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Posted: 2/19/2015 4:54:47 PM EDT
[#1]
Made in Italy on the magazine probably means Mec-Gar. You can draw your own conclusions...
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Posted: 2/19/2015 5:07:26 PM EDT
[#2]
ADDENDUM: The LC9s-PRO slide stop is almost impossible to operate to release the slide to chamber the first round due to it taking too much thumb pressure to do so. This results in the operator having to release the slide using the "sling-shot" method. Problem is that the right hand thumb comes into contact with the mag release button while performing the slingshot slide release technique and can cause the mag to drop resulting in no round being chambered and the mag dropping out of battery, or worse yet dropping out of the pistol. The solution once again is a stronger mag release spring (or a fence around the mag release button).
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Posted: 2/20/2015 1:42:23 PM EDT
[#3]
I don't know how you're holding the gun but none of my fingers come anywhere near the magazine release when I'm firing, or when I slingshot the slide to load a round. BTW almost all new guns will be very difficult to disengage the slide stop until they are broken in. The M&P is very difficult even when broken in. There is a reason they are called slide stops and not slide releases. Slingshotting is the proper method for loading.
I don't think anything you described is a design flaw with the gun 
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Posted: 2/20/2015 1:59:40 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't know how you're holding the gun but none of my fingers come anywhere near the magazine release when I'm firing, or when I slingshot the slide to load a round. BTW almost all new guns will be very difficult to disengage the slide stop until they are broken in. The M&P is very difficult even when broken in. There is a reason they are called slide stops and not slide releases. Slingshotting is the proper method for loading. I don't think anything you described is a design flaw with the gun My thoughts as well. |
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Posted: 2/20/2015 3:26:22 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't know how you're holding the gun but none of my fingers come anywhere near the magazine release when I'm firing, or when I slingshot the slide to load a round. BTW almost all new guns will be very difficult to disengage the slide stop until they are broken in. The M&P is very difficult even when broken in. There is a reason they are called slide stops and not slide releases. Slingshotting is the proper method for loading. I don't think anything you described is a design flaw with the gun +1...No issue with mag release. I think a lot of the mag release problems are grip related and the cruder sharper notch on the Italian made mags helps a little when your pushing the mag release with your finger when you're firing the weapon. 
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Posted: 2/20/2015 3:35:17 PM EDT
[#6]
Most of the articles I've read on line say that the Italian mags are better that then the US mags. I have both for my LC9s and they both work fine.
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Posted: 2/20/2015 7:51:45 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Most of the articles I've read on line say that the Italian mags are better that then the US mags. I have both for my LC9s and they both work fine. Agreed. The posts I've read on other Ruger forums say that the USA made LC9 mags are problematic and the Italian Mec-Gar mags are preferred. |
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Posted: 2/21/2015 10:36:24 AM EDT
[#8]
What you are experiencing is learning how to operate a new pistol. As in keep your fingers off the widget unless you want the widget to function.
Real problems arise when the widget operates WITHOUT your finger operating it. Such as dropping mags or locking the slide open or a safety falling on. Mec-Gar makes best quality mags that are standard on any number of pistols whether labeled or not. Concentrate on learning what to do rather than bending yourself so much. The gun and its parts are operating as intended. |
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Posted: 2/21/2015 1:10:26 PM EDT
[#9]
The Italian company Mec-gar is the OEM magazine manufacturer for many quality firearms if you were not aware of that before.
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Posted: 2/22/2015 8:51:50 AM EDT
[#10]
Please post pics of your grip technique & a detailed essay explaining why you place your thumb near the mag catch. |
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Posted: 2/22/2015 11:30:52 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't know how you're holding the gun but none of my fingers come anywhere near the magazine release when I'm firing, or when I slingshot the slide to load a round. BTW almost all new guns will be very difficult to disengage the slide stop until they are broken in. The M&P is very difficult even when broken in. There is a reason they are called slide stops and not slide releases. Slingshotting is the proper method for loading. I don't think anything you described is a design flaw with the gun ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Having been involved in multiple shooting situations as a police officer, I probably understand better than most that any firearm that "can" malfunction in a life/death situation, probably "will" malfunction. (Think of "Murphy") And while it is true that the mag release problems mentioned can be circumvented at the range when taking your time, it is foolish to carry a problematic weapon for real life self-defense where even a minor weapon problem could result in your death. Some here apparently believe that a slide-stop that will not release the slide isn't a real problem because the 'slingshot method" is the "proper" way to load a pistol? I suspect those with that kind of whimsical attitude have never had to reload one-handed? Think about trying to use the "slingshot" method while wounded or while trying to physically hold off an attacker armed with a knife or hammer and maybe you'll understand. In many areas of life you can ignore minor problems, or pretend they don't matter and get away with it, but not with regard to life/death situations. |
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Posted: 2/22/2015 10:36:59 PM EDT
[#12]
Everyone works weapon's systems slightly different, but I've personally ran my lc9s through several matches and have never had any of the malfunctions or difficulties you've had thus far. |
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Posted: 2/23/2015 3:48:09 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Having been involved in multiple shooting situations as a police officer, I probably understand better than most that any firearm that "can" malfunction in a life/death situation, probably "will" malfunction. (Think of "Murphy") And while it is true that the mag release problems mentioned can be circumvented at the range when taking your time, it is foolish to carry a problematic weapon for real life self-defense where even a minor weapon problem could result in your death. Some here apparently believe that a slide-stop that will not release the slide isn't a real problem because the 'slingshot method" is the "proper" way to load a pistol? I suspect those with that kind of whimsical attitude have never had to reload one-handed? Think about trying to use the "slingshot" method while wounded or while trying to physically hold off an attacker armed with a knife or hammer and maybe you'll understand. In many areas of life you can ignore minor problems, or pretend they don't matter and get away with it, but not with regard to life/death situations. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I don't know how you're holding the gun but none of my fingers come anywhere near the magazine release when I'm firing, or when I slingshot the slide to load a round. BTW almost all new guns will be very difficult to disengage the slide stop until they are broken in. The M&P is very difficult even when broken in. There is a reason they are called slide stops and not slide releases. Slingshotting is the proper method for loading. I don't think anything you described is a design flaw with the gun ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Having been involved in multiple shooting situations as a police officer, I probably understand better than most that any firearm that "can" malfunction in a life/death situation, probably "will" malfunction. (Think of "Murphy") And while it is true that the mag release problems mentioned can be circumvented at the range when taking your time, it is foolish to carry a problematic weapon for real life self-defense where even a minor weapon problem could result in your death. Some here apparently believe that a slide-stop that will not release the slide isn't a real problem because the 'slingshot method" is the "proper" way to load a pistol? I suspect those with that kind of whimsical attitude have never had to reload one-handed? Think about trying to use the "slingshot" method while wounded or while trying to physically hold off an attacker armed with a knife or hammer and maybe you'll understand. In many areas of life you can ignore minor problems, or pretend they don't matter and get away with it, but not with regard to life/death situations. Do you know how I know you're full of shit? 
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Posted: 2/24/2015 1:14:35 PM EDT
[#14]
There have been many, many reports of defective magazine latches and or springs with the LC9S/ Pro, my Lc9s included. I have only put 100 rds through mine since it being repaired and no magazine dislodging yet. I need a few hundred more before I call it GTG.
Contact Ruger I bet they say send it in. |
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Posted: 2/24/2015 4:25:54 PM EDT
[#15]
I can't figure out how you are pressing the mag release with your thumb. With either a combat grip or a firing hand only grip, my thumb isn't in a position to depress the mag release while firing this particular handgun. Do you have small hands? Are you wrapping your middle finger over the top of your thumb?
Can you take a pic of your grip?
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Posted: 2/25/2015 10:33:46 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Having been involved in multiple shooting situations as a police officer, I probably understand better than most that any firearm that "can" malfunction in a life/death situation, probably "will" malfunction. (Think of "Murphy") And while it is true that the mag release problems mentioned can be circumvented at the range when taking your time, it is foolish to carry a problematic weapon for real life self-defense where even a minor weapon problem could result in your death. Some here apparently believe that a slide-stop that will not release the slide isn't a real problem because the 'slingshot method" is the "proper" way to load a pistol? I suspect those with that kind of whimsical attitude have never had to reload one-handed? Think about trying to use the "slingshot" method while wounded or while trying to physically hold off an attacker armed with a knife or hammer and maybe you'll understand. In many areas of life you can ignore minor problems, or pretend they don't matter and get away with it, but not with regard to life/death situations. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I don't know how you're holding the gun but none of my fingers come anywhere near the magazine release when I'm firing, or when I slingshot the slide to load a round. BTW almost all new guns will be very difficult to disengage the slide stop until they are broken in. The M&P is very difficult even when broken in. There is a reason they are called slide stops and not slide releases. Slingshotting is the proper method for loading. I don't think anything you described is a design flaw with the gun ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Having been involved in multiple shooting situations as a police officer, I probably understand better than most that any firearm that "can" malfunction in a life/death situation, probably "will" malfunction. (Think of "Murphy") And while it is true that the mag release problems mentioned can be circumvented at the range when taking your time, it is foolish to carry a problematic weapon for real life self-defense where even a minor weapon problem could result in your death. Some here apparently believe that a slide-stop that will not release the slide isn't a real problem because the 'slingshot method" is the "proper" way to load a pistol? I suspect those with that kind of whimsical attitude have never had to reload one-handed? Think about trying to use the "slingshot" method while wounded or while trying to physically hold off an attacker armed with a knife or hammer and maybe you'll understand. In many areas of life you can ignore minor problems, or pretend they don't matter and get away with it, but not with regard to life/death situations. If you can IM me. I would be interested to know what department. I am a Firearms Instructor for my department here in Texas as well and I compile information for training purposes. Thanks. |
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Posted: 2/28/2015 11:58:40 AM EDT
[#17]
UPDATE:
1. Ruger sent a new "Italy" mag. It works OK, so the previous "Italy" mag must have been faulty. 2. The slide stop that was impossible to operate with my thumb was "fixed" by locking the slide open, then tapping the slide stop lever down to release the slide 30+ times using a wooden hammer & dowel. The slide stop is still very hard to operate with my thumb, but at least now it works. Hopefully with time it will get better. 3. There doesn't seem to be a cure for the "accidental mag release problem" until Ruger manufactures a stronger spring. GRIPPING STYLE: Any self-defense pistol that has to be gripped a certain way to avoid possible malfunctions is seriously flawed. |
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Posted: 2/28/2015 12:32:38 PM EDT
[#18]
I still don't see how you're possibly hitting the magazine release when you're shooting. My right middle finger wraps around the grip right below the magazine release, and my left palm sits just on top of that middle finger and leaves a perfect "cave" around the magazine release. Exactly the same as every other gun I shoot.
I have 2 USA magazines and no matter how hard I shake, tug, or pry neither of them come out without intentionally pushing the magazine release, which is probably one of the stiffest ones on all my guns. |
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Posted: 2/28/2015 12:44:52 PM EDT
[#19]
9over40: Tried to send an IM but it didn't go through. However, I doubt that anything I did on the job years ago would be of any help now, since we weren't subject to anything like today's restrictions and strict oversight.
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Posted: 2/28/2015 1:13:50 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I still don't see how you're possibly hitting the magazine release when you're shooting. My right middle finger wraps around the grip right below the magazine release, and my left palm sits just on top of that middle finger and leaves a perfect "cave" around the magazine release. Exactly the same as every other gun I shoot. I can do the same thing, but that's not the point. The point is that when a very tight grip with the thumb touching the mag release button is used, the mag release button CAN BE be accidentally activated BY THE THUMB DUE TO THE FORCE OF THE RECOIL, causing the mag to drop out of the pistol. Think of fast action combat shooting one-handed or gripping a baseball bat. The reason I use that style of grip is because I also carry a revolver and often practice shooting one-handed and like to use the same gripping style in all situations. As far as other pistols are concerned, I have shot 30+ different pistols over the years and this is the only one with this problem. Anyway, I'm not trying to convince you or anyone else of anything. Just passing along problem info I've identified. |
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Posted: 2/28/2015 1:28:45 PM EDT
[#21]
Again everyone works handguns slight different, but I find that somewhat odd. Like I mentioned above I've ran the lc9s at a match, rapid fire, double taps, weak hand, strong hand, and while the recoil is a bit more than say a cz75 full size, I never once dropped a mag. It ran so boringly normal that I probably sold 2-3 for the shooters that were watching me run it. Sure I had to reload 3 times when others only needed to reload twice, but that was still good enough to win my division. When the bug classification solidifies I'll probably be running the lc9s in it.
It's hard to agree that it's a flaw if no one can recreate it. But again, everyone runs handguns slightly different, if these are flaws to you, maybe you'd be better off getting something else? |
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Posted: 2/28/2015 2:10:58 PM EDT
[#22]
Just for the fun of it I tested the mag release weights of the following pistols (with loaded mags inserted) using an RCBS trigger pull gauge:
LC9s-PRO = 4.0 pounds Glock 42 = 5.0 pounds Springfield XDs-9 = 8+ pounds The RCBS scale only goes up to 8 pounds and the XDs-9 never did release the mag even going slightly past 8 pounds. Also, the shape of the LC9s-Pro mag release button may be part of the problem since the rear portion sticks up pretty high compared to the other two pistols. |
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Posted: 2/28/2015 2:18:11 PM EDT
[#23]
You must have some monster sized hands. I thought I had good sized hands but there is no way I can get enough pressure from the side of my thumb to release the magazine, and my thumb isn't long enough to push it straight on without rotating my hand so far that I can no longer pull the trigger
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Posted: 2/28/2015 2:30:31 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You must have some monster sized hands. I thought I had good sized hands but there is no way I can get enough pressure from the side of my thumb to release the magazine, and my thumb isn't long enough to push it straight on without rotating my hand so far that I can no longer pull the trigger The RECOIL when actually shooting is what causes the thumb to sometimes bump into the mag release button hard enough to drop the mag. |
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Posted: 3/1/2015 12:44:47 AM EDT
[#25]
After rereading your first two posts, I can only say...
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Posted: 3/1/2015 8:19:13 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My thoughts as well. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I don't know how you're holding the gun but none of my fingers come anywhere near the magazine release when I'm firing, or when I slingshot the slide to load a round. BTW almost all new guns will be very difficult to disengage the slide stop until they are broken in. The M&P is very difficult even when broken in. There is a reason they are called slide stops and not slide releases. Slingshotting is the proper method for loading. I don't think anything you described is a design flaw with the gun My thoughts as well. Quoted:
After rereading your first two posts, I can only say... +1 |
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Posted: 3/1/2015 1:24:26 PM EDT
[#27]
Ever heard of "Murphy's Law"? It states, "Anything that can go wrong, will go wrong." Which is precisely why firearms should be thoroughly tested under all reasonable conditions prior to being released for sale so that any and all "potential problems" can be identified and corrected.
The original LC9 had two huge problems when it was released for sale = (1) a way too long and difficult trigger-pull and (2) an unnecessary magazine safety. Those two "issues" were eliminated by Ruger when they redesigned it as the LC9s PRO. However the redesigned LC9s PRO still has two serious "Murphy-prone" issues (1) a mag release button that sticks up too high and has a weak spring allowing the mag to drop out of the pistol when bumped during recoil, and (2) a slide stop that is so stiff that it is almost impossible to thumb-activate to drop the slide. Ruger needs to correct these problems, especially since the cost to do so would be negligible and could save the lives of some users. |
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Posted: 3/2/2015 11:57:32 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
9over40: Tried to send an IM but it didn't go through. However, I doubt that anything I did on the job years ago would be of any help now, since we weren't subject to anything like today's restrictions and strict oversight. Ok. Thanks Appreciate the effort. |
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Posted: 3/5/2015 6:41:13 PM EDT
[#29]
IMO, the op has a mag issue. Ask me how I know...
Call Ruger and tell them you have mags that drop and they will send you some new ones. If you poke around you will find this is a fairly common issue. It's not specific to the Italian mags (which are Mecgar, good stuff) or USA mags. |
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Posted: 3/6/2015 12:25:23 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
IMO, the op has a mag issue. Ask me how I know... Call Ruger and tell them you have mags that drop and they will send you some new ones. If you poke around you will find this is a fairly common issue. It's not specific to the Italian mags (which are Mecgar, good stuff) or USA mags. I've read many of the posts you are making reference to. I suggest you read more than the thread title. In a number of those posts the OP would say that they sent their brand new pistol back to Ruger for repair. Ruger would "repair' their pistol and test fire it 30 rounds with no mag drop. The OP would get the pistol back and after firing a few rounds they would experience mag drop. Take what you want from that. Were there some bad mags out there, probably. Were there a few weak springs out there, maybe. But, there are also a lot of shooters like the OP "using a tight grip with your thumb touching the mag release button (which it always does with a tight baseball bat type grip)" I think this particular pistol has become attractive to first time pistol owners. They take it out to the range for the first time and somehow - I can't replicate it - find a way to press the mag release while firing. They freak out, go home and find the first forum they can to find out why their brand new pistol is "malfunctioning". The problem has all but disappeared from the Ruger forum. I would surmise that a lot of these inexperienced shooters have figured out that they were what was malfunctioning.
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Posted: 3/6/2015 1:45:25 PM EDT
[#31]
I hate to be antagonized into posting explicit background info since some think it's bragging. So instead, all I'll say is that I probably have more military, police and civilian real-life and competition pistol shooting experience than 99% of the folks on this site. This means that I'm not a new shooter who doesn't know how pistols and mags need to function to be reliable for all users.
To clear up another misconception, I like the LC9s PRO, a lot. However it does have the problems I have described that need to be addressed by Ruger to make it a reliable Murphy-Proof self-defense pistol for everyone, regardless of gripping styles and physical limitations. |
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