a little sometime but I just haven't yet.

The sad thing is after having all of this work done on the 65 I've been appointed a to a PD again and I've been carrying my Glock 19 duty weapon instead. The 65 has only been to the range once and it's sat in the safe ever since. It's just not right!
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I might have missed it....but what are those grips??


They are Precision Gun Specialties Hideout Grips. I bought all of my sets from Brownell's but for some reason they stopped stocking the smooth version. My friend ordered a set directly from PGS.

I have a set of them on my 642 and 317 snubs, also. Those are the smooth with the finger grooves and they fit my hand very well.


has karl worked on your 642 too? if so what work/pics? I dont really NEED anything done on mine, but...


No, other than chamfering of the chambers and the grips, my no-lock 642 is stock. I specify "no-lock" because after having a Model 66 lock up while firing I'll NEVER trust my life to a POS Smith with the lock again.

I'll probably end up having Karl smooth the trigger out a little sometime but I just haven't yet.

The sad thing is after having all of this work done on the 65 I've been appointed a to a PD again and I've been carrying my Glock 19 duty weapon instead. The 65 has only been to the range once and it's sat in the safe ever since. It's just not right!



Hey, having work is good    --- That 65 will always be there  ---     A Glock 19 is also a darn capable critter  --- i disliked Glocks until the first time i shot one --- then my mind changed
   I'm primarilly a revolver guy , but i do have Glocks 20, 29 and 42   (traded a Glock 23 for this caried much, shot little S&W 19 though -- i'm not crazy )

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